Cricket Discussion - Part 2

RussellEbertHandball

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Talking about 4 day tests. I think its an inevitability, despite prima facie not really opening up that many extra days of other international opportunities, about 43 or 44 days. What are you gonna fill it with? More ODI's? they aren't rating. More international T20's? nope. More domestic T20's?? probably.

Timeless tests with a rest day --> 5 day tests with a rest day --> 5 day tests no rest day.

I reckon 7.5 hrs x 4 days, day night tests will not produce many draws, when no weather intervenes.
 

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RussellEbertHandball

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Despite all the pump up about this Aussie attack I'm taking McGrath, Gillespie, Lee & Warne in their pomp all day every day.
I agree. They only played 16 tests together as a quartet which is about half of what I would have thought. Would have put it around 27-30 tests range. They took 267 out of a possible 320 wickets in those 16 tests


From 16 Tests which featured all four bowlers together, Australia won ten matches and lost only twice. Having had to tackle such a strong bowling unit, England bore the brunt of their damage. In those matches between 2001 and 2005, Warne picked 89 wickets and McGrath scalped 77 wickets. While Lee accounted for 52 victims, Gillespie fell short of the 50-mark by just three wickets.

But Warne and McGrath player over 100 together
Australia's unparalleled dominance during the late 1990s and early 2000s was often attributed to the presence of two champions bowlers. With 980 wickets from 104 matches, Glenn McGrath and Shane Warne remain the most prolific bowling duo in Test history.

That website ranks the above quartet as #2, only behind Roberts, Holding, Garner and Croft

The 'Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse' played 11 Tests together from 1979 to 1982. West Indies won five of those matches and lost on only one occasion. It took a gallant century from Kim Hughes to buck the trend at the iconic Melbourne Cricket Ground in the 1981 Boxing Day Test. In those eleven matches, Holding topped the bowling charts with 51 scalps. While Garner and Croft picked up 47 and 46 wickets respectively, an ageing Roberts chipped in with 28 scalps.
 

JimmyBeerCans

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I agree. They only played 16 tests together as a quartet which is about half of what I would have thought. Would have put it around 27-30 tests range. They took 267 out of a possible 320 wickets in those 16 tests


From 16 Tests which featured all four bowlers together, Australia won ten matches and lost only twice. Having had to tackle such a strong bowling unit, England bore the brunt of their damage. In those matches between 2001 and 2005, Warne picked 89 wickets and McGrath scalped 77 wickets. While Lee accounted for 52 victims, Gillespie fell short of the 50-mark by just three wickets.

But Warne and McGrath player over 100 together
Australia's unparalleled dominance during the late 1990s and early 2000s was often attributed to the presence of two champions bowlers. With 980 wickets from 104 matches, Glenn McGrath and Shane Warne remain the most prolific bowling duo in Test history.

That website ranks the above quartet as #2, only behind Roberts, Holding, Garner and Croft

The 'Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse' played 11 Tests together from 1979 to 1982. West Indies won five of those matches and lost on only one occasion. It took a gallant century from Kim Hughes to buck the trend at the iconic Melbourne Cricket Ground in the 1981 Boxing Day Test. In those eleven matches, Holding topped the bowling charts with 51 scalps. While Garner and Croft picked up 47 and 46 wickets respectively, an ageing Roberts chipped in with 28 scalps.
I'm surprised it was only 16 tests I guess Lee debuted a few years after Gillespie & it was probably interrupted with injury a bit? Gillespie & McGrath probably stick in my mind more than Lee for some reason, Lara hated facing Gillespie.
 

RussellEbertHandball

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I'm surprised it was only 16 tests I guess Lee debuted a few years after Gillespie & it was probably interrupted with injury a bit? Gillespie & McGrath probably stick in my mind more than Lee for some reason, Lara hated facing Gillespie.
yep I'm doing another list from that site of bowling pairs and it's McGrath and Gillespie that were a longer running pair

McGrath and Gillespie Together: 362 wickets at 23.02 in 47 Tests
 

philreich

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Despite all the pump up about this Aussie attack I'm taking McGrath, Gillespie, Lee & Warne in their pomp all day every day.
Although I don't disagree, I reckon Pat Cummins is definitely in the frame with those greats of the past. He may not be as good as McGrath, but I think he sits comfortably alongside Lee and Gillespie. He's a wonderful bowler, and we're very lucky to have him.
 

JimmyBeerCans

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Although I don't disagree, I reckon Pat Cummins is definitely in the frame with those greats of the past. He may not be as good as McGrath, but I think he sits comfortably alongside Lee and Gillespie. He's a wonderful bowler, and we're very lucky to have him.
Gillespie was averaging around the same as McGrath for a fair chunk of his career iirc he was a different bowler after multiple injuries, I think he was a step above Lee.
 

JimmyBeerCans

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Yeah Dizzy was a superb bowler - I seem to remember him taking 7 for 37 against the Poms in England. At his best, he was unplayable.
I mean if you were picking the best of the last 20 years or so Cummins & Johnson etc would be pushing Lee out probably, in terms of the mix early career Brett Lee coming in bowling lightning quick after McGrath & Gillespie is still mouth watering we were lucky to see it I guess.
 

RussellEbertHandball

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Fast Bowling pairs The website I linked above, the guy has done his ranking for 10 best fast bowling pairs. All subjective but he produces stats of wickets averages and tests bowling together. This starts at 10th and finishes at his 1st ranked pair


McGrath and Gillespie Together: 362 wickets at 23.02 in 47 Tests
Trueman and Statham Together: 283 wickets at 25.75 in 35 Tests [Wisden says 35 Tests in tandem: 284 wickets]
Lillee and Thompson Together: 132 wickets at 26.05 in 16 Tests [Wisden says 26 Tests in tandem: 217 wickets]
Willis and Botham Together: 187 wickets at 28.95 in 26 Tests
Anderson and Broad Together 611 wickets in 80 Tests as at 1 Nov 2015 [since that test they have taken a further 159 wickets and 167 wickets respectively so probaly is 850+]
Roberts and Holding Together: 216 wickets at 25.27 in 28 Tests
Marshall and Garner Together: 230 wickets at 20.16 in 23 Tests
Walsh and Ambrose Together: 412 wickets at 22.10 in 52 Tests [Wisden says 95 tests 775 wickets]
Donald and Pollock Together: 346 wickets at 21.36 in 44 Tests
Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis Together: 476 wickets at 22.39 in 56 Tests [Wisden website says 61 Tests in tandem: 550 wickets]

The Wisden website with their 10 best pairing of bowlers ie any combo.Their figures look more accurate.
 

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Garibaldi Red

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If the Kiwis make it through today’s play, tomorrow would be the only day of the series that they wouldn’t have bowled.
 

RussellEbertHandball

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Kiwis have had some bad luck, losing the toss in Perth and being out in the field for 2 days when it was 40 degrees, and heat of all days in Perth, lots of injuries before this test for 5 changes, but apart from Wagner, they have been pathetic virtually every day in day out for this series.

Yeah Blundell made a century and there have been a few half centuries, but nobody apart from Wagner has performed in 4 or 5 let alone 6 innings, of their speciality.

Pakistan were hopeless but the Kiwis were more disappointing given how well they have played the last 3 years.

Ignoring 4 and 5 test series, I reckon this 3 test series has been as disappointing by a visiting team, based on expectations of how good the oppo have been, since the 2001-02 South Africa series where they came here with a great all round side and were smashed 0-3 and Oz won by 246 runs, 9 wickets and 10 wickets and was a battle of #1 and #2 sides. But at least they made a 350+ and 450 in 2 of their 6 innings' with the rest between 120 and 270.

The Indian 4 test series in 2011-12, where they came here with an excellent but ageing batting line, and solid bowling rather great bowling attack, they were smashed 0-4 with 2 innings defeats, a 100+ run defeat and a 298 run defeat. In their 8 innings they made 1 score of 400 (at SCG), 3 in the 200's and 4 between 160 and 199.

In this series NZ has made 166,171, 148,240, 251 and 5/80 odd as I type. That just isn't good enough by their batsmen.
 

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