Health Coronavirus 2020 / Worldwide (Stats live update in OP) Part 4

[Gralin]

Well China went to great lengths to try and destroy our trade relationship with them when the Aus govt suggested there should be an investigation into the pandemic

Which was all about the fact they don't let anyone be critical of them and we aren't big enough to get away with minor posturing

 

[owen87]

breathtaking naivety

 

[MrKK]

You constantly take the discussion in to the gutter in the first place.

Not at all, someone else takes it there, I just follow them down and splash around in the gutter for a while.

 

[owen87]

Your post didn't justify a more indepth reply.

 

[MrKK]

Your post didn't justify a more indepth reply.

Memes > facts sourced from major newspapers. Got it

 

[owen87]

Memes > facts sourced from major newspapers. Got it

The below wasn't a 'fact'

I guess it's possible these things are unrelated but it would take breathtaking naivety to believe that.

It was a typical conspiracy board type comment.

 

[MrKK]

The below wasn't a 'fact'



It was a typical conspiracy board type comment.

Is it wrong? Why would China (or any country) run a covert social media operation to push something that wasn't to their benefit?

 

[owen87]

Is it wrong? Why would China (or any country) run a covert social media operation to push something that wasn't to their benefit?

Your conclusion is wrong.

1 + 1 = 3 is what you've done.

 

[Forward Press]

The problem is the twisting of facts that are plausible enough to then draw the conclusion he wants.

The following are three undeniable facts:
- China's government controls how they are viewed on the internet, social media and other publications through universal censorship, and monitoring and silencing of dissident voices
- China's government implemented harsh lockdowns in Wuhan and elsewhere when required to control the virus
- Lockdowns have hurt the economies of Western countries

Ergo, it is also a fact (according to some) that China's government control of media and their implementation of lockdowns were deliberate schemes to hurt the economies of Western countries. This logic is airtight to conspiracy theorists - I don't waste too much time trying to point out the logical failure in that line of reasoning, because they simply shift goalposts.

 

[MrKK]

Your conclusion is wrong.

1 + 1 = 3 is what you've done.

What's the right conclusion? I'm all ears.

 

[owen87]

What's the right conclusion? I'm all ears.

Fortunately Forward Press has already answered this;

The problem is the twisting of facts that are plausible enough to then draw the conclusion he wants.

The following are three undeniable facts:
- China's government controls how they are viewed on the internet, social media and other publications through universal censorship, and monitoring and silencing of dissident voices
- China's government implemented harsh lockdowns in Wuhan and elsewhere when required to control the virus
- Lockdowns have hurt the economies of Western countries

Ergo, it is also a fact (according to some) that China's government control of media and their implementation of lockdowns were deliberate schemes to hurt the economies of Western countries. This logic is airtight to conspiracy theorists - I don't waste too much time trying to point out the logical failure in that line of reasoning, because they simply shift goalposts.

 

[MrKK]

Fortunately Forward Press has already answered this;

Sorry, where was the conclusion about why China promoted a lockdown strategy around the world? I'll help you out, since there's only 2 options.
1. Benevolence - they discovered that lockdowns were the best strategy and wanted the world to share in the benefits.
2. Self-interest - they knew lockdowns would be ruinous to their competitors' economies.

Don't confuse the Chinese leadership with the overpromoted dumbarses we suffer as our political leaders. Nothing the CCP does is without purpose, so which is it?

 

[owen87]

Sorry, where was the conclusion about why China promoted a lockdown strategy around the world? I'll help you out, since there's only 2 options.
1. Benevolence - they discovered that lockdowns were the best strategy and wanted the world to share in the benefits.
2. Self-interest - they knew lockdowns would be ruinous to their competitors' economies.

Don't confuse the Chinese leadership with the overpromoted dumbarses we suffer as our political leaders. Nothing the CCP does is without purpose, so which is it?

Forward Press also covered this bit

This logic is airtight to conspiracy theorists - I don't waste too much time trying to point out the logical failure in that line of reasoning, because they simply shift goalposts.

 

[Hawk Dork]

Sorry, where was the conclusion about why China promoted a lockdown strategy around the world? I'll help you out, since there's only 2 options.
1. Benevolence - they discovered that lockdowns were the best strategy and wanted the world to share in the benefits.
2. Self-interest - they knew lockdowns would be ruinous to their competitors' economies.

Don't confuse the Chinese leadership with the overpromoted dumbarses we suffer as our political leaders. Nothing the CCP does is without purpose, so which is it?

CCP does whats in the best interests of the CCP
Lockdown was the best option, they did it well including feeding and medicating the lock downees and building the hospitals in record time.
So did Australia and NZ

Half arsed lockdown doesnt work, its not their problem but they do lose customers so technically it is their problem

 

[Forward Press]

Forward Press also covered this bit

Occam's razor - the simplest explanation is usually the best - that the Chinese government struggled to contain an outbreak of a novel coronavirus emerging in Wuhan, imposed harsh lockdowns (and it worked, because their authoritarian rule enforced it), and virtually every other country in the world imposed restrictions on movement and assembly in attempts to contain an uncurable virus that killed people. Does that not make the most sense?

Sure, there may indeed be a plot by the CCP to introduce a man-made virus then impose restrictions in a cunning ruse to take down the Western world - but nothing you say will ever disprove MrKK's view on that; nothing - because lack of evidence of this plot is also evidence in his eyes. The moon landing may also have been faked on a Hollywood soundstage. Hence, why I don't bother with those arguing the conspiracy angle.

 

[owen87]

Occam's razor - the simplest explanation is usually the best - that the Chinese government struggled to contain an outbreak of a novel coronavirus emerging in Wuhan, imposed harsh lockdowns (and it worked, because their authoritarian rule enforced it), and virtually every other country in the world imposed restrictions on movement and assembly in attempts to contain an uncurable virus that killed people. Does that not make the most sense?

Sure, there may indeed be a plot by the CCP to introduce a man-made virus then impose restrictions in a cunning ruse to take down the Western world - but nothing you say will ever disprove MrKK's view on that; nothing - because lack of evidence of this plot is also evidence in his eyes. The moon landing may also have been faked on a Hollywood soundstage. Hence, why I don't bother with those arguing the conspiracy angle.

I particularly enjoy how these people (the NWO, the CCP, the Rothschilds, whoever else) are SO smart they manage to literally fool the entire world in to following their agenda without anyone ever letting it slip. All those academics, doctors, CEOs, teachers, engineers, they’ve fooled every single one of them.

But not these BigFooty posters, not these people, they’re not sheeple, they’re too smart to be fooled you see.

 

[Gralin]

So the only reason we had a lockdown in Australia and other countries is because the CCP tricked us into it?

Nothing at all to do with medical science or the history of quarantine and isolation for dealing with pandemics?

Just a bunch of tweets and bam world shut down

 

[owen87]

So the only reason we had a lockdown in Australia and other countries is because the CCP tricked us into it?

Nothing at all to do with medical science or the history of quarantine and isolation for dealing with pandemics?

Just a bunch of tweets and bam world shut down

Also the WHO told us to. Because China told them to. But then the WHO told us to not use masks. So we used them.

 

[Forward Press]

I particularly enjoy how these people (the NWO, the CCP, the Rothschilds, whoever else) are SO smart they manage to literally fool the entire world in to following their agenda without anyone ever letting it slip. All those academics, doctors, CEOs, teachers, engineers, they’ve fooled every single one of them.

But not these BigFooty posters, not these people, they’re not sheeple, they’re too smart to be fooled you see.

So the only reason we had a lockdown in Australia and other countries is because the CCP tricked us into it?

Nothing at all to do with medical science or the history of quarantine and isolation for dealing with pandemics?

Just a bunch of tweets and bam world shut down

 

[Gralin]

Certain posters will take this GIF as irrefutable proof of the conspiracy.

Of course they'd also take you denying your part in this as irrefutable proof.

 

[MrKK]

Deliberate release of a man-made virus? Fake moon landings? Rothschilds? NWO?

WTF are you on about? Sounds like you blokes would be more at home in the conspiracy forum.

 

[Over The Post]

I posted this on March 25 as a followup to a post on Feb 23, in the SRP coronavirus thread. Current comments in italics.

OK peeps, grab your tinfoil hats.

Covered earlier in this thread was the July 2019 story about senior Chinese researchers and students working at the National Microbiology Laboratory (NML) in Winnipeg, Canada, a level 4 containment facility, being fired, escorted off the premises and having their security clearances revoked, before pissing off back to Wuhan's equivalent Level 4 establishment. (Just google it, plenty of news sites.)

Turns out there was a scientific paper, published by Nature in 2015, that detailed American experiments at the University of North Carolina.

TL;DR version:
- UNC has a Level 3 lab
- in 2015 they sourced horseshoe bat coronavirus from the Wuhan Institute of Virology
- created two SARS variants, one of which had little effect on baby mice but was lethal to older mice
- vaccines were ineffective in older mice and actually increased lung damage
- the virus replicated "robustly" in human lung tissue
- they wanted to extend testing to primates (funding denied apparently)
- the United States Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases was involved
- the research was funded by the US National Institution of Health (NIH) and by USAID (which is a well-known front for the CIA)

So work on this project continued, for up to four years after the paper was published. There's conjecture that the research was also being carried out in parallel at Winnipeg and Wuhan. (A couple of the senior Chinese scientists also worked at UNC)

Even though the virus may have escaped through infected animals being sold through the wet market in Wuhan, (this was in response to the rumour that "used" infected animals were being flogged off by lab employees to the market) there is more than a suggestion that it is originally a product of the US biological warfare apparatus. (More than a suggestion but a very long way from being certain.)

Double tinfoil hat time: the military games in October would have been the absolute peak time to do a false flag attack by releasing the virus in Wuhan and fingerpointing at the Wuhan Institute of Virology who presumably had their own stash. And how did so much of Iran come down with it so quickly?

Paper (a bit heavy going but even a non-medical person can pick up key points and phrases):

A SARS-like cluster of circulating bat coronaviruses shows potential for human emergence - Nature Medicine

Ralph Baric, Vineet Menachery and colleagues characterize a SARS-like coronavirus circulating in Chinese horseshoe bats to determine its potential to infect primary human airway epithelial cells, cause disease in mice and respond to available therapeutics.

www.nature.com

==

No conspiracy theory, just documented facts. Personally I cannot speculate where it came from; the above is just as likely a scenario as any being put forward.

 

[Gralin]

 

[MarcMaverick]

Firefly ended way too soon.

 

[Forward Press]

Firefly ended way too soon.

That is one thing everyone in this thread can agree on.