News Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread III - L6ckdown

[Royal Flush]

R youse all still in lockdown?
* me dead.
It's almost Christmas.
You poor campaigners

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[7577969923]

The school hinted that illiteracy was involved and thus it's DHHS' fault. If that's the case, then DHHS should have been notified at the first call with an interpreter (if that occurred). If they weren't notified then I don't think you can spend hundreds of millions of dollars on interpreters just in case someone can't read their mother tongue.

I hope I've misread it and it's just a genuine miscommunication or misunderstanding.

How much exactly do you think interpreters get paid? What is the cost to Victoria of getting the communication wrong and easing gets pushed back even a week? I guarantee that interpreters would barely cost 1% of the figures you are quoting and that is far less than the economic cost of lockdown.

 

[DesertRoo]

R youse all still in lockdown?
fu** me dead.
It's almost Christmas.
You poor campaigners

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

Stop mocking us, or Dan will take away our interwebs...

 

[Themanbun]

How much exactly do you think interpreters get paid? What is the cost to Victoria of getting the communication wrong and easing gets pushed back even a week? I guarantee that interpreters would barely cost 1% of the figures you are quoting and that is far less than the economic cost of lockdown.

I think it is significantly cheaper to have a bunch of translated written communications than it is to have an interpreter for each and every conversation you have with every ESL person you ever interact with. That would rack up into the hundreds of millions as time goes on. Can you please just stop being a nitpicking w***er for one page of this thread?

 

[7577969923]

I think it is significantly cheaper to have a bunch of translated written communications than it is to have an interpreter for each and every conversation you have with every ESL person you ever interact with. That would rack up into the hundreds of millions as time goes on. Can you please just stop being a nitpicking w***er for one page of this thread?

There isn't a page where you haven't been. It's not as though there is anything important that contract interpreters could have been doing over the past 12 weeks.

 

[Royal Flush]

Stop mocking us, or Dan will take away our interwebs...

That would be one effective deterent of punishment.
Surprised this hasn't already been written on the white board of his covid enforcement plan

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[rickety]

That would be one effective deterent of punishment.
Surprised this hasn't already been written on the white board of his covid enforcement plan

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It probably has been, he just can't recall it.

 

[Themanbun]

There isn't a page where you haven't been. It's not as though there is anything important that contract interpreters could have been doing over the past 12 weeks.

Yep, I post here frequently. I dont quote every single one of your posts incessantly trying to nitpick and argue every tiny little point. It's really tiresome that no matter what I post I can expect a combative quote from you putting to proof and arguing. I had you on ignore for a while there, and I've been avoiding interaction with you, so I'll be returning to that now for both our sakes. You've been polite for the most part so I apologise for calling you what I just did. I think we're all getting a little on edge the longer this drags on.

The budget for covid related translation and multicultural comminication is already above $14m according to SBS and I imagine skyrockets if every single communication has to be interpreted live and verbally, rather than proforma translated written communication that can be rolled out. If we take a ratio of one live, verbal communication for every ten written communications my number doesn't seem so ridiculous. But the exact number wasn't the point and we both know that, I was making the point that it will cost a lot more money and a lot more resources (not just the translators, but the time it takes to have verbal conversations versus firing off a letter) than currently. I think in 21st century Australia so long as you have an initial verbal conversation I think you should be able to presume literacy.

All I'm saying is a "hey I can't read" during the first conversation (if there was a first conversation) would have been handy, rather than sticking the boots into the department for not presuming someone can't read. It's easy to s**t can the gov but I'm not so sure on this one.

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Ok. Certain members of the Islamic community, some that I know personally are “they”

Not so hard.

 

[7577969923]

Yep, I post here frequently. I dont quote every single one of your posts incessantly trying to nitpick and argue every tiny little point. It's really tiresome that no matter what I post I can expect a combative quote from you putting to proof and arguing. I had you on ignore for a while there, and I've been avoiding interaction with you, so I'll be returning to that now for both our sakes. You've been polite for the most part so I apologise for calling you what I just did. I think we're all getting a little on edge the longer this drags on.

The budget for covid related translation and multicultural comminication is already above $14m according to SBS and I imagine skyrockets if every single communication has to be interpreted live and verbally, rather than proforma translated written communication that can be rolled out. If we take a ratio of one live, verbal communication for every ten written communications my number doesn't seem so ridiculous. But the exact number wasn't the point and we both know that, I was making the point that it will cost a lot more money and a lot more resources (not just the translators, but the time it takes to have verbal conversations versus firing off a letter) than currently. I think in 21st century Australia so long as you have an initial verbal conversation I think you should be able to presume literacy.

All I'm saying is a "hey I can't read" during the first conversation (if there was a first conversation) would have been handy, rather than sticking the boots into the department for not presuming someone can't read. It's easy to sh*t can the gov but I'm not so sure on this one.

All I'm saying is that at the stage we were at we should have been micro-managing every single case. Especially a household with a single mother and three children from a non-English speaking background with two kids that have had the virus and a third in isolation. For the sake of bringing in an interpreter for a few hundred bucks and absolutely making sure that the comms were understood, we now are in a situation where the whole easing of the lockdown is at risk costing tens of millions per day.

 

[DaveyBoy123]

I would simply reiterate the point that we have now had 8 months to build contact tracing that is capable of coping with these things and as I understand it they are still using pen and paper.

Pretty much all of the outbreaks that have kept us locked up the last few weeks are directly attributable to DHHS failures. The state is paying a huge price for government and bureaucratic incompetence.

That's all a fair call & I agree for the most part... But you made 1 factual & 1 practical error in your previous post... & then the above was your reply to being corrected.

If you actually look at your wording above (especially the 1st 6 words), does it remind you of anyone? I think it just goes to prove that no solution is as simple as it seems... And it's not always easy to say "I was wrong...".

 

[Val Keating]

Not so hard.

I don’t know what that means?

 

[Val Keating]

To be fair to the mother who sent her child that turned out to be infected to school it really does appear that she was trying to do the right thing. She had kept the child's two siblings who had previously tested positive at home until she received clearance from the DHHS that they were okay to return to school. She had kept the child in question in isolation until the DHHS cleared the two siblings. Unfortunately, the communication from the DHHS seems to have given her the impression that all three kids were cleared to go back to school.

It’s not exactly an isolated case though is it

 

[Muscles Thommo]

You won't appreciate this but what is happening now reminds me of trying to get a handle on a fire that keeps breaking out of control lines. It's seems very similar in some ways and despite obvious differences. I think what he is saying is actually reasonable, even if it's a PITA.

Yeah thought you would

 

[7577969923]

It’s not exactly an isolated case though is it

I think the view is that is the case that triggered this outbreak.

 

[ferball]

Yep I get that, but I took "they" as being specific to the folk concerned, not the entirety of whatever nationality or religion "they" are from. I have no time for racism, and have travelled my fair share of the world without causing or suffering from and or because of it. I have no problem with being descriptive, with respect.

Yeah that's all good.

Did you read the biscuit story?

 

[rickety]

Yeah that's all good.

Did you read the biscuit story?

Lol yep. Many many years ago, in a Territory to our North, I was known for eating dog biscuits .... at least for a few weeks :-D Made a killing selling cigarettes too, to my colleagues ;-D

 

[Tas]

How much exactly do you think interpreters get paid? What is the cost to Victoria of getting the communication wrong and easing gets pushed back even a week? I guarantee that interpreters would barely cost 1% of the figures you are quoting and that is far less than the economic cost of lockdown.

As the child of migrants whose parents are still not fluent in English, I think all migrant visas should be conditional on them becoming fluent in English over the next few years after their arrival, otherwise their Visa expires before they are granted permanent residency or citizenship. The country did my parents no favours allowing them to migrate without forcing them to understand the language. If they were required to do it, they would have done it and it would have greatly improved the quality of their life.

It is a massive burden on the children when your parents do not understand English properly, they are far less likely to access services they need because of the language barrier despite them being able to get translators, in my experience, the vast majority do not get translators.

 

[ferball]

No way!

I posted the thread more about the apathy that was happening at the time. I could see it unraveling in China and was starting to feel uneasy.

When the BBC went through that Italian Ward a month or so later and there was one room of 20 in ICU with those plastic bags on their heads I thought we are really in trouble now if that’s what happens and I thought what an awful way to die...in pain and alone

I felt a similar way after seeing that story in Italy, tho it was already coming out on Twitter.

I thought things were gonna ev a lot worse than they have been, not just here but worldwide. That may yet happen. In the month before you started the thread there was video from Wuhan. It was someone holding a video out their flat window at night, twenty stories off he ground maybe. The sound was people howling like someone had opened the gates of hell.

When I saw that I thought "*! This could be it. The end of the world. Or whatever." Within a day or so there were responses to that video saying the howling was just people saying "Yay Wuhan we're the best!" "Wuhan Doctors rule!" "We are stronger than the virus." And other inspirational highlights.

Maybe they are telling the truth too. I don't speak whatever language people were howling in. But that vid was apocalyptic, and shot on a phone then posted on Twitter. Not made up for some movie.

 

[ferball]

All I'm saying is that at the stage we were at we should have been micro-managing every single case. Especially a household with a single mother and three children from a non-English speaking background with two kids that have had the virus and a third in isolation. For the sake of bringing in an interpreter for a few hundred bucks and absolutely making sure that the comms were understood, we now are in a situation where the whole easing of the lockdown is at risk costing tens of millions per day.

Yeah that is a fair point.

 

[7577969923]

Well, this seems like some good news. I assume these are tests Andrews' said needed to come back before he could decide on reopning.

Tests find no cases linked north Melbourne outbreak

No new positive cases have been linked to the coronavirus outbreak in Melbourne’s northern suburbs after more than 1100 associated swabs were processed on Sunday.

The news comes after Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews opted to delay a planned announcement on easing restrictions pending the test results.

In a statement released at 6pm, Victorian Commander of Testing and Community Engagement Jeroen Weimar said all 1135 tests linked to the outbreak that had been returned on Sunday had been negative.

This followed 2500 swabs process on Saturday, from which three additional cases have been confirmed in East Preston Islamic School Students, with another two preliminarily linked to the school.

Mr Weimar said more than 13,000 people had been tested in the northern suburban local government areas of Banyule, Darebin, Hume, Moreland and Nillumbik since October 20, with 1400 swabs taken on Sunday being processed throughout the evening and into Monday.

“This testing enables us to get a very clear picture of how many cases there are and ensure there is a plan in place for everyone who tests positive along with the close contacts,” Mr Weimar said.

“There will at times no doubt be delays as more people come forward, but we are so appreciative of everyone making the effort, particularly during these colder spring days.”

A total of 39 cases have been linked to the outbreak, including cases associated with East Preston Islamic College and Croxton Special School.

Mr Weimar said the Department of Health and Human Services was continuing to investigate links between the outbreak and other positive cases within the area.

“Mystery” cases with no known source of infection have been detected over the past fortnight in postcodes covering Reservoir and Broadmeadows in Melbourne’s north, Heidelberg in the northeast, and Box Hill and Wantirna in the east, with established links between the northern suburban cluster and a cluster at the Box Hill hospital.

Mr Weimar said a special paediatric pop-up site had also been established to cater for the very specific needs to the Croxton Special School community.

“People have really embraced this call to action for which we are very grateful. We continue to meet with community and business leaders to ensure everyone has the information they need,” he said.

 

[Hojuman]

Zero & Zero lads

 

[gokangas]

Zero & Zero lads

Dan must be shattered.

 

[Themanbun]

Some choice quotes from what is actually a pretty balanced article.

"The Business Council of Australia labelled the pause 'inexplicable'...

...the chief executive of the Victorian chamber of Commerce and Industry, Paul Guerra, said the government had once again moved the goalposts...

But the chief executive of Australian medical research institute the Burnet Institute, Brendan Crabb, told the AFR it made sense to take a breath and make sure the northern suburbs outbreak was controlled before opening.

...

Professor Crabb, who is an adviser to the federal government via the National COVID-19 Health and Research Advisory Committee, said he had no doubt significant improvements had been made to the state's contact tracing capabilities."

Feds, business lash Andrews on virus tracing

Business leaders and the Coalition say the Victorian Premier's move to delay the next reopening announcement shows a lack of faith in the state's contact tracing.

www.afr.com

 

[Hearts to hearts]

Dan must be shattered.

He would be delighted and relieved. There is not a single real reason to believe otherwise, and nor a single real interest of his served by not being able to move on as quickly as they believe is possible.

On the northern suburbs outbreak, The Age has the family sharing their email from DHHS and also adding that only one member of the family is not fluent in English. All reminded me of my interactions with Centrelink over the years, and the number of times I’ve wondered how people who don’t have strong language skills and are not tertiary educated manage, because they confused me.