Current Disappearance of little William Tyrrell *Homicide gets an AVO on the foster parents

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Awakening

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There's not a lot of money in fostering. If there was they might get more people doing it.

Looking after kids is not cheap. Maybe if you had a tonne of foster kids that you didn't clothe feed send to day care or any extra curricular activities you might get in front, but there'd be easier ways to make a buck then having foster kids live with you.

Most biological families get some sort of payment for their kids too; family tax benefit for example.

I'm not saying that people don't try to profit from fostering but I don't believe it's common and I can't see that as a motive in this case because they are significantly wealthier than the average aussie family.
 

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Awakening

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I've been curious about how long MFC & FFC have been together for. According to this they met in 2006.

The foster father, who works in sales, could be seen limbering up in court rooms in his pink business shirt and skinny jeans, twisting his square toe shoes and breathing deeply.

He told the court he had met the foster mother about 2006 and as a motorcyclist he had ridden his trail bike around the Kendall State Forest “extensively”.

He explained away his frantic behaviour after arriving home and tearing off to run like a madman up hill and down dale without finding where his wife had already searched for William.

“There is method in my madness,” he said, “I thought it was probably better for me to branch out … outside the house.”

The foster father was in the witness box barely more than an hour, which left some observers unsatisfied, and wanting to get more of an insight into him and William."

 

Pies1990

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I've been curious about how long MFC & FFC have been together for. According to this they met in 2006.

The foster father, who works in sales, could be seen limbering up in court rooms in his pink business shirt and skinny jeans, twisting his square toe shoes and breathing deeply.

He told the court he had met the foster mother about 2006 and as a motorcyclist he had ridden his trail bike around the Kendall State Forest “extensively”.

He explained away his frantic behaviour after arriving home and tearing off to run like a madman up hill and down dale without finding where his wife had already searched for William.

“There is method in my madness,” he said, “I thought it was probably better for me to branch out … outside the house.”

The foster father was in the witness box barely more than an hour, which left some observers unsatisfied, and wanting to get more of an insight into him and William."


Might not mean much….but having ridden motorbikes in Kendall SF (I presume the one south of Batar Creek Rd) he would know the area very well?
 

Awakening

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According to 7 news report in December 2021;

"The foster mother, 56, and foster father, 54, each face one count of common assault against a child in a Sydney home this year."

So when they met in 2006 FFC was 41 and MFC was 39.

We don't know if they have any biological children from previous relationships.

I can only assume they wanted to create a family together as they were interested in long term fostering and were wanting to adopt WT.

We don't know if they tried other ways of creating a family first like fertility treatments or overseas adoption or whether fostering was their first choice.

One of the foster families I know wanted to do fostering before they even tried for a family. They felt very strongly about caring for needy kids. They had (and still have) a long term placement when their first biological child was born. There were never fertility issues they genuinely wanted to foster kids.

In terms of overseas adoption, they are often connected to religious organisations and it can be difficult to adopt if you have previously been married, are gay or over the age of 40.

It does seem cruel to me that FACS were looking at WT as a potential adoption. It seems cruel towards the biological parents who were doing courses and trying to change and very much wanting their children with them, but also cruel to the foster family, telling them this was a possibility when the bios were determined to get their kids back.

This was never going to be a straightforward adoption, it would of been in courts for years. Removing someone's parental rights when those parents are demonstrating their willingness to change and to fight for their kids would not be easy.

It doesn't appear that this was a situation where mum and dad had no interest in their kids. Some biological families agree to put their kids into a permanent long term arrangement or adoption OR don't respond to requests to show up to meetings or court to discuss the custody of their kids because they are missing in action.

So it seems bizarre and cruel and unfair that this was happening.
 

Lady O

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“It seems cruel towards the biological parents who were doing courses and trying to change … “

Except they couldn’t, and didn’t. Have they, since then? Have they got their daughter back?

I gather they aren't together any more, but she has two other children and presumably they are being well cared for.
I think that if they hadn't been together when WT was born, he wouldn't have been taken into foster care. All that just from what I have read and my own opinion.
 

Awakening

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“It seems cruel towards the biological parents who were doing courses and trying to change … “

Except they couldn’t, and didn’t. Have they, since then? Have they got their daughter back?

From my understanding they'd basically lost custody of their daughter and she was in a long term placement with the foster family, which is probably why she remained with them when WT disappeared but I obviously don't know that for fact.

I'm not romanticising the bio family but they at least still seem interested in their kids (or at least saying they were) and the mum went on to have 2 more kids that remained in her care for at least some period of time (not sure if they still are?) so I assume things improved at least temporarily.

WT was still very young so I'm not sure why there was a push for adoption, such a final thing.
 

Awakening

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I gather they aren't together any more, but she has two other children and presumably they are being well cared for.
I think that if they hadn't been together when WT was born, he wouldn't have been taken into foster care. All that just from what I have read and my own opinion.

That was my understanding. That the big issue that FaCS had was their relationship as there was violence.

I'm assuming whatever the nature of that violence it caused FaCS to have extreme concern for the safety and/or welfare of the kids. Perhaps they feared the kids would be caught up physically in the violence or the kids showed signs of psychological trauma due to the violence they were witnessing.
 

kat1234

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Might not mean much….but having ridden motorbikes in Kendall SF (I presume the one south of Batar Creek Rd) he would know the area very well?
Wow! This is very interesting. Indeed. I wonder if he ever went back for a ride after WT went missing?

Trail bike riding does sound like such fun doesn’t it?
 

CodyRose

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Do we know anything about FGM? How old was she? With respect, did she have any health issues which might have clouded her perception of things? Dementia, Alzheimers or similar? I'm wondering what her plans were after selling her home. I understand she wasn't interviewed, or am l incorrect?
I’m wondering if the FGM did tell someone/people that the family was coming up. I read that they rang on the way up. She may have told someone between then and the disappearance.
 

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CodyRose

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From my understanding they'd basically lost custody of their daughter and she was in a long term placement with the foster family, which is probably why she remained with them when WT disappeared but I obviously don't know that for fact.

I'm not romanticising the bio family but they at least still seem interested in their kids (or at least saying they were) and the mum went on to have 2 more kids that remained in her care for at least some period of time (not sure if they still are?) so I assume things improved at least temporarily.

WT was still very young so I'm not sure why there was a push for adoption, such a final thing.
I read the the bio mother is coping well with the two children
 

CodyRose

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During the coronial inquest, they expressed their concern through a 'media release' about how Mr Savage had an unaccounted for 2 hours when he was home alone for 2 hours listening to Ray Hadley whilst his wife went out to play bingo, and that this was suspicious and not being pursued vigorously enough by NSWPF. It all started with the finger of suspicion being pointed at Bill Spedding, and continued with a total of about 650 'persons of interest' over several years culminating in the Paul Savage persecution campaign. Jubelin was in constant contact with FPs reporting to them the so called 'progress' of the investigation, and Jubelin seems to be on very friendly terms with the FPs.
if the photo metadata is correct the fps and fgm also had 118 minutes longer
 

CodyRose

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Yes. Common, possible and probable that the body was placed somewhere (like for example the disabled riding school) then moved somewhere else.
The foster family were there in Kendall for a week after WT disappearance and probably returned a few times after that.
I’m guessing FM will be eventually charged with interfering with a corpse. Maybe FF too? Let’s see what comes back from forensics on the FGM car that was being driven by FM on the day of WT disappearance.
Maybe an abductor could have placed the body back near the house after the police had been through to make it look,Ike the FP were involved
 

BFew

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Maybe an abductor could have placed the body back near the house after the police had been through to make it look,Ike the FP were involved
Are you thinking that if this happened, that maybe whoever discovered the body, might have then disposed of the body somewhere, or got assistance from someone to assist dispose of it, rather than report the body to Police.
 

Awakening

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Good point!

My understanding is that this visit to go to Kendall for the weekend had been planned for some time so plenty of people could have known about it.

The only change to this plan was the last minute decision to go there a day earlier and they rang FGM to tell her they were on their way.

They were going to leave on Friday 12th September but instead left on Thursday 11th.

So the FGM could have told people they were arriving on Friday and the abductor could have arrived at the Kendall house early Friday morning to lie in wait.
 
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kat1234

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My understanding is that this visit to go to Kendall for the weekend had been planned for some time so plenty of people could have known about it.

The only change to this plan was the last minute decision to go there a day earlier and they rang FGM to tell her they were on their way.

They were going to leave on Friday 12th September but instead left on Thursday 11th.

So the FGM could have told people they were arriving on Friday and the abductor could have arrived at the Kendall house early Friday morning to lie in wait.
Totally possible. But who? And why?
 

CodyRose

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Are you thinking that if this happened, that maybe whoever discovered the body, might have then disposed of the body somewhere, or got assistance from someone to assist dispose of it, rather than report the body to Police.
I‘m just thinking that an abductor is not necessarily ruled out just because a body was laid to rest near the house. The sniffing dogs suggest he left in car rather than walking through the forest … but whose car? Body might have been dropped back.
 

CodyRose

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My understanding is that this visit to go to Kendall for the weekend had been planned for some time so plenty of people could have known about it.

The only change to this plan was the last minute decision to go there a day earlier and they rang FGM to tell her they were on their way.

They were going to leave on Friday 12th September but instead left on Thursday 11th.

So the FGM could have told people they were arriving on Friday and the abductor could have arrived at the Kendall house early Friday morning to lie in wait.
Yes I suspect people knew all the time no secret
 

BFew

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Body might have been dropped back.
Is it possible that there wasn't 24/7 physical and digital surveillance of everyone coming and going from Foster Nana's house, from the day William disappeared, until the next owner of the property moved in?
 

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