Danny Frawley CTE

Remove this Banner Ad

Gough

Moderator
Sep 29, 2006
52,866
92,249
AFL Club
Hawthorn
It relies on former footballers and their families being prepared to donate their brains to "brain bank" researchers following their death.

It's part of the problem with CTE - it's received so little coverage and there's so little awareness, I wonder how many former footballers in Australia even know they can have their brain analysed after they die and potentially help future footballers? (Which, in a lot of cases, might help out the deceased persons family. I think of how many footballers have become pieces of sh*t after their careers and wonder how much was really them and how much was brain injury caused by repetitive head knocks. .)

I know a couple of rugby league players have committed their brains to research, just as Danny Frawley had made it known that he'd committed his brain to research a few years ago - but I don't know whether any from those codes have had their brains analysed after dying.
Travis Tuck's family have allowed his brain to be used for research purposes.
 

Strange Cat

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 26, 2017
16,474
26,951
AFL Club
Geelong
There was a survey done awhile ago, they asked athletes if they could take a drug to guarantee a gold medal, but it would kill them, would you take it.
Something like 85% said yes.

I think footballers are now aware of the risks in footy, i don't think they are worried too much.
I think being young plays a role in this , when you’re young you can’t imagine life 30 years away....they are ignorant of the consequences of poor health in their later years.

it’s not a sport thing
 

PhatBoy

Brownlow Medallist
May 5, 2016
25,357
26,553
AFL Club
Geelong
I only got a couple of concussions playing footy (rugby league) but they were heavy and while I think the effects of it would have been fairly minor if I had a ‘normal’ life I am starting to see the effects of it now that I am going through a lot of personal upheaval and yes, a battle with depression.

I don’t think in any way that the depression is linked to my concussion (for all I know it could be but it’s more to do with personal circumstances IMO) however when my depression is at its worst or my behaviour at its most manic, I am prone to explosions of erratic behaviour that previously I simply wouldn’t have entertained.

it is certainly a real issue and I’m glad that out of the tragedy of DF’s death, something worthwhile may result
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Gough

Moderator
Sep 29, 2006
52,866
92,249
AFL Club
Hawthorn
I only got a couple of concussions playing footy (rugby league) but they were heavy and while I think the effects of it would have been fairly minor if I had a ‘normal’ life I am starting to see the effects of it now that I am going through a lot of personal upheaval and yes, a battle with depression.

I don’t think in any way that the depression is linked to my concussion (for all I know it could be but it’s more to do with personal circumstances IMO) however when my depression is at its worst or my behaviour at its most manic, I am prone to explosions of erratic behaviour that previously I simply wouldn’t have entertained.

it is certainly a real issue and I’m glad that out of the tragedy of DF’s death, something worthwhile may result
Take care of yourself Phatty.
 

Strange Cat

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 26, 2017
16,474
26,951
AFL Club
Geelong
I only got a couple of concussions playing footy (rugby league) but they were heavy and while I think the effects of it would have been fairly minor if I had a ‘normal’ life I am starting to see the effects of it now that I am going through a lot of personal upheaval and yes, a battle with depression.

I don’t think in any way that the depression is linked to my concussion (for all I know it could be but it’s more to do with personal circumstances IMO) however when my depression is at its worst or my behaviour at its most manic, I am prone to explosions of erratic behaviour that previously I simply wouldn’t have entertained.

it is certainly a real issue and I’m glad that out of the tragedy of DF’s death, something worthwhile may result
Send me a PM if you ever need to talk mate

look after yourself
 

Bomberboyokay

Cancelled
Sep 27, 2014
34,231
28,820
AFL Club
Essendon
Frawley had also stopped taking depression medication at the time of his death. Interesting development but not sure where it fits in.
Yep, but at the time of his death Frawley was holding down several TV and radio roles. Seems a little speculative to pin the lot on head knocks.

CTE is also observed in (a lower proportion of) non-athletes, isn't it?
Frawley killed himself, had depression, had CTE from playing football. You seem keen on downplaying the connection.
 

nobbyiscool

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 11, 2006
13,712
15,316
Democratic People's Republic of Victoria
AFL Club
West Coast
Other Teams
Raiders/TasTigers/MV/Iggles
Wary of drawing direct links. The obvious message inferred by the headlines is for parents not to let their kids play footy because it's inherently dangerous.
You're being wilfully ignorant, and you're acting as though Frawley's was the first CTE diagnosis in contact sport. It's not, and it's not even the first in AFL.

Footy is inherently dangerous, which is why the problem needs to be acknowledged - only then will we start doing the research that will allow sporting codes to start making changes to overcome it, or at least to minimise the risk.
 

Established1870

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 28, 2016
7,823
15,788
Tigris River
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Other Teams
Baghdad Bombers

LoungeLizard

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 15, 2009
9,545
7,680
gippsland
AFL Club
Collingwood
You're being wilfully ignorant, and you're acting as though Frawley's was the first CTE diagnosis in contact sport. It's not, and it's not even the first in AFL.

Footy is inherently dangerous, which is why the problem needs to be acknowledged - only then will we start doing the research that will allow sporting codes to start making changes to overcome it, or at least to minimise the risk.
It has been acknowledged and the AFL has made changes to try and minimise the risk, but unless they ban all contact, there is always going to be a risk.
Like 1000's of everyday life things, unless we live in bubbles, there is a risk.
 

Ron The Bear

Come on Sydney, come on!
Jul 4, 2006
33,874
33,819
Melbourne
AFL Club
Richmond
Footy is inherently dangerous, which is why the problem needs to be acknowledged - only then will we start doing the research that will allow sporting codes to start making changes to overcome it, or at least to minimise the risk.
What do you want to do about it? Research is in its relative infancy. The theory goes that It's not the big hits that do the damage, but hundreds or thousands of smaller sub-concussive knocks. Do you want to put a warning on footy gear a la cigarette packets?
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Strange Cat

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 26, 2017
16,474
26,951
AFL Club
Geelong
What do you want to do about it? Research is in its relative infancy. The theory goes that It's not the big hits that do the damage, but hundreds or thousands of smaller sub-concussive knocks. Do you want to put a warning on footy gear a la cigarette packets?
And what would you want to do about? Just do nothing?

resersch is needed to prevent future cases, parents have a right to have an informed choice about what their children play...if it destroys contact sport so be it.

there’s a bigger picture at play here
 

catscollector

Club Legend
Jun 30, 2018
2,593
3,073
AFL Club
Geelong
It has been acknowledged and the AFL has made changes to try and minimise the risk, but unless they ban all contact, there is always going to be a risk.
Like 1000's of everyday life things, unless we live in bubbles, there is a risk.
You can see the NFL made dramatic changes in their ruling interpretations after CTE became a very big problem after decades of research.
The concern for me though, the athletes are becoming finely tuned with each passing decade. You were considered a freak if you ran a 4.4 at the 40 metre dash combine, nowadays, it's not uncommon to run such times.
With speed and such velocity, you will always get head knocks no matter how much you try and prevent it from happening.

I will say this though, I am not sure what the statistics say but to me, it does not appear we see as many concussions in the AFL today. Feels like we get maybe one a week, sometimes none for a fortnight.
Go back 20+ years and concussions appeared to be quite common.
 

Ron The Bear

Come on Sydney, come on!
Jul 4, 2006
33,874
33,819
Melbourne
AFL Club
Richmond
And what would you want to do about? Just do nothing?

resersch is needed to prevent future cases, parents have a right to have an informed choice about what their children play...if it destroys contact sport so be it.

there’s a bigger picture at play here
I don't know what should be done, but not advocating rushing into any big decisions until more is known.
 

Kappa

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 7, 2014
20,837
25,718
AFL Club
Collingwood
I don't know what should be done, but not advocating rushing into any big decisions until more is known.
I think we know a lot already but we're trying to ignore the obvious truth, that over time contact sports are going to see massive falls in participation as kids and parents get scared of brain injuries.

Once more facts come out it's only going to get worse. There is no outcome here that isn't a disaster for head-knock sports.
 

Linda Lovelace

Club Legend
Apr 24, 2013
1,864
5,187
AFL Club
Collingwood
We've always known about CTE to some degree. It is literally just the modern term for punch drunk. Don't get me wrong, understanding and awareness has grown, but we've always known the basic equation.

People like to drop their monocle in their champagne and pretend it's some major revelation that getting hit in the head repeatedly is bad for you. But the reality is that we pay to watch people get hit for nothing more than a brief respite from our own meaningless lives, knowing they could get seriously hurt. They take the money and fame and trade off the risk of their long-term health. We are all consenting adults here, even if we are bigger scumbags than we like to admit.

There needs to be significant research on the specifics of mitigation strategies - how much time players should rest in between concussions etc and from a medical perspective on strategies for long-term treatment. We don't need the distraction of the idiotic hysteria that portrays this as a new phenomenon, not something we have been well aware of for at least a century.
 

Red Black and Blue

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 1, 2006
21,490
12,941
Melbourne
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Everton, Storm, Victory
That's not what is says.
Yeah no, it does. It says experts can’t agree on the identification and categorisation and they can’t determine when it starts.


“Contrary to common perception, the clinical syndrome of CTE has not yet been fully defined,
2 its prevalence is unknown, and the neuropathological diagnostic criteria are no more than preliminary.”
 

TheExtractorFactor

Premiership Player
Nov 27, 2012
3,275
13,111
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Other Teams
Knicks // NY Giants
Random bump but I was reading an article about a recently retired Rugby Union player who has been diagnosed with dementia and one of the quotes reminded me very much of something Danny had said previously.

"Mel wanted him to see a doctor. He told her not to worry, that it was just he was feeling stress. Then he had the blackout. He was out on a bike ride, a 25-mile loop he had done countless times. Halfway round, he had no idea where he was. He stopped, sat on the side of the road, called home, and Mel told him to cycle back the way he came."


"The most frightening thing happened when I was at the MCG one afternoon," he said. "I called [my wife] Anita up after a game. I was sitting in the car park, behind the wheel. I had no idea where to go, or what to do. I was lost. I had to call my wife up to work out how to get home from the MCG. I’d been driving home from the MCG for 30 years, and I didn’t know if I should turn left or right," he said.

There have been a series of articles about Rugby Union players with similar stories in the Guardian. Although CTE can only be diagnosed in people who have died I wonder if we will be seeing ex footy players diagnosed with early onset Dementia which will be linked to CTE.
 

Power Raid

TheBrownDog
Oct 15, 2004
69,137
59,023
West Perth
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Random bump but I was reading an article about a recently retired Rugby Union player who has been diagnosed with dementia and one of the quotes reminded me very much of something Danny had said previously.

"Mel wanted him to see a doctor. He told her not to worry, that it was just he was feeling stress. Then he had the blackout. He was out on a bike ride, a 25-mile loop he had done countless times. Halfway round, he had no idea where he was. He stopped, sat on the side of the road, called home, and Mel told him to cycle back the way he came."


"The most frightening thing happened when I was at the MCG one afternoon," he said. "I called [my wife] Anita up after a game. I was sitting in the car park, behind the wheel. I had no idea where to go, or what to do. I was lost. I had to call my wife up to work out how to get home from the MCG. I’d been driving home from the MCG for 30 years, and I didn’t know if I should turn left or right," he said.

There have been a series of articles about Rugby Union players with similar stories in the Guardian. Although CTE can only be diagnosed in people who have died I wonder if we will be seeing ex footy players diagnosed with early onset Dementia which will be linked to CTE.
rugby league and rugby union, as sports will be finished.

you can't have criminal negligence resulting in gaol time, for directors, and health issues like this. Something has to give and I can guarantee repealing laws won't happen.

AFL will also be at risk but at least it can modify the game to become more like Gaelic footy or soccer.
 

Remove this Banner Ad