Politics Coalition MPs want school chaplains to ''help'' the mental health of kids re: climate change

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Pie eyed

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I don't mind Scripture/Religion studies as a philosophy class in primary and early high school for regular public schools. As long as you have the right hippy teachers, it's a nice thing to have in the schedule, like PE, dance, health, design&tech, etc. In that respect it functions a bit like a chaplain or tutorial or group meet. It was one of the more questioning class environments I had in school, and some kids out there might need that in their lives. It would be one of the best class opportunities to dwell on big fears like climate change anxiety as long as the teacher isn't inappropriate, complemented by studies in the sciences and health-based subjects. I remember we learnt about many religions, listened to music, studied ethics, etc. Harmless. But yeah, depends on the school type, the individual teacher and the community expectations.

But as someone who came from church from early childhood, scripture class by comparison was toned down and basically curriculum Sunday school and essentially harmless. And that was back in the Howard era.
Sunday school.
That is where religion should be taught.

Do they teach astrology in schools?

Why religion?
 

demondavey

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I went to a Catholic school but realised very early on that there is no afterlife and we are simply advanced animals in terms of our cerebral cortex. We are and have been the most mentally advanced animals on the planet. Nothing points me towards thinking there is a god. Can it even be proven? I’ve seen nothing to indicate such. No proof per say.

What really reinforces that we are animals when all is said and done is that we have spent centuries fighting over interpretation and opinion on God. The Middle East is critically divided over this notion and even as recently for Western countries we saw ‘the troubles’ take hold of Ireland and England due to religion.

Very primitive, yet very advanced.
 

Present Not Past

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I went to a Catholic school but realised very early on that there is no afterlife and we are simply advanced animals in terms of our cerebral cortex. We are and have been the most mentally advanced animals on the planet. Nothing points me towards thinking there is a god. Can it even be proven? I’ve seen nothing to indicate such. No proof per say.

What really reinforces that we are animals when all is said and done is that we have spent centuries fighting over interpretation and opinion on God. The Middle East is critically divided over this notion and even as recently for Western countries we saw ‘the troubles’ take hold of Ireland and England due to religion.

Very primitive, yet very advanced.
What a piece of work is Man.
 

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Boronia67

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The Coalition in Australian politics and the media is the last refuge of Conservatism in Australia They are a barrier to this country moving forward into the future. They will be the death of us all.
Fostering a social homogeneous society which is a key objective of the chaplains in school program is beneficial. We are than able to connect and get along better with each other with less government regulation.
 

Boronia67

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oh I agree Seeds, trust me on that - but if, for some misguided reason, politicians insist on inflicting religion on school children, then a more honest approach would be to encompass all religion, not just the one that the LNP (and tbf the ALP is just as rife with religious nutters) think will curry favour in the ‘Afterlife’ ..
If the objective is to bind people together through a shared set of social values than teaching one religion is the best way to go.
 

CM86

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Fostering a social homogeneous society which is a key objective of the chaplains in school program is beneficial. We are than able to connect and get along better with each other with less government regulation.
What are the benefits, and how are they achieved?

Australia has become more multicultural and diverse in my lifetime. During which the ability to connect has increased, and people seem to be getting along better.
There may be no causation.
I've also noticed that percentage of Australian people who identify as religious, has been declining.

There have been some changes to the trend since 2016.

Could you expand on the involvement of government regulation?
If the objective is to bind people together through a shared set of social values than teaching one religion is the best way to go.
Which religion? Who decides and how?

Why can't we "bind people together" just through social values, education, support, community etc, rather than through the prism of one specific religion?
From what I understand, religions were based on the shared social values of their time. Rather than social values existing due to religion.
 

Deaneus!

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I don't mind Scripture/Religion studies as a philosophy class in primary and early high school for regular public schools. As long as you have the right hippy teachers, it's a nice thing to have in the schedule, like PE, dance, health, design&tech, etc.
i like this - a couple lessons, like

okay class, major religions - christianity first, there's catholicism for the europeans, protestantism for the whackjob americans, islam for the middle east, etc etc. remember it's all bullshit. china are communists so thery're godless bastards. japan go shinto. africa i don't know. everyone used their religions to justify killing everyone else.

but the one true god is the flying spaghetti monster"

would never work in the real world because people. imagine doing this in the US!
 

Deaneus!

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I would have thought the best way to help kids about the stress of climate change is bloody do something about it, rather than sending more propagandists into secular public schools to brainwash the kiddos.
Calm down mate - today's stressed kids are tomorrow's paedo-victims, everybody wins!

(except the climate & the kids)
 

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Rusty Brookes

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Rusty Brookes

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Worth noting that religious people tend to be happier. Obviously a great thing.

1) You can't tell me a devout Catholic living in a third world poo hole is going to be more happy than atheist old me sitting in first world luxury in Australia. The country with the highest suicide rate in the world is Lesotho - a 95% Christian country at 72.4 suicides per 100,000. Sweden (the most atheist country in the western world) has a suicide rate of 14.7 per 100,000.

2) Part of that happiness is self-delusion in putting up with crappy situations in this world because there's promise of eternal paradise in a fictitious one

3) Religious people drink less and they're happier? They've got the maths wrong.

But seriously I honestly don't care what people believe. I'm a secularist and you should have the right to your religion. But the flip side applies and people should have the right to not be bothered by other's religion, particularly in a public setting and particularly in an educational one.
 

Gough

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CM86

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I would have thought the best way to help kids about the stress of climate change is bloody do something about it, rather than sending more propagandists into secular public schools to brainwash the kiddos.
I have my own biases, so I may read into things.
But I believe the main concern is pushing an anti-climate science/pro-fossil fuel agenda, rather than these leaders and groups having any real concern about the mental health of children.

It is actually just virtue signalling.

Putting more funding into mental health would be the most obvious and genuine first step.
 

Boronia67

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What are the benefits, and how are they achieved?

Australia has become more multicultural and diverse in my lifetime. During which the ability to connect has increased, and people seem to be getting along better.
There may be no causation.
I've also noticed that percentage of Australian people who identify as religious, has been declining.

There have been some changes to the trend since 2016.

Could you expand on the involvement of government regulation?

Which religion? Who decides and how?

Why can't we "bind people together" just through social values, education, support, community etc, rather than through the prism of one specific religion?
From what I understand, religions were based on the shared social values of their time. Rather than social values existing due to religion.
A homogeneous society means we are united as one nation rather than divided into separate tribes often conflicting with one and other.

The benefits are many including facing challenges as one, the ability to get along with each other, more civil elections and political discore, people tend to donate more time and money to charitable causes, less crime, less need for government regulation and greater individual freedom.

A simple shared set of social norms and values that bind us together is the right approach. Skin colour is not relevant.

The covid-19 outbreak is a good example of how a lack of cohesiveness can cause trouble. Case numbers are much higher in areas that could be described as ethnic enclaves in Melbourne and Sydney. Than because we are not all on the same page government regulation via lockdowns is required to tackle the virus

Another example is how we tackle climate change. We just can not come close to an agreement.

I would also suggest Its very hard to have a civil political discussion in this country involving people with diverse viewpoints.

The predominant religion in this country is Christianity and it has played a greater role than any other religion in shaping our history.

You can bind people through other avenues by all means. Christianity tho is an effective tool. You get a set of values from one clear source of authority.
 

FredLeDeux

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A homogeneous society means we are united as one nation rather than divided into separate tribes often conflicting with one and other.

The benefits are many including facing challenges as one, the ability to get along with each other, more civil elections and political discore, people tend to donate more time and money to charitable causes, less crime, less need for government regulation and greater individual freedom.

A simple shared set of social norms and values that bind us together is the right approach. Skin colour is not relevant.

The covid-19 outbreak is a good example of how a lack of cohesiveness can cause trouble. Case numbers are much higher in areas that could be described as ethnic enclaves in Melbourne and Sydney. Than because we are not all on the same page government regulation via lockdowns is required to tackle the virus

Another example is how we tackle climate change. We just can not come close to an agreement.

I would also suggest Its very hard to have a civil political discussion in this country involving people with diverse viewpoints.

The predominant religion in this country is Christianity and it has played a greater role than any other religion in shaping our history.

You can bind people through other avenues by all means. Christianity tho is an effective tool. You get a set of values from one clear source of authority.
The last time a society was based on a shared set of values derived from christianity was pre-reformation 16th century Europe.
Personally, I'm glad we've moved on from those barbaric times.
 

Rusty Brookes

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A homogeneous society means we are united as one nation rather than divided into separate tribes often conflicting with one and other.

The benefits are many including facing challenges as one, the ability to get along with each other, more civil elections and political discore, people tend to donate more time and money to charitable causes, less crime, less need for government regulation and greater individual freedom.

A simple shared set of social norms and values that bind us together is the right approach. Skin colour is not relevant.

The covid-19 outbreak is a good example of how a lack of cohesiveness can cause trouble. Case numbers are much higher in areas that could be described as ethnic enclaves in Melbourne and Sydney. Than because we are not all on the same page government regulation via lockdowns is required to tackle the virus

Another example is how we tackle climate change. We just can not come close to an agreement.

I would also suggest Its very hard to have a civil political discussion in this country involving people with diverse viewpoints.

The predominant religion in this country is Christianity and it has played a greater role than any other religion in shaping our history.

You can bind people through other avenues by all means. Christianity tho is an effective tool. You get a set of values from one clear source of authority.
Given Christians can't even agree on how to worship God (shout out to Belfast here and the European Wars of Religion) how is it decided what religion we must adhere to? Given Catholicism is the predominant form of Christianity, everyone had better go out and buy a rosary and a velvet picture of the Pope.

By your logic, you must be OK with what's going on in Afghanistan. After all, all the Taliban wants is a religious homogeneous society.

And I've heard of cognitive dissonance before but suggesting forcing religion on a population will leader to greater individual freedom takes it to a new level.
 

Gough

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Christianity tho is an effective tool. You get a set of values from one clear source of authority.
This is where Christians don't get it, you don't have ownership of deciding what is moral or not. It's entirely possible for people to live an moral life without setting one foot into a church ever. I don''t need fairy tales to know that killing and stealing is wrong in fact I'd go further and say if you need some fictional beardie with a tablet to guide your life and it's values perhaps it's you that needs to re-examine them and not the atheists.
 

Boronia67

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Given Christians can't even agree on how to worship God (shout out to Belfast here and the European Wars of Religion) how is it decided what religion we must adhere to? Given Catholicism is the predominant form of Christianity, everyone had better go out and buy a rosary and a velvet picture of the Pope.

By your logic, you must be OK with what's going on in Afghanistan. After all, all the Taliban wants is a religious homogeneous society.

And I've heard of cognitive dissonance before but suggesting forcing religion on a population will leader to greater individual freedom takes it to a new level.
Let's be clear I am advocating for Chaplains in schools and Christianity to be taught to kids with the parents having the option of pulling them out. Nothing more.
 

Rusty Brookes

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Let's be clear I am advocating for Chaplains in schools and Christianity to be taught to kids with the parents having the option of pulling them out. Nothing more.
But why only Christianity? Why not Islam? Why not Satanism?

It's been established that Satanists want their kids to learn their religion - why should only Christians be taught in schools?


As has been mentioned in this thread, there are Sunday Schools where you can have your kid taught Christianity (although I do like the idea of no child being taught religion until they have the mental capacity to understand what they are being taught having gone through it myself).

BTW - your post wasn't just about Christianity being taught in schools. You very clearly outlined a position that you believe a society should function on the basis of everyone following the same religion
 

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