Opinion Commentary & Media IV

[Psicosis]

It's not that deep, though.

We comfortably beat last year's premiers last year, and then at 2-0 this year (both wins against current top 8 sides) things were pretty good. We then got smashed by injuries and it exposed that our depth is poor. Now, partly that was from poor drafting and trading, and partly from senior players being given too many chances (credits in the bank and all that) when dropping them and giving young players a go would have been great for development.

This year, with many of those young players performing well having been given that chance, shows the folly of the previous approach.

So we could do a lot of good with getting rid of some of the low-hanging fruit - those constantly injured (eg Garner, Jacobs), those who have been on the list for years and never cemented a spot (Durdin, Wood, etc).

You give short-term contracts for those who are getting old but are still best 22 (Macmillan, Pittard) and the Joeys who haven't had a proper chance yet (Murphy, Crocker) and say to the young players, you have to force the oldies out. If they can't, well, that tells us something.

I think there is a real danger in cutting too hard. The best 22 is reasonable, but the depth has been shown up, and it doesn't require a full rebuild to fix that.

Regardless of what happens with the 25-30 year old group, I don't think we have the strong young core yet to win a flag.

Do we have some promise? Absolutely we do, the kids have been a real positive of 2020. However, can we put our hand up and say categorically they are capable of bringing us back to contender status? I can't yet.

I really rate what Freo has done (and this isn't just due to them getting a plug on the couch). Over 3 years they added 6 first round picks (Cerra, Brayshaw, Sturt, Henry, Serong, Young). This is what I want us to do, whether or not you label that as rebuilding is really a matter of opinion.

 

[Kanga Glory]

All of this seems to stem from an article published last week that suggests smaller clubs should basically become nurseries for bigger clubs.

We don’t lose many players we want to keep, as we know once you walk through the Arden st gates there is something special and if that doesn’t work imagine telling Archer you want out

 

[Snake_Baker]

.............imagine telling Archer you want out

 

[La Flama Blanca]

The four clubs you listed have an abundance of players that were highly rated juniors playing for them - Acquired through the draft, trade or Academy.. We have tried the trade route, we've got access to TT through academy, our last mechanism really seems to be the draft.

I think it's clear that you need a club that drives high standards and professionalism, no argument from me on that point. However when it comes to talent, raw talent, an area we are seen as lacking in by the majority of AFL perception, I see no other avenue then having high picks to get us access to the most talented juniors in the country.

Does this mean that some picks may flop? Absolutely, especially with our drafting inconsistencies in the past. However the reality is that without access to the best junior talent in the country (coupled with driving high club standards), I don't think we will challenge as a genuine contender.

The two combined is definitely a good strategy. I just hope the club doesn't think it's just a matter of collecting a few picks and we're a contender because it's really not that simple as the Melbournes and Carltons of the world have shown over many years.

 

[ferball]

We don’t lose many players we want to keep, as we know once you walk through the Arden st gates there is something special and if that doesn’t work imagine telling Archer you want out

Not right now. Tho I agree it's a cool place and long may that continue.

I just re read the article..

I'll highlight the key bits..

Sources familiar with North's shift in thinking said that while the club wasn't planning to trade out struggling key forward Ben Brown, it would be prepared to look at moving Brown if the right deal was on the table.

So the two bits of info in that bit are that (1) we want to keep Brown and had no plans to trade him - being prepared to accept the right offer is a whole other story obviously but even then it would be prepared to look at the right deal. So they haven't really considered it or its structural implications. But if you have something better than * had for Joe the Goose then we'll look at it. That is almost 100% at odds with the current media narrative.

And (2) the sauce for this info isn't at the club. They are familiar with our shift in thinking. So Josh Kelly's manager rings the club and says "How about it? Josh wants to come home. How about giving GWS those two picks you have, straight swap." And we say: "Nah **** that we're going to the draft."

He is a source familiar with our change in thinking.

Or Jake Niall rings the club and says "I hear you're interested in trading those two firsts for free agent Zac Williams." And we say "No we're going to the draft with those picks, and with next year's picks etc etc."

And suddenly he is a source familiar with our thinking.

He very specifically phrases everything to make it clear he isn't quoting the club.

The view internally is that the Roos' group of players aged 26 and over is not capable of taking them to contention and that the only way forward is invest more heavily in the national draft, a process that will take two or three years.

In explaining that changes the club had made would not influence the team overnight, Buckley said Rawlings and coach Rhyce Shaw needed time to make their mark. Buckley indicated that they wanted to bring elite youth into the club.

We said at the start of the year that missing finals was a failure so now we have to be seen to do something about it. Instead of doing what Brad did we'll be clear that isn't our focus ... That should buy us some time. Leave us alone for two years and if we are still shit Rhyce can carry the can and we'll chase Simo.

Finally...

More broadly, there is an argument within the AFL industry that smaller clubs such as North, the Dogs, Port Adelaide and Melbourne must place a greater emphasis on drafting compared to teams with more resources who are better placed to land sought-after recruits from other clubs and expensive free agents, although on-field results also dictate the appeal of clubs.

Cos were playing like shit and we're going to the draft Josh Kelly's manager doesn't like North any more. Plus small clubs should exist so managers can rape their lists for big bucks and commissions. But if they are having a good year and are cashed up that doesn't apply.

 

[ferball]

The only really key piece of info in this article is that we won't be swapping our picks for Josh Kelly.

 

[see see]

Anyone got footage from on the couch when they spoke about North?

Here you go

 

[ferball]

Here is the link, tho it's also about eight pages back.

No big fish: North's shift in recruiting policy

North Melbourne have changed tack on their recruiting policy, and are planning to spend at least the next two post-seasons replenishing at the draft and taking a heavily youth-focused approach.

amp.theage.com.au

 

[Dastardly]

Sure as hell not the first time, and definitely won't be the last time I agree wholeheartedly with Shaun William Ryder

It's not that deep, though.

We comfortably beat last year's premiers last year, and then at 2-0 this year (both wins against current top 8 sides) things were pretty good. We then got smashed by injuries and it exposed that our depth is poor. Now, partly that was from poor drafting and trading, and partly from senior players being given too many chances (credits in the bank and all that) when dropping them and giving young players a go would have been great for development.

This year, with many of those young players performing well having been given that chance, shows the folly of the previous approach.

So we could do a lot of good with getting rid of some of the low-hanging fruit - those constantly injured (eg Garner, Jacobs), those who have been on the list for years and never cemented a spot (Durdin, Wood, etc).

You give short-term contracts for those who are getting old but are still best 22 (Macmillan, Pittard) and the Joeys who haven't had a proper chance yet (Murphy, Crocker) and say to the young players, you have to force the oldies out. If they can't, well, that tells us something.

I think there is a real danger in cutting too hard. The best 22 is reasonable, but the depth has been shown up, and it doesn't require a full rebuild to fix that.

 

[7577969923]

Regardless of what happens with the 25-30 year old group, I don't think we have the strong young core yet to win a flag.

Do we have some promise? Absolutely we do, the kids have been a real positive of 2020. However, can we put our hand up and say categorically they are capable of bringing us back to contender status? I can't yet.

I really rate what Freo has done (and this isn't just due to them getting a plug on the couch). Over 3 years they added 6 first round picks (Cerra, Brayshaw, Sturt, Henry, Serong, Young). This is what I want us to do, whether or not you label that as rebuilding is really a matter of opinion.

Whatever you want to call it we have been rebuilding/regenerating/turning over the list in a relatively aggressive manner since the draft of 2016 and have done much better since then than in the five years prior. I would completely reject the idea that we are starting from scratch. This year hasn't gone to plan and injuries have played a roll in that but have a great opportunity now to add at least 3 first rounders and 2-second rounders to the foundations we have already built.

That foundation we have built since 2016 includes about 15 players who will be on our list in 2021, 10 or 11 will be best 22, and 3 to 5 have A grade potential.

 

[Supreme_Chancellor]

One hell of an off-season is is in order, and I for one can’t wait!

 

[king of the road]

One hell of an off-season is is in order, and I for one can’t wait!

Makes sense. Been one hell of a season.

 

[The acurate one]

Makes sense. Been one hell of a season.

the last 12 months have been hell just quietly

 

[ferball]

the last 12 months have been hell just quietly

Hang in there brother.

 

[giantroo]

 

[DrZaius]

Except we are not lambs - we will be older and have more experience than all the teams we play.

The myth that we are playing more kids than our opposition needs to be called out - its just another deflection on our part.

Sure - our kids are the shining light on this otherwise painful season but we ARE NOT playing more kids than our opponents.

Christ dude, you are obsessed with this. Any time we are older on average than our opponent you come in with a passive aggressive comment in the match preview thread.

Out of our entire list we only have 7 players that have not played a game this year. Only 4 of those players have not played a game for NMFC.
Combden, Crocker, McGuinness & Perez. The only reason they have not played this year is because they have literally been injured the entire time and therefore unavailable for selection.

We all know it's our mid-tier players that are our problem, and we are rightfully copping it in the media without our own 'supporters' pushing their own narratives just because they want to say "I told you so".

 

[scooby1279]

Legend thanks mate! Spot on, its irrelevant about a rebuild or not, the fact those players are dishing up crap like they did on the weekend is pathetic.

 

[Mcarcherey]

Just copped it On The Couch.

Teeing off players for not respecting the jumper, not seeing any system in our game, using the rebuild as a cop out for our performances..

Can't say I disagree.

I agreed with some of the on field comments...especially when they asked questions of the coaching...

But i just can't stand how they try and make comparisons that are not like-for-like.

for example they compared us to freo and how they moved on players to bring players like brayshaw, serong and cerra and started rebuilding before us. that's simply untrue. They got brayshaw through GCS paying absolutely stupid overs for weller (who they never wanted to trade), serong was from pick swaps and cerra was from where they finished in 2017.

We're forever going to get shit because we didn't trade on goldy or higgins, completely forgetting they're free agents. what would we get? a couple of third round compensation picks (if we're lucky, since the AFL randomly picks what clubs should get)?...by the third round clubs aren't climbing over one another for a specific player like in the top ten, by that stage they're role players. whatever pick we get in the third round would probably still be there by the fourth or fifth anyway.

 

[Black2Blue]

Media analysis has become an oxymoron. In other words, the media is dominated by oxygen-thieving morons who couldn't analyse a game of bingo.

How any journalist would use this pandemic season to measure anything regarding the future direction of the club is beyond me. The quality of footy is worse than I can recall in my decades of watching and this is despite shortened quarters. Who knows how different clubs have managed the relocation and isolation, but it is no coincidence in my book that the Queensland, Adelaide, and Perth based clubs are playing the best footy at the moment (Adelaide are a different level of sh!t so they don't count but weren't Gold Coast lay down misere for the spoon). Not only have we been decimated by injury, but I imagine rehabbing in a tent in a sunshine state resort is far from ideal and having a squad without match practice doesn't help either. One game at Docklands, a coach and new footy department finding their feet, and half this list in the final year of their contract are huge factors at North. There are so many elements that make the typical "club losing, bottom of the ladder, time to rebuild" talk more ludicrous this year than others.

A good journalist would be discussing if the club has issues in injury management first and foremost. Then if this is an opportune time for Rhyce and co to try out the list before the contract business begins and he stamps his imprint on the team. And that it's good to be at the pointy end of the draft before the FA & Academy picks distort things too badly. And how about the point that we have 5 Rising Stars in a season and a half, without spending years at the bottom of the table so the basis of a regeneration of the list is well underway. Sure, lots of issues have been exposed at the club this year but the rebuild talk is bullshit. Instead of 'rebuild', try 'injury', 'low draft pick', 'experimenting', or 'just wanting to get this pandemic year from hell over with while staying afloat financially'. We need a rejig of the squad sure. But when so called 'footy journalists' suggest they would rather be in Adelaide's shoes than ours they should be handing their accreditation in or they are playing with some pathetic fanboi or AFL agendas like others have suggested.

 

[The chorus]

I watched Adelaide last night and they were much better than I expected and better than when they played us. They made mistakes but at least they took the game on and moved the ball quickly. That's what I want to see against Brisbane: taking the game on, moving the ball quickly and I will put up with the mistakes

 

[The acurate one]

Hang in there brother.

yeah cheers man, was my daughters birthday on Monday, so didn't see her. yesterday was my Ma's birthday, my first without her since she passed. And spending the majority of your time by yourself.

I'm not ****ing sure how Dan Andrews thinks this ok for people in my position? Now we may extend this. ****. Oh also cost me a budding relationship.

 

[King Corey]

The Robbo article and those like it are very positive for us imo.

We're being shown an understanding that we've battled to stay competitive and are rebuilding as a last resort rather than serially tanking.

Plus it doesn't hurt to be spoken about, good or bad. Any publicity and all that (within reason) especially when it's projecting an upward path into the future.

 

[Psicosis]

Whatever you want to call it we have been rebuilding/regenerating/turning over the list in a relatively aggressive manner since the draft of 2016 and have done much better since then than in the five years prior. I would completely reject the idea that we are starting from scratch. This year hasn't gone to plan and injuries have played a roll in that but have a great opportunity now to add at least 3 first rounders and 2-second rounders to the foundations we have already built.

That foundation we have built since 2016 includes about 15 players who will be on our list in 2021, 10 or 11 will be best 22, and 3 to 5 have A grade potential.

Yes we are fortunate that we have a good foundation of highly talented juniors developing.

Since 2016 we have had the following picks in the top 40: 12, 34, 36, 4, 23, 8, 31, 34, 35

We have also managed to secure some talent with later picks, which is a great result & definitely made our situation look better.

From my perspective, these picks haven't got us access to enough talent. As I've suggested in previous posts, I'd want another 6 over the next 3 years in that 1-20 bracket. We currently have 2 in 2020, 1 in 2021, 1 in 2022 - so we need to find a way to get additional picks in 21/22.

 

[barnrokn]

You couldn't tell through all the "supplements" drama?

 

[kool kangas]

The Robbo article and those like it are very positive for us imo.

We're being shown an understanding that we've battled to stay competitive and are rebuilding as a last resort rather than serially tanking.

Plus it doesn't hurt to be spoken about, good or bad. Any publicity and all that (within reason) especially when it's projecting an upward path into the future.

Never got to see it. Can someone post Robbos article please..