Crowd noise, Majority crowds, home crowds and umpiring decisions

[WillHayward]

This is a proven world wide phenomenon.

Yet the AFL is so arrogant and so full of media spin they want to pretend our game is immune from this. That somehow our umpires are more professional than every other sport in the world. Less human.

What was it Dennis Pagan used to say?

"Don't piss in my pocket and tell me its raining"

Here are some interesting academic research articles on this topic. The crowd noise phenomenon has been known about for decades!

In Support of the Supporters? Do Social Forces Shape Decisions of the Impartial?

Influence of crowd noise on soccer refereeing consistency in soccer

"Football Freakonomics": How Advantageous Is Home-Field Advantage? And Why?

 

[Kwality]

Doesnt happen in Grand Finals, that day the ground is neutral.

Now Will, you & you research, when will you learn:
Gils told us, so its true so its neutral just like he's told us about booing, same sex marriage ... all hail Gil.

 

[Back One Out]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

 

[BallaratBulldog]

Not usually an issue for us since we bribe the umps.

 

[WillHayward]

Doesnt happen in Grand Finals, that day the ground is neutral.

Now Will, you & you research, when will you learn:
Gils told us, so its true so its neutral just like he's told us about booing, same sex marriage ... all hail Gil.

True.

I forgot.

Gil is the gentleman oracle.

And his parents own a big farm in South Austraia called Rose something - so he must be 100% honest.

 

[WillHayward]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

I dont think going back to the old VFL is the answer...

I also think what you you desribed above also perfectly describes Geelong's situation - who last time I looked were Victorian...

 

[Back One Out]

Not usually an issue for us since we bribe the umps.

It's funny cos it's true

 

[Teen Wolf]

I didn't realise such a statement had been made, do you have a link for it? Unrealistic expectations like that would only set umpires up to fail.

 

[DroopStDanny]

It's funny cos it's true

Voted yet?

 

[Farang83150]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

LOL...Points for being so stupid, well done.

 

[Kwality]

True.

I forgot.

Gil is the gentleman oracle.

And his parents own a big farm in South Austraia called Rose something - so he must be 100% honest.

Very smart of you to fall in line Will, I'm there too.

As for the family farm, the property portfolio is a bit more than that, & good luck (hard work) to the famiy forebears ... they've even got a lump of the Nullabor I'm told.

They have home courts in basketball dont they, dont buy the neutral stuff ... as long as its fair, as long as you earn the advantage, no FIX in the programming.

 

[Kwality]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

No one denies there are too many teams in Melbourne , more often than not, Melbourne is the home of the half full stadium SO much so clubs are looking to move home games away because they cant pull a crowd.

Transparent is the right of some clubs to unearned (aka gifted) home ground advantage on GF day.

There is a reason the Lions threepeat trumps the Hawks effort.

 

[Back One Out]

No one denies there are too many teams in Melbourne , more often than not, Melbourne is the home of the half full stadium SO much so clubs are looking to move home games away because they cant pull a crowd.

Transparent is the right of some clubs to unearned (aka gifted) home ground advantage on GF day.

There is a reason the Lions threepeat trumps the Hawks effort.

Behold... the Free Kick Differential table

 

[thedank]

I've had a few so dont piss on my parade if this is a terrible idea, im just spitballing

why dont umps wear noise cancelling headphones with mics to communicate to each other/AFL HQ?
+no crowd noise influential
+stops them hearing abuse from players and fans
+can easily discuss calls with each other and HQ

 

[juss]

I've had a few so dont piss on my parade if this is a terrible idea, im just spitballing

why dont umps wear noise cancelling headphones with mics to communicate to each other/AFL HQ?
+no crowd noise influential
+stops them hearing abuse from players and fans
+can easily discuss calls with each other and HQ

That's creative, and the points you make are actually all positive even though it seems ridiculous.

 

[juss]

Theoretically from social psychology it makes sense it would have an impact. From a psychological perspective, humans are prone to peer pressure, prone to conforming and prone to not wanting to appear incompetent.

Therefore biasing noise influencing your decisions towards one being correct and the other not being correct, if it's a 50/50 call in your mind which way do you think you would end up going?

It's a pretty sound hypothesis that biasing noise influences close decisions.

 

[DrPowellPepper]

Wish the new crowd control guys would wear them too

I've had a few so dont piss on my parade if this is a terrible idea, im just spitballing

why dont umps wear noise cancelling headphones with mics to communicate to each other/AFL HQ?
+no crowd noise influential
+stops them hearing abuse from players and fans
+can easily discuss calls with each other and HQ

 

[kaiserchief13]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

Much easier to make finals as non Vic but much harder to finish top 2 as it means you have to win numerous away games

 

[Scotland]

Not usually an issue for us since we bribe the umps.

We just have our own set. They favour us at home because 60,000 boos then on the road they are immune to the crowd whether it's 5,000 at Blacktown or 70,000 at the G. Good lads.

 

[Kwality]

Behold... the Free Kick Differential table

& your version of what the above is: ??

 

[Dazzler9]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

"It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 55,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium."
Sure is!

"Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series"
So why don't all the non-Vic sides enjoy such an advantage? You'd think the non-Vic sides would all make the top 8 each and every single year, wouldn't you?

But they don't. Wonder why? Probably 'cos they have an away ground disadvantage every second week. Maybe??

 

[Ron The Bear]

Behold... the Free Kick Differential table

Richmond was -122 in 2018.

More people have watched Richmond play in the last three years than any other club, yet they have been last for free kick differential each season.

Crowd noise can be a factor, but there are clearly other variables at play.

 

[Back One Out]

"It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 55,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium."
Sure is!

"Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series"
So why don't all the non-Vic sides enjoy such an advantage? You'd think the non-Vic sides would all make the top 8 each and every single year, wouldn't you?

But they don't. Wonder why? Probably 'cos they have an away ground disadvantage every second week. Maybe??

We need to do another couple of Free Kick Differential tables

One for home games and one for away games

 

[Back One Out]

Richmond was -122 in 2018.
More people have watched Richmond play in the last three years than any other club, yet they have been last for free kick differential each season.
Crowd noise can be a factor, but there are clearly other variables at play.

The Richmond gameplan has revolved around relentless pressure on the opposition ball-carrier. Very easy to give away frees when you play like that. Probably something that Hardwick was happy to wear if it meant your opponents were coughing up the footy and getting killed on the turnovers.

The Tigers had very low possession totals for a team that won so often, meaning they probably weren't infringed against with the same regularity as a high possession team that made the ball & not tackling their main objective.

Richmond have also played with an undersized bullocking ruckman who basically tries nullify his taller opponents in the hitouts and beat them areound the ground - Nank gave away more frees than anyone in 2018

 

[Kwality]

It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium
Think of all that umpire-influencing and home ground advantage

Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series

Finish in the Top 2 and you get two home finals with a huuuuge home advantage & crowd-influenced umpiring
No wonder so many non-Victorian pretenders make the Grand Final.

Why cant a Melbourne team pull 40, 000

"It must be great to play 11 home games in front of 40,000 55,000 partisan barrackers in a packed-out smaller stadium."
Sure is!

"Massive advantage over your rivals in terms of winning 12+ games and playing in the finals series"
So why don't all the non-Vic sides enjoy such an advantage? You'd think the non-Vic sides would all make the top 8 each and every single year, wouldn't you?

But they don't. Wonder why? Probably 'cos they have an away ground disadvantage every second week. Maybe??

In fairness to the Melbourne clubs, other than 5 games on the road, they can play 17 games at home, its the fans not going to the game thats the problem, TOO MUCH FOOTY IN MELBOURNE, supply exceeds demand, wont go to this ground or the other. Its recognised by clubs such as the Hawks, or Melbourne, even North (any more?), who are bit more active trying to put bums on seats.

WHEN its good enough for the bigger clubs, e.g Pies & Tiges to play 17 times in Melbourne its precious to sook about the Eagles - its not as if these clubs havent felt failure.