Corona virus, Port and the AFL. Part 2.

[gbear]

All Vic clubs should have to move to interstate hubs to maintain the season. There is no way they are going to have 0 cases anytime soon.

 

[raptalia]

Surely Andrews cannot be serious about relaxing restrictions in Victoria as planned on June 22?

According to the ABC Daniel Andrews has said that Victoria is committed to 'virus suppression rather than elimination'. That puts Andrews at odds with other states that appear to be on the cusp of eliminating the virus. It would appear that Victorians not realise that if they do not eliminate the virus Australia cannot eliminate it.

The Coburg cluster has now risen to 11 people with two schools closed and the source is still unknown. The Coburg cluster involves several extended families and is growing day by day. That is not even suppression it is a recipe for disaster.

The fact that two people have now tested positive after a protest rally in Melbourne must also tell Andrews that the virus is still out there and allowing crowds at sporting contests in Victoria is a huge risk. Get 2 cases in 54 days as SA has done then you can think about crowds.

 

[Andre]

Surely Andrews cannot be serious about relaxing restrictions in Victoria as planned on June 22?

According to the ABC Daniel Andrews has said that Victoria is committed to 'virus suppression rather than elimination'. That puts Andrews at odds with other states that appear to be on the cusp of eliminating the virus. It would appear that Victorians not realise that if they do not eliminate the virus Australia cannot eliminate it.

The Coburg cluster has now risen to 11 people with two schools closed and the source is still unknown. The Coburg cluster involves several extended families and is growing day by day. That is not even suppression it is a recipe for disaster.

The fact that two people have now tested positive after a protest rally in Melbourne must also tell Andrews that the virus is still out there and allowing crowds at sporting contests is a huge risk.

Berejiklian took the early lead in most incompetent leader, with Palaszczuk's Hail Mary of local elections failing to steal the front position. Andrews started back of the track, but has the last month being slowly, but steadily been moving up the field. Can he snatch an unlikely victory here? His tactics of ignoring health advice (without the buck passing of NSW employed over the Ruby Princess) and still talking about opening up, whilst his state has outbreaks unlike everywhere else, let's just say

 

[Chewy316]

Surely Andrews cannot be serious about relaxing restrictions in Victoria as planned on June 22?

According to the ABC Daniel Andrews has said that Victoria is committed to 'virus suppression rather than elimination'. That puts Andrews at odds with other states that appear to be on the cusp of eliminating the virus. It would appear that Victorians not realise that if they do not eliminate the virus Australia cannot eliminate it.

The Coburg cluster has now risen to 11 people with two schools closed and the source is still unknown. The Coburg cluster involves several extended families and is growing day by day. That is not even suppression it is a recipe for disaster.

The fact that two people have now tested positive after a protest rally in Melbourne must also tell Andrews that the virus is still out there and allowing crowds at sporting contests in Victoria is a huge risk. Get 2 cases in 54 days as SA has done then you can think about crowds.

Elimination is not possible unless you maintain a 14 day quarantine for all international travellers at the bare minimum. That is simply not practical either.

Is the R(0) below 1 with the measures with have implemented? Yes. Is the medical health system at a point by which they have the necessary resources to handle any major outbreak going forward? Yes.

Based on this alone, there is zero reason not to continue lessening the restrictions.

 

[raptalia]

Elimination is not possible unless you maintain a 14 day quarantine for all international travellers at the bare minimum. That is simply not practical either.

Is the R(0) below 1 with the measures with have implemented? Yes. Is the medical health system at a point by which they have the necessary resources to handle any major outbreak going forward? Yes.

Based on this alone, there is zero reason not to continue lessening the restrictions.

Absolute rubbish. I have just heard Gladys Berejiklian say that international quarantine will stay as far as NSW goes. I suggest you take a close look at the number of cases that have been detected in quarantine in recent weeks.

Victoria has a problem and it is made worse because some Victorians will not admit that they have a problem.

In SA we are counting down the days 'til elimination. In Victoria you are counting the number of ICU beds and respirators you have.

 

[Chewy316]

Absolute rubbish. I have just heard Gladys Berejiklian say that international quarantine will stay as far as NSW goes. I suggest you take a close look at the number of cases that have been detected in quarantine.

Victoria has a problem and it is made worse because Victorians will not admit that they have a problem.

Might be staying for now, but a 14 day quarantine is not going to be kept in the long term even if a vaccine or form of treatment isn't found. And given that there has never been a efficacious vaccine produced for any type of corona virus over the last 40 years, i won't be holding my breath on that.

In the short term 14 day quarantining for overseas travellers a fine proposal because you don't have people for the most part travelling internationally anyway. But let's wait and see what the party line on this is at the end of the year - won't be surprised if it changes given these hard line stances have been changing as fast as Melbourne's weather over the past few months.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Can we open up to everyone except Victoria?
Would be impossible to monitor though

 

[Capital Power]

Looking at the quality of certain of Andrews' ministers, is it any wonder that they've flown the coop on this one? If I'm Marshall, I'm not opening travel from Victoria at least until there's a semblance of a plan to arrest the rise in new cases. Unfortunately that means we are less likely to see any more home games this year

 

[gbear]

Might be staying for now, but a 14 day quarantine is not going to be kept in the long term even if a vaccine or form of treatment isn't found. And given that there has never been a efficacious vaccine produced for any type of corona virus over the last 40 years, i won't be holding my breath on that.

In the short term 14 day quarantining for overseas travellers a fine proposal because you don't have people for the most part travelling internationally anyway. But let's wait and see what the party line on this is at the end of the year - won't be surprised if it changes given these hard line stances have been changing as fast as Melbourne's weather over the past few months.

Sorry, but a 14 day quarantine period will be here to stay going forward. It may be relaxed with regards to trans Tasman Travel, but otherwise it will remain. It is the only way we will be able to safely open up our international borders:

 

[raptalia]

Can we open up to everyone except Victoria?
Would be impossible to monitor though

What really needs to happen is for Berejiklian to go against her right wing instincts and close the Victorian border. If NSW closed it's border with Victoria and SA maintained it's closed border Victoria would be isolated.

 

[Andre]

Vic 45
NSW 19


What really needs to happen is for Berejiklian to go against her right wing instincts and close the Victorian border. If NSW closed it's border with Victoria and SA maintained it's closed border Victoria would be isolated.

She shouldn't have a problem with it. Marshall closed borders. Tasmania is Lib and went first with closed borders. Closed or not isn't a party thing. Or handling it in general. The best two leaders out of this have been Marshall and McGowan, one Liberal one ALP. The worst two have been NSW and QLD's leaders, again one of each party.

 

[Chewy316]

Sorry, but a 14 day quarantine period will be here to stay going forward. It may be relaxed with regards to trans Tasman Travel, but otherwise it will remain. It is the only way we will be able to safely open up our international borders:

Might be here for the foreseeable future. But let's say that a vaccine isn't produced (and based on history I doubt one does get produced), do you think that such a quarantine period would remain in place indefinitely?

I would postulate that having a 2 week quarantine period for every single overseas traveller or resident coming to Australia would no doubt kill international tourism trade if such a policy was still enforced in 12+ months from now.

As a short term solution it is a great way of getting the numbers down. At the same time, a balance remains necessary in the long term. One would hope that a more practical solution could be reached, even in the absence of a vaccine.

She shouldn't have a problem with it. Marshall closed borders. Tasmania is Lib and went first with closed borders. Closed or not isn't a party thing. Or handling it in general. The best two leaders out of this have been Marshall and McGowan, one Liberal one ALP. The worst two have been NSW and QLD's leaders, again one of each party.

I think early on NSW was a mess (see ruby princess) but lately NSW has been pretty steady in their approach to the point where id say Dan Andrews has tied Palaszczuk for most incompetent. You're completely right when you say though that this has not turned into a political episode here, unlike the US where the restrictions are reflective depending of whether the state is federally blue or red.

 

[Andre]

Might be here for the foreseeable future. But let's say that a vaccine isn't produced (and based on history I doubt one does get produced), do you think that such a quarantine period would remain in place indefinitely?

I would postulate that having a 2 week quarantine period for every single overseas traveller or resident coming to Australia would no doubt kill international tourism trade if such a policy was still enforced in 12+ months from now.

As a short term solution it is a great way of getting the numbers down. At the same time, a balance remains necessary in the long term. One would hope that a more practical solution could be reached, even in the absence of a vaccine.

It could go beyond a Trans-Tasman bubble. Most South Pacific countries are free of the virus. If there's no cases in other countries they'd want to join in. Until there's at least better treatment (if not a vaccine) then a 'good' / 'bad' country divide could be done, as long as each 'good' country adhere's to a 14 day quarantine for anyone from a 'bad' country.

 

[gbear]

It could go beyond a Trans-Tasman bubble. Most South Pacific countries are free of the virus. If there's no cases in other countries they'd want to join in. Until there's at least better treatment (if not a vaccine) then a 'good' / 'bad' country divide could be done, as long as each 'good' country adhere's to a 14 day quarantine for anyone from a 'bad' country.

indeed. Border screening will be imperative. The highest risk will be from China, the US and transit countries.

 

[raptalia]

indeed. Border screening will be imperative. The highest risk will be from China, the US and transit countries.

The three biggest problems for us will be UK, Italy and India as many Australians have family ties with these counties. The US and China are important re tourism an business but if people have to travel to these countries they will have to do two weeks in quarantine.

 

[RossFC]

 

[raptalia]

View attachment 893134

I am still puzzled about some of these figures. Victoria has recorded 83 positive tests since June 1st including 45 cases in the past week yet has only 49 active cases and the active case tally in Victoria has dropped from 71 to 49 since June 1. One can only assume that the cases being detected are extremely mild and the patients recover very quickly or that these people have been out there that long they are no longer considered contagious. There is probably a logical explanation within the definition of 'active'.

 

[RossFC]

I am still puzzled about some of these figures. Victoria has recorded 83 positive tests since June 1st including 45 cases in the past week yet has only 49 active cases and the active case tally in Victoria has dropped from 71 to 49 since June 1. One can only assume that the cases being detected are extremely mild and the patients recover very quickly or that these people have been out there that long they are no longer considered contagious. There is probably a logical explanation within the definition of 'active'.

Yeah it could be either the figures are not always accurate or people are already sick for a period of time before testing positive and then recover soon after that.

 

[Capital Power]

I am still puzzled about some of these figures. Victoria has recorded 83 positive tests since June 1st including 45 cases in the past week yet has only 49 active cases and the active case tally in Victoria has dropped from 71 to 49 since June 1. One can only assume that the cases being detected are extremely mild and the patients recover very quickly or that these people have been out there that long they are no longer considered contagious. There is probably a logical explanation within the definition of 'active'.

I think the Victorian numbers are being confused with a count of the number of ministers still in their roles.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Ah, the Vics, still the weakest link.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Please be selective

 

[Capital Power]

Please be selective

Agreed. If they open, say, to ACT residents, how do they know that I haven't driven over via Melbourne. Not that I would, as I'd love to get to Adelaide, but it'd be very hard to police

 

[Butters Made Me Do It]

Elimination is not possible unless you maintain a 14 day quarantine for all international travellers at the bare minimum. That is simply not practical either.

Is the R(0) below 1 with the measures with have implemented? Yes. Is the medical health system at a point by which they have the necessary resources to handle any major outbreak going forward? Yes.

Based on this alone, there is zero reason not to continue lessening the restrictions.

gotta agree with this, the time we bought with shutdown was to limit spread but also to improve capacity to treat. Elimination without vaccine is an impossibility. Loosening restrictions while enforcing established quarantine for infected is the way forward

 

[raptalia]

Agreed. If they open, say, to ACT residents, how do they know that I haven't driven over via Melbourne. Not that I would, as I'd love to get to Adelaide, but it'd be very hard to police

Maybe you would need to produce photo ID such as a driver's licence as part of a 200 point ID check. If you are a NSW or Victorian resident you self isolate for 14 days upon arrival.

Another 9 cases in COVIDtoria today. As yet there is no indication as to where these originated. Hopefully all 9 are travelers in quarantine but I have a bad feeling they are not. The mindset in South Australia and the ACT is totally different from that of Victoria. Here and in the ACT we are thinking elimination while in Melbourne they are thinking containment. While that attitude remains we should not even contemplating opening our border to Victoria.

 

[raptalia]

gotta agree with this, the time we bought with shutdown was to limit spread but also to improve capacity to treat. Elimination without vaccine is an impossibility. Loosening restrictions while enforcing established quarantine for infected is the way forward

So you do not think a State with two cases in 52 days, both imported from overseas, is close to eliminating the virus? You think that if the State in which you reside cannot do it no else should be allowed to? With your typical Victorian attitude you close your eyes to the fact that several States and Territories have all but eliminated the virus. Victorians might be better placed by congratulating those States and Territories that are on the cusp of elimination and aim to get to into that position themselves rather than telling the rest of Australia it cannot be done.

I have no problem with Victorians following the Swedish model, which what loosening restrictions and quarantining the infected really is, but do not inflict the results on the rest of Australia by insisting that we open our borders. As posted previously while the rest of Australia is counting down to elimination Victorians are counting ICU beds and respirators.