Coronavirus/COVID-19

[Sentinel]

Italy has the oldest average age in all of Europe with over a 1/4 of its population over 65.

So much utter cr@p spoken. The figures world wide tell the mortality rate is directly connected to age and illness. Some random dude on the internet talking absolute sh!t shouldn’t scare anyone.

With all due respect, I think you are incredibly naive about what's going to happen here to the healthcare system and the flow on effect (regardless of the fact most people who will need it for COVID-19 treatment are going to be old and sick). It has been coming for months and we're sitting ducks right now.

 

[Mattdougie]

With all due respect, I think you are incredibly naive about what's going to happen here to the healthcare system and the flow on effect (regardless of the fact most people who will need it for COVID-19 treatment are going to be old and sick).

If Italy had taken the steps we have(granted they didn’t have the time or knowledge at that stage) this would not have occurred at the rate it did there and if you think their aged population has no correlation to its mortality rate then you my friend are the naive one.

If any person over 70 or designated as high risk hasn’t self contained themselves already then they are morons.

If you have an aged pop and have no restrictions in place you will get theses results

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Without meaning to scare anyone, here's an alarming account of what is potentially to come over the next couple of weeks:

Well at the risk of sounding like MD (which I have to assume as I can’t see his posts) I have the unsubstantiated feeling that this will subside fairly soon...

Keep watch on

Coronavirus Update (Live): 128,239,149 Cases and 2,804,346 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...

www.worldometers.info

 

[Contador]

What is MD actually trying to argue here? That we should follow in China's footsteps or do the exact opposite and just go about our business and let the virus spread?

Both at the same time it seems. Given MD's track record of being drastically wrong about everything, his opinion that the virus is nothing to worry about has just made me significantly more concerned about it.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Both at the same time it seems. Given MD's track record of being drastically wrong about everything, his opinion that the virus is nothing to worry about has just made me significantly more concerned about it.

Please don’t tell me I’m drastically wrong

 

[Mattdougie]

Well at the risk of sounding like MD (which I have to assume as I can’t see his posts) I have the unsubstantiated feeling that this will subside fairly soon...

Keep watch on

Coronavirus Update (Live): 128,239,149 Cases and 2,804,346 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer

Live statistics and coronavirus news tracking the number of confirmed cases, recovered patients, tests, and death toll due to the COVID-19 coronavirus from Wuhan, China. Coronavirus counter with new cases, deaths, and number of tests per 1 Million population. Historical data and info. Daily...

www.worldometers.info

And these figures would not count thousands of people who have had it and not been tested

 

[Sentinel]

If Italy had taken the steps we have(granted they didn’t have the time or knowledge at that stage) this would not have occurred at the rate it did there and if you think their aged population has no correlation to its mortality rate then you my friend are the naive one.

If any person over 70 or designated as high risk hasn’t self contained themselves already then they are morons.

If you have an aged pop and have no restrictions in place you will get theses results

Italy's aged population will mean a higher mortality rate than we'll likely see here, yes. But not by orders of magnitude. We are taking steps but even if every 70+ year old were in quarantine, its still going to hit us because these people still need contact with the outside world to survive and receive whatever level of care they normally need.

I truly hope I'm wrong and I don't think we'll see it as bad as Northern Italy, but it will still be a shock that is going to last for a number of months and will be devastating.

 

[Mattdougie]

Italy's aged population will mean a higher mortality rate than we'll likely see here, yes. But not by orders of magnitude. We are taking steps but even if every 70+ year old were in quarantine, its still going to hit us because these people still need contact with the outside world to survive and receive whatever level of care they normally need.

I truly hope I'm wrong and I don't think we'll see it as bad as Northern Italy, but it will still be a shock that is going to last for a number of months and will be devastating.

If you were over 70 or sick what would you be doing for the next period of time?

 

[Sentinel]

If you were over 70 or sick what would you be doing for the next period of time?

Staying indoors and limiting contact with the outside world, like my 92 year old grandparents are doing already.

 

[Mattdougie]

Staying indoors and limiting contact with the outside world, like my 92 year old grandparents are doing already.

Exactly As both my parents are doing

So with the restrictions from Monday and hopefully the common sense and self concern of the elderly and sick, there should be very limited contact between the two groups so explain to me how this gets out of control now?

 

[gangsta deluxe]

Differing opinions is part of life but I would expect options on something like this to roughly fall within a short distance of a centre of fact. With this it depends on what day or who you listen to on how drastic we should go.

I’ve never said ignore anyone I’ve simply stated my opinion right or wrong. I’ve never said I won’t follow the directions we are given.

The virus is novel, the information provided is based on data available - some of this is local, some of this is broader. Of course it is contradictory and of course there is difference in expert opinion, we simply havent got a full handle on what to do yet.

I would place full trust in the CDC and the WHO as they have access to the largest body of data and have the greatest international access. For reference, and so you have the most up to date information, the below graphic comes from these groups.

FWIW my hope is that the AFL do something really innovative as sport is a critical part of our national spirit and wellbeing (the later is certainly true for me!). As an example, I hope they pay the payers a huge premium to stay isolated over the coming months, and play the game, without crowds. Many of them will get it but if they dont come into too much contact with old people it is very, very, very unlikely any dies or faces a serious risk. The exposure would be great for AFL - everything else cancelled while it is on...

 

[weltschmerz]

So with the restrictions from Monday and hopefully the common sense and self concern of the elderly and sick, there should be very limited contact between the two groups so explain to me how this gets out of control now?

People can be contagious before knowing they're sick. You could have been next to someone on the train who was very contagious, but had no symptoms and didn't feel a reason to self quarantine.

 

[Mattdougie]

The virus is novel, the information provided is based on data available - some of this is local, some of this is broader. Of course it is contradictory and of course there is difference in expert opinion, we simply havent got a full handle on what to do yet.

I would place full trust in the CDC and the WHO as they have access to the largest body of data and have the greatest international access. For reference, and so you have the most up to date information, the below graphic comes from these groups.

FWIW my hope is that the AFL do something really innovative as sport is a critical part of our national spirit and wellbeing (the later is certainly true for me!). As an example, I hope they pay the payers a huge premium to stay isolated over the coming months, and play the game, without crowds. Many of them will get it but if they dont come into too much contact with old people it is very, very, very unlikely any dies or faces a serious risk. The exposure would be great for AFL - everything else cancelled while it is on...


View attachment 839606

I wasn’t referencing the respected or offical channels of info mate just the internet “experts” some were throwing up as fonts of knowledge on this.

 

[Sentinel]

Exactly As both my parents are doing

So with the restrictions from Monday and hopefully the common sense and self concern of the elderly and sick, there should be very limited contact between the two groups so explain to me how this gets out of control now?

Because it will continue to spread across those who are not sick and old, often without any obvious symptoms, and then spread to those sick and elderly who rely on the support of the other group to function on a daily basis.

The idea of shutting things down is specifically to slow all of the above.

 

[Mattdougie]

People can be contagious before knowing they're sick. You could have been next to someone on the train who
was very contagious, but had no symptoms and didn't feel a reason to self quarantine.

We can’t change the past only the future and in the elderly this doesn’t sit in your system for weeks it puts you in your a$$ very quickly if it effects you.

 

[Mattdougie]

Because it will continue to spread across those who are not sick and old, often without any obvious symptoms, and then spread to those sick and elderly who rely on the support of the other group to function on a daily basis.

The idea of shutting things down is specifically to slow all of the above.

If an elderly person has contact with very few people that are fully aware of the “rules” they have very little chance of becoming ill.

It’s not an airborne disease.

Anyway agree to disagree AGAIN

 

[gangsta deluxe]

A major issue is strain on the health system - if resources are used supporting old people then other issues (car accidents, flu, etc.) dont get the support they need...

 

[Mattdougie]

A major issue is strain on the health system - if resources are used supporting old people then other issues (car accidents, flu, etc.) dont get the support they need...

Absolutely mate and these measures will sort that but I think if we do it go extreme for a month

Limited movement people under 65.

Next to none over 65.

I’ve never dismissed the seriousness of this for the elderly just the way we go about it but now we have taken this path do it properly

 

[dogwatch]

How is it possible to listen to so many “experts” and have such opposing views on what we should do? Surely a medical fact is a medical fact that should be shared by a vast majority of health professionals?

Most medical experts in fact have a high level of agreement on the risks and severity of this disease. You only need to read some of the accounts of doctors working in northern Italy (several accounts are doing the rounds and some have even been posted here I think) to see how serious, distressing and overwhelming it is when the health services get inundated. It happened in China too. You might have seen the footage of a health worker in Wuhan in meltdown - because she was (a) overworked and stretched to breaking point and/or (b) helplessly watching people die who would otherwise have lived if they hadn't been so swamped with so many sick people struggling to breathe.

Great news if the story about only 8 new cases in China is true. In fact that would be the best news we've yet had on this disease but I'll remain sceptical for the time being because the Chinese government works hard on its PR and - as I think you've said yourself - the number of cases is consistently under-reported (even if they're being honest this time).

So why are there such opposing views?
Great question!

My guess is it's a combination of factors:

• Volatility. The rapidly changing face of the pandemic means there is more dramatic news coming out all the time, almost by the hour. Accompanying this is a very steep learning curve among health professionals as to how this totally new disease behaves and consequently how we should respond. There's little doubt that the official advice we're receiving now is very different from what we were hearing only 3 weeks ago. There's still so much we don't know, like whether you can get re-infected, whether 14 days is really a safe period, how contagious you can be before you become symptomatic, how long the virus can remain viable on a surface (such as a hand rail or doorknob) and so on.
• A lot of people are in denial and don't want to see such drastic countermeasures. There could be lots of understandable reasons for that. Some have a business or a job under threat. Some have an event planned (eg a wedding or a holiday). Some are disgusted by panic buying and herd behaviour. Some simply don't want their comfortable life style compromised by all this fuss. Whatever the reasons those people tend to filter what they hear or read, selecting only the reports or social media posts that suit their gut feeling. It's understandable but it's not really sifting through all the evidence which overwhelmingly says this is extremely serious, not only to our health but also to our economy and our social fabric.
• A much smaller proportion of divergent responses could be from people with vested interests who are running deliberate distractions. Hard to know if that's a factor here but it can be a highly successful tactic, e.g. the tobacco industry did it for decades in delaying the crackdown on smoking.
• Those interpreting and presenting the advice and medical facts are often lay people (eg journos or social media hounds) who unintentionally filter out or give undue weight to different parts of the whole picture. That's why I 100% agree with you that it's important to read widely and from different sources.

 

[stefoid]

 

[Dry Rot]

No point arguing with people like you that read the worse case and think it’s gospel.

Check out what is happening in Europe now and find out something about the topic, otherwise you are going to get a hell of surprise.

I’ve listened to 100 doctors tell me 80 different things but the ONE you source on the internet MUST be right.

If you think that after following this for 2 months and spending hours and days researching it, that I rely upon one source, then you are really mentally challenged.

 

[Dry Rot]

China's coronavirus cases drop to single-digit


China's health authority says only eight more cases of coronavirus infection were reported in the country on Thursday. It's the first time that fewer than 10 cases have been reported since the authority began releasing such figures in January.

The National Heath Commission announced on Friday that the new cases bring the total number on mainland China to 80,813.

Among the eight cases, five were confirmed in the city of Wuhan, Hubei Province, the epicenter of the outbreak. Officials say the other three were people entering China from affected areas.

The death toll from the outbreak on mainland China has reached 3,176, up seven from the previous day, mostly in Hubei Province.

Do have any idea what the CCP did in Wuhan to achieve that result for now?

 

[Dry Rot]

And what about the stat that around 70% are fully recovered within two weeks?

Or that around 94% of “bad” cases are people who are old or have existing ailments.??

You really are embarrassing yourself now. I understand why so many posters don't bother to engage with you.

Learn something about the subject. Around 80% are mild, but learn what happens with the other 20%.

And no, they are all not old.

 

[Mattdougie]

You really are embarrassing yourself now. I understand why so many posters don't bother to engage with you.

Learn something about the subject. Around 80% are mild, but learn what happens with the other 20%.

And no, they are all not old.

WHO statistics

 

[Sentinel]

I give it less than a month before we see riots in America