Review Dees v Brad's Bombers: the Good, Bad & Ugly

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Oliver's game was ******* selfish, absolutely nothing in that to help us and that's both his and Goody's fault. At one point he got a tap with someone already on him and kicked it over his head the wrong ******* way. Instead of trying to change the game or the advantage of his tag the coaches and him just say well * it get as many crap disposals with no impact as possible and you'll get your AA and coaches votes. That's the problem with a guy who can't go forward, can't go back. He's useless once a good tagger gets involved. Petracca should be absolutely dominating after that but his confidence is lower than shark s**t right now.
 
Probably worse than the Brisbane game in a lot of ways. Defensively awful (forwards and mids included, our pressure stank) and so many poor individual performances.

He was not our worst (Tommo says hi) but Grundy is non competitive in the air and defensive running isn't there. Would be silly to rush max back, but he was a liability. Don't really care if he can get some disposals linking up (half were hospital handballs anyway).
 
Tom McDonald was s**t and rightly should never play again, 15x I read how he played on WAFL defenders last week that's why he was good? He played on Barass and Yeo the * are people on about? Had nothing to do with the defenders and everything to do with the piss easy ball movement vs the atrocious one today.
 

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it’s amazing how in the data driven world we overrate blokes like Grundy and Oliver, they were putrid yesterday.

Viney a real workhorse who never gave up, Langdon showed class and poise and the young fella in defence was good but overall from an opposition fan too many dees players shirked the contest and didn’t run both ways. Easy to work on and would just write it off as an aberration due to the conditions and underrating our guys.
 
There’s clearly a lot of s**t idiot coaching going on in the AFL at the moment.

Ross Lyon and Brad Scott have got pretty makeshift sides out there at the moment but are getting results by playing good footy. McRae has turned a team that looked like s**t campaigners under Buckley into arguably the competition benchmark. Longmire had no recognised key defenders as well as their most dangerous KPF go down and still smashed Richmond. Chris Scott took a bunch of Grandpas to a flag by fixing up ball movement, managing the squad and playing to his team’s strengths.

On the other side of the coin you have Beveridge playing the tallest and shittest forward line ever seen, Brisbane being a bunch of downhill skiing softcocks, Voss playing 967 inside mids and trying to slow play dump kick the other team to sleep, Stewart Dew, Justin Longmuir, Ken Hinkley, and Goodwin binning a structure that worked to play a bunch of forwards that can’t compete in the air or on the ground. 🎓
 
craffles said:
it’s amazing how in the data driven world we overrate blokes like Grundy and Oliver, they were putrid yesterday.

Viney a real workhorse who never gave up, Langdon showed class and poise and the young fella in defence was good but overall from an opposition fan too many dees players shirked the contest and didn’t run both ways. Easy to work on and would just write it off as an aberration due to the conditions and underrating our guys.
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Spot on with everything. I think Oliver's first half was horrible. It wasn't even a close tag by Setterfield. Sure he had 20 touches in the last quarter when the game was finished but he was nowhere when the game was on the line. He was just apart of an onball brigade that was getting spanked. It definitely wasn't an aberration as we were just as poor against Brisbane. I don't rate essendon but it's an even comp and if you rock up with the lack of defensive intensity you're going to get rolled.

Irrelevant to what we're talking about but shoutout to the umps who were awful. How was that not deliberate out of bounds in the last quarter. the guy booted it directly out of bounds from 50m, no-one else around. It just showed the ineptitude of the umps off the back of some holding the ball tackles (when we rarely made a tackle) not paid.

Also, if Will Day got 2 weeks for his normal tackle, then Zac Merrett is getting 2-3 weeks. And commentators do your job. They didn't even pick up on the dangerous tackle that will clearly result in a suspension. They also didn't pick up on when the melksham goal hit the post. Watch the game. End of rant.
 
Topkent said:
Oliver's game was ******* selfish, absolutely nothing in that to help us and that's both his and Goody's fault. At one point he got a tap with someone already on him and kicked it over his head the wrong ******* way. Instead of trying to change the game or the advantage of his tag the coaches and him just say well * it get as many crap disposals with no impact as possible and you'll get your AA and coaches votes. That's the problem with a guy who can't go forward, can't go back. He's useless once a good tagger gets involved. Petracca should be absolutely dominating after that but his confidence is lower than shark s**t right now.
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I know you have a bit of a hate-boner for him, but I think calling his game selfish is a tad harsh.

It was a poor game by his standards, but at least he had a crack and put his head over the ball unlike some of his soft as butter, fumbly teammates. Having 25 contested possessions isn't selfish – his workrate put the others to shame.

Again, yes, it was a low impact 41-possession game, but **** me, there's about 20 other guys who could be singled out for embarrassing performances yesterday (see McDonald, May, Tomlinson, Grundy, Spargo before he went off and Brayshaw in particular)
 
Scythe94 said:
I know you have a bit of a hate-boner for him, but I think calling his game selfish is a tad harsh.

It was a poor game by his standards, but at least he had a crack and put his head over the ball unlike some of his soft as butter, fumbly teammates. Having 25 contested possessions isn't selfish – his workrate put the others to shame.

Again, yes, it was a low impact 41-possession game, but **** me, there's about 20 other guys who could be singled out for embarrassing performances yesterday (see McDonald, May, Tomlinson, Grundy, Spargo before he went off and Brayshaw in particular)
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I don't hate Oliver at all, selfish because there's no will to change things up. He continues to play the exact same way no matter what. We continue to tap the ball down to him with 15 guys hanging off him and he gets a pointless disposal that doesn't help anything just so he can point to his stat sheet
 
Scythe94 said:
I know you have a bit of a hate-boner for him, but I think calling his game selfish is a tad harsh.

It was a poor game by his standards, but at least he had a crack and put his head over the ball unlike some of his soft as butter, fumbly teammates. Having 25 contested possessions isn't selfish – his workrate put the others to shame.

Again, yes, it was a low impact 41-possession game, but **** me, there's about 20 other guys who could be singled out for embarrassing performances yesterday (see McDonald, May, Tomlinson, Grundy, Spargo before he went off and Brayshaw in particular)
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Spot on. 'useless once a good tagger goes to him'. He's probably the most untaggable player in the afl. Good ole Tk. We're talking about a b2b AFLCA winner. he's dealt with every tagger that has come his way, for years. Imagine if Judd Mcvee got 41 touches in the midfield whilst having attention on him. We'd all be saying he's the next Chris Judd. We just set a very high bar for Clarry.
 
danster168 said:
Spot on with everything. I think Oliver's first half was horrible. It wasn't even a close tag by Setterfield. Sure he had 20 touches in the last quarter when the game was finished but he was nowhere when the game was on the line. He was just apart of an onball brigade that was getting spanked. It definitely wasn't an aberration as we were just as poor against Brisbane. I don't rate essendon but it's an even comp and if you rock up with the lack of defensive intensity you're going to get rolled.

Irrelevant to what we're talking about but shoutout to the umps who were awful. How was that not deliberate out of bounds in the last quarter. the guy booted it directly out of bounds from 50m, no-one else around. It just showed the ineptitude of the umps off the back of some holding the ball tackles (when we rarely made a tackle) not paid.

Also, if Will Day got 2 weeks for his normal tackle, then Zac Merrett is getting 2-3 weeks. And commentators do your job. They didn't even pick up on the dangerous tackle that will clearly result in a suspension. They also didn't pick up on when the melksham goal hit the post. Watch the game. End of rant.
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Could not agree more on the umpires, it felt like we received much more awful decisions in our favour but they were just disgraceful all day. I don’t understand with how much money the game makes how we just can’t get it right, surely we can pump so money into the umpiring fraternity. Do AFL umps train under duress? Eg run 10kms then do simulations etc?

I know they aren’t always going to get it right but it’s become pretty unbearable last few years. Also agree if Day gets 2 Merrett should as well but we all know the top echelon of players are protected species EG Harry McKay so expect nothing.

PS thanks for letting me share some thoughts on the dees board, I like it when oppo fans do on ours as it helps reduce echo chambers etc.
 

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We aren’t a premiership threat because we can’t handle being hunted by an aggressive team.

Our game style is built on having a bunch of good players and assuming they can constantly walk through tackles at will. When it doesn’t happen we go to pieces and we don’t have the players who hunt the opposition and win it back.

It’s beyond me why Viney is playing as a handball receive, run forward player. That’s the only way Trac and Clarry can play, if Viney has a place in the side it’s as a tackling machine who doesn’t let the opposition walk it out of contested situations like they did yesterday.

I’ve had a gutful of fringe players coasting by and delivering * all.
Tell me we wouldn’t have played better yesterday swapping Sparrow, Tomlinson, Melk for Jordon, Turner and Laurie. Need to re-establish a culture where going through the motions and being too slow to defend isn’t tolerated.
 
Dark Avenger said:
ANB. Elite endurance comes in so handy when you touch the ball 5 times a game.
McVee. How long until Salem is fit?
May. May & Lever only work well as a unit which is why May should be dropped. Hopefully Lever will be back from injury this week.
Grundy. Grundy to play at Casey where he can practice against ruckmen of similar ilk from todays game & hopefully concede less than 5 goals.
Spargo. It finally happened you ducking campaigner!
Petracca. Overrated & overhyped. Probably be listed in the best players thread despite contributing sweet FA again.
Petty. His debut game isn't looking so bad anymore.
Van Royen. Are they saying BOO? No they're saying Van ROO-yen. I was saying boo.
Viney. Duhhhhh. I'm the captain.
McDonald. If only he could play West Coast reserves every week. Maybe pick him next time we play the Hawks.
Rivers. Another player that gets comfortable once they re-sign. Keep him at Casey until his contract is up again. Then he might start playing well again.
Pickett. Needs to look Goody in the eye & tell him what his intentions for next year are. Until then play him at Casey.
Langdon. Doesn't look as dynamic without the long flowing locks. I'd be giving him a spell at Casey until his hair grows back.
Melksham. Your offsping better be a triple Brownlow medalist to warrant carrying your arse to 100 games.
Oliver. Held to 2 disposals in the first quarter. Obviously can't handle a tag. A week at Casey might do him some good.
Brayshaw. Who on Earth handed out that contract to him. Can't blame him for not trying when you've just swindled the club like that.
Chandler. Seen him play better games when he was the sub. (Unactivated)
Bowey. To think it took him 18 games before he experienced a loss. His win loss record is soon gonna rival Nathan Jones.
Sparrow. So glad were giving him more midfield minutes. 13 disposals? Well at least they were impactful right? No? Well... I like his sheets.
Fritsch. Struggled to have an impact. Two goals isnt enough from him. Needs to go back to defense.
Hunter. Should have persisted with Baker.
Jordon. Apparently the average AFL career is 5 years. This is good news because I only have to watch this dud for 2 more seasons.
Tomlinson. Only player that can hold his head high today. Why are they resigning all these overrated selfish campaigners when this guy is out of contract?
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Great post, did LOL.

Also, looks like I'll be getting a game next week. Perhaps alongside Fritsch in defence.
 
danster168 said:
Spot on. 'useless once a good tagger goes to him'. He's probably the most untaggable player in the afl. Good ole Tk. We're talking about a b2b AFLCA winner. he's dealt with every tagger that has come his way, for years. Imagine if Judd Mcvee got 41 touches in the midfield whilst having attention on him. We'd all be saying he's the next Chris Judd. We just set a very high bar for Clarry.
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41 touches that didn't change anything.
Credit to him for sticking to it, not many (any?) Did fo us yesterday. But games like that each week won't do much to lift the team.

Oliver's never had a problem getting the ball. Making an impact with as many touches as possible is his issue. That's not helped by half-assed efforts around him, but with that much footy he needs to be setting up a lot more play. According to the AFL stats he had 8 score involvements from his 41. Trac had 7 with 15 odd less touches. ANB had 7 from a third as many touches.
 
Topkent said:
I don't hate Oliver at all, selfish because there's no will to change things up. He continues to play the exact same way no matter what. We continue to tap the ball down to him with 15 guys hanging off him and he gets a pointless disposal that doesn't help anything just so he can point to his stat sheet
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I don’t think it’s up to him to play a different way at all. If he is getting tagged then someone needs to come in and flatten the tagger. I guess the issue with that these days is that any adverse physical contact gets you in trouble. Melbourne might want to submit some footage to the umpiring department to show him being held.

It’s beyond acceptable that people get away with that s**t at a stoppage. You can’t bump anymore but you can hug a bloke like a python.
 
Bit of a frustrating evening. Will cop the loss and move forward provided Simon's famous 'learnings' are identified and actioned.

Few things I don't understand. Main one being why when we are bad we are god awful bad? Can't just have a few blokes having off games, it has to be everyone all at once. Either the preparation and planning isn't right or the systems and structures are breaking down. Either way, it is a product of leadership, both on and off field.

Where is the 'refuse to lose' mentality? We go in at half time with the momentum against us. This is the opportunity to reset and refresh, and again for the leaders to take charge. I'll never forget Dustin Martin in the Geelong Grand final - mid/late 2nd term, everything going Cats way, and Dusty just says no, this is not happening. Could feel the energy through the TV. If we're going to be a successful we need to accept adversity and say not today. Make it rain.

The knocks on Clayton are ridiculous. Nobody in the league gets attention he receives from the opposition. Setterfield was on top of him the entire match and was flirting with the legal threshold. The bloke does the best he can. Can't expect him to be perfect every week. When he's getting the hard tags, Christian 'Hungry Hippo' Petracca should be taking the game by the scruff of the neck. These two really should be working in tandem to break games apart.

Few players efforts I would question, but no point ranting about them. Hopeful the ressies play well today and will be rewarded for their efforts next week.
 
demondavey said:
I don’t think it’s up to him to play a different way at all. If he is getting tagged then someone needs to come in and flatten the tagger. I guess the issue with that these days is that any adverse physical contact gets you in trouble. Melbourne might want to submit some footage to the umpiring department to show him being held.

It’s beyond acceptable that people get away with that s**t at a stoppage. You can’t bump anymore but you can hug a bloke like a python.
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Its up to the coach as well though and up to him, but bashing his head against a wall over and over again in a game we are clearly losing is rubbish to me. I'm super harsh on Oliver no doubt but also Petracca. It's not fun bashing Tomlinson or Melk to me because ultimately they don't matter. They fill holes at the end. Oliver and Trac can win and lose games and they (especially Petracca) get credit for very average games alot.
 
Topkent said:
Its up to the coach as well though and up to him, but bashing his head against a wall over and over again in a game we are clearly losing is rubbish to me. I'm super harsh on Oliver no doubt but also Petracca. It's not fun bashing Tomlinson or Melk to me because ultimately they don't matter. They fill holes at the end. Oliver and Trac can win and lose games and they (especially Petracca) get credit for very average games alot.
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I think Petracca needs a lot more criticism than he is getting. I am not sure what the conversations are internally but they should be very firm. Oliver deals with a prick head hanging off him like dags on a sheep’s arse every week, I feel that’s a big enough battle at times.
 
No Gawn and no Lever = no on field leadership.

Coupled with Goody refusing to change things up or give anyone a spray and it felt like we were rudderless all game. No direction, no leadership, no one to tell the boys to get their s**t together.
 
Kind of felt like the bombers did a Melbourne on Melbourne. They go it in their forward 50 and kept the pressure on until they scored. We constantly bombed it straight to their defenders who had pressed up to the centre and they just put the ball straight back in. Contrastingly when we did get it forward we'd either just give them an easy intercept by terrible delivery or there was a complete lack of pressure they easily walked it out. Not sure what the solution is, if players can't handle pressure in a round 5 then how will they cope for finals.
 
Look I know you blokes love meming s**t up and saying I hate Oliver port Adelaide etc. But if you look at Oliver's games

33, 37, 25, 34 and 41 disposals. His 25 disposal game was a ******* country mile better than the others. One of the best games I've ever seen him play. When we start playing s**t he goes into this mode of I need to win every single stoppage and get 40 disposals. The 2 games he had 37 and 41 were huge losses where he didn't do that much in. I call it selfish because it seems like instead of our midfield working as a team it becomes about him doing it alone to the point he gets it and slams it on a boot while being tackle and it goes straight up in the air. He's better than that, he can link play and kick the ball, he's quick. But he reverts to a Tom Mitchell style disposal padder when we are playing s**t. If that's me hating him, so be it.
 
Dory_77 said:
41 touches that didn't change anything.
Credit to him for sticking to it, not many (any?) Did fo us yesterday. But games like that each week won't do much to lift the team.

Oliver's never had a problem getting the ball. Making an impact with as many touches as possible is his issue. That's not helped by half-assed efforts around him, but with that much footy he needs to be setting up a lot more play. According to the AFL stats he had 8 score involvements from his 41. Trac had 7 with 15 odd less touches. ANB had 7 from a third as many touches.
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The stats do say a completely different story though. Oliver is ranked the 4th in the comp for highest score involvements per game for midfielders.
He is also the number 1 ranked mid in the comp for score launches. So in terms of impact on the scoreboard he is the most impactful midfielder in the comp statistically. That's if we're using score involvements and score launches as a metric.
 
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