News Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread IV

[Swallow_Wood]

So... can someone who is more knowledgeable than I am help me out here... We have a family friend who is, and I quote "Not anti-vax, but will only take the/a subunit COVID vaccine".

I googled it and I'm just as confused as I was before I googled.

Is this "subunit" thingamajig realistic (within a decent period of time), or a pipe-dream/excuse to not get vaccinated?

Novavax is a subunit vaccine currently under review by the TGA. If approved we have an agreement in place to take delivery this year. By all accounts a double dose is 89% effective.

 

[Ligma]

Thanks.

I'm okay but certainly over the whole situation.

Definitely mate, I’d suggest journaling in the morning or some meditation, I know they kinda sound silly but it can improve your mental health, especially when counselling lines are months long.

I have so much respect for parents who’ve had to homeschool little ones throughout this period, I could never imagine how hard it is to juggle working and helping the kids.

 

[DaveyBoy123]

Novavax is a subunit vaccine currently under review by the TGA. If approved we have an agreement in place to take delivery this year. By all accounts a double dose is 89% effective.

Ta... At least I can look into more of a (is the correct word ) "brand" now. Just googled it and saw the following things:

- Novavax has struggled to find a way to produce its shots.
- Novavax has yet to apply to the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for emergency use authorization and says it may not apply for approval until the fourth quarter of this year after months of delays.
- U.S. regulators told the New York Times in August that the hold-up stemmed from poor quality control at Novavax's manufacturing facilities.

In layman's, are they onto something, but can't get their crap together in order to (for want of a better word) "compete" with the big boys?

 

[Val Keating]

Novavax is a subunit vaccine currently under review by the TGA. If approved we have an agreement in place to take delivery this year. By all accounts a double dose is 89% effective.

Can you get that down the track if you’ve already had one of the other vaccines?

 

[Themanbun]

Can't remember if someone posted this here already, but it had me thinking:



Some of us are out of work at the moment, and that's a source of anguish.

For people who are in work, like my industry is, there's also a sense of exhaustion from work itself. There has been a bit of an obsession with performative stuff that makes overt moves to care for people's mental health, but doesn't really do it. There are managers pushing performance assessments while their staff's sanity hangs on by a thread.

However, a company a mate of a mate works for recently gave their staff a whole paid week off. They legit just said something to the effect of: "you are exhausted. We can tell. Rather than start managing performance to hit a number, we are giving you a paid week off so you can switch off and take some time to yourself."

They've apparently all come back and outstripped their previous monthly performance in the space of a week.

I think across the spectrum, working, not working, health care sector, etc. people are just exhausted, and there's still a ways to go yet.

 

[giantroo]

How exposure site quarantine rules could be relaxed
Victorians caught at a Covid hot spot could soon avoid the dreaded two weeks’ home quarantine — but only if they meet this requirement.

September 27, 2021 - 6:00AM



Victorians caught at coronavirus exposure sites could avoid staying home for two weeks, with isolation rules to be overhauled as vaccination targets are reached and the state reopens.

The Herald Sun can reveal state and federal authorities are considering relaxing isolation requirements for those who are fully vaccinated, while aiming contact tracing resources at controlling outbreaks in high-risk areas.

The Doherty Institute, which is modelling the effect of new containment models, has backed the shift and told national cabinet to move away from the existing “zero tolerance” tracing approach.

Experts say this is crucial to avoid the chaos seen in Britain, where an estimated 1.7 million people – in a country of 67 million – were forced to isolate after they were caught at exposure sites when restrictions were eased.

Britain’s so-called “pingdemic”, fuelled by its Bluetooth tracing app, caused widespread workforce shortages before the government scrapped the isolation rule for those who were fully vaccinated and instead encouraged them to be tested.

Victorian authorities are already allowing fully vaccinated healthcare workers who are exposed to Covid-19 to return to work if they return a negative test after five days, with daily saliva tests and two more PCR tests also required.

Under existing rules, Victorians who visit tier 1 exposure sites must isolate for 14 days, and are only released after two negative test results.
In its latest report to the national cabinet, the Doherty Institute said tracing and isolation measures would shift to target “transmission reduction, allowing a lesser focus on casual and place-based contact tracing outside high-risk settings”.
Deakin University epidemiology chair Professor Catherine Bennett said authorities “don’t have to find every case in the future” and should make tracing in high-risk settings the priority.

She said secondary contacts at exposure sites could be asked to have a test instead of isolating for 14 days.

A spokeswoman for federal Health Minister Greg Hunt said the national medical expert panel was examining revised leave requirements for health workers, while a state government spokesman said they would have “more to say soon” about revised rules.

 

[Ligma]

It's not a contest about one type of hardship versus another. People are doing it tough in different ways. There is a fair chasm between people doing it tough and feeling their mental health ebb away and the idiots you are talking about. What I see in the people that I talk to is that people that are genuinely responsible and have abided by almost all of the lockdown regulations for 270 plus days in the last 18 months are saying enough is enough and that they just can't do it anymore.

Many of the regulations seem arbitrary and even punitive, and because none of the medical advice is ever actually released the Premier can hide behind that as a blanket statement without ever having to justify what they are doing. I don't know how anyone could have watched/listen to Andrews claim he didn't have to justify putting a 9.00 pm curfew on Melburnians and not be furious. He is taking away a basic human right, to be able to leave our homes at the times of our choosing, and has never been able to point to exactly who in the administration requested it and on what medical or scientific advice it is based on. The playground ban and other actions seemed like ridiculous state overreach with no real evidence to support their imposition.

What I see is that people who genuinely believe that Covid is serious, that minimising cases was the right thing to do, that have rolled up their sleeves for a vaccine at the earliest possible opportunity, and have largely cut themselves off from society for a year and a half, are saying enough is enough and that they have done their share. They feel especially aggrieved at selfish pricks that refuse to get vaccinated and are holding us back from getting back to some kind of normal, at those that roam around refusing to wear masks and attending big family gatherings and religious ceremonies. I see people looking at the disparities in case numbers between Hume (2,962 active cases and very low vaxx rates) and where they live (27 active cases in my LGA and close to double the fully vaxxed rate) and think fu** you Hume.

I see people who have done the right thing looking at a long list of arbitrary restrictions on our freedoms, that are not really enforced and deciding which ones matter and which ones they feel don't really do anything. In some sense, they are creating a double vaxxed club, if you will, and creating a set of privileges that get shared only among those that have had both shots. We also have a sense that the anit-vaxxers and residents of Hume have been ignoring the guidelines from day 1. They will now have people visit their homes, share a glass of wine with a friend at a picnic, travel beyond the 10km limit, shop multiple times a day, and sometimes with a second member of their household. These are all very normal human things to do.

If you haven't been in a situation where you have found your own resilience and mental health slipping away in the last few months, I would ask please be patient with those of us that have. One person's "selfish action" can be another's act of self-preservation.

In my view this is lowkey invalidating BlackShadows feelings. I don’t think he was ever trying to make a contest rather get other people to understand what other people are also going through because they feel like they aren’t being heard.

As you said people who have followed the rules just can’t do it anymore, which is exactly what BS has said. Not everyone suffers the same in this situation and BS is totally justified in saying what he has to just like anyone else here.

 

[Gasometer]

Hypothetical

Let’s just say I need to go to the USA sometime next year and have had double dose Astra, which is currently not recognised by the USA travel authorities.

Am I able to go and get two shots of Pfizer to meet my need to visit the USA?

Is this medically possible?

 

[Val Keating]

Hypothetical

Let’s just say I need to go to the USA sometime next year and have had double dose Astra, which is currently not recognised by the USA travel authorities.

Am I able to go and get two shots of Pfizer to meet my need to visit the USA?

Is this medically possible?

In my uneducated opinion they’ll have to recognise it eventually because most of Europe (well definitely the UK) is vaxxed with it.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

In my uneducated opinion they’ll have to recognise it eventually because most of Europe (well definitely the UK) is vaxxed with it.

I believe they recognize the UK version, but not the Aus one (currently).

 

[Gasometer]

But is it possible to go back and get two lots of Pfizer?

Wat would be the health consequences?

Would it diminish the effectiveness of Astra for instance?

 

[Val Keating]

I believe they recognize the UK version, but not the Aus one (currently).

That’s weird. Are they exactly the same? It’ll probably get sorted before Australia joins in on international travel.

 

[Val Keating]

But is it possible to go back and get two lots of Pfizer?

Wat would be the health consequences?

Talk to your doctor.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

That’s weird. Are they exactly the same? It’ll probably get sorted before Australia joins in on international travel.

I believe each country has to apply to have their version cleared by the destination country.

 

[gokangas]

Bit of a drop today. 705.

 

[ferball]

Novavax is a subunit vaccine currently under review by the TGA. If approved we have an agreement in place to take delivery this year. By all accounts a double dose is 89% effective.

I thought originally they were producing a vaccine based on the whole virus that had been attenuated or inactivated. I was disappointed when it turned out they weren't because I'd prefer one of those vaccines myself.

IIRC tho the novavax vaccine introduces the entire Protein Spike (dunno if the others target the whole spike or not but don't understand why they wouldn't) from the virus but other proteins including the membrane, envelope and nucleocapsid proteins to the immune system as well. Which is effectively the same as a whole attenuated or inactivated virus in that it introduces multiple targets for the immune system and should result in a more comprehensive response.

You can see the way different proteins are expressed on the virus surface and inside it with this diagram:

 

[ferball]

Ta... At least I can look into more of a (is the correct word ) "brand" now. Just googled it and saw the following things:

- Novavax has struggled to find a way to produce its shots.
- Novavax has yet to apply to the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for emergency use authorization and says it may not apply for approval until the fourth quarter of this year after months of delays.
- U.S. regulators told the New York Times in August that the hold-up stemmed from poor quality control at Novavax's manufacturing facilities.

In layman's, are they onto something, but can't get their crap together in order to (for want of a better word) "compete" with the big boys?

It was always going to be available late this year, but that is the next few months.

One thing i've heard but haven't wanted to comment on here was that when it submitted its emergency approval application to the FDA, Pfizer had no data on the vaccines effectiveness beyond the initial two months. Now we are seeing waning effectiveness in some cases with Pfizer (possibly with AZ as well but that seems less certain at this point.) So perhaps its less Novavax being unable to get their crap together and more being more certain about how their product works and its effectiveness. (Could be either I spose, its a more complex product.)

Alot of this vaccine rollout is about marketing (like everything i guess) and the companies with the first vaccine on the market will have a tremendous economic advantage over their competitors, to the point where they may dominate the market and prevent competitors from successfully developing other, potentially better vaccines. Banging on about this might get you painted as an anti vaxxer when its not necessarily the case. Its just an issue with "letting the market decide".

Your friend may not be anti vax btw. There is good reason to believe the Novavax vaccine will be more effective and generate a broader immune response because it stimulates a response against more than just the spike protein.

 

[rickety]

Hypothetical

Let’s just say I need to go to the USA sometime next year and have had double dose Astra, which is currently not recognised by the USA travel authorities.

Am I able to go and get two shots of Pfizer to meet my need to visit the USA?

Is this medically possible?

Just give em a wink and tell em you know that bloke down under

 

[ferball]

But is it possible to go back and get two lots of Pfizer?

Wat would be the health consequences?

Would it diminish the effectiveness of Astra for instance?

It shouldn't but by the time you go there may be better options available than Pfizer. Talk to your doctors closer to when you go.

 

[7577969923]

In my view this is lowkey invalidating BlackShadows feelings. I don’t think he was ever trying to make a contest rather get other people to understand what other people are also going through because they feel like they aren’t being heard.

As you said people who have followed the rules just can’t do it anymore, which is exactly what BS has said. Not everyone suffers the same in this situation and BS is totally justified in saying what he has to just like anyone else here.

Not my intention to invalidate BlackShadow's feelings or experiences at all. Nor those of TheAccurateOne either, for that matter. More trying to point out that though our individual experiences may differ this pandemic has been extremely tough on many of us. For anybody doing it tough, those feelings are valid. I know that to be the case from my personal experience.

 

[Ligma]

Not my intention to invalidate BlackShadow's feelings or experiences at all. Nor those of TheAccurateOne either, for that matter. More trying to point out that though our individual experiences may differ this pandemic has been extremely tough on many of us. For anybody doing it tough, those feelings are valid. I know that to be the case from my personal experience.

Just the way it came across just kind of sounded like it, that’s all. Absolutely, everyone has different coping mechanisms as well, for me running is the way I distract myself.

 

[Only Forwards]

Try living with two kids aged 3 and 1, both of us working full time at home and no other support.

Having young kids and work is like having 2 full time jobs, feeling like you do neither well and feeling guilty about both.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

NSW unvaccinated population to stay in lockdown until December 1 at which time they’ll be allowed the same freedoms as vaccinated persons.

Businesses given the power to decide if unvaccinated persons can enter.

 

[B4Bear]

Nails it.

 

[Ligma]

Nails it.

That is very well said. Next season a crowd with only double vaxxed people at the footy?