Crows V Saints

[oneandone]

just thought id say it was a fair effort by the crows kept the pressure on us most of the night, you were hard done by from the umpires but we were first to the ball in most instances (no gloating intended). Walker is a star in the making, dangerfield has balls continuously trying to break the lines will be a champion, the porpoise is a freak.
damn shame to see hentschel go down again
you blokes have a lot to look forward too good luck for the rest of the season

 

[Old Spice]

30-11 equally appalling

WTF is unequally appalling then? 14-18? (I think it rhymes with) Duck off, please, just because the free kick count didn't favour you last week, ie the umpires didn't hand it to you on a silver plate, you think we couldn't find plenty of decisions that didn't go our way last week, difference is we've accepted it, happens all the time, you guys just can't accept it.

Yes the Tippet/Dawson one was a shocker, but it barely made up for the 5 he missed from having his arm/jumper/leg/head/whatever else held, not to mention the arm chopping, every other time he or any of our other players went near it. Oh and don't you dare touch Kosi or Riewoldt, they might fall to pieces. Should I go on?

I'm sorry, I rarely go off at the umpires, because at the end of the day there's nothing you can do, but really when its 11-30, thats a difference of 19, we didn't get 19 free kicks, you could say 3 times as many, I think I can release, that's just wrong. 18-14? Get over it, we get that all the time.

Sorry Mods, please delete if you feel the need, but just can't stand Collingwood ferals coming on here and telling me that was fair.

Some fair points about individual decisions. Sounds very much like the complaints Collingwood had last week, except last week we lost by four points, tonight you lost by a fair old margin. Can't have it both ways me old totee.

Still, shouldn't matter what the margin is, the umpires need to realise they are not players and the less we see of them the better. I reckon, unfortunately, you were a victim of Jeff Gieschen obstinance - let's not take a backward step after the foul decisions of last week but march on like good old Christian soliders.

EDIT: Oh, and one more thing, suppoerters of a side that has so many atrocious 80's bogan haircuts shouldn't be talking about Collingwood ferals.

That is all.

 

[birdmanptr]

just thought id say it was a fair effort by the crows kept the pressure on us most of the night, you were hard done by from the umpires but we were first to the ball in most instances (no gloating intended). Walker is a star in the making, dangerfield has balls continuously trying to break the lines will be a champion, the porpoise is a freak.
damn shame to see hentschel go down again
you blokes have a lot to look forward too good luck for the rest of the season

Thanks same to you the very clean hands by you guys tonight

 

[Vader]

The Collingwood game is old news. This thread is for discussion of the Crows vs St Kilda game. No more attempts to derail the thread, or the cards will come out.

 

[Mismatched]

To the footy, St. Kilda played well and congratulations to them, they pressured us into handballing and handballing into retreat until we made the errors. Although I think we do have ourselves or the coaching staff to blame in some respect in that there's times when the play on or quick handball just aren't on and all it would take is a quick steady, look up the ground and better option is there.

Having said that, I do like the game plan and I think give us a year or so, a few more mature bodies running around etc. Tippet, Walker and co a few years older providing quality targets like Riewoldt and Kosi did tonight, and we could be Geelong like, could even be later on in the year. At stages we look very good, but to me, and our seats are high up on the wing so I get the overall tactical view very well, we look like a team still coming to grips or learning our game plan, hence we get a few shocking turnovers that result in what look like really easy goals. What I like though is that we still keep attacking, we don't seem to go into our shells like we used to when this happens. At this stage, we need to make the mistakes and learn from them.

Just my thoughts on a few players, will probably give a few later(if, fingers crossed, my recorder worked):

Dangerfield: Is just an absolute unit, so strong through the legs and core, just watching him stand up in tackles is amazing, elite players keep their feet in tackles, but few, if they go to ground in a tackle can get back up with 1, 2, even 3 blokes still laying the tackle, this bloke can and it is amazing. Bit like those bobo dolls or jack in a boxes, no matter how many times you knock him down, just keeps jumping back up. Disposal also hasn't seemed to be a problem in his first 2 matches either which is good. This bloke will be a player, don't bother playing him in the SANFL, his tank is still suspect, but he'll develop that faster playing AFL I feel.

Petrenko: Just love this bloke, is almost untackle-able, is so quick and agile, as well as strong in the core, that I can see him and Dangerfield just killing it in the future as teams won't be able to touch them.

Walker: Certainly stepped up in the 2nd half when Hentschel went down, hope they keep giving him similar game time because every time he goes near it, you feel something special might happen, give him a few games to adjust to the pace and style of AFL and he'll really start showing what he's got.

Certainly missed Stevens, oh and I hope Moran bloody hurries up and develops into a half decent backman, or even Sellar/Mckernan, because Rutten just isn't quick/agile/tall enough to go with the likes of Kosi, might as well have put Hentschel on him before he got injured or even Otten and sent Rutten forward just to change things up a bit.

Tippet: much improved game and surprise, surprise, I think we'll find he spent a lot longer on the ground up forward. Good to see him kick 3 straight as well, got one easy one from the umps, but made up for all the shockers he missed that if he wore the #12 for the red, white and black would have been paid instantly.

Porplyzia: gee this bloke is a star, just when you thought the game was going to run away from us in the 3rd, who pops up? If he ever improves on his consistency, watch out. The mark over Tippet was just special.

Anyways, not too dissapointed, performances like this were going to happen, I thought we played pretty well for 3 and a half quarters, against probably a far superior team which boasts probably the 2nd or 3rd best forward line in the league. With the number of 2nd and 3rd year players we have at the moment, we've got to expect this and watching St. Kilda, I was suspect about them preseason, but I think they will be a top 4 side again this year. They've had the cattle for years, but it looks like they've finally put it all together, into a far more complete package.

 

[Mismatched]

Some fair points about individual decisions. Sounds very much like the complaints Collingwood had last week, except last week we lost by four points, tonight you lost by a fair old margin. Can't have it both ways me old totee..

Fair enough, except with 10 minutes to go, the game was still anyone's, you could tell next goal could possibly win it and St Kilda got it. The margin flattered St. Kilda a bit because they kicked away in the last couple of minutes when the game was done and dusted, as happens in many games today. You take your foot off the pedal when the game has been decided and you'll quickly lose by 6-7 goals. The percentage could come back to haunt us, but trust me, the game was a lot closer than the margin suggests.

 

[Mismatched]

just thought id say it was a fair effort by the crows kept the pressure on us most of the night, you were hard done by from the umpires but we were first to the ball in most instances (no gloating intended). Walker is a star in the making, dangerfield has balls continuously trying to break the lines will be a champion, the porpoise is a freak.
damn shame to see hentschel go down again
you blokes have a lot to look forward too good luck for the rest of the season

Cheers mate, with regards to being first to the ball, half the problem was that when we were first to the ball, we'd be immediately wrapped up and bang, holding the ball. Why would we want to be holding the ball when all that happens is a free kick to the opposition. My beef with the umpires has nothing to do with "in the backs" or "high tackles" that are associated with being first to the ball. I'm all for players being paid these.

It was the lack of any prior opportunity given to our players, the blatant holding the man's that would be paid to Riewoldt or Kosi, that just weren't to Tippet, Walker or Hentschel, or just stupid things like Vince being done for a fend off when he had both arms wrapped around the ball. Not to mention Andy Otten giving away a free kick for taking an uncontested mark, not touching his opponent once. These are what stump me.

 

[oneandone]

Cheers mate, with regards to being first to the ball, half the problem was that when we were first to the ball, we'd be immediately wrapped up and bang, holding the ball. Why would we want to be holding the ball when all that happens is a free kick to the opposition. My beef with the umpires has nothing to do with "in the backs" or "high tackles" that are associated with being first to the ball. I'm all for players being paid these.

It was the lack of any prior opportunity given to our players, the blatant holding the man's that would be paid to Riewoldt or Kosi, that just weren't to Tippet, Walker or Hentschel, or just stupid things like Vince being done for a fend off when he had both arms wrapped around the ball. Not to mention Andy Otten giving away a free kick for taking an uncontested mark, not touching his opponent once. These are what stump me.

fair call, there were several blatant ones there for tippet and walker that werent paid, i thought the vince one was there but a bit soft. i also believe the umps set a precedent early on with a few soft ones that went our way and it set the tone for the night with what would be given a free kick and what wouldnt. personally i dont think kosi got any soft ones tonight but rooey did. the otten one was definately soft was nothing in it, had no idea where the umpire picked that one. what i think hurt you guys the most was two 50's that we turned into goals at crucial times especially the maric one, thought he was just starting to break even with king and gardiner

 

[Go the Guts]

Gday folks, first poster here. Was at the game tonight, IMO St. Kilda's pressure was the most telling thing all night, and the reason we lost. Some great signs all round as many have said in various threads, but we should be prepared for many more losses this season - If Goody, Eddy and Macca have an off day, we are in strife. And they will - all of them are the other side of 30, and in the first 2 games they have featured prominently, especially Edwards. The gulf between our talented youngsters and the seasoned old engine room is quite large in terms of years and experience.

The umpiring was unbelievable to watch all night as a quiet observer, but if that's the worst we get all season well we've hopefully had our shocker over with tonight.

Also, looking forward to Dangerfield showing his true potential, have watched all the Youtube footage of him as a youngster, and his pace looks incredible, as well as his natural skills. Can see why they took him over Brad Ebert.

Good to be amongst you all anyway.

 

[NSWCROW]

Strange...we've never had a problem with McBurney before ???????..............

 

[Elder van Berlo]

Petrenko shirked a contest or two (he preffered to tackle than take the ball on occasions tonight)

Would you blame him? Twice in two weeks now he's picked the ball up, been collared and gone HTB. Why would you bother getting the footy when you can just sweat off and make the tackle?

 

[Crow-mo]

Not much to say apart from:

In: Cook
Out: Knights

yes, with comments like that its best you say as little as possible.

 

[Crow-mo]

Im opening myself up to abuse here, but from an outsiders view, thats probably the worst game ive seen Knights play. There were players that were less effective, but he made mistake after mistake, fumbles, fell over, kicks to the opposition. I know opinion on this board is poles apart (either extreme love or extreme hate for him) and I usually sit in the middle, but I cant remember him playing worse than that.

I don't know what you're talking about, or whether you're watching on old 12" black n white telly. but the bolded point just ain't true.

in fact the only interesting thing about his game, you didn't mention. that his kick to handball ratio was about face, and he handballed at every occasion - per the confusing game plan. this is a guy who kicks whenever he gets the chance, and in this game he has over 2 handballs to every kick - and you noticed that this is the worst game you can remember him playing, yet you (and quite a few others to be fair) never noticed that?

kicks to the opposition? he only kicked it 6 times, and 1 clanger. fell over? mistake after mistake? nonsense. I saw him handball to space twice in the first quarter, which was a set play at a stoppage - and others weren't in position.

all in all this is just invented excuses to justify an already held opinion. he wasn't great, and he seemed uncomfortable in the handball and play on mandate of the gameplan - but he wasn't bad or worthy of being singled out for negative attention.

Petrenko on the other hand...once he gets the pace of AFL, he will be an absolute gun. Is an absolute clone of a young Mcleod playing down at Alberton. That bounding sort of run, great evasive skills, great kick. Has all the basics to become a star.

he looks alright, but don't think he looks anything like McLeod of 1994. petrenko is a lower centre of gravity, short steps, compact; whereas McLeod was a loper - big long strides, gliding across turf.

Walker too. Grew incredibly once he got the gametime in the second half. Could have ended with 4 goals really and looked dangerous everytime he went near it. As soon as he gets the respect and confidence of his teammates, he'll star as well.

he fades in and out of the game, but his movement is fantastic. he has great control of his body in the air, the upper body in particular - that sort of float that special players have. he needs to involve himself more, but he has a grace about himself. lot of time.

but bottom line Macca, your view of Knight's game is more than a little biased. I know you don't rate him, but you're all over the place on his game today.

 

[Crow-mo]

Funny how we all see things differently. I thought Knights was one of the few players to run and carry. He was in my top 5 tonight.

that's almost as silly. we got no run and carry from knights tonight, he was handball king. normally he runs, bounces and kicks - and (under instruction no doubt) he didn't play his natural game.

 

[Crow-mo]

yep at this rate, Maric will be buggered by round 10. Desperately need another ruckman.

spot on. Ivan was pretty good, but he struggled to man the front line against both King and Gardiner on his own.

I actually thought he was pretty good, but he's still too young and inexperienced to carry it all on his own.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

The Collingwood game is old news. This thread is for discussion of the Crows vs St Kilda game. No more attempts to derail the thread, or the cards will come out.

So its okay for other teams to troll at will on this board but Crows supporters can't reply. Case in point my posts were deleted from the Trent H thread but Asguardian can troll whenever he likes.

What are we trying to be politically correct on this board and show we accept all opinions - sorry doesnt apply to Aussie rules and especially in this state.

 

[Crow-mo]

Also, I watch Doughty very closely tonight considering he cops the brunt of a lot of your criticism and I would have had him and Maric very highly in my best players this week. He has good disposal and gets the hard ball. There are plenty that should get dropped before he does. That is just my opinion, but yeah I thought he played well tonight.

agreed. anyone taking pot shots at Doughty this week is utterly clueless.

decisive and strong in the contest, very good. few can say the same.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

I'm surprised Maric didn't get a guernsey in the best players. Thought he was great.

Macca/Goodwin and edwards are still having a massive impact on our performances and are all still in our top 5. Could actually be a bad thing given none will be around when we next challenge for a flag. Are we in effect stagnating until these 3 champions hang up the boots?

 

[Vader]

So its okay for other teams to troll at will on this board but Crows supporters can't reply. Case in point my posts were deleted from the Trent H thread but Asguardian can troll whenever he likes.

Asgardian may be the biggest troll on the planet, but he does it on Bay13 where that sort of thing is expected. He knows that he'll get booted off the Adelaide Board before he can blink if he tries it here.

What happens on the Bay, stays on the Bay. That's a concept which you (and several other Crows fans) struggle to come to terms with. I judge only according to what happens on this board and there was nothing out of line in anything Asgardian posted last night.

Your own post, on the other hand, was very lucky not to get a yellow card for abuse.

It is NOT ok for other teams to troll this board and I was up until 2AM last night handing out cards to & deleting posts from Collingwood fans who attempted to do just that.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

Asgardian may be the biggest troll on the planet, but he does it on Bay13 where that sort of thing is expected. He knows that he'll get booted off the Adelaide Board before he can blink if he tries it here.

What happens on the Bay, stays on the Bay. That's a concept which you (and several other Crows fans) struggle to come to terms with. I judge only according to what happens on this board and there was nothing out of line in anything Asgardian posted last night.

Your own post, on the other hand, was very lucky not to get a yellow card for abuse.

It is NOT ok for other teams to troll this board and I was up until 2AM last night handing out cards to & deleting posts from Collingwood fans who attempted to do just that.

Fair enough. Thanks for the reply. I suppose I'm not used to some of the type of human beings that come from the Port board - supposedly good blokes and then stab you in the back when your back is turned. Just when you think they can't get any lower.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

I have tried to avoid the hype, but we really do have a lot to work with in our current group of players aged 24 and under. I actually believe when you compare the two lists, our current list of 24 and unders have more talent across the board when compared to similar aged players in our premiership teams.

Porplyzia/Maric/McKay/Tippett/Knights/VB/Petrenko/Dangerfield/Walker and quite possibly Ottens and Douglas could be better than average players.

Porplyzia/Marc/Knights/Petrenko/Dangerfield/Walker/Mckay could all be elite players in their respective possessions.

BTW Patty Dangerfield - what is it game number 3 - wow.

 

[TheLeftFist8]

I'm surprised Maric didn't get a guernsey in the best players. Thought he was great.

Macca/Goodwin and edwards are still having a massive impact on our performances and are all still in our top 5. Could actually be a bad thing given none will be around when we next challenge for a flag. Are we in effect stagnating until these 3 champions hang up the boots?

It's amazing how different perspectives vary so much. He was poor in the first half, got beaten, and did not deserve to be in the best.

Edwards was excellent last night. Kudos to Johncock as well, can be very proud of his efforts. Bock also won his position, until late when the flood of delivery forward consumed all our defenders.

Will be interested to see how Rutten backs up after that effort. Watching at the ground i thought he was average but not terrible, it's just that his opponent actually made him pay last night and he was isolated 1 on 1 more than usual. He has deficiencies that threaten to hurt us but hasn't yet had too many blowouts.

Walker was only a few inches from kicking 4, good to see him work into the game. Wont be a complete player for a couple years as his body strength is still lacking through the core but is improving rapidly. In a year where the premiership is a little out of reach, he should be given every opportunity for as long as his body holds up. I'd think a mid-year spell with Norwood followed by an end of season return ala Tippett 08 would be on the cards.

Otten looks a lot like Bassett except he doesn't display the blatant disregard for safety and full-on intensity that Bassett did. Also has a limited ability to spoil with his wrong hand or find a way of getting his good hand through (unlike the mighty left fist which always found its target). Still, he is a great talent.

Dangerfield and Petrenko...sensational promise. People have made a good distinction between these young blokes who instinctively look to risk and create forwards motion and delivery versus the older blokes who take the safer approach. My only fear going forward (pardon the irony) is that our young blokes will start chip chipping and lose confidence in aggressive risk taking.

 

[Bollox]

Enjoyed the game despite what some say..whilst the umpiring was inconsistent i wouldnt go blaming it. U actually benefitted from it too on occasions but the wieght of free's against was over the top...over umpiring is an endemic problem. They seemed strict on guys making an effort to get it out when tackled but plenty werent paid.

You guys shouldn't worry too much about this loss i reckon. Two games against two top 8 teams and u have a 1-1 start. Craig's gameplan looks sound and pretty much a similar story to other coaches by the looks...two things being drummed in...keep it moving and get in their face when u dont have it as the best way to beat zoning. Probably skills that let u down thru the middle..they had more efficient disposers on the night like Dal Santo but Edwards had another damn good game and is easily your best afield so far this yr. Edwards just couldnt exert the same influence on the game as a cpl of the saints guys.

So much GOOD stuff for u guys that this loss shouldnt hurt. You need games against the top 8 likelies anwyay right ?..best to get them early for your own improvement.

Not one of those youngsters shirked it or looked out of place...skills and strength the only things letting them down on oaccasions and thats normal early in careers..BIG positives for the future and one of the toughest jobs this week would be to resist the temptation to drop ANY of them after a loss. Otten showed lots but naturally faded after halftime..liked his game the most despite some errors (which kid doesnt make em ?), Dangerfield and Walker look very promising..Petrenko showed some nads and came back strong after a knock..Mackay/Tippett both looked good...LOTS of positives and if someone has to suffer the knife u wouldnt want it to be any of those blokes. Didnt like Knights game and realistically Reilly would be on notice...wouldnt drop Knights tho.

Highlight was going to be the Riewoldt/Bock matchup for me .. coz its AA CHF on AA CHB...bit of a fizzer coz Riewoldt really isnt matchfit after his op and interrupted preseason...but Bock was DAMN good running off him. I think Reiwoldt must have decided he couldnt keep up in the second half and tried to act as a decoy and ran Bock away from any contest and limit his run out game second half. Bock got the better of him but Rutten was soundly beaten one on one by Koschitzke who was damn strong last night. Rare sight to see Rutten beaten. Tippett showed some great signs as did Walker late in the game...Walker just looks the goods despite probably needing another 2 yrs to become damaging at this level for more than short occasional bursts and thats natural.

Their big guys were just too powerful...Gardiner and King were far too expereineced but at least Maric had a good go and was working without a safety net. Maric is coming along nicely i reckon. Makes some blues but wouldnt be too harsh on him.

Dangerous thing this week would be to make kneejerk changes that arnt needed..its only round 2 and they've both been top 8 mobs and u are 1-1 so u can stay positive...its the gameplan that needs to be concentrated on and not go butchering the personnel...i'd think about Reilly and maybe give Knights a roasting but not drop him....but not one of those kids deserves anything but a slap on the back. btw..Mackay looks all class.

 

[54Dogs]

I thought the Crows kids looked good last night. Great attack on the ball from Danger and Petrenko, Otten reads the game well but doesn't seem to have a natural intensity or aggression about him. Should slot in OK to free up Stevens though. Walker just moves like a class act, actually looks like he may be better suited with more room to move if he has the tank. Also loved Tippets aggression and attack at the ball.

On the downside Reilly seemed a bit ho hum and other than a few tackles Douglas had very little impact.

What changes would you be looking at for next week?

Hentschell > Stevens (if fit) or Gill /Griffin

Possibly Symes in as well.

 

[CaptainDangerfield]

It's amazing how different perspectives vary so much. He was poor in the first half, got beaten, and did not deserve to be in the best.

Given he has only really played 1 season of AFL footy and he rucked pretty much the entire game on his own against two seasoned veterans, i would give him 10/10 for heart alone.

As others have said ^^^^ I like the way our kids are willing to go in and get their own ball. At times last night, i thought Petrenko and especially Dangerfield were outstanding in this regard. However, re Otten, hmmm not sure about him. He really doesn't appear to like the body. Obviously, too early to call but.........