Dane Swan

[jonbe54]

Swan is a running machine and extremely hard to tackle, he is good overhead and a decent kick.

His job is to break through and set up.

He does this extremely well and has done for a while now.

He has never been a tackling machine and never will be, thats not his game.

That is why we have the luke balls etc in the team.

Everyone has their job and his is to run

Why is this so hard for some people to understand????

 

[SnakePlisskin]

Dead right jonbe54 , saw in the paper today " mr unaccountable " and thought all they're doing is nitpicking on the current brownlow medalist for that online show the tackle knowing they'll get plenty of bites that's all.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

Swan is a running machine and extremely hard to tackle, he is good overhead and a decent kick.

His job is to break through and set up.

He does this extremely well and has done for a while now.

He has never been a tackling machine and never will be, thats not his game.

That is why we have the luke balls etc in the team.

Everyone has their job and his is to run

Why is this so hard for some people to understand????

You want us to understand that our 3 time copeland trophy winning Brownlow medalist has only one role in the team and that is to run and set up? And you want us to believe that Nathan Buckley's new gameplan allows only one player in our midfield defensive responsibility? Why yes, that is extremely difficult to understand.
Swanny isn't a tackling machine? In 2010 he averaged almost 5 tackles a game. Previously his average had been about 3, and it was again in 2011. That is a pretty big difference, remembering that tackle numbers have skyrocketed in the last couple of years. If he averaged 5 tackles a game how did we win the Grand Final when our outside player was being so defensive?

I understand that you need to have different players with different capabilities running through the midfield, but there is no excuses or plans for Dane Swan to be poor at pressuring, tackling and manning up. And if there is a plan that says, its ok Swanny you just work so hard running forward of the ball so don't worry too much about the defensive responsibilities, then Nathan Buckley ought to be sacked already!! There is absolutely no way Bucks would've told Swanny that.

 

[jonbe54]

You want us to understand that our 3 time copeland trophy winning Brownlow medalist has only one role in the team and that is to run and set up? And you want us to believe that Nathan Buckley's new gameplan allows only one player in our midfield defensive responsibility? Why yes, that is extremely difficult to understand.
Swanny isn't a tackling machine? In 2010 he averaged almost 5 tackles a game. Previously his average had been about 3, and it was again in 2011. That is a pretty big difference, remembering that tackle numbers have skyrocketed in the last couple of years. If he averaged 5 tackles a game how did we win the Grand Final when our outside player was being so defensive?

I understand that you need to have different players with different capabilities running through the midfield, but there is no excuses or plans for Dane Swan to be poor at pressuring, tackling and manning up. And if there is a plan that says, its ok Swanny you just work so hard running forward of the ball so don't worry too much about the defensive responsibilities, then Nathan Buckley ought to be sacked already!! There is absolutely no way Bucks would've told Swanny that.

Errm show me any part of my post where I mentioned Bux.

If your job is to break the break away from the packs - and his is - you need to be focused toward that.

There are very few complete players in the comp and trying to make Swan more accountable could take away is ability to break free as often.

Do you want 3 more tackles a game in exchange for 5 less damaging runs?

Because tackling and blocking are EXTREMELY draining. Swan is already under pressure with the sub rule - which has worked extremely well in that respect - and forcing him to tackle and block as well as run his nuts off is going to dismantle his effectiveness sooner or later.

 

[DWil6]

Nah Swanny is an asset. No question. May have his less influential games but this just isn't a problem in my opinion.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

Errm show me any part of my post where I mentioned Bux.

If your job is to break the break away from the packs - and his is - you need to be focused toward that.

There are very few complete players in the comp and trying to make Swan more accountable could take away is ability to break free as often.

Do you want 3 more tackles a game in exchange for 5 less damaging runs?

Because tackling and blocking are EXTREMELY draining. Swan is already under pressure with the sub rule - which has worked extremely well in that respect - and forcing him to tackle and block as well as run his nuts off is going to dismantle his effectiveness sooner or later.

Tell me, which Geelong midfielder has the same license as Swanny then? They are the premier team so they must have someone doing this crucial role that you speak of.

Also, I'm not just talking about pure tackling numbers, I'm talking about pressure acts, pushing into the defensive 50 with the same drive as pushing into the forward 50, nailing a tackle when it needs to be nailed. If you are seriously saying that Swan is so good that he has a license to just exert most of his energy running forward of the ball to break packs, then we are just a mile off in our thinking of what makes a premiership team.

 

[jonbe54]

Tell me, which Geelong midfielder has the same license as Swanny then? They are the premier team so they must have someone doing this crucial role that you speak of.

Also, I'm not just talking about pure tackling numbers, I'm talking about pressure acts, pushing into the defensive 50 with the same drive as pushing into the forward 50, nailing a tackle when it needs to be nailed. If you are seriously saying that Swan is so good that he has a license to just exert most of his energy running forward of the ball to break packs, then we are just a mile off in our thinking of what makes a premiership team.

I don't care about Geelong or any other team - we didn't model our team on any other to win in '10 and I hope to god we don't now.

If you take that I'm saying he has a license to bludge you are essentially putting your own spin on my posts.

So in an attempt to make it as plain and un - twistable as possible then:

Swan is a running midfielder in that his job is to run and break the game open. I mentioned nothing about running forward of the ball, you tried to put those words in my mouth - something I don't particularly like.

His focus - NOT HIS ENTIRE GAME - is therefore toward being in a position to do just that.

The more tackles you lay, the less chances you have to break away.

You still haven't answered my question either

Are you prepared to sacrifice 5 damaging break aways to gain 3 extra tackles?

I'd take the extra runs any day but you seem to believe we have to match the competition.

We should be making the competition match us - not copying the reigning premier which is always a waste of time.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

I don't care about Geelong or any other team - we didn't model our team on any other to win in '10 and I hope to god we don't now.

If you take that I'm saying he has a license to bludge you are essentially putting your own spin on my posts.

So in an attempt to make it as plain and un - twistable as possible then:

Swan is a running midfielder in that his job is to run and break the game open. I mentioned nothing about running forward of the ball, you tried to put those words in my mouth - something I don't particularly like.

His focus - NOT HIS ENTIRE GAME - is therefore toward being in a position to do just that.

The more tackles you lay, the less chances you have to break away.

You still haven't answered my question either

Are you prepared to sacrifice 5 damaging break aways to gain 3 extra tackles?

I'd take the extra runs any day but you seem to believe we have to match the competition.

We should be making the competition match us - not copying the reigning premier which is always a waste of time.

I think this is grossly overating Swanny's ability to himself be the player with ball breaking from a stoppage/break away. I can't remember him doing it more than once or twice for an entire game. But yes, I would be willing to sacrifice his breakaway from the stoppage, if he would stay and defend with intensity. This is not to say I don't think he should run forward and link up when we have the ball, it means you shouldn't just push forward assuming we are going to win the ball. Win the ball, then run forward. Imo he runs forward too often before we have control of it.

And being an outside runner means that he should have a responsibility to chase the opposition when they themselves break from the stoppage. I don't see him doing this often, or atleast not with the same amount of effort he puts in the other way. So I am saying that I do think Swanny is bludging defensively, you don't have to agree with that, but your response is that he is a running player so he is supposed to play on the outside and that is why he doesn't get as many tackles.
Well what happened in 2010 when we won the flag and his tackle rate went up by about 2 a game?
And I don't even particularly care so much for the tackles and stats anyway, but I can see it with my eyes. In 2010 he was pretty good with his intensity in tackling, manning up and defending, not great, but pretty good. Last year and already this year he just doesn't put the same zip into it.

So just to be clear, are you saying that he has less defensive responsibility because he is a runner on the outside of the contest? Because I think runner's on the outside of the contest are crucial to stopping the opposition from running it away.
I guess its just we see him differently. Are you going to the game saturday night? If you are, I'd advise you to just solely watch Swanny for 5-10 minutes and see if you still have the same opinion then.

 

[jonbe54]

I think this is grossly overating Swanny's ability to himself be the player with ball breaking from a stoppage/break away. I can't remember him doing it more than once or twice for an entire game. But yes, I would be willing to sacrifice his breakaway from the stoppage, if he would stay and defend with intensity. This is not to say I don't think he should run forward and link up when we have the ball, it means you shouldn't just push forward assuming we are going to win the ball. Win the ball, then run forward. Imo he runs forward too often before we have control of it.

And being an outside runner means that he should have a responsibility to chase the opposition when they themselves break from the stoppage. I don't see him doing this often, or atleast not with the same amount of effort he puts in the other way. So I am saying that I do think Swanny is bludging defensively, you don't have to agree with that, but your response is that he is a running player so he is supposed to play on the outside and that is why he doesn't get as many tackles.
Well what happened in 2010 when we won the flag and his tackle rate went up by about 2 a game?
And I don't even particularly care so much for the tackles and stats anyway, but I can see it with my eyes. In 2010 he was pretty good with his intensity in tackling, manning up and defending, not great, but pretty good. Last year and already this year he just doesn't put the same zip into it.

So just to be clear, are you saying that he has less defensive responsibility because he is a runner on the outside of the contest? Because I think runner's on the outside of the contest are crucial to stopping the opposition from running it away.
I guess its just we see him differently. Are you going to the game saturday night? If you are, I'd advise you to just solely watch Swanny for 5-10 minutes and see if you still have the same opinion then.

I didn't say he has less defensive ability because he is a runner I said he can't run off as frequently or effectively while he is tackling or blocking. I think that's common sense don't you? You can't do two things at once and its certainly a totally different mindset. Where do you see this outside runner thing? One of the things that sets Swan apart from many of his contempories is his ability to win his own ball and burst away with it.

Tackling and blocking are second to the ball defensive skills, winning the ball and breaking away are offensive skills which I can't see anyone disputing. Swan has the offensive skills to a high degree and the defensive skills to a lesser degree. They are not mutually exclusive but the practice of one lessens the effectiveness of the other in any set play.

As you say we see Swan in a totally different light, I see him as a wrecking ball with the ability to break the play wide open and I'm happy for him to be that way. You apparently want to turn him into an all rounder and are willing to sacrifice some of that attacking flair.

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

I don't think I have ever been as disappointed with a player as I am with Dane Swan right now. Such a carefree attitude. He had 1 tackle tonight. Where is the defensive effort?
He wants to retire by 30? If he keeps playing the me-first football he is at the moment, he can retire right now.
Am I wrong or does he look like he doesn't want to get hurt?

 

[Pera]

I agreed with you on the first page and I'm agreeing with you again.

A cocky "look at me, look at me" Brownlow medalist at the moment. Had no desire in putting the body in tonight and we were torn a new one in the guts.

 

[soreplums]

He'll bounce back. He is at his best when he runs hard both ways and gets on the end of it or links up. He just needs to be the one pushing back deeper and let Pendles be the one pushing forward. Pendles has better disposal and I would rather have him running into goal or hitting up our forwards.

 

[Vince12]

I flicked through but didn't read everything so sorry if already brought up.. Has he put on a lot of weight? Nearly everyone I was with tonight thought he looked more Stuart Dew than Dane Swan. His body looks like a cylinder. I know he's always been deceptively quick but his body shape looks a lot worse than normal

 

[dayna36]

Bloody hell there are things we aren't privvy to..like how many times the runner went out giving him messages..at one stage Swanny was playing full forward then in another qtr he was full back..he tried so hard to get the ball moving that maybe defensively he was lacking BUT with the 2 players out it left 2 on the bench.... this affected rotations and the boys had to cover for those that fell to injury overall the mini comeback in the 2nd could not continue especially with 2 men down..we were last to the contest we looked slow but it was swanny's fault....Please give the guy a break he tried he is improving week by week daisy???? pendles??? blair???? wellers??? Swanny is ahead of all except maybe pendles so yes Dane needs to get better BUT I believe this is happening week by week ..it's important to keep the faith now more than ever

 

[FAIRANDBALANCED]

Bloody hell there are things we aren't privvy to..like how many times the runner went out giving him messages..at one stage Swanny was playing full forward then in another qtr he was full back..he tried so hard to get the ball moving that maybe defensively he was lacking BUT with the 2 players out it left 2 on the bench.... this affected rotations and the boys had to cover for those that fell to injury overall the mini comeback in the 2nd could not continue especially with 2 men down..we were last to the contest we looked slow but it was swanny's fault....Please give the guy a break he tried he is improving week by week daisy???? pendles??? blair???? wellers??? Swanny is ahead of all except maybe pendles so yes Dane needs to get better BUT I believe this is happening week by week ..it's important to keep the faith now more than ever

The problem is that Dane puts all his efforts into running forward and getting the footy rather than stopping the guys he is playing on, you know, the guys like Marc Murphy and Chris Judd who tore us a new one all night.

 

[davywap]

Since when has it been Swan's job to shut down other players?

I can't believe I'm hearing all this crap about Swan when Thomas is playing like crap ATM. At least Swan is still getting plenty of the ball, Thomas ain't even doing that much.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

If he's not interested, piss him off now.

He's been by far the most disappointing of a large group.

 

[pillager]

Swan is a victim of his own high standards.

He definitely needs to get his mojo back!

 

[ipswichpies]

I am not sure Swan wants to bounce back he just looks like he could not care and I am not sure he is the only one,S Ed said there is a bit of trouble brewing within the playing group and TBH it looks like he is right.

Some of the players are down on form and confidence but to me it looks like a few are looking pretty petulant as well we are getting absolutely no leadership at all from these players,I won,t mentioned names because if were true to ourselves we know who they are.

If we had had no injuries we may have been alright but there is something going on no doubt about it,if we had a full list to choose from I would be dropping a few players and some of them would be big names,I think Buckley has a few weeks and then he has to make a stand by that time any realistic chance we had will be gone anyway.

S Ed may have spoken about first and I thought at first it was nothing but it has to sorted out otherwise we are in serious trouble and not just on the injury front,we are getting injuries constantly but quite a few people have said that the effort is not there and maybe though we did not like what Ed said it may be true we only need to look at some players attitudes to see this could be so.

 

[Ed D]

Am I the only one who thought Swan was one of the only players who did their job last night? He played all over the ground, got intercept marks, created run, had clearances, inside 50s and goal assists. Or are people upset that he's not laying many tackles (when for all we know he's being coached to play an attacking role)?

 

[woopedazz]

Hear Hear! I'm dumbfounded by all these negative posts after a game from which neither coach believed you could take much in regard to the result. Some people are looking for every little flaw from a side which contained a mountain of players who would never get close to top 22. Sheesh!

Aren't you the guy who wants Collingwood to take 2012 as a development year? Swan is a bit lost at the moment, but he will find his heart and bounce back soon.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Am I the only one who thought Swan was one of the only players who did their job last night? He played all over the ground, got intercept marks, created run, had clearances, inside 50s and goal assists. Or are people upset that he's not laying many tackles (when for all we know he's being coached to play an attacking role)?

No, I didn't think Swan was too bad, of our midfielders I would have rated ...

Blair >> Swan >> Thomas > Pendlebury

By the way, I think Blair has been playing consistently well so far - I'd have him top three in Copeland voting after three rounds.

 

[BlueJet]

For such a big unit he played some incredibly soft footy last night. On a number of occasions he had the opportunity to throw himself in and battle smaller men (Lucas/Simpson/Curnow) for the footy but simply opted not to. It wasn't a good look.

 

[ipswichpies]

My conception of some of our players ATM may be a misconception but some of them do not look to interested to me atm.

We have been unsettled all pre season and now it is carrying on into the season proper and we should be able to expect better leadership from our experienced players and it just is,nt there,Keeffe and Blair have been our best across all 3 games,it is about time some of the more experienced one,s starting putting there hands up.

On Wood I never expected to much 1st game back I think he needs 1 or 2 months unbroken games as 1st ruck Jolly is the 1 we are going to have to nurse to get him through the year,just too many injuries all at once and no continuity.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Must have been watching a different game last night. Was our best player.