Dimma gets another 2 years

[Helen Wheels]

There's obviously quite a bit about this announcement that makes me feel ill (though it was obviously coming), but nothing more than the supporters who defend the re-signing by opining that it 'takes the pressure off' Hardwick. Now the players have to tow his line for years longer and not undermine him or start looking forward to a future without him.

He has sufficient positive pressure on him to perform. This lightens the constant media chatter.

I have very few good things to say about Hardwick's tenure, but one good thing I've been able to say through the first few years, was that he's kept the group together and got along well with a majority of the players. Even though cracks have shown at times with individuals over the lack of success and general direction, that's been one of Hardwick's few fact-based strengths.

How about making three finals, for one thing. That's not easy.

Given this fact, why are these supporters so downright fearful to have the playing group given a realistic ultimatum - either become more successful in September or the coach, mentor and friend you supposedly 'love' won't be here next year.

I think this is understood.

Newsflash: if the players do that instead of giving their absolute all for Hardwick, it's quite simply because they've already lost belief - and no amount of 'removing pressure' from the shoulders of a terminally mediocre coach is going to magically produce a different result than the past.

Everything I've seen and heard indicates that the players are 100% with him. You're speculating.

The progress might not be as fast as you want but we have made progress under Hardwick. If you can nominate a better coach who is available, please do.

 

[tropicaltiger]

It's possible the players you mentioned don't rate him,it does happen in football so maybe he is.

OF course they DON'T rate him... the only thing they rate is the $$$$$$$ and the smell of their own farts.....

 

[Livonski]

Game day coaching is a little over rated.
I was talking to someone in the highest level of the Hawthorn coterie - only 12 invited to this group. They are allowed to sit in the coaches box during the season. This person said Clarkson did 99% of the coaching during the week and not much at all during game day. Sure he'd send messages down to the "line coaches", but it was more on reiterating instructions to what the players weren't doing that they were supposed to.

I spoke to Chris Scott about this very point last year. He said that if we have to think up moves on game day we've failed as a coaching group. It's always about implementing pre arranged strategies to fit each scenario as its played out.
Seat of the pants moving the magnets is so old school.

 

[TigerImposter]

I spoke to Chris Scott about this very point last year. He said that if we have to think up moves on game day we've failed as a coaching group. It's always about implementing pre arranged strategies to fit each scenario as its played out.
Seat of the pants moving the magnets is so old school.

Thanks for mentioning the android CScott otherwise I may have been fooled
This explains the delayed reaction time in making a move when the ship hits the fan. Too late Waites got three on a bloke inches below him. I'm glad DH had been doing his homework pre game , but unfortunately he didn't understand the difference between inches and millimetres
Best coaches pull the moves when the pressure cooker is on
DH has missed out three years running now
Sheedy Malthouse and Clarkson (08 amazing) Hafey etc don't write the script on Thursday they write history on game day by using tactical nous under game day pressure

 

[Severe]

At least we can save money not buying grand final tickets for a couple more years.

 

[SunshineBoy]

I spoke to Chris Scott about this very point last year. He said that if we have to think up moves on game day we've failed as a coaching group. It's always about implementing pre arranged strategies to fit each scenario as its played out.
Seat of the pants moving the magnets is so old school.

Thanks Dimma

 

[Rayzorwire]

He has sufficient positive pressure on him to perform. This lightens the constant media chatter.

There is no 'positive pressure' come September, just the real world variety. Success - or at very least significant forward momentum towards it - lightens the 'media chatter.'

Hardwick's failure to bring either over recent years was the making of the situation he and we as a club find ourselves in. Not to mention his own words about when success would come under his system and how it would be achieved.

He's failed his own set timeline miserably and halfway through his tenure he was forced to adopt the almost exact opposite blueprint to the one he used to sell himself to the club. He fully criticised us when he arrived (just as Wallace did) for always topping up with limited shelf-life senior hacks in the past and not going the 'pure' way through the draft, educating the 'right kind' of 'great disposal' players into the 'right kind' of system.

Which part of him being a full-circle hypocrite has sat well with you?

Everything I've seen and heard indicates that the players are 100% with him.

Great, then the simple binary options I presented - either they 'love' him enough to drive themselves to greater success, or they don't - should be a resounding, 100% 'yes they do' from you.

So what is the real problem you have with testing that theory?

That Hardwick, or the players will crack?

If you can nominate a better coach who is available, please do.

I said I preferred several others (including Hinkley once it was down to only two) when he was appointed and there's at least half a dozen I would have taken in the interim, plus several current assistants now.

We've had plenty of chances, plenty of options, just no clarity of vision or courage.

 

[Helen Wheels]

YeahNah Rayzorwire. I disagree with pretty well everything you say and I don't think we'll see eye-to-eye. We could go back and forth all night.

 

[Rayzorwire]

It's always about implementing pre arranged strategies to fit each scenario as its played out.

So when Hardwick gets his all too familiar 'bunny in the headlights' routine happening in the coaches box and the fact that he's lost and literally helpless is obvious to everyone, it's merely because he's misplaced his run sheet of 'pre-arranged strategies?'

Or maybe, just maybe, 'pre-arranged strategies' - and those who rely too heavily on them - are not much use when the opposition deploys unexpected strategy or the game presents scenarios you forgot to 'pre-arrange' a plan for?

Sounds a lot like you'd happily buy into having an AI 'pre-arranged strategy machine' coach the club if you could be convinced it planned better through the week. We could pop it up there in the box and it would never look like a bunny in the headlights. Bonus!

 

[SplintWhisky]

 

[wegetpumped]

YeahNah Rayzorwire. I disagree with pretty well everything you say and I don't think we'll see eye-to-eye. We could go back and forth all night.

He has put some good points across Helen which to me seem spot on. But on another post of your's do you really believe in what you hear > As of the seen it what have you seen?

 

[Livonski]

So when Hardwick gets his all too familiar 'bunny in the headlights' routine happening in the coaches box and the fact that he's lost and literally helpless is obvious to everyone, it's merely because he's misplaced his run sheet of 'pre-arranged strategies?'

Or maybe, just maybe, 'pre-arranged strategies' - and those who rely too heavily on them - are not much use when the opposition deploys unexpected strategy or the game presents scenarios you forgot to 'pre-arrange' a plan for?

Sounds a lot like you'd happily buy into having an AI 'pre-arranged strategy machine' coach the club if you could be convinced it planned better through the week. We could pop it up there in the box and it would never look like a bunny in the headlights. Bonus!

Just thought I'd give an anecdote from a current day AFL coach to help people gain an insight into what actually happens in the box on match day.
You and TigerImposter can twist that into a stream of bile and hatred if you like. You guys know best. Don't let anything you see or read influence your point of view. Don't learn, don't change, don't adapt. Dinosaurs end up extinct.

 

[wegetpumped]

Just thought I'd give an anecdote from a current day AFL coach to help people gain an insight into what actually happens in the box on match day.
You and TigerImposter can twist that into a stream of bile and hatred if you like. You guys know best. Don't let anything you see or read influence your point of view. Don't learn, don't change, don't adapt. Dinosaurs end up extinct.

In reality all top coaches will tell you as to what you referred to. Most things are sorted pre match and as most coaches say that you can't do much during actual game time. But most of the top coaches have to change something during game time if the plan goes pear-shape that's why we call them gameday coaches. One good referral by raz was pointing to was what on earth was dh thinking leaving batch on Waite and why when grimes went on him and stopped him did dh put batch back on him after h/t? Equation? How much did we loose by and how many did Waite kick on Batch?

 

[Speedie41]

At least we can save money not buying grand final tickets for a couple more years.

Good, I'm poor and can't afford that kind of overpriced stuff.

 

[have a RHG]

Its rediculous really. Makes you wonder why some of these clown actually support the club.

 

[wegetpumped]

Its rediculous really. Makes you wonder why some of these clown actually support the club.

Takes 2 clowns to make a circus.

 

[TigerImposter]

YeahNah Rayzorwire. I disagree with pretty well everything you say and I don't think we'll see eye-to-eye. We could go back and forth all night.

i'm glad i fell asleep drunk on the couch

 

[TigerImposter]

So when Hardwick gets his all too familiar 'bunny in the headlights' routine happening in the coaches box and the fact that he's lost and literally helpless is obvious to everyone, it's merely because he's misplaced his run sheet of 'pre-arranged strategies?'

Or maybe, just maybe, 'pre-arranged strategies' - and those who rely too heavily on them - are not much use when the opposition deploys unexpected strategy or the game presents scenarios you forgot to 'pre-arrange' a plan for?

Sounds a lot like you'd happily buy into having an AI 'pre-arranged strategy machine' coach the club if you could be convinced it planned better through the week. We could pop it up there in the box and it would never look like a bunny in the headlights. Bonus!

Auto pilots work on expensive air crafts

 

[TigerImposter]

Just thought I'd give an anecdote from a current day AFL coach to help people gain an insight into what actually happens in the box on match day.
You and TigerImposter can twist that into a stream of bile and hatred if you like. You guys know best. Don't let anything you see or read influence your point of view. Don't learn, don't change, don't adapt. Dinosaurs end up extinct.

yes ,but the legacy they left is still remembered today

 

[CoggaRules]

So a finals win and a premiership are not part of his KPIs? (you said meeting or exceeding)

That's great what is a football club in business for? to get a war chest? or to win premierships?

do you need to call a friend?

Of course they are in it to win premierships, but at the end of the day the $$ graph is tracking along and I can guarantee ya the only KPIs that matter are the ones that keep the tills humming. Right now its pretty much a safety first approach, ie the $$ are flowing in and the board want steady as she goes. Its like they mapped out a doomsday scenario, which has us languishing in 10th and they view the next 2 years after that and basically the number membership wise have ballooned via mum and the 2 or 3 kids trundling along to the game to sing the song. Those members are not going to go gaga when we dont win a flag in the next 2 years, they just want to sing the song 12 or 13 times or more...the purists like us who demand success, the board say suck shit you are in the minority...

 

[SunshineBoy]

Its rediculous really. Makes you wonder why some of these clown actually support the club.

 

[CoggaRules]

As alot are saying its a safety first approach. If Dimma stumbles and the team doesnt live up to expectations, the spin can get them out of it and it doesnt really hurt the bottom line moving forward. On the other hand if they held firm on the 1 year and the above happened, team didnt live up to expectations, lets say they went out and head hunted a proven coach....lets think the tankers and Malthouse and how quick things can turn to shit and then take into account our track record when hiring coaches, even though we seemed to improve our process, it was purely a show to erase our past stupidities when swooping on the next cab on the rank...so I can see why they are comfortable with extending for 2 years. But one things for sure, if these brightside muppets defend Dimma if or when he f**ks up, I will then understand what I am dealing with.

 

[Goldfrog]

He has sufficient positive pressure on him to perform. This lightens the constant media chatter.

How about making three finals, for one thing. That's not easy.

I think this is understood.

Everything I've seen and heard indicates that the players are 100% with him. You're speculating.

The progress might not be as fast as you want but we have made progress under Hardwick. If you can nominate a better coach who is available, please do.

Sorry if this is coming a second time, don't think my first post went through.
I think that you are misunderstanding what some posters on here are saying. There may not be a better coach than Dimma this year, or even next year, BUT if there is, or the best he does is more of the same than we are stuck with him, or a big payout.
Why would we want to, or NEED to, sign him at this stage. He ain't going anywhere.
Let him PROVE he deserves another contract by improving our results. If he ,or the players are under pressure, good. What elite sportsperson or team isn't.

 

[Goldfrog]

He has sufficient positive pressure on him to perform. This lightens the constant media chatter.

How about making three finals, for one thing. That's not easy.

I think this is understood.

Everything I've seen and heard indicates that the players are 100% with him. You're speculating.

The progress might not be as fast as you want but we have made progress under Hardwick. If you can nominate a better coach who is available, please do.

With respect, I think you aren't quite understanding what a lot of posters are saying. There may not be anyone better this year, or maybe even next year. BUT, we have signed him up so if anyone better does come along, or if we continue to make finals without winning them, we are stuck with him. Or a sizable payout.
I'm not anti-Dimma necessarily. The question however is a simple one. Why did we NEED to sign him at this stage?????????? Got me buggered.

 

[Helen Wheels]

He has put some good points across Helen which to me seem spot on. But on another post of your's do you really believe in what you hear > As of the seen it what have you seen?

No, I don't believe everything I hear but all I'm saying is that everything I've heard says it's a happy camp. Haven't heard anything to the contrary and any talk of dissent in the ranks would filter out to the world pretty quickly IMO. Bad news travels fast.