Decriminalisation of drugs... your thoughts?

[RobbieK]

Anyone remember the gin scourge/craze in London?

Opium in China and Singapore?

I’m pro people “trying” recreational drugs but there’s a reason why drugs shouldn’t be legal

So we should make alcohol illegal?

 

[Power Raid]

So we should make alcohol illegal?

I can see alcohol going down a similar path to cigarettes over the next 40 years. Cigarettes pressure came on in the 1980s and at its current trajectory will be illegal in another 30-50 years. If alcohol follows a similar journey, it will be illegal around the next century.

 

[Father Jack]

Well, considering how well Prohibition went in the US, and the fact that the War on Drugs has proved to be completely unwinnable, maybe in another 30-50 years we'll have realised just how pointless banning these sorts of things is.

 

[Power Raid]

Well, considering how well Prohibition went in the US, and the fact that the War on Drugs has proved to be completely unwinnable, maybe in another 30-50 years we'll have realised just how pointless banning these sorts of things is.

I agree

but the difference will be big brother technology and the calls for bigger and bigger government.

 

[Jesse Custer]

What is the point of living if you can't do what you want?

 

[Contra Mundum]

It would save millions of dollars and reduce the prison population by 2/3rds.

 

[Bomberboyokay]

I agree

I'm not sure you do.

 

[Mofra]

It would save millions of dollars and reduce the prison population by 2/3rds.

The other side of the coin is creating new industries without restriction.
Hemp is a magnificent crop for paper and fibre production, and uses far less water than cotton. Secondary industries would benefit too e.g. paper production from hemp would competitive as right now we export plantation woodchip to Japan for a pittance then buy back paper for a hugely inflated FOB price.

 

[Power Raid]

I'm not sure you do.

I’m sure. What would make you sure?

 

[Contra Mundum]

The other side of the coin is creating new industries without restriction.
Hemp is a magnificent crop for paper and fibre production, and uses far less water than cotton. Secondary industries would benefit too e.g. paper production from hemp would competitive as right now we export plantation woodchip to Japan for a pittance then buy back paper for a hugely inflated FOB price.

Seems like a total no brainer to me!


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Decriminalise every drug. And I mean every drug. I want nothing to do with ice or anyone who uses it, but I don't think locking them up is going to do anything to stop what is essentially a health problem, as outlined very well by Johan Hari in his TED talk. Unless they committed crimes other than possession or trafficking, of course. No tolerance for drug driving or drug violence.

This isn't sufficient of course, there needs to be a huge increase in mental health support services, unemployment support services and general community services to ensure that people have the support they need to find alternatives to drug abuse for escaping their problems.

 

[Opts]

People keep saying that we lost the war on drugs. The truth is that there has NEVER been a war on drugs.

I spent 1.5 decades acting as an informant against drug traffickers. The Leftist magistrates and judges never enforced the law, that was the problem. The worst magistrates and judges were those during the Rob Hull era.

One example off the top of my head was a guy on welfare that had $5m street value of cannabis and amphetamines in his house as well as numerous firearms. He'd been doing it for years and owned property worth tens of millions. He only got four years and was back on the streets trafficking as soon as he was released. Why wouldn't he?

There were dozens of other incidents where crooks caught with traffickable quantities received good behaviour bonds and even escaped conviction. This isn't good enough.

I can see the benefits of the decriminalisation of some drugs but not until we've exhausted the avenue of having an actual war.

 

[Opts]

I can see alcohol going down a similar path to cigarettes over the next 40 years. Cigarettes pressure came on in the 1980s and at its current trajectory will be illegal in another 30-50 years. If alcohol follows a similar journey, it will be illegal around the next century.

You might be right. Tobacco and alcohol will be illegal, yet all other drugs will be legal. Go figure.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

People keep saying that we lost the war on drugs. The truth is that there has NEVER been a war on drugs.

Imagine thinking your own personal experience constitutes the sum total of what's out there. You do know the measures the Reagan administration took against drugs, right?

 

[RobbieK]

People keep saying that we lost the war on drugs. The truth is that there has NEVER been a war on drugs.

I spent 1.5 decades acting as an informant against drug traffickers. The Leftist magistrates and judges never enforced the law, that was the problem. The worst magistrates and judges were those during the Rob Hull era.

One example off the top of my head was a guy on welfare that had $5m street value of cannabis and amphetamines in his house as well as numerous firearms. He'd been doing it for years and owned property worth tens of millions. He only got four years and was back on the streets trafficking as soon as he was released. Why wouldn't he?

There were dozens of other incidents where crooks caught with traffickable quantities received good behaviour bonds and even escaped conviction. This isn't good enough.

I can see the benefits of the decriminalisation of some drugs but not until we've exhausted the avenue of having an actual war.

The war on drugs has been incredibly stupid, but thinking that that war would be won if only it was fought harder is even more stupid.

In Australia drug offences are the second highest reason for incarceration, narrowly behind only violent offences, representing around 20% of the prison population. About 2/3 of those in prison on drug offences were only charged with possession or use.

Compare that to the US, where their policies have led to almost half of their prison population being in for drug offences.

Things are a lot better over there, yeah?

 

[Snake_Baker]

I spent 1.5 decades acting as an informant against drug traffickers.

How do you morally justify behaving like this?

 

[Snake_Baker]

The war on drugs has been incredibly stupid

More importantly, it's oppression.

The libertarian aspects of the issue are rarely analysed.

 

[Deliverance]

Decriminalise every drug. And I mean every drug. I want nothing to do with ice or anyone who uses it, but I don't think locking them up is going to do anything to stop what is essentially a health problem, as outlined very well by Johan Hari in his TED talk. Unless they committed crimes other than possession or trafficking, of course. No tolerance for drug driving or drug violence.

This isn't sufficient of course, there needs to be a huge increase in mental health support services, unemployment support services and general community services to ensure that people have the support they need to find alternatives to drug abuse for escaping their problems.

I thought ice had no health treatment options. Does it?

 

[Gough]

The war on drugs has been incredibly stupid, but thinking that that war would be won if only it was fought harder is even more stupid.

In Australia drug offences are the second highest reason for incarceration, narrowly behind only violent offences, representing around 20% of the prison population. About 2/3 of those in prison on drug offences were only charged with possession or use.

Compare that to the US, where their policies have led to almost half of their prison population being in for drug offences.

Things are a lot better over there, yeah?

The war on drugs annoys more that anything for it's origins, Ehrlichman fessed up years ago that it was a ruse for Nixon to go after his enemies and nearly fifty years later with everything we know about the man we're still slavishly following his lead.

 

[Snake_Baker]

I thought ice had no health treatment options. Does it?

The REAL problem is people who hear & read this crap, then carry on like they are some authority on the matter. They aren't.

Do you want REAL education? Here it is:

Substance use - amphetamines: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia

Amphetamines are drugs. They can be legal or illegal. They are legal when they are prescribed by a doctor and used to treat health problems such as obesity, narcolepsy, or attention deficit hyperactivity

medlineplus.gov

Amphetamine, past and present – a pharmacological and clinical perspective

Amphetamine was discovered over 100 years ago. Since then, it has transformed from a drug that was freely available without prescription as a panacea for a broad range of disorders into a highly restricted Controlled Drug with therapeutic applications ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Here is a very good history analysis of amphetamines:

America’s First Amphetamine Epidemic 1929–1971: A Quantitative and Qualitative Retrospective With Implications for the Present

Using historical research that draws on new primary sources, I review the causes and course of the first, mainly iatrogenic amphetamine epidemic in the United States from the 1940s through the 1960s. Retrospective epidemiology indicates that the absolute ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Dr Carl Hart:

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I thought ice had no health treatment options. Does it?

All of them have treatment options. Addictions are mental diseases that in general can be beaten through a combination of abstinence and building a support network to reduce the need to reach for drugs as an escape. Check out Johan Hari's TED talk on drugs.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Gabor Mate is also a very good source for a better understanding of addiction.





.
His ground breaking book, "In the realm of hungry ghosts":

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjBit3M06vkAhU263MBHapeAG8QFjAAegQIABAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fthezeitgeistmovement.se%2Ffiles%2FIn_the_Realm_of_Hungry_Ghosts_-_Gabor_Mate__M.D_.pdf&usg=AOvVaw25BaOGrxQ9qZjjL6O4LGuB

 

[Opts]

How do you morally justify behaving like this?

Clearly you have no idea what an informant is. An informant is the main cop who charges someone.

To say that the other type of informant is bad means that you like drug traffickers. Which side are you on?

 

[Opts]

More importantly, it's oppression.

The libertarian aspects of the issue are rarely analysed.

Oppression?

 

[Snake_Baker]

Clearly you have no idea what an informant is. An informant is the main cop who charges someone.

Your perceptive capabilities are atrocious. If you get me started on this, I will show you up badly.

Did you know that the man in your avatar was a heavy Adderall (amphetamine) user?

To say that the other type of informant is bad means that you like drug traffickers. Which side are you on?

If it's a choice between you (as a police informant) or the drug dealer, then I am with the drug dealer.

You have dedicated a significant portion of your very blinkered life to engaging in an act of massive social vandalism, on behalf of political interests and against the people. I only hope that the remaining years of your life bring you the wisdom to see the error of your ways, and a more compassionate understanding.