Cox v Gawn

[danster168]

 

[Shueygod]

View attachment 1980237

, this is why he is the most overrated player in the league. Vs Geelong was a good average game in totality

 

[danster168]

, this is why he is the most overrated player in the league. Vs Geelong was a good average game in totality

huh? you're basing a guys career based on 1 game? 1 game in which he was one of his teams best players. lol Gawn with more AA jumper means he's better.

 

[Shueygod]

huh? you're basing a guys career based on 1 game? 1 game in which he was one of his teams best players. lol Gawn with more AA jumper means he's better.

I’m saying the hyperbole on the game is an accurate summation of how overrated he is by the media. Stanley shut him down for most of last night but apparently Geelong “didn’t have an answer”.

It was probably the 5th best ruck performance this round.

 

[danster168]

I’m saying the hyperbole on the game is an accurate summation of how overrated he is by the media. Stanley shut him down for most of last night but apparently Geelong “didn’t have an answer”.

It was probably the 5th best ruck performance this round.

where did I reference his game? He isn't overrated at all. What did you think his 5 goal effort in a prelim versus the cats? Probably the greatest game by a ruckman in the history of the game.

I didn't reference last nights game at all. He didn't play well, but he stood up when it counted in the last quarter with a goal from 55m as well as 4 contested marks.

 

[Shueygod]

where did I reference his game? He isn't overrated at all. What did you think his 5 goal effort in a prelim versus the cats? Probably the greatest game by a ruckman in the history of the game.

I didn't reference last nights game at all. He didn't play well, but he stood up when it counted in the last quarter with a goal from 55m as well as 4 contested marks.

Are you the media? Was obviously referring to Cornes comments on the game.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Both are awesome. AA’s don’t mean much once you’ve both got so many.

Splitting hairs but would say that Cox better skills and around the ground, Gawn better contested work. Both good tap rucks. Would have been good to see them match up with both in their prime.

Impossible to say one is definitively better than the other.

 

[danster168]

Are you the media? Was obviously referring to Cornes comments on the game.

you're a smart man, if Gawn is having a quiet first half it's certainly got nothing to do with Rhys bloody Stanley. It's all on Max

 

[00Stinger]

Both are awesome. AA’s don’t mean much once you’ve both got so many.

Splitting hairs but would say that Cox better skills and around the ground, Gawn better contested work. Both good tap rucks. Would have been good to see them match up with both in their prime.

Impossible to say one is definitively better than the other.

Yeah I kinda go with this opinion.

Different rucks but both sit at the top of the ruck tree

Sent from my SM-S908E using Tapatalk

 

[schmuttt]

I think if Gawn matches him in AAs and wins another premiership he inches ahead, but as for now I have them pretty even.

Still standing by this.

Gawn was average on Saturday night but his ability to lift in the last quarter was again on display. I reckon I’ve seen 10 more ‘skilled’ rucks but I’ve never seen anyone impact games to the extent he does.

 

[Goosecat]

Well Juddy reckons Cox is arguably the greatest Ruckman in Footy History. Even in his first year in WAFL he managed to win BOG in the Grand Final as a lanky kid.

 

[eaglevision]

Well Juddy reckons Cox is arguably the greatest Ruckman in Footy History. Even in his first year in WAFL he managed to win BOG in the Grand Final as a lanky kid.

The best ruck and midfield we’ll ever see.

 

[00Stinger]

Even in his first year in WAFL he managed to win BOG in the Grand Final as a lanky kid.

So we are comparing reserve grade games now?

 

[Scythe]

Think it's much of a muchness, honestly. Two outstanding players with different strengths, so it depends on what you value more from a player.

Cox was a much better kick (don't have his DE% stats at my disposal) and was able to use his running power to impact games in transition more, whereas Gawn is a better contested contested player (more than double the contested marks, more contested possessions, more tackles etc). Gawn the better tap ruck, but the stats favour him a bit due to the more congested modern game (more stoppages, etc).

Career accolades are quite similar, though Gawn looks likely to earn his 7th AA nom this year, which would put him ahead of Cox in that regard.

Think it's still fairly subjective at this stage, though.

Category (per game)	Cox	Gawn
Kicks	8.9	9.2
Handballs	6.9	6.4
Disposals	15.9	15.6
Contested Possessions	6.7	9.1
Uncontested Possessions	9.2	6.4
Clearances	2.8	3.5
Hitouts	22.9	33.0
Marks	5.3	4.6
Contested Marks	0.9	2.1
Goals	0.6	0.5
Tackles	1.5	2.5
Inside 50s	2.2	2.4
Rebound 50s	1.5	1.3
Career	Cox	Gawn
Games	290	211*
All-Australians	6	6*
Premierships	1	1*
AFLCA Champion Player	0	1*
Best and Fairests	1	2*
Browlow Votes	71	108

 

[Milanista28]

Loved Cox, but Gawn for me.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Think it's much of a muchness, honestly. Two outstanding players with different strengths, so it depends on what you value more from a player.

Cox was a much better kick (don't have his DE% stats at my disposal) and was able to use his running power to impact games in transition more, whereas Gawn is a better contested contested player (more than double the contested marks, more contested possessions, more tackles etc). Gawn the better tap ruck, but the stats favour him a bit due to the more congested modern game (more stoppages, etc).

Career accolades are quite similar, though Gawn looks likely to earn his 7th AA nom this year, which would put him ahead of Cox in that regard.

Think it's still fairly subjective at this stage, though.

Category (per game)	Cox	Gawn
Kicks	8.9	9.2
Handballs	6.9	6.4
Disposals	15.9	15.6
Contested Possessions	6.7	9.1
Uncontested Possessions	9.2	6.4
Clearances	2.8	3.5
Hitouts	22.9	33.0
Marks	5.3	4.6
Contested Marks	0.9	2.1
Goals	0.6	0.5
Tackles	1.5	2.5
Inside 50s	2.2	2.4
Rebound 50s	1.5	1.3
Career	Cox	Gawn
Games	290	211*
All-Australians	6	6*
Premierships	1	1*
AFLCA Champion Player	0	1*
Best and Fairests	1	2*
Browlow Votes	71	108

The bolded is incorrect. They are very similar. Cox's averages look significantyl less in the hitouts but that's a reflection of the change in game.

Both are consistently top ~3 in hitouts per game when they played. With singnficant drop offs when Nic Nat came along, and when Gawn played with Jackson. Don't confuse Cox's last years when he was at the end and a bit useless in the ruck with his actual ruck work in his prime.

 

[Blackas87]

Gawn x 7 All Australian

 

[Trav 20]

Compare the pair:

Games: Gawn x 247 - Cox x 290

Gawn x 8 All Australian - Cox 6
Gawn x 3 B&Fs - Cox 1
Gawn x 1 AFLCA - Cox 0
Gawn x 592 Coaches Votes from 247 games (ave. 2.40) - Cox x 338 Coaches Votes from 273 games (ave. 1.23)
Gawn x 121 Brownlow Votes from 224 games - Cox x 71 Brownlow Votes from 290 games (ave. 0.24) - Gawn 50 more from 66 less games

Gawn averages more disposals (even without adjusting 2020 season stats)
Gawn averages more hitouts (x 10 ave - Gawn already more than 1,500 ahead)
Gawn averages more tackles
Gawn averages more clearances (totals - 917 to 813 ie 104 more from 43 less games)
Gawn averages more contested possessions (45% more)
Gawn averages more contested marks (totals - 511 to 246 ie a whopping 265 more from 43 less games)
Cox averages more general marks
Cox averages more goals (0.6 to 0.5)
Cox averages more goal assists

Gawn x 1 premiership
Cox x 1 premiership

Gawn has clearly been the more influential player on the outcome of games. This is recognised by Gawn smashing Cox in Brownlow votes, as well as coaches votes.

Not only has Gawn won the AFLCA, he's finished top 20 x 6 times and top 5 twice.
Cox has never won it and finished top 20 just once (13th). The award started in 2003 which is 2 years after Cox started his career in 2001. Looking at the stats Cox wouldn't have troubled the voters of the award in his first 2 years had it been around, which is understandable for a 19/20 year old ruck.

Gawn has taken 4+ contested marks in a game 43 times (17.4%). Cox took 4+ contested marks in a game 7 times (2.4%). For today's current players Gawn has the most 4+ contested marks in a game with Tom Lynch second on 40. Gawn is 6th on the all time list (since records started) and will soon pass Jonathan Brown and Tom Hawkins

26

Tom Hawkins

Age

37

Ht

197cm

Wt

105kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.2

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

4.4

3star

M

5.5

5star

T

1.9

4star

G

2.1

5star

D

12.7

3star

K

8.6

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

5.1

5star

T

2.1

3star

G

1.6

5star

D

7.8

2star

K

5.6

3star

HB

2.2

2star

M

4.2

4star

T

1.0

3star

G

2.2

5star

.

The most contested marks Cox took in a game was 6, which he did once. Gawn has taken 8 twice. Gawn has taken 6+ contested marks in a game six times.

Most goals in a game: Gawn x 5 (prelim final) - Cox x 5 (H&A)

It doesn't matter how you slice it or dice it Gawn has past Cox as this century's greatest ruckman and in my opinion lays claim to being the greatest ruckman of all time. I saw Simon Madden, who was a great player, but he also spent a lot of time playing as a key forward. As a pure ruckman it's Gawn for me.

EDIT: Updated as of end of season round 24, 2025.

 

[Sully90]

Compare the pair:

Games: Gawn x 232 - Cox x 290

Gawn x 7 All Australian - Cox 6
Gawn x 2 B&Fs - Cox 1
Gawn x 1 AFLCA - Cox 0
Gawn x 121 Brownlow Votes from 224 games - Cox x 71 Brownlow Votes from 290 games (Gawn 50 more from 66 less games)

Gawn averages more disposals (even without adjusting 2020 season stats)
Gawn averages more hitouts (x 10 ave - Gawn already more than 1000 ahead)
Gawn averages more tackles
Gawn averages more clearances (845 to 813 ie 32 more from 58 less games)
Gawn averages more contested possessions (45% more)
Gawn averages more contested marks (475 to 246 ie a whopping 229 more from 58 less games)
Cox averages more general marks
Cox averages more goals (0.6 to 0.5)
Cox averages more goal assists

Gawn x 1 premiership
Cox x 1 premiership

Gawn has clearly been the more influential player on the outcome of games. This is recognised by Gawn smashing Cox in Brownlow votes as well as coaches votes.

Not only has Gawn won the AFLCA, he's finished top 20 x 5 times.
Cox has never won it and finished top 20 just once (13th). The award started in 2003 which is 2 years after Cox started his career in 2001. Looking at the stats Cox wouldn't have troubled the voters of the award in his first 2 years had it been around, which is understandable for a 19/20 year old ruck.

Gawn has taken 4+ contested marks in a game 40 times (17.2%). Cox has taken 4+ contested marks in a game 7 times (2.4%). For today's current players Gawn has the most 4+ contested marks in a game with Tom Lynch second on 39.

Most goals in a game: Gawn x 5 (prelim final) - Cox x 5 (H&A)

It doesn't matter how you slice it or dice it Gawn has past Cox as this century's greatest ruckman and in my opinion lays claim to being the greatest ruckman of all time. I saw Simon Madden, who was a great player, but he also spent a lot of time playing as a key forward. As a pure ruckman it's Gawn for me.

Nah Cox still the number 1 by a fair margin for mine. Had a consistently better team around him nicking AFLCA, Brownlow, and BnF votes off him. The other rucks he was coming up against were better then they are now as well. Gawn an all time great dont get me wrong, but Cox is his superior every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

 

[Trav 20]

Nah Cox still the number 1 by a fair margin for mine. Had a consistently better team around him nicking AFLCA, Brownlow, and BnF votes off him. The other rucks he was coming up against were better then they are now as well. Gawn an all time great dont get me wrong, but Cox is his superior every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

Clearly not.

Less disposals, less hitouts, less contested marks, pretty much less everything.

229 less contested marks from 58 more games. It just sums up everything right there. That's an extraordinary number.

As for better teams ? LOL Cox has a career winning record of 49% and Gawn has a career winning record of 49%.

Oliver has won 2 x AFLCA and both he and Petracca have multiple B&Fs, All Australians and top Brownlow finishes.

Just because you want it to be Cox doesn't make it Cox. It's Gawn.

Their. Records. Speak. For. Themselves.

 

[danster168]

, this is why he is the most overrated player in the league. Vs Geelong was a good average game in totality

haha 35 touches and completely owned your whole team. back in your box.

 

[Aura]

Just because you want it to be Cox doesn't make it Cox. It's Gawn.

Their. Records. Speak. For. Themselves.

In what world would a Fremantle fan want Cox to be better than Gawn? Sandilands maybe sure. But Cox? What lol

 

[Trav 20]

In what world would a Fremantle fan want Cox to be better than Gawn? Sandilands maybe sure. But Cox? What lol

Just assumed it was WA parochialism which might outweigh club allegiances.

 

[Blackas87]

Nah Cox still the number 1 by a fair margin for mine. Had a consistently better team around him nicking AFLCA, Brownlow, and BnF votes off him. The other rucks he was coming up against were better then they are now as well. Gawn an all time great dont get me wrong, but Cox is his superior every day of the week and twice on Sundays.

Cox didn’t have Judd and Cousins after 2007 and Kerr never got more the 8 votes in the Brownlow after that period either. Cox didn’t have these guys taking votes off him for half his career unlike Gawn competing with Oliver and Petracca who combined actually received more votes than Cousins and Judd combined in seasons

 

[Shueygod]

haha 35 touches and completely owned your whole team. back in your box.

Against the worst team in the comp, not sure that’s the gotcha you think it is.