List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade and F/A Discussion 2022--> PART 2

[Jen2310]

Carry on.

 

[Maggie5]

Updated provisional draft order and trades thanks to Lore.

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

So who are we trading for next year?

 

[jonbe54]

So who are we trading for next year?

THAT is going to be very interesting considering our vastly improved salary cap position . . . .

 

[sr36]

Also highlights everything that is wrong with the equalisation measures. That this years Premier can acquire 3 former 1st round players, and still have pick 7 in the forthcoming draft is a blight on the system.

I don't think that too much is wrong. They've just got to sort out the uncontracted discounts at trade. If a 2-7 year player walks out you'll often get less return than if an 8 year player walks out - and with the compo for these 8 year players, they give out more if the player is younger. So that part of the system isn't working The really big trade win for the Cats was Bowes + 7. Cats have managed their cap brilliantly - with a fair bit of luck due to stars playing for * all. That great management gets them serious perks and put them in a position to make a run at Bowes and they got lucky . System is reasonably equal, but the managements aren't.

 

[Pistol Night]

So who are we trading for next year?

Cadman

 

[magpies42]

Usually best available is a sound strategy. But in our case, if the best available is a midfielder, may pass to concentrate on a KPF. That's probably a greater need, providing a good one can be had. We have plenty of midfielders.

Yes but I think you look at it then from a trade collateral perspective. You’re better off having a Dunkley situation than a Weideman type.

 

[Quicky]

Hey guys,

Said this in response to a Pies poster on our board who came across with an olive branch, and I'm posting it here in the interest of mending fences as well, as I actually really liked Collingwood this year...and this whole Henry thing came out of nowhere - which turned BF and the wider social discussion into an ugly sh*t fight on both sides.

"I'm actually genuinely happy with this outcome. Eliminates some of the bad blood between clubs (will take a while for it to go away, but the deal was fair for all). We were happy with 25 and 33, and essentially in the end that's what we gave up - if you value Cooper at that pick, which is good all round. Meant you kept 25 and 27 and got Mitchell. Hawthorn got a young talent, and we ended up with Henry without all the nonsense of the draft.

All's well that ends well"

********************

I'm not someone who's said 'Pick 25 hahaha' all along. I actually went on trade radio and said to Rendell that I think it should be Pick 18, and was surprised at how it all played out. In the end, I thought 25 and 33 (Sav) or 25 and a Future 2nd might get it done, and that you'd send one of those picks for Mitchell. In the end, that's pretty much how it worked out - but with Cooper leaving instead of Sav, given our depth in the mids but not down back.

It's been an exhausting trade period, with a lot of chinese whispers and not much fact at all. Both clubs valued Ollie differently in terms of where their list is at, but both clubs did what was right by them - and I actually think we can all say that we got a decent end, but not a perfect one for either side...which is generally when you know a trade is pretty fair all around.

Like last time, I won't outstay my welcome as I'm just passing this on...but hopefully we move on and have a fierce match next year.

Good luck in 2023,

Shadow

I think there are going to be bad feelings from this because of how Mackie and Henry's management team chose to play it.

Trading out the 23' 2nd rounder was a cynical tactic to retain the Cats future 1st and to squeeze us with pick 25.

The language from Henry's management team to create leverage: development, pay, environment, brother, homesick trying to paint us in a poor light was really ordinary.

It's well known Geelong treat the Falcons as their personal zone and work on getting the cream home at the 1st opportunity. Clearly this happened with Ollie.

It makes those tactics I just described pretty disgraceful and says a lot about your footy club. I'm satisfied we made the best of a bad hand but I don't think how it played out will be forgotten by us.

 

[sideswipe]

His issue has never been talent. Just application (and decision-making: see doing cocaine on gameday).

Better not to post lies. He didn't do cocaine on gameday.

 

[barrackers]

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Not sure who’s worse with these reviews- Buckenara or these Goombas.

It’s a little funny that Melbourne are being praised for Grundy despite taking on most if not all his contract for the 4 years beyond ‘23, yet at the same time we were criticised when the contract was done. Another example of long term contracts being ok for some clubs, but not others?

 

[Go Woods]

So who are we trading for next year?

Naughton, Logan McDonald or Ben King both OOC 2024, unsure about Naughton OOC 2025?

 

[doppleganger]

Updated provisional draft order and trades thanks to Lore.

That looks like nice work.

Have added 2 players who should be best 22 - Mitchell and McStay. This equals best performed clubs like Richmond / Brisbane / Dees in terms of senior acquisitions.

We also have a couple of senior bodies who help fill weaknesses, and the best draft hand of the 2022 finalists.

And we didnt lose anybody from our 2022 finals team that gave it a real good shake.

Solid trade period.

 

[jonbe54]

It’s a little funny that Melbourne are being praised for Grundy despite taking on most if not all his contract for the 4 years beyond ‘23, yet at the same time we were criticised when the contract was done. Another example of long term contracts being ok for some clubs, but not others?

No another example of Collingwood always being seen to be doing the wrong thing - even if the media have to paint it so.

 

[brysie]

It’s a little funny that Melbourne are being praised for Grundy despite taking on most if not all his contract for the 4 years beyond ‘23, yet at the same time we were criticised when the contract was done. Another example of long term contracts being ok for some clubs, but not others?

Very salient point.

A lot of commentators seem to adopt the attitude that any club who wins a flag is immune to criticism (or the criticism is less severe) for the following few years or so. You'll hear how well they're run as a club and, if a move seems counterintuitive to that team's interests, the commentators will speculate that there has been a shift in approach and/or that everyone (including them) is missing something.

Case in point is Melbourne this year - Melbourne fans were despairing at times this year when their forward line failed to deliver (particularly in the back end of the season), despite having an elite midfield and defensive unit. Now, their two rucks (who are admittedly very good) are consuming a relatively large portion of their salary cap and their forward line is reliant on Tom McDonald returning, Ben Brown staying fit and Van Rooyen being ready to step up and hold down a key position forward spot.

 

[Maggie5]

Just a query, we have lost:

Brown C
Brown T
Grundy (still paying part of salary)
Henry
Chugg
McMahon
Roughhead (R)

Have added, McStay, Hill, Frampton and Mitchell.

How has this helped our salary cap as I doubt the new players would be earning less than those delisted?

 

[KinderSmock]

So who are we trading for next year?

Well, we can start to read through the lines a little bit.

We have virtually no capital which indicates free agents will be the preferred choice. Collingwood has never landed a big name free agent so it would be nice to do that for once. We also probably will want to trade out a handful of players to gain draft picks.

 

[KinderSmock]

Cadman

If GWS take him at one, he's staying there for some time. They've interviewed extensively for players that aren't going home anytime soon.

 

[satanshoof101]

Considering our main midfield group is quite experienced. If both Madgen and Poulter get delisted and we have a spare list spot. We should get Narkle or Stocker to train on with us over the summer. Both young and surely have their best footy ahead of them. Imagine the influence of Pendlebury, Sidebottom, and Mitchell would have on those two developing Midfielders. Both offer a point of difference Stocker would be a more defensive mid while Narkle is a more attacking mid. Both would have the capacity to fill in if we get injuries to our older midfield and we don’t have to throw our younger midfielders to the sharks.

Also surely either Stocker or Narkle would take what we were going to pay Fiorini

 

[sr36]

Protecting that future first was what it was about. Mackie on sen we gave up a lot for 25 to facilitate Collingwood wanting a higher pick. We tried to get higher than 25.

Deal for the snow flake could have been done in 2 minutes with their future first and seemingly didn’t check with Wright if 25 would get it done.

I think he thought he had us snookered and we'd have to fold rather than taking nothing. But when he realised Wright wouldn't do that deal as there really wasn't enough gap between 41 which will come in a bit and 25 for him to become a big unders taker he had to ship out Sav or Stephens. Preferably Stephens as Sav is bloody good tall depth for a team in contention. I think Mackie got a bit lucky TBH. And has damaged trust in his future trades making them harder.

 

[jonbe54]

Just a query, we have lost:

Brown C
Brown T
Grundy (still paying part of salary)
Henry
Chugg
McMahon
Roughhead (R)

Have added, McStay, Hill, Frampton and Mitchell.

How has this helped our salary cap as I doubt the new players would be earning less than those delisted?

I don't believe it is slashing the cap so much as re-distribution - GW and Sly have unrelentingly talked about doing this and it makes sense.

Roughy retired, Grundy we are paying out in a lump sum this year, the Browns simply were never going to make it big, McMahon hasn't show enough and the little bitch was desperate to be a big fish in a small pond again.

We needed a capable tall at either end, a live wire small forward and a clearance beast.

Mission accomplished and we still have 3 under 30 picks to take to the draft.

 

[gouki88]

Better not to post lies. He didn't do cocaine on gameday.

Didn't he? That was my memory of what happened. Was it just a positive test?

 

[brysie]

Considering our main midfield group is quite experienced. If both Madgen and Poulter get delisted and we have a spare list spot. We should get Narkle or Stocker to train on with us over the summer. Both young and surely have their best footy ahead of them. Imagine the influence of Pendlebury, Sidebottom, and Mitchell would have on those two developing Midfielders. Both offer a point of difference Stocker would be a more defensive mid while Narkle is a more attacking mid. Both would have the capacity to fill in if we get injuries to our older midfield and we don’t have to throw our younger midfielders to the sharks.

Also surely either Stocker or Narkle would take what we were going to pay Fiorini

Is it known why Geelong chose to delist Narkle?

 

[satanshoof101]

So who are we trading for next year?
We should go after Tom De Koning

12

Tom De Koning

Age

24

Ht

201cm

Wt

102kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.0

4star

CL

0.5

2star

HO

1.5

4star

No current season stats available

D

8.0

2star

K

3.0

1star

HB

5.0

4star

CL

0.5

3star

HO

1.5

5star

, could literally play anywhere and would especially help our ruck/fwd situation.

 

[doofdoof]

So who are we trading for next year?

Naughton, Logan McDonald or Ben King both OOC 2024, unsure about Naughton OOC 2025?

We could also do a Bowes or Grundy type trade where we gain a good pick or player from a team looking to dump.

That flexibility/optionality can be weaponised if another team need to rid itself of something they don't want in their cap, especially if we are not only one of the only clubw with space, but also a destination club with real chances to win a flag (vs a North who nobody wants to go to!)

 

[gouki88]

So who are we trading for next year?
We should go after Tom De Koning, could literally play anywhere and would especially help our ruck/fwd situation.

Is he any good?