News Cyril and Shannyn Rioli speak to Caro - link to club statement in page 8

[Hawthorn23]

Some further developments to the story in the video below:

Mod edit: it’s a must watch for anyone reading this thread.

 

[hawkman]

if an indigenous colleague had been vilified in that way by another colleague - and had been given and accepted a ‘heartfelt’ apology - would you, without checking with that colleague - report it to HR and your senior managers?

Also this was 9 years ago. There might be more of a feeling to report it now

 

[SJT76]

if an indigenous colleague had been vilified in that way by another colleague - and had been given and accepted a ‘heartfelt’ apology - would you, without checking with that colleague - report it to HR and your senior managers?

I’ve seen it done with sexual harassment. Resulted in a further investigation that found 2 or 3 people had also been harassed by the same person, but hadn’t wanted to “make a scene” so kept quiet about it… I can assure you they were grateful that the witness reported it

 

[threesixpio]

if an indigenous colleague had been vilified in that way by another colleague - and had been given and accepted a ‘heartfelt’ apology - would you, without checking with that colleague - report it to HR and your senior managers?

Didn’t say without telling the person first. Of course I’d tell , rather than check with.

EDIt: I come at this as a leader finding out

 

[threesixpio]

I’ve seen it done with sexual harassment. Resulted in a further investigation that found 2 or 3 people had also been harassed by the same person, but hadn’t wanted to “make a scene” so kept quiet about it… I can assure you they were grateful that the witness reported it

Some organisation are structured where people in leadership MUST report it if aware

 

[checkraiseulite]

Didn’t say without telling the person first. Of course I’d tell , rather than check with.

EDIt: I come at this as a leader finding out

if they said they prefer to leave it there and not make a big deal out of it and not take it any further - you’d still report without any regard for the victim’s agency to make their own decisions?

 

[threesixpio]

if they said they prefer to leave it there and not make a big deal out of it and not take it any further - you’d still report without any regard for the victim’s agency to make their own decisions?

Yes - it’s tough and I believe in a person’s agency…But my organisation requires it

 

[threesixpio]

PS: it’s not like HR and other areas will not take a complainants views into account

PPS: There is a positive obligation on employers to eliminate discrimination as far as possible

You MUST adhere to policies and practices put in place for this purpose

PPPS: racist comments affect more than just the complainant. This is not an opinion - it’s law

 

[threesixpio]

and I’ll add …this is a super duper example of why it should work this way …Cyril finds out about it …no systems in place to look into it further

 

[threesixpio]

HR is more than just looking at one off situations. If a box falls on someone’s head you don’t move on with an apology - you look at systems to make sure the box doesn’t fall on another persons head etc

 

[MrPremiership]

HR is more than just looking at one off situations. If a box falls on someone’s head you don’t move on with an apology - you look at systems to make sure the box doesn’t fall on another persons head etc

And you don't blame the victim who got hit by the box

 

[Randy Campbell]

And you don't blame the victim who got hit by the box

HR is not about looking for someone to blame, it's about making sure you can't be blamed.

 

[Dipper]

Yes - it’s tough and I believe in a person’s agency…But my organisation requires it

Yes, I would imagine it wouldn't be any other way.

I suppose we're talking about a footy club in 2013 with players on an end of year trip.

Does that change things at all?

You've used an analogy about a box falling on somebody's head (which I quite enjoyed btw) on the flip side footballers on an end of year trip sometimes have incidents where one belts another one silly, now if that happened in your office I don't think the victim's views could get the aggressor off but on end of year footy trips it's most often the case. Certainly in that regard its not quite the same thing.

Additionally I have wondered whether Cyril spoke to the player in question to ask if he minds his experience being brought up now. I'd hope so, his agency is paramount in my mind.

Sent from my SM-A326B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[HairyO]

Yes, I would imagine it wouldn't be any other way.

I suppose we're talking about a footy club in 2013 with players on an end of year trip.

Does that change things at all?

You've used an analogy about a box falling on somebody's head (which I quite enjoyed btw) on the flip side footballers on an end of year trip sometimes have incidents where one belts another one silly, now if that happened in your office I don't think the victim's views could get the aggressor off but on end of year footy trips it's most often the case. Certainly in that regard its not quite the same thing.

Additionally I have wondered whether Cyril spoke to the player in question to ask if he minds his experience being brought up now. I'd hope so, his agency is paramount in my mind.

Sent from my SM-A326B using BigFooty.com mobile app

That is the interesting one. The aggrieved player and the one who was offensive are apparently still friends all these years later.

It would be interesting to know if they wanted this aired. Especially the victim.

Caro didnt bother fact checking so I assume didnt bother asking either.

 

[grumbleguts]

Yes, I would imagine it wouldn't be any other way.

I suppose we're talking about a footy club in 2013 with players on an end of year trip.

Does that change things at all?

You've used an analogy about a box falling on somebody's head (which I quite enjoyed btw) on the flip side footballers on an end of year trip sometimes have incidents where one belts another one silly, now if that happened in your office I don't think the victim's views could get the aggressor off but on end of year footy trips it's most often the case. Certainly in that regard its not quite the same thing.

Additionally I have wondered whether Cyril spoke to the player in question to ask if he minds his experience being brought up now. I'd hope so, his agency is paramount in my mind.

Sent from my SM-A326B using BigFooty.com mobile app

The box analogy is a good one, except for one thing. Typically the box falling is an accident. We try and set up our work place to avoid accidents. We have gloves to stop acid getting on our hands. But the gloves won't stop some one deliberately throwing the acid at someone else. Infrastructure to prevent accidents only goes so far. Education has to take over to prevent people going outside the brief of infrastructure.

 

[checkraiseulite]

The box analogy is a good one, except for one thing. Typically the box falling is an accident. We try and set up our work place to avoid accidents. We have gloves to stop acid getting on our hands. But the gloves won't stop some one deliberately throwing the acid at someone else. Infrastructure to prevent accidents only goes so far. Education has to take over to prevent people going outside the brief of infrastructure.

easiest solution is ban the footy trip and consumption of alcohol at club functions.

obviously footy is not corporate enough.

 

[NYRB]

any idea who the player is? would i be out of line for it being a current player in commentary at the moment?

 

[chopflop]

Which 2013 hawks still play and do commentary. Pretty sure the answer is none

any idea who the player is? would i be out of line for it being a current player in commentary at the momen

 

[NYRB]

Which 2013 hawks still play and do commentary. Pretty sure the answer is none

Im not going to say its him but Jordan Lewis .

 

[chopflop]

Im not going to say its him but Jordan Lewis .

No it wasn't Jordan.

 

[eldorado]

Im not going to say its him but Jordan Lewis .

Yes, Jordan Lewis played in 2013 and now does commentary.

What does that have to do with anything?

 

[NYRB]

Yes, Jordan Lewis played in 2013 and now does commentary.

What does that have to do with anything?

I thought he was the racist , Cyril was referring to.

Again im not trying to pinpoint or accuse him but it just seemed like it might be him.

 

[eldorado]

I thought he was the racist , Cyril was referring to.

Again im not trying to pinpoint or accuse him but it just seemed like it might be him.

I don't know if there's any basis whatsoever to start throwing any names around. Does anyone benefit from such needless speculation?

 

[chopflop]

I thought he was the racist , Cyril was referring to.

Again im not trying to pinpoint or accuse him but it just seemed like it might be him.

but that's exactly what you did. Just be patient. Caro has said she will name the player eventually.

If someone on this board knows for sure they aren't going to post it.

 

[Bugs1977]

I thought he was the racist , Cyril was referring to.

Again im not trying to pinpoint or accuse him but it just seemed like it might be him.

Just because someone has let slip a racist comment it doesn’t make them a racist. If that was the case I reckon just about everyone on this planet would be one. We’ve all said things in our life that we regret and sometimes not think how it would be perceived by others. IMO what actually makes someone a racist is when they clearly understand what they’re saying is hurtful and repeatedly keep saying it.

 

[tommyk72]

Just because someone has let slip a racist comment it doesn’t make them a racist. If that was the case I reckon just about everyone on this planet would be one. We’ve all said things in our life that we regret and sometimes not think how it would be perceived by others. IMO what actually makes someone a racist is when they clearly understand what they’re saying is hurtful and repeatedly keep saying it.

While I think the comment made was racist, a problem we all face is that something can be very objectively racist (the comment made by the player) and there are also times when racism can be exceptionally subjective (the comment made by Jeff).

The objective things are easier to pinpoint. Navigating the subjective the things can be more complex.