Review Collingwood v Geelong: Shanks For The Memories

[iGNITER]

Geez what a terrible game that was.

 

[Finnishpie]

Play like we did today and we'll lose to the dogs and wouldn't be surprised if we lost both. Bring that team from round 4 and we'll win and win well. This might be a cliche but it rings true - what separates the goods teams from the "promising" (or in our case -read frustrating) middling teams we need to bring that round 4 team every week or at least most weeks.

If we can't and that is probably likely then we may as well pack it up and go home, personally I'm sick and tired of having my hopes bolstered by glimpses of world domination only to realise a false dawn year after year. When will it end?

I felt this one coming. A combination of things. Injuries mounting. Young players slowing down. Slow decline in class in the team. Thing is, we just need Reid, Pendlebury, Elliot, Maynard, Aish in the team. Our second tier players just aren’t that good or are too young to sustain an entire season.

If you said we’d be 4/4 at this point in January, I’d have been okay with it as long as I’ve seen improvement, which I have.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I felt this one coming. A combination of things. Injuries mounting. Young players slowing down. Slow decline in class in the team. Thing is, we just need Reid, Pendlebury, Elliot, Maynard, Aish in the team. Our second tier players just aren’t that good or are too young to sustain an entire season.

If you said we’d be 4/4 at this point in January, I’d have been okay with it as long as I’ve seen improvement, which I have.

It would be impossible to have Elliot, Wells & Reid on the park for 18, 19 games a year. Thing is they're those constantly injured types and Pendles and Dunn are what now 30? Does the club really think we can flag with the list we've got? Sure if the planets align every week and that allows us to play to potential then yeah - you could say that for 10 -11 other teams right now.

Yeah nah, we're just makin up the numbers as usual - another year again.

 

[Finnishpie]

It would be impossible to have Elliot, Wells & Reid on the park for 18, 19 games a year. Thing is they're those constantly injured types and Pendles and Dunn are what now 30? Does the club really think we can flag with the list we've got? Sure if the planets align every week and that allows us to play to potential then yeah - you could say that for 10 -11 other teams right now.

Yeah nah, we're just makin up the numbers as usual - another year again.

I think our style and some of the new players are on the right track though. Sadly, as you say, we have some problems with age - which is why we can’t lose Moore or De Goey or we’ll be a mess.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I think our style and some of the new players are on the right track though. Sadly, as you say, we have some problems with age - which is why we can’t lose Moore or De Goey or we’ll be a mess.

Well Moore is one of those constant injured - so yeah there's your answer. Mess

 

[ColinMochrie]

It would be impossible to have Elliot, Wells & Reid on the park for 18, 19 games a year. Thing is they're those constantly injured types and Pendles and Dunn are what now 30? Does the club really think we can flag with the list we've got? Sure if the planets align every week and that allows us to play to potential then yeah - you could say that for 10 -11 other teams right now.

Yeah nah, we're just makin up the numbers as usual - another year again.

I mean of course we were going to just make up the numbers this year. That was always going to be the case. I just wanted to see an actual game plan and to stop the terrible rebounding that teams destroyed us with in the last few years with our terrible zoning.

There has been improvement this year and even our bad games (bar round 1) at least the game plan stood up. Our problem now is our depth and disposal.

Yes it's still a bad problem to have and I dont count the injuries to Wells, Reid and Elliot because they have been injured for 4 years. But we have suffered more injuries than just them. And losing multiple players IN games is a huge problem that will effect matches.

Hopefully with our captain and a few of our better midfielders coming back in the team we can beat the teams more around our tier on the ladder and set ourselves up for a crack at finals.

Really these next 4-6 weeks is what will make or break our season. We could win all of them and realistically would hope to win at least 4 of them if we are going to make finals.

We have lost to teams that are in the premiership race. Hawks have rebounded and look a threat, cats and Richmond were always going to be challengers. The only loss that looks bad at this point (in terms of ladder position) is the GWS game as they haven't really played well this year but they are a talented team.

So yeah for me there has been improvement since round 1 with a clear game plan. We need to figure out these injuries (not including Reid Elliot and Wells) and why they happen year after year. If we can get some consistency on the park we would perform better.

4-4 isn't a terrible result considering the teams we have played. However with the injuries now adding up the "easy run" has become a bit harder. If we can get some wins in the next month and get some of our better ball users back on the park we will be in a good position to make finals which is all I was hoping for this year.

 

[Linda_Lovelace]

Its hard to get too upset about yesterday. Its very hard to play consistent footy when your side is constantly being hit by injuries.

Some are just bad luck but the recurring type are doing my head in. I just don't understand why the club cannot manage our players better. I am not meant to have the answers, there are so called experts at the club to handle it. I really wonder what the board does at its meetings. They seem to be living in an alternate universe.

Maybe they will realize when crowds drop off, its is so deflating to see the same old crap happen year after year.

 

[Gone Critical]

Its hard to get too upset about yesterday. Its very hard to play consistent footy when your side is constantly being hit by injuries.

Some are just bad luck but the recurring type are doing my head in. I just don't understand why the club cannot manage our players better. I am not meant to have the answers, there are so called experts at the club to handle it. I really wonder what the board does at its meetings. They seem to be living in an alternate universe.

Maybe they will realize when crowds drop off, its is so deflating to see the same old crap happen year after year.

Not sure what you expect the club to do. We don't have big numbers of soft tissue injuries compared to the rest of the competition and all the players currently suffering them have some risk factors involved which no one can change.

 

[marshdogg]

I see a lot of forward bashing which is unfair imo. The issue was we went through the middle at least a dozen times and turned it over. Forward handballs and inboard chips are high risk high reward, which is why guys like adams, treloar, murray, crisp, often do more harm than good.

 

[DaVe86]

Don't know what to feel after yesterday.

In a lot of ways, I feel that it was a major step backwards. I felt like I was timewarped backed to 2017. It was a familiar feeling where we were more than in the game in general play and statistically, yet couldn't capitalize on forward entries or shots on goals. Far too many turnovers and just slow ball movement. Plus add another 2 injuries to the mix, and I really felt like I did last year. I was emotionally unattached to the game and gave up hope pretty quick.

In other ways, I kind of expected this performance to come sooner or later. Let's face it, we were pretty average in the previous 5 quarters leading into this game, we were missing our skipper, and there was always going to be a tipping point after a pretty solid schedule in the previous 3 weeks. I felt as if we were flat, and just couldn't get going.

I also felt like we've been poor around stoppages and in the ruck over the past fortnight. We've given up some really easy centre clearances, and far too many stoppage goals in our defensive 50. We got away with it last week, but it was the difference this week with the Cats just getting crucial goals at crucial times.

I won't be blaming injuries on this match as we were playing poorly even before we lose Moore and Phillips. But it is concerning that we'll now be without Reid, Moore and Elliott for a few more weeks. It's just hard to keep the momentum going when we have so many guys coming in and out.

Ultimately, we all said at the start of the year that we need to be 4-4 after round 8. We've achieved that. So it's not doom and gloom. Our next 2 games are winnable, but are at Etihad against sides that play that ground frequently. They are the most important games for the season for us. Win them and go 6-4 and the hard work from the opening 2 months will pay off. Lose them, and we could quickly slip to another 12th-14th place finish given the high injury toll.

We'll need to clear up the ground ball in our defensive 50. Both the Saints and the Dogs are filled with small forward types.

 

[Axl the great]

Agree. More talking our overall weakness. Nonetheless we lacked any forward threat today also.

Geelong designed it to go the way it did.
The congestion at both ends, the scrappy man on man around the contest played right into Geelongs hands.
And typical Collingwood once the pressure comes on for a while our disposal and decision making goes to crap for the whole game, including pathetic goal kicking.

On a side note, I thought footy wasn't too bad to watch these days until I Youtoubed Collingwood vs Brisbane round 8 2003. What a game! The skills were sublime, nobody fumbled, it was free flowing and It was just a beautiful game to watch.
Today's game is a boring rugby style scrum and I'll watch Pies games from now and that's about it.

 

[Axl the great]

I think our style and some of the new players are on the right track though. Sadly, as you say, we have some problems with age - which is why we can’t lose Moore or De Goey or we’ll be a mess.

De Goey would be a massive blow and would set us back in a big way.
Moore if we get a great return I would take it and run on exposed form. Moore could be something else or he could be the next Rhys Stanley.
For me Darcy doesn't show enough glimpses just yet or for long enough in games, this may mean he's a slow burner and could really be something at 24 or 25.
Should we be able to snare the no1 pick or Lynch by trading Darcy then it's a pretty easy call from my perspective.

 

[sideswipe]

Not sure what you expect the club to do. We don't have big numbers of soft tissue injuries compared to the rest of the competition and all the players currently suffering them have some risk factors involved which no one can change.

You are never going to win against the medical staff baggers.

Things are going ok thus far in the year. 8 games in we have played all of last year's prelim finalists plus what can now be judged to be a good Hawthorn team. We have won every game we were expected to win (think Hawthorn was close to even money?) plus the surprise win against Adelaide.

We now have a big stretch of games where we will start favorite. Get to the bye with 7-5 or even 8-4 and we will be flying.

 

[Gone Critical]

Geelong designed it to go the way it did.
The congestion at both ends, the scrappy man on man around the contest played right into Geelongs hands.
And typical Collingwood once the pressure comes on for a while our disposal and decision making goes to crap for the whole game, including pathetic goal kicking.

On a side note, I thought footy wasn't too bad to watch these days until I Youtoubed Collingwood vs Brisbane round 8 2003. What a game! The skills were sublime, nobody fumbled, it was free flowing and It was just a beautiful game to watch.
Today's game is a boring rugby style scrum and I'll watch Pies games from now and that's about it.

I take a slightly different view. The only reason todays game can be played in the phone box like it is is because of the fabulous skills the players have. 2003 may have been aesthetically better to look at but it didnt need the skills of the current player because they had time and space. The speed and ability to hit targets quickly and precisely allows the current game to become as congested as it has.

 

[Axl the great]

I take a slightly different view. The only reason todays game can be played in the phone box like it is is because of the fabulous skills the players have. 2003 may have been aesthetically better to look at but it didnt need the skills of the current player because they had time and space. The speed and ability to hit targets quickly and precisely allows the current game to become as congested as it has.

Agree to a certain point but the pressure around the football and most importantly the perceived pressure players think they are under can make for horrible viewing.
The game from 15 years ago I watched the other day was as you described in style yes, however I could count on one hand the horrible turnovers we see in the modern game today every couple of possessions. With the same fitness levels those Collingwood and Brisbane teams from 2002 2003 would absolutely cream todays AFL teams in my opinion.

 

[Gone Critical]

Agree to a certain point but the pressure around the football and most importantly the perceived pressure players think they are under can make for horrible viewing.
The game from 15 years ago I watched the other day was as you described in style yes, however I could count on one hand the horrible turnovers we see in the modern game today every couple of possessions. With the same fitness levels those Collingwood and Brisbane teams from 2002 2003 would absolutely cream todays AFL teams in my opinion.

Always an interesting debate but I have to go the other way. The current players are bigger but even taking that away have grown up playing footy with a speed of movement that would mesmerise the 2002-3 players. They wouldnt even see the ball before it was gone. The current teams would smash them for mine.

I am a bit biased as I love the modern game for its speed and movement in close. Just continues to evolve.

 

[sideswipe]

Agree to a certain point but the pressure around the football and most importantly the perceived pressure players think they are under can make for horrible viewing.
The game from 15 years ago I watched the other day was as you described in style yes, however I could count on one hand the horrible turnovers we see in the modern game today every couple of possessions. With the same fitness levels those Collingwood and Brisbane teams from 2002 2003 would absolutely cream todays AFL teams in my opinion.

Did you know your former drummer was the guest speaker at the Collingwood President's lunch yesterday?

 

[Linda_Lovelace]

Not sure what you expect the club to do. We don't have big numbers of soft tissue injuries compared to the rest of the competition and all the players currently suffering them have some risk factors involved which no one can change.

Its year after year that we have important players suffering from recurring soft tissue injuries.

 

[Maggie5]

Not sure if right thread but can someone tell me how the stat of 'tackle' is defined?

Does the stat mean that player has been halted in play thereby ensuring a stoppage occurs and or free kick due to incorrect disposal?

 

[partypie]

Here we go again.


We are not a bottom six team. Stop carrying on like such a ******* sook all the time.

Damn ease up on Dave a little mate - he might go a bit overboard but he cares and nobody can argue that he's a devoted Collingwood man.

While I don't agree with him right now I'm worried that he might not be completely off the mark, as some worrying signs are starting to emerge:

• Were now officially exposed in what was already an area of weakness (KPFs).

• Grundy is clearly struggling after a really strong start to the season (he must be carrying some sort or injury).

• The two glimmers of hope for the forward line (Elliott and Moore) are now out for at least another 4-6 weeks.

• Selection committee stubbornly sticking with vanilla players who "play a role" (not really) and don't add a point of difference or threaten the opposition in any meaningful way.

• Our steady regression back to our old style of indecisive, indirect and inaccurate football (Brisbane game notwithstanding as there was no defensive structure on either side).

• Our defensive structures don't appear to be holding up (or perhaps aren't sustainable)

• The dip in performance from in our midfield, who now generally lose the arm wrestle in the middle and rely on our back line to intercept and set up our forays forward.

• Our marked inability to apply scoreboard pressure when we are in control in general play.

Add all that together with our inability to escape the clutches of the injury imp and it paints a picture of a 4-4 side that may be heading in the wrong direction.

Once again I'm not saying that Dave is right about us being a bottom 6 team, but there's a nagging little voice at the back of my head that is saying there's a chance that he might not be wrong.

 

[Chameleon75]

Not sure if right thread but can someone tell me how the stat of 'tackle' is defined?

Does the stat mean that player has been halted in play thereby ensuring a stoppage occurs and or free kick due to incorrect disposal?

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2017-12-28/stats-glossary-every-stat-explained

Preventing an effective disposal

 

[Maggie5]

Its hard to get too upset about yesterday. Its very hard to play consistent footy when your side is constantly being hit by injuries.

Some are just bad luck but the recurring type are doing my head in. I just don't understand why the club cannot manage our players better. I am not meant to have the answers, there are so called experts at the club to handle it. I really wonder what the board does at its meetings. They seem to be living in an alternate universe.

Maybe they will realize when crowds drop off, its is so deflating to see the same old crap happen year after year.

It is the recurring in-game injury (same one) after supposedly being fit to play that is doing my head in.

http://m.afl.com.au/news/2017-12-28/stats-glossary-every-stat-explained
Preventing an effective disposal

Thank you.
Gee, not so sure I will place that much emphasis on it now, as one could make a tackle, ball spills and another player from opposing team picks it up and goals.

 

[jackcass]

One week doesn't a season make. Think Elliott is the only one on our list who has ever kicked 30+ goals in a season for Collingwood. We seriously lack forward fire power compared to the competition and relying on a few cameo goal kickers to allow us good scoring on the odd occasion won't cut it. We desperately need a forward or two who can kick 40+. Teams essentially don't make finals without that if you look at recent history.

I think availability is our biggest issue. If anyone had told me pre-season we'd be 4-4 after 8 rounds with next to zero impact from Moore, Elliott and Fasolo I'd have laughed at them. Add that Reid has missed the last 3 games. I think most teams rely on their mids and fringe forwards to hit the scoreboard (10-20 goals) to some degree but if given a choice I wouldn't like to be relying on them for so many games.

 

[jackcass]

Our skills and missing key players let us down today. Our courage and tenacity was outstanding. We controlled the last 40 minutes of the game and despite constant near misses when kicking for goal (most were literally six inches to the wrong side of the post) we never dropped our heads. The resolve and spirit was commendable. I listened to 3AW and they were very upbeat about our performance. Ling and Richardson both thought we ran all over Geelong in the last quarter and only needed to convert one of our many shots on goal to get some real momentum and cause some panic. It didn't eventuate but anyone who throws up their hands and gives us away based on that performance is kidding themselves.

I agree. I think there'd be some real questions being asked down at the cattery at the moment even though they got the 4 points. Rare that a team lacking 2 players for a significant period of a game can push so hard for so long and but for a few errant shots on goal would have seriously pushed the outcome. Especially when we were so terrible for much of the 1st quarter when we had the full 22 available.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Let's all remain positive here re.

Good thing to come out of the weekend was Charles Kurnow kicking the seeler to hand over the Jack Lukosios Cup to Brisbane re.

And Weiterslug and Duck face SOS playing agst the Werribee Stingrays or whatever re.. 2 halies.