Injury Daniel Menzel - third (partially) ruptured ACL

[Pure_Ownage]

Surgery does worry me given Menzel's history, and given Balmey's history, whenever he refers to any injury as minor I automatically assume it's 20 weeks That said it may not mean a lot, it was an athroscope, which is basically exploratory/investigation, given Menzel's history naturally any report of anything and they would have investigated to make sure the acl was all ok. Therefore the damage may have been very minor, the bigger issue as most have touched on is probably mental and whether it affects Dan's confidence in his knee, and that's where the real problem will be.

McCarthy's also a concern with me, largely because of our history with foot injuries.

 

[dazbroncos]

Surgery does worry me given Menzel's history, and given Balmey's history, whenever he refers to any injury as minor I automatically assume it's 20 weeks That said it may not mean a lot, it was an athroscope, which is basically exploratory/investigation, given Menzel's history naturally any report of anything and they would have investigated to make sure the acl was all ok. Therefore the damage may have been very minor, the bigger issue as most have touched on is probably mental and whether it affects Dan's confidence in his knee, and that's where the real problem will be.

McCarthy's also a concern with me, largely because of our history with foot injuries.

Arthroscopic clean outs and nip and tucks can be fairly minor. They can also be the catalyst to something else. With any luck, and if anyone is due its Menz, that it was not totally correlated to the reconstruction graft and only a peripheral issue. The massive factor is the psychological factor of trusting again the knee is good - especially when he was doing solo work when it happened and that it seemed such a low grade affair when it did happen - in that he really didnt have massive reactions at the time of the event.

The good thing is that the timing of the procedure, not really an operation, is that he can recover over the XMAS training break and keep his fitness levels up and resume training in the NY.

In terms of Abraham Lincoln, he was riding the bejesus out of the bike at the open session so his fitness level seemed ok. (of course my version of giving a bike the business and that of a professional footballer might could be a little apart... )

Given the clubs history with Egan, then the caution with Hawkins, Varcoe etc, I would expect he will given a wide space with no pressure to perform until it is right. It's not like we needs his input this year even and as much as I hate to say that - I would rather see him managed this season than risked and injured further.

Go Catters

 

[FromDawn2Dark]

I can't see him playing NAB Cup now, seems like too much of a risk. But delaying him too much wouldn't help his confidence either. It could be a good thing in hindsight or it could be a sign of concern. Only time will tell and no point stressing like it's the end of his career when it isn't. Hopefully it's smooth sailing from here and he's causing havoc to opposition teams heading into September, rather than NAB Cup.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Sorry no credibility when it comes to reporting on injury's this bloke,he's dead set the Julia Gillard of the medical room.

How you feel about Neil Balme's credibility is how I feel about people who drop politician's names like this.

 

[giggler99]

Hope this does not effect his confidence, usually the problem with knee injuries is the mental scares.

 

[hbk_aus]

He did tweet that the operation went well and that he is still very confident in his body or something like that. I am sure somebody could find the exact tweet if required.

 

[Vdubs]

Just feel for the guy and sincerely hope this doesn't play too much on his mind going forward.
No need to rush him but obviously a concern he has caused this from a relatively innocuous incident.
Maybe Veedubs can comment - best result if something wasn't 100% from the operation?

All I can say is it would obviously be better if it didn't have to be rescoped in the first place, BUT, IF the reconstruction itself was ok, and just some scar tissue had to be removed, that is reasonably optimistic. If the graft has been injured, that is a worry. I am a worrier, and I won't be worried unless in 4-6 weeks time he's still not training in some running capacity.



For those who thought that reconstructed knees are ever stronger or better than the original knee, despite the original going down with injury, that unfortunately is faulty thinking. There were some posts back a few where some had had ACL recons and seemed to suggest this assertion. Unless there was a tight notch or tunnel for the ACL to travel through, and that had to be widened, the reconstructed knee at best would be about 85% of the preinjured knee strength. That's a generalisation that I deal with on a daily basis.
I have ZERO knowledge of Menzel's particulars, so nothing here is gospel.

 

[dazbroncos]

All I can say is it would obviously be better if it didn't have to be rescoped in the first place, BUT, IF the reconstruction itself was ok, and just some scar tissue had to be removed, that is reasonably optimistic. If the graft has been injured, that is a worry. I am a worrier, and I won't be worried unless in 4-6 weeks time he's still not training in some running capacity.



For those who thought that reconstructed knees are ever stronger or better than the original knee, despite the original going down with injury, that unfortunately is faulty thinking. There were some posts back a few where some had had ACL recons and seemed to suggest this assertion. Unless there was a tight notch or tunnel for the ACL to travel through, and that had to be widened, the reconstructed knee at best would be about 85% of the preinjured knee strength. That's a generalisation that I deal with on a daily basis.
I have ZERO knowledge of Menzel's particulars, so nothing here is gospel.

but your general knowledge is 85% more than most of us monday morning wives tales Dr's bring to the table so you are WAY in front of the rest of us..

Keep it up!

Go Catters

(but from my memory of physiology at Lincoln School of Health Sciences.... a reco will never be as strong as the original... period..)

 

[Cat of Ages]

Fellow Cat fans, This is a question to clarify what we mean when we refer to a Matt Egan ‘situation’. We use Matt’s name as a kind of a sad codeword, but I am not sure if this means: 1. There are certain kinds of injury that seem small, but are very dangerous for footballers (e.g. navicular break) and are dreaded by players and fans alike OR, 2. That Cat fans have come to believe (rightly or wrongly) that Matt’s career fate was in part a management issue. I am not a doctor, so I have no idea. Chris Scott admitted he felt they might have rushed Travis Varcoe a little late in 2012, but otherwise it’s unclear to me if we are talking about the nature of certain injuries or anxieties about judgment. Another factor in there I would call the SJ09 factor: how much say do players have about how they feel they are going?
Go Cats 2013!

 

[Vdubs]

Fellow Cat fans, This is a question to clarify what we mean when we refer to a Matt Egan ‘situation’. We use Matt’s name as a kind of a sad codeword, but I am not sure if this means: 1. There are certain kinds of injury that seem small, but are very dangerous for footballers (e.g. navicular break) and are dreaded by players and fans alike OR, 2. That Cat fans have come to believe (rightly or wrongly) that Matt’s career fate was in part a management issue. I am not a doctor, so I have no idea. Chris Scott admitted he felt they might have rushed Travis Varcoe a little late in 2012, but otherwise it’s unclear to me if we are talking about the nature of certain injuries or anxieties about judgment. Another factor in there I would call the SJ09 factor: how much say do players have about how they feel they are going?
Go Cats 2013!

We as supporters do not want to lose any player due to a career ending injury. Even worse at such a young age when he was AA CHB. Matty himself was desperate to play the 07 GF. That had an impact on what went awry with his injury, given he sustained the injury the last game before finals, and NOBODY returns from that injury within 3 months. Even during his acceptance speech on AA night, he made a public plea to Bomber to be considered for selection, and Bomber was clearly guarded, as he should have been.
That the screw fixation broke down, and then broke down repeatedly is disastrous, but unfortunately can occur with THAT bone. Would that have happened if Matty did not push himself into training with the forlorn hope of playing finals? We can only surmise.
It was not a case of poor management medically. Just my summation of events. Does anyone know differently?

 

[footscore]

the reconstructed knee at best would be about 85% of the preinjured knee strength. That's a generalisation that I deal with on a daily basis.
I have ZERO knowledge of Menzel's particulars, so nothing here is gospel.

VEEDUBS, can I ask you what's your honest gut feel on Menzel for the future as a player?
Do you believe he will be the same player we saw in 2011 and do you think he will end up doing the knee again?

Me personally, it's like a bad dream the events over the past year...to wake up on the morning of his long awaited return in the VFL and see the headlines "Menzel does ACL" was very depressing and I don't even know the bloke so it's not as if I have any inkling of how emotional he would personally feel but he was the most exciting player I had seen for a while and I was so looking forward to see this young superstar in the making make a name for himself.
I know others will come around in time but Menz was becoming such a devastating weapon with the perfect mix of size and uncanny football ability but I wonder if he will ever be the same again

 

[footscore]

recent posts are making me think otherwise as it seems the knee may not be as strong before the injury.

I have belief it will come good though, Adrian Peterson's exploits this season have given hope to thousands of talented athletes around the world

 

[burto]

recent posts are making me think otherwise as it seems the knee may not be as strong before the injury.

I have belief it will come good though, Adrian Peterson's exploits this season have given hope to thousands of talented athletes around the world

Forgive my ignorance, but who is Adrian Peterson?

 

[cats_09]

Forgive my ignorance, but who is Adrian Peterson?

Running Back for the Minnesota Viking - tore his ACL & MCL on 24th Dec last year. He returned for week 1 of the season this year which was 9th Sept.
He has been massive this year on his return and he requires 208 rush years in the last game of the season (this weekend), to break the season record for rush years in a season - the Vikings play Green Bay, and he rushed for 210 years in the game against them earlier this season, so not impossible but might be difficult; but should get to 2,000 rush years which is a fantastic achievement.

 

[footscore]

Forgive my ignorance, but who is Adrian Peterson?

NFL quarterback for the Minnesota Vikings about 1 inch shorter but 10kg's heavier than Menzel who sustained a horrible ACL injury and went through the process of recovery like Menz to play the following year and will end up winning the NFL's equivalent of the Brownlow medal for being the best player in the game.

 

[Vdubs]

VEEDUBS, can I ask you what's your honest gut feel on Menzel for the future as a player?
Do you believe he will be the same player we saw in 2011 and do you think he will end up doing the knee again?

Me personally, it's like a bad dream the events over the past year...to wake up on the morning of his long awaited return in the VFL and see the headlines "Menzel does ACL" was very depressing and I don't even know the bloke so it's not as if I have any inkling of how emotional he would personally feel but he was the most exciting player I had seen for a while and I was so looking forward to see this young superstar in the making make a name for himself.
I know others will come around in time but Menz was becoming such a devastating weapon with the perfect mix of size and uncanny football ability but I wonder if he will ever be the same again

I'm like you, a huge Menzel fan, loved what he did v Pies/Hawks in 2011 finals.
Honestly, I am heartened by my previous favourute to watch, WOJO. He came back from an ACL reco, and in 2 years, was scintillatingly quick again, and able to twist and turn.
In all honesty, I have not seen too many , if any at Geelong, successfully return from 2 ACL reconstructions. Of course it can be done, and another player I hugely admire, and who doesn't-LENNY HAYES- came back this year and won B&F , the year directly after his 2nd other knee reconstruction.
So I am realistically positive about Menzel. I know his surgeon is the best ACL reconstructor in Melbourne, he has great facilities at Geelong, he has desire and motivation, and he would love a flag to join Bundy and Duncan.

 

[Cat of Ages]

I'm like you, a huge Menzel fan, loved what he did v Pies/Hawks in 2011 finals.
Honestly, I am heartened by my previous favourute to watch, WOJO. He came back from an ACL reco, and in 2 years, was scintillatingly quick again, and able to twist and turn.
In all honesty, I have not seen too many , if any at Geelong, successfully return from 2 ACL reconstructions. Of course it can be done, and another player I hugely admire, and who doesn't-LENNY HAYES- came back this year and won B&F , the year directly after his 2nd other knee reconstruction.
So I am realistically positive about Menzel. I know his surgeon is the best ACL reconstructor in Melbourne, he has great facilities at Geelong, he has desire and motivation, and he would love a flag to join Bundy and Duncan.

Thanks for both of yours, VDBs, re Matty Egan and also on Menz. When we watch the DVD of that second 2011 game vs Pies before the finals, we come close to tears, seeing how Dan opened them up. We 'watch' VFL on the Cats' site from NSW and Nathan Kettle went ever so quiet for about 20 minutes at that fateful VFL game this year. We couldn't believe it, either. Dan Menzel is a superstar in the making and we all keep our hopes up for his sake.

 

[CharacterFirst]

I think he's cooked guys. But I have thought that for a while now. If and when he gets back, it will only be a matter of time until it goes again. We dodged a bullet not having two Menzels on the list.

 

[The rabbi]

I think he's cooked guys. But I have thought that for a while now. If and when he gets back, it will only be a matter of time until it goes again. We dodged a bullet not having two Menzels on the list.

Oh ye of little faith.

 

[CharacterFirst]

Oh ye of little faith.

lol. I have plenty of faith in things or people worthy of faith.

 

[AM]

Oh ye of little faith.

Regrettably "faith" has little to do with it.

I'm concerned and London to a brick so are more than a few at the club.

 

[Hot Tin Roof]

Sorry no credibility when it comes to reporting on injury's this bloke,he's dead set the Julia Gillard of the medical room.

Don't see the comparison. Balme is a team player. Besides, she has him on scalpel skills

 

[Vdubs]

I think he's cooked guys. But I have thought that for a while now. If and when he gets back, it will only be a matter of time until it goes again. We dodged a bullet not having two Menzels on the list.

Why don't we all assume that what you say is correct, then if he does manage to string a couple of games together, then a couple of seasons together, without mishap, it's a bonus and a blessing.
While he's on our list there's hope, and hope is what we need for Menzel, Vardy, Varcoe, Simpson, H Mac, Smedts, and any player that has been injured. And of course, we must also hope that all the others don't get injured.
Hope is all you need.

 

[footscore]

if he never re-captures that explosive first step we became accustom to seeing, he could still turn into a midfielder if he works on his endurance in later years.

 

[Connoisseur]

NFL quarterback for the Minnesota Vikings about 1 inch shorter but 10kg's heavier than Menzel who sustained a horrible ACL injury and went through the process of recovery like Menz to play the following year and will end up winning the NFL's equivalent of the Brownlow medal for being the best player in the game.

I don't know how people can waste their precious time watching that rubbish.

Guy throws balls and a bunch of obese halfwits run around like headless chooks until they catch their prey then sit around doing nothing for what seems an eternity. Rinse and repeat.

Feel dumb just watching a second of it.