Decriminalisation of drugs... your thoughts?

[Dan Baker]

What?

Dan, cant you just stick to playing prosecutor on the crime board?

Don't take my word for it. Speak to a health professional and do your own research.

Codeine is banned in Greece because of its addictive properties. Jail time.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Mate, they heavily tax tobacco to discourage people from smoking.

Yes, so how you managed to draw a correlation between that and my stance about the legalisation of illicit drugs is truly perplexing.

Can you imagine the tax they would put on recreational drugs if your utopian all drugs are legal and cheap and easy to get fantasy became reality?

Minuscule in comparison to tobacco.

Fair to say you are way to caught up in the 'drugs are safe' bubble to appreciate that legalisation isn't going to play out how you have fantasized.

This subject is far beyond your comprehension.

 

[Dan Baker]

Mate, they heavily tax tobacco to discourage people from smoking.
Can you imagine the tax they would put on recreational drugs if your utopian all drugs are legal and cheap and easy to get fantasy became reality?

Fair to say you are way to caught up in the 'drugs are safe' bubble to appreciate that legalisation isn't going to play out how you have fantasized.

People think because they have media propaganda that a drug war has failed. No one has contemplated the impacts of legalisation.

Drugs are certainly not safe. Those that work in health facilities know the implications.

This is where legalisation fails, if the government has drugs sold with a tax, illegal dealers will only sell illegal drugs cheaper.

So is the government to give away free dangerous drugs?

 

[Number37]

Yes, so how you managed to draw a correlation between that and my stance about the legalisation of illicit drugs is truly perplexing.



Minuscule in comparison to tobacco.



This subject is far beyond your comprehension.

Pure speculation on your part.

You have absolutely nothing of substance to back up your speculation.

"it's a scare campaign"
"drugs are safe"
"drug cartels will disappear"
"it's a scare campaign"
"drugs are safe"

Simply doesn't cut it, no matter how many times you repeat it.

 

[Number37]

People think because they have media propaganda that a drug war has failed. No one has contemplated the impacts of legalisation.

Drugs are certainly not safe. Those that work in health facilities know the implications.

This is where legalisation fails, if the government has drugs sold with a tax, illegal dealers will only sell illegal drugs cheaper.

So is the government to give away free dangerous drugs?

Free/cheap/readily available recreational drugs will NEVER EVER happen.
It would be the height of stupidity.

Mental health issues + recreational drug use is already a recipe for disaster.

 

[Dan Baker]

Criminals will only turn to another source of illegal revenue. Government seeks to apprehend and convict large scale operations that generate large quantities of money. Government will only be doing elsewhere if legalisation of psychoactive drugs occurs.

I am dealing with two friends right now who are ongoing drug users. One has completely lost their mind on dextroamphetamine and cannabis.

 

[Number37]

Criminals will only turn to another source of illegal revenue. Government seeks to apprehend and convict large scale operations that generate large quantities of money. Government will only be doing elsewhere if legalisation of psychoactive drugs occurs.

I am dealing with two friends right now who are ongoing drug users. One has completely lost their mind on amphetamine and cannabis.

According to Snake your friends are a scare campaign and drugs are safe.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Time to engage the ignore function.

Enjoy your propaganda.

 

[Dan Baker]

Unfortunately the brains capacity to deal with drugs is weakened with age which is why many people end up in mental institutions in their late 20's, but that doesn't mean there is currently many people in mental health care facilities at a younger age.

Some people are more predisposed to mental health issues triggered by psychoactive drugs than others.

 

[Dan Baker]

Time to engage the ignore function.

Enjoy your propaganda.

Drug-induced psychosis: Using or withdrawing from drugs, especially cannabis and amphetamines, can cause psychotic symptoms that last for short or long periods

https://www.headspace.org.au/young-people/understanding-psychosis-for-young-people/

 

[Power Raid]

You are having an argumant with yourself. "Decriminalisation" is your term.

I want all drugs legally available to users.

"Mass production", if you like.

I'm pro this but only provided free outside of society

 

[Snake_Baker]

I'm pro this but only provided free outside of society

I don't quite get the bolded portion.

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

I don't quite get the bolded portion.

Fairly sure I have seen Power Raid mention this before - a big clinic/centre/commune in the middle of Australia (i.e. away from general society) where free drugs are administered at will to whoever wants them. But the only way you leave is straight to rehab or in a body bag. (Sorry if I've misinterpreted your position there, Power Raid).

Sign me up.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Fairly sure I have seen Power Raid mention this before - a big clinic/centre/commune in the middle of Australia (i.e. away from general society) where free drugs are administered at will to whoever wants them. But the only way you leave is straight to rehab or in a body bag. (Sorry if I've misinterpreted your position there, Power Raid).

Sign me up.

A tad dystopian don't you think?

 

[Power Raid]

Fairly sure I have seen Power Raid mention this before - a big clinic/centre/commune in the middle of Australia (i.e. away from general society) where free drugs are administered at will to whoever wants them. But the only way you leave is straight to rehab or in a body bag. (Sorry if I've misinterpreted your position there, Power Raid).

Sign me up.

yep

I like drugs but recognise there is a reason why drugs are not and should not be legal. For normally functioning people who are discrete, they have no issues with responsible usage under the current regime.

For those that f up, rather than ruining other people's lives and society, we should have a free place where they can enjoy there remaining days doing what they love. Alternatively, they can find their feet and choose rehab.

The idea of people walking the streets sniffing fuels, glues and solvents, going berserk on ice in hospitals or destroying families is extremely sad for all involved. A free drug centre could be the circuit breaker they need and the choices they make in that drug centre are their's to own.

 

[Snake_Baker]

The idea of people walking the streets sniffing fuels, glues and solvents, going berserk on ice in hospitals or destroying families is extremely sad for all involved

I agree that the idea is sad, but the reality is very sporadic.

 

[Power Raid]

I agree that the idea is sad, but the reality is very sporadic.

I'm not sure it is that uncommon. I see at least one a day and I live in the wealthiest suburbs and don't work in the CBD.

Regardless of numbers, a free drug clinic provide a choice.

 

[Snake_Baker]

I'm not sure it is that uncommon. I see at least one a day and I live in the wealthiest suburbs and don't work in the CBD.

You see people, "walking the streets sniffing fuels, glues and solvents, going berserk on ice in hospitals or destroying families" every day?

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

A tad dystopian don't you think?

Sure do, but I wouldn't mind spending a bit of time in that place. Reckon it would be fun for maybe a few years max, but then I'd have to get out - my skin is way too pale for central Australia..

 

[Power Raid]

You see people, "walking the streets sniffing fuels, glues and solvents, going berserk on ice in hospitals or destroying families" every day?

2/3 today so far

 

[Snake_Baker]

2/3 today so far

 

[Leeda]

are you/we all talking about drugs we/us have taken or are we talking about the clients, people, we see and so
would never so called 'have a bar of'.

In other words, crisis only happens to everyone else and you or your colleagues will be the trans luscents of these idiotic
themes.

It is one thing to know about how drugs are used, how they affect people and who is affected by the drug taker.

Like women who take drugs and still are somehow allowed to have children. It amazes me that these women and men still
are allowed to do this without any kind of limit.

Every drug user, every person with a mental illness and every person who is affected by some kind of issue is always tied to a system
of litigation or else in some kind of mouse wheel.

Yet women can become pregnant to multiple men and with all kind of issues and still no one does anything about it.

Drugs are almost always the point of contact with all these women.

So we have those who can't have kids, we have those who have kids and are on drugs and the like, and we have those who
don't do things because they know that it is not going to help a child or anyone else..

sorry if this is confused a bit but it is a sad and sorry issue for me.

 

[Power Raid]

yep it only something that happens on tv.

young kids with paint circles around their nose and face aren't paint sniffing. They've just finished abstract finger painting school.

ice addicts aren't something real, it's all make believe. the women with scars on her face struggling to keep her vehicle between the white lines is just having a laugh pretending she's ben cousins.

the little community kicking the s**t out of each other in the park aren't abusing alcohol and sniffing solvents, they're just trying out for UFC's outdoor special event.


It's a real tough issue as you can't help people until they want to help themselves. However pretending it isn't a real issue, for all too many, is a little naive.

 

[Snake_Baker]

yep it only something that happens on tv.

Way to miss the point.

young kids with paint circles around their nose and face aren't paint sniffing. They've just finished abstract finger painting school.

Yep, Bunnings is cleaning up by selling solvents by the truck load to "young kids". Your loaded terminology is a giveaway.

ice addicts aren't something real, it's all make believe.

Actually, this is correct. Repetitive users take methamphetamine because they like it, not because they have cravings in the classical sense, like a heroin or alcohol addict. There are no withdrawal issues with methamphetamine. The term "ice addict" is a fallacy.

the women with scars on her face struggling to keep her vehicle between the white lines is just having a laugh pretending she's ben cousins.

Your sappy terminology is highlighting your ignorance.

the little community kicking the s**t out of each other in the park aren't abusing alcohol and sniffing solvents, they're just trying out for UFC's outdoor special event.

Could be. People have punched on with each other since time immemorial. Certainly a lot longer than the 120 or so years most of these compounds have been in circulation, and apparently with greater propensity if the historians are to be believed. I hope your not seriously suggesting that the removal of drugs in society will turn the world in to an expanded version of the Brady Bunch.

It's a real tough issue as you can't help people until they want to help themselves. However pretending it isn't a real issue, for all too many, is a little naive.

Most people don't want or need anyone's help when it comes to illegal drugs, considering 91% of users are considered recreational users. They would be helped best by the invasive bleeding heart element of society keeping their noses out of their business.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

In the drug legalisation debate I really don't think we talk enough about alcohol.

The general comments on alcohol I see are:
1. Prohibition in the 20s made everything way worse, it's evidence in favour of legalization
2. Legalisation aids in legalisation and the ability to tax/get revenue to deal with the negative outcomes
3. Lots (most ) of people drink regularly with no ill side effects, there is a small portion of alcohol users that become addicts.
4. Adults should be able to do whatever they like as long as they don't hurt anyone else.

These are all fair points, but to take a step back, the alcohol problem in this country is ******* outrageous. We're not the only country, I don't know how well we do when indexed about others - but the problem is still way too big. The current approach is not working fast enough.

Found one article here that estimates alcohol related issues costing Australia $36 billion. * me.
http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2010/s2991780.htm

So in the discussion around legalisation (or not) I think we have to concede that it's insufficient to fix addiction issues, and regulation is only a compensation approach rather than a wholesale cure.