Play Nice Derailed, (The Place to Continue Off-Topic Discussion)

[TheGreatGrundy]

I resent the implication that Steve McKee had any Clydesdale characteristics at all and find your statement deeply offensive on behalf of my breed. I suggest we settle this in standard stallion vs stallion fashion. That customarily involves a lot of loud noise, some stomping, general prancing, pointed mutual groin sniffing, and leaving steaming poo piles as testimony to our individual bona fides and bodacious cojones.

If you need to know what that looks like you can find examples on youtube or if you prefer just enter any Dayne Beams thread at your own risk.

Sound like fun! My testicles are as described and would enjoy the opportunity of a public airing. I may take you up on the challenge!

 

[jmac70]

Sound like fun! My testicles are as described and would enjoy the opportunity of a public airing. I may take you up on the challenge!

I’ll visit you in jail.

 

[deltablues]

Where do sheep dogs fit into this conversation?

They are lying doggo, biding their moment...

 

[Ingy]

Point of order your honour: Whilst I'm delighted with the form that young Josh has shown (right from the pre-season games til now) HE is no- where near the level his dad was even as a youngster.

Living where I do and with the links to GFC that I have, the comparisons that have been presented by Geelong and moreso latterly by AFL aficionado's that GAJ is better than his dad... I'm really hoping that the youngsters that see our two "new" Daicos's and compare them to their famous father do so in the knowledge that Peter was a once in a lifetime player (much like the elder Ablett). Peter's ability to do pretty much anything he wanted from the moment he stepped onto the field in his first game separated him from mere mortals. His ability to read play, to make play for others and (when he had to) winning games off his own boot...well those things will seldom be repeated.

Josh has elements of his father's brilliance. His balance and problem solving is highly evolved. He has great hands, kicks the ball well (maybe 85% of his father's level) and he has a hunger to get involved and to assist his team mates. But lets not compare the two...by year 4 Josh has played 35 odd games and kicked 17 goals, Peter had played 80 odd games (including 3 finals series and 3 GF's) and kicked 170 odd goals mainly playing as a midfielder and sometime forward.

Ablett snr is SO FAR AHEAD of any of his sons that its embarrassing when they're compared to him.
Any comparison between Peter and Josh (or Nick in future) is even more far fetched.

I'm just so glad we have both the boys playing for us, they will both give us all, plenty of Daicos moments!

Nah, Gary Jr's better than Gary Snr.

GAJ is the GOAT

 

[Robroy22]

Nah, Gary Jr's better than Gary Snr.

GAJ is the GOAT

Can you tell me ONE skill or attribute that GAJ has that is better than his dad? (other than shaving his head or attracting Brownlow votes out of umps that value one: two touches)

 

[jonmacTrag]

Can you tell me ONE skill or attribute that GAJ has that is better than his dad? (other than shaving his head or attracting Brownlow votes out of umps that value one: two touches)

Anyone who has the opinion that jnr is in any way comparable to his dad obviously hasn't seen probably the single most astonishing GF performance by a player of all time.
Snr all but carried the pussies across the line single handedly in the GF against the Hawks.
I'm very biased against players from other clubs but that was astonishing and no one can belittle it.

 

[Ingy]

Can you tell me ONE skill or attribute that GAJ has that is better than his dad? (other than shaving his head or attracting Brownlow votes out of umps that value one: two touches)

Gut running.

Winning contested possessions.

Durability (he's played over a hundred more games).

Tackling.

And he's not such a massive point-kicker as his dad was. Senior kicked more behinds than Buddy FFS

 

[johncitizen]

Anyone who has the opinion that jnr is in any way comparable to his dad obviously hasn't seen probably the single most astonishing GF performance by a player of all time.
Snr all but carried the pussies across the line single handedly in the GF against the Hawks.
I'm very biased against players from other clubs but that was astonishing and no one can belittle it.

Senior was twice the player of his son. No comparison.

 

[Sea fog]

Gut running.

Winning contested possessions.

Durability (he's played over a hundred more games).

Tackling.

And he's not such a massive point-kicker as his dad was. Senior kicked more behinds than Buddy FFS

This is the professional era. Gary sen. was a lazy trainer for a lot of the time.

 

[jonmacTrag]

This is the professional era. Gary sen. was a lazy trainer for a lot of the time.

As were many of his compatriots, but for some the gloss of the modern system is enough I suppose.

 

[Robroy22]

Gut running. Sorry mate but Snr started as a winger and even after he moved forward he regularly ran his opponents into the ground. He had endurance too. And fast? He was explosive. Just because GAJ made his name as a mid, he was a pretty ordinary forward in his first 4 years and he is now too. Maybe he played 100 too many games?

Winning contested possessions. Oh Boy! Snr could out mark anyone, in packs, over packs, on the lead, one handed. He couldn't be "out strengthed" in contests and he had a MEAN streak that meant he would hurt opponents if they got in his way. (now when has GAJ ever done that?) He could baulk, he could tackle. IF he wanted the ball, then no-one could stop him getting it. GAJ was always good at handball receives but over time he has learned to find the ball on the ground or on the lead. Contested possessions for this father/son is chalk and cheese.

Durability (he's played over a hundred more games). They do play a few more each year than they did in Snr's time but yes GAJ has played more games. (But on that stat then Kevin Bartlett's better than Dusty?)

Tackling. Lol...did you ever see Snr play? He hurt blokes he tackled...but didn't need to tackle on most occasions because he already had them beaten and had the ball!

And he's not such a massive point-kicker as his dad was. Senior kicked more behinds than Buddy FFS

Snr kicked @ 61%
Jnr kicked @ 57%

 

[Ingy]

This is just classic Boomeritis

 

[Robroy22]

This is just classic Boomeritis

Is that the social media word for fact?

 

[jonmacTrag]

This is just classic Boomeritis

It's all in black and white - stir yourself to do some proper research.

 

[gouki88]

There’s no world in which Jnr “not kicking as many points” is a win for him. Snr had 599 scoring shots in a 3 year 64 game period. That’s nearly 10 scores a game for 3 seasons and you’re trying to fault him for it...?

 

[Robroy22]

There’s no world in which Jnr “not kicking as many points” is a win for him. Snr had 599 scoring shots in a 3 year 64 game period. That’s nearly 10 scores a game for 3 seasons and you’re trying to fault him for it...?

he was a freak

 

[gouki88]

he was a freak

Yeah, undoubtedly. I never got to see him live, but even catching replays of his efforts are insane. Never seen such a combination of speed, strength, aggression and skill.

My dad often raves about him being right up there in terms of talent with Fabulous Phil

 

[Robroy22]

Yeah, undoubtedly. I never got to see him live, but even catching replays of his efforts are insane. Never seen such a combination of speed, strength, aggression and skill.

My dad often raves about him being right up there in terms of talent with Fabulous Phil

Much better than Phil. Snr played for 14 years....Phil couldn't keep up that level of excitement for more than a couple of years!

 

[gouki88]

Much better than Phil. Snr played for 14 years....Phil couldn't keep up that level of excitement for more than a couple of years!

Oh yeah, in production no doubt. More just mercurial ability I think

 

[partypie]

Nah, Gary Jr's better than Gary Snr.

GAJ is the GOAT

Nah as good as GAJ has been (and he is one of the all time greats) GAS was the better footballer.

There was literally nothing he couldn't do on a football field and the shocking thing was that he was by all reports pretty average on the training track so a lot of what we saw out of him on the field was pure ability.

The two areas GAJ has been better in over the journey are with his preparation / getting the most out of himself and his laser-sharp focus.

Both of them had an innate ability to think two or three steps ahead of their opponents which is how both have managed to make so many good players from quality opposition look almost second rate when matched up against them a lot of the time over their career.

 

[johncitizen]

Yeah, undoubtedly. I never got to see him live, but even catching replays of his efforts are insane. Never seen such a combination of speed, strength, aggression and skill.

My dad often raves about him being right up there in terms of talent with Fabulous Phil

I watched them both play. Daicos had more pure talent than Carman. Not by much. Many here have said Carman was the best.. Daicos had everything.. think Didak x 2 .. He was as good as Gary Ablett Snr..

Daics more exciting to watch.

 

[jonmacTrag]

Oh yeah, in production no doubt. More just mercurial ability I think

Phil was a fantastic talent but also a huge frustration to club and team mates, Snr was simply a fantastic talent.

 

[loki04]

Nah as good as GAJ has been (and he is one of the all time greats) GAS was the better footballer.

There was literally nothing he couldn't do on a football field and the shocking thing was that he was by all reports pretty average on the training track so a lot of what we saw out of him on the field was pure ability.

The two areas GAJ has been better in over the journey are with his preparation / getting the most out of himself and his laser-sharp focus.

Both of them had an innate ability to think two or three steps ahead of their opponents which is how both have managed to make so many good players from quality opposition look almost second rate when matched up against them a lot of the time over their career.

Buckley was a better play then Gaz jnr, best mid ive seen is Bucks.

Ablett played a good chunk in a weird era where 90% of coaches phased out the tagger, could you imagine Buckleys numbers had he been allowed no opponents scragging off him all game....fair dinkum.

 

[Ingy]

Is that the social media word for fact?

Almost nothing that you wrote was a fact. It was all your opinion.

You asked for skills or attributes that Junior had over Senior and then in rebuttal you are talking about marking and speed, neither of which I mentioned.

You said he started as a winger but I'm pretty sure you're wrong. He was a half-forward flanker.

On one single occasion, Senior won more than thirty possessions. If, as you say,"IF he wanted the ball, no one could stop him from getting it", how did he not get it more often? Did he just decide he didn't want it a lot?

Junior AVERAGED more than thirty possessions in 2009-2015 and 2017.

He is no. 4 all-time for tackles.

No. 2 all-time for inside 50s.

No. 5 for clearances.

No. 1 for contested possessions (chalk and cheese indeed). Jnr has more contested possessions than Snr had possessions altogether, so don't go dismissing his possession counts as cheap one twos because it's garbage.

No. 1 for handballs (though Pendles is going to overtake him this week, which is exciting)

Senior isn't in the Top 30 all-time for marks. Loewe, Daniher, Carey, Lockett are in there, no Ablett Snr.

He's fifth all-time for goals, but third all-time for behinds. He was a point-kicker. 61% for a forward is not a 'best of all time' conversion rate, I am afraid. Lockett, Lloyd, Dunstall, Mason Cox all a lot better.

Your rebuttal for this statistical superiority is going to be that stats are cheap in today's game. Well, if you were your side's focal point, goals were cheap in the 80s. Lockett and Dunstall were both doing it better than Senior at the time and they kicked a couple hundred goals apiece more than he did.

Gary Ablett Senior was the best half forward flanker ever to play the game.

Gary Ablett Junior is the best player to ever play the game.

 

[gouki88]

Phil was a fantastic talent but also a huge frustration to club and team mates, Snr was simply a fantastic talent.

Thank God GAS didn't stick around at Hawthorn with his brothers!