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Jindrrk

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Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but it relates to O'Meara so here will do.

There have been a lot of recent rumblings about the North medical team and Saunders in particular, mainly based on the growing incidence of soft tissue injuries (especially hammies) and very long recovery times. Before last year, I never really paid much notice to the negative comments, writing it off as the nature of the game means that there will be injuries and it's a bit unfair to blame the medicos. Last year, and especially this pre-season, has me re-thinking the matter. I'm now more open to the suggestion that there is a problem with injury prevention and management at NMFC.

All that is background to the main point - who the f*** rejected O'Meara when he had his (alleged) medical with us last year? Recall that this was at a time when he hadn't even started talking to Hawthorn (or at the very least, we were in more advanced talks if O'Meara tested with us first). If we had in him the box seat then lost him due to an incorrect medical decision, then surely this needs to be investigated.
I am not going to cry over Jaeger as what is done and we have a lot to look forward too, but I am in the same vote as you; but what tipped me over the edge was last night seeing the Ben Jacobs news. I was riled. How can a guy be in the position to re-fracture it? I guess I shouldnt blurt out since I am not familiar or have knowledge in fractures.....but I think a player shouldnt be in a position to re-fracture it again. And it didnt help when Mason Wood's mysterious hamstring injury earlier in the week.

I am now wondering what is going on. And this Saunders being stationed in Adelaide now part time or whatever it making me wonder if they are just slowly pushing him out the door without trying to cause a fuss or bring attention to it.

I usually dont like to read too much into things or be overly critical of the club, but after last nights news it made me scratching my head wtf is going on.

And withj Jaeger, I was told by a couple of physios, one I know and one who I am a client of; that they dont expect Jaeger to play for too long and that hawks have taken a massive risk. So we will see how that pans out.
 

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LuvtheKangas

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i dont think the opinion has been proven otherwise just yet.
Yeah, agree to a large extent with you and the other posters who said something similar. When I formed the opinion yesterday and discussed it with a couple of people, I was suggesting that if Jaeger got through the season then this would be a serious indictment on the medical team's decision.

But when I thought about it more this morning, I came to the conclusion that if his knee was so bad that he was not considered worth the risk, he shouldn't have been able to do what he did yesterday.
 

shintemaster

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But when I thought about it more this morning, I came to the conclusion that if his knee was so bad that he was not considered worth the risk, he shouldn't have been able to do what he did yesterday.
Not sure it works that way though...

Hawks have won a stack of premierships in the last decade, they can afford to gamble in a way we shouldn't IMHO. The proof won't be in whether he has a good year or even a couple. If he's still on their list in 5 years and has been a consistent contributor for that time then maybe we can look at it - and who we picked up with any potential picks. I just don't think we were in a position to gamble on him and it is way too early to even begin assessing.
 

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Not sure it works that way though...

Hawks have won a stack of premierships in the last decade, they can afford to gamble in a way we shouldn't IMHO. The proof won't be in whether he has a good year or even a couple. If he's still on their list in 5 years and has been a consistent contributor for that time then maybe we can look at it - and who we picked up with any potential picks. I just don't think we were in a position to gamble on him and it is way too early to even begin assessing.
Hawks gave up pick 10 and second 2017 pick. If you think about equivalence, it'd be like not getting Jy Simpkin and potentially compromising the Hrovat deal.

I'm a bit salty over it, but it will be one of those ones where 'time will tell'.

Also, re Saunders, his move back to Adelaide and still being with us part-time makes sense given JB's departure. He got him over and I would have thought the tenures were linked somewhat. Still good we have his input now though.

That said, I was wondering, given he's a groin man, is it possible that any injury prevention work in this area may have an inadvertant indirect affect on the hamstrings? Working gluts, I believe, helps with adducters etc. but is it possible that there is a relay affect? Or, simply a failure, as per last year, to assess the impact of limited rotations with more burst speeds, rather than endurance? Also, most of the said players are younger. Not sure if that's an issue or not?

We need to count Higgins (collision) and Garner (predisposition to hammies?) out of this. Also, Luke's injury chasing Cyril wasn't something you couldn't have anticipated, just as Cyril did one chasing Atley (or being chased by Atley).
 

B Tron

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Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but it relates to O'Meara so here will do.

There have been a lot of recent rumblings about the North medical team and Saunders in particular, mainly based on the growing incidence of soft tissue injuries (especially hammies) and very long recovery times. Before last year, I never really paid much notice to the negative comments, writing it off as the nature of the game means that there will be injuries and it's a bit unfair to blame the medicos. Last year, and especially this pre-season, has me re-thinking the matter. I'm now more open to the suggestion that there is a problem with injury prevention and management at NMFC.

All that is background to the main point - who the f*** rejected O'Meara when he had his (alleged) medical with us last year? Recall that this was at a time when he hadn't even started talking to Hawthorn (or at the very least, we were in more advanced talks if O'Meara tested with us first). If we had in him the box seat then lost him due to an incorrect medical decision, then surely this needs to be investigated.
Dude wanted Hawthorn from the get go. We were never in the running anyway.
 

B Tron

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Hawks gave up pick 10 and second 2017 pick. If you think about equivalence, it'd be like not getting Jy Simpkin and potentially compromising the Hrovat deal.

I'm a bit salty over it, but it will be one of those ones where 'time will tell'.

Also, re Saunders, his move back to Adelaide and still being with us part-time makes sense given JB's departure. He got him over and I would have thought the tenures were linked somewhat. Still good we have his input now though.

That said, I was wondering, given he's a groin man, is it possible that any injury prevention work in this area may have an inadvertant indirect affect on the hamstrings? Working gluts, I believe, helps with adducters etc. but is it possible that there is a relay affect? Or, simply a failure, as per last year, to assess the impact of limited rotations with more burst speeds, rather than endurance? Also, most of the said players are younger. Not sure if that's an issue or not?

We need to count Higgins (collision) and Garner (predisposition to hammies?) out of this. Also, Luke's injury chasing Cyril wasn't something you couldn't have anticipated, just as Cyril did one chasing Atley (or being chased by Atley).
Think it was more Scott than JB who got him over.

And he is more than a groin man. His speciality is the whole lumbar region and the interaction of all joints/tendons/ligaments/muscles in that whole area. Basically all the key aspects re running etc are through that area. And he is a gun.

Last year we had hamstring tendon problems which means the muscles were made too strong too quickly so they failed under increased load. Dan Meehan implemented the conditioning aspects before he bailed early in the year but I suspect the base assumptions used in commencing the use of Kangatech at the club (ie base measurments as to what optimal muscle performance looks like) were off, hence the results were pinging tendons.

You would hope that over time this would be addressed and rectified. We have to remember that hammys happen quite regularly but if Woods is a tendon then there should be serious questions.

But on O'Meara, his injuries were serious and repeat meaning real risk for long term damage. He will need to be managed throughout his career and the risk of further damage is elevated due to the pressure and movement around that joint. At this stage he is up and going but how long will that last?
 

Kimbo

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Think it was more Scott than JB who got him over.

And he is more than a groin man. His speciality is the whole lumbar region and the interaction of all joints/tendons/ligaments/muscles in that whole area. Basically all the key aspects re running etc are through that area. And he is a gun.
Scott wanted him, but I seem to recall it was the relationship with JB (SA) that was the clincher?!

Thanks re the other para. :ballotcheck:
 

LuvtheKangas

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Dude wanted Hawthorn from the get go. We were never in the running anyway.
I suspect that's true, making the point somewhat (but not completely) moot. If rejecting him was an incorrect medical decision, it is still an indictment on the team making the decision, notwithstanding the subsequent indication that we were never in the running for his services.
 

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Jindrrk

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Also remember LuvTheKangas that theres always another great player coming.....and as Kimbo said above that could be Simpkin we may of traded away and possibly even Hrovat. Personally I'd rather not sell the farm to take a chance on a player who might or not be the best player in the upcoming years. There will be other players....maybe not as good as Jaeger but at least they have more of a chance staying on the park over 10 years than he may.
 

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Todd Goldstein scoffs at talk North Melbourne will slide in 2017

LAUREN WOOD, Herald Sun
February 27, 2017 7:30pm

TODD Goldstein has no time for doubters and has rubbished suggestions that North Melbourne could be on the slide this season.

Key quartet Brent Harvey, Drew Petrie, Nick Dal Santo and Michael Firrito were all let go by the club at the end of last season, with coach Brad Scott declaring at the time that blooding younger players was to be a focus.

The club has avoided the term “rebuild” throughout the last six months.


The Kangaroos defeated Hawthorn by 21 points on Sunday and while the All-Australian ruckman emphasised the fact that “it is only the pre-season”, he is buoyed by the team’s prospects — despite talk that a dip in performance could be on the cards in 2017.

“I think this side is a lot more capable and a lot better than we’re given credit for,” Goldstein declared.

“A core of our group is still here that have been in preliminary finals. We’ve got the experience still and everyone on the outside can say what they want and, until the real stuff starts, no one knows.

“We’re not going to put a ceiling on it. Our goal is to play finals and go from there. We’re definitely good enough to do that.”

Goldstein, 28, said it was familiar territory for the Roos.

“It’s one of those things about being North Melbourne — I don’t think I’ve ever been here when we’ve been a side that has been picked to do very well,” he said.

“We’ve always been the underdogs. If that’s the title we’ve got to take, that’s what we’ll take. We don’t really worry about too much. It’s about how we’re training and how we’re performing on game day.

“The wins will take care of themselves.”


The ruckman — who had set himself during the pre-season to feature in the return to Arden Street clash — played 65 per cent of game time in Sunday’s win and rucked for the entirety of that. Goldstein felt he combined well with young big man Braydon Preuss, who booted three goals.

“He had a real presence,” Goldstein said of his teammate.

“He’s going to take some confidence from that ... we’ve got to deflate his head a little bit.

“I’ll play whatever role the coaches want me to play. If that’s me playing one-out (in the ruck), I’ll play one-out.

“If it’s me and Preussy playing together — and we showed (on Sunday) that we can do it — it’s whatever the coaches want and whatever’s best for our footy club to win a premiership.”
 
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I am not going to cry over Jaeger as what is done and we have a lot to look forward too, but I am in the same vote as you; but what tipped me over the edge was last night seeing the Ben Jacobs news. I was riled. How can a guy be in the position to re-fracture it? I guess I shouldnt blurt out since I am not familiar or have knowledge in fractures.....but I think a player shouldnt be in a position to re-fracture it again. And it didnt help when Mason Wood's mysterious hamstring injury earlier in the week.

I am now wondering what is going on. And this Saunders being stationed in Adelaide now part time or whatever it making me wonder if they are just slowly pushing him out the door without trying to cause a fuss or bring attention to it.

I usually dont like to read too much into things or be overly critical of the club, but after last nights news it made me scratching my head wtf is going on.

And withj Jaeger, I was told by a couple of physios, one I know and one who I am a client of; that they dont expect Jaeger to play for too long and that hawks have taken a massive risk. So we will see how that pans out.
BUT and this is a just me being highly sceptical, what weight do you really give to physio's opinions? Personally not much. In fairness though dfdespite writing the profession off as a bunch of glorified masseuses (without the happy ending) I was recently introduced to one who I will only describe as a ruddy genius. I'd been treated for a hip/lower back/adductor problem in Sydney by a guy who works with a lot of the swans players. After a couple of months, (and over a grand) and excruciating pain just to walk I went to the doc and asked for scans, drugs, anything and everything to sort me out. He said no, go and see the physio, told him I had, and he said not this physio you haven't. After 1 consultation, with this young bloke fresh out of uni who was running his own practice, he had me doing different stretches, working with rubber bands, doing a load of different pilates exercises, and within a fortnight I was doing dead lifts twice my body weight and running again. I really don't know what my point is here, except that physical demands on players are changing all the time as is medical thought and the best way to prevent and treat injuries. Just as "old fashioned" coaches have been phased out, is it possible some new thought into the medical side of things may be overdue? dunno I'm no doc (or physio)
 

Jindrrk

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BUT and this is a just me being highly sceptical, what weight do you really give to physio's opinions? Personally not much. In fairness though dfdespite writing the profession off as a bunch of glorified masseuses (without the happy ending) I was recently introduced to one who I will only describe as a ruddy genius. I'd been treated for a hip/lower back/adductor problem in Sydney by a guy who works with a lot of the swans players. After a couple of months, (and over a grand) and excruciating pain just to walk I went to the doc and asked for scans, drugs, anything and everything to sort me out. He said no, go and see the physio, told him I had, and he said not this physio you haven't. After 1 consultation, with this young bloke fresh out of uni who was running his own practice, he had me doing different stretches, working with rubber bands, doing a load of different pilates exercises, and within a fortnight I was doing dead lifts twice my body weight and running again. I really don't know what my point is here, except that physical demands on players are changing all the time as is medical thought and the best way to prevent and treat injuries. Just as "old fashioned" coaches have been phased out, is it possible some new thought into the medical side of things may be overdue? dunno I'm no doc (or physio)
Funny you brought it up. My physio I believe knows Steve. My physio is old school and used to work for one of the clubs. I cant say what kind of physio Steve is but I believe mine had positive words. I am certainly not here to criticise Steve or the team; my issue is just I am left wondering what is going down there. Last season cost us due to the amount of injuries and this year seems to be an uphill battle already with some missing proper preseason and some getting injured before the season starts.

Glad to hear you have sorted it out. If you dont mind, can you shoot me across your physio details as I am looking for an alternative one....its ok that if its in QLD. I am battling constant hip, glute med and piriformis issues and wouldnt mind seeing your one when I visit my brother who lives in Bris for an alternative assessment.
 

koshari

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iam thinking we are on a par at least with Hrovat, Preuss, and possibly Simpkin or Atley in the middle and VW.
admittedly iam placing big expectations on Jy but on the other hand i didnt think NDSs season last year would be that hard to replicate and from early signs Ats could be handy up the ground.

The bigger hole to fill will be Wellsy whos good games last year were A grade.
 
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