Certified Legendary Thread Discussion arising from Shhhhhh

[HairyO]

So after Collingwood go out in straight sets he will come out swinging?

What about the rest of the Melbourne media? Too caught up in the Bartel break up to report AFL interfering with free agency?

No. He will quietly tell Gil to increase Pendlebury's ambassador payments to match Coniglio's.

He knows how to play the game.

 

[play2win]

Afl throwing money at gws players is fools gold. You cant buy culture and expect silverware to follow. That is just some kinda stupid.

 

[marklar]

Only because GWS gets huge amounts of money, concessions and assistance, but have won nothing.

Exactly. The angst against COLA happened because of the Franklin deal after them winning in 2012, there was a concern that the extra payments were going to create a monster. GWS haven't done squat and are on the GC decline in the next few years if the stars don't stick around.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Why is nobody reporting it? Why is Eddie Macguire not up in arms? Why haven’t other clubs called it out?

When Sydney had COLA and used it to lure Tippett and Franklin, Macguire and the Victorian media saw to it that COLA was scrapped and the swans were then banned from trading

In this instance it seems to be people on the internet with all the finer details of Coniglio’s contract yet the Melbourne media and Macguire types (who never miss an opportunity to whinge about favouritism of northerners) remain silent.

It is obviously very possible the AFL kicked some money in at some point but the sort of numbers above are just guesswork. People on the internet are just making assumptions and guessing.

Melbourne never willingly tanked.
Essendon players don’t know what they took.
Ben Cousins wasn’t on drugs in 2006.
The St Kilda school girl made it all up.
Coniglio re-signed for less money.

 

[Billyc]

Melbourne never willingly tanked.
Essendon players don’t know what they took.
Ben Cousins wasn’t on drugs in 2006.
The St Kilda school girl made it all up.
Coniglio re-signed for less money.

Except that the complete opposite to everything you just posted was widely reported.

So my question remains: how do you know the details of Coniglio’s contract yet it’s not widely reported? Or have you just made an assumption (quite possibly right, though plenty of players have milked free agency to squeeze the maximum they can out of their existing clubs) and have you just guessed at the figure?

 

[Billyc]

The only way I could ever see it coming out would be if the player receiving the ambassador payments somehow revealed it which is probably a 0.0001% chance of happening. Even then I’m sure the AFL would have some kind of coverup to fall back on.

But people on the internet know the details. Is Coniglio loose lipped with Internet hawthorn fans to share in an echo chamber or are those fans making up numbers?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Except that the complete opposite to everything you just posted was widely reported.

So my question remains: how do you know the details of Coniglio’s contract yet it’s not widely reported? Or have you just made an assumption (quite possibly right, though plenty of players have milked free agency to squeeze the maximum they can out of their existing clubs) and have you just guessed at the figure?

We don’t know the details of Coniglio’s contract for sure, that’s why it is alleged.

There is lots of chatter about the AFL being involved in this if you talk to people in or connected to the industry though and we all know the AFL love to manipulate an outcome so it really shouldn’t surprise you that people are skeptical about his contract and the AFL’s involvement.

Btw, In each of those cases listed above, that’s exactly what was reported at the time. In some cases it still is.

People still rattle on about the Essendon players not knowing, the st kilda school girl saga got square away with a tell all on 60 minutes where she said it was all made up, she then bought herself a new house in Queensland....an unemployed 20yr old. The AFL said the Dees never tanked, but fined then anyway.

The AFL keep serving up bullshit and the masses keep swallowing it. How could anyone possibly trust them?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

But people on the internet know the details. Is Coniglio loose lipped with Internet hawthorn fans to share in an echo chamber or are those fans making up numbers?

You say this like posters on the internet aren’t real people with real relationships outside of these boards. It’s weird.

 

[Bugs1977]

We don’t know the details of Coniglio’s contract for sure, that’s why it is alleged.

There is lots of chatter about the AFL being involved in this if you talk to people in or connected to the industry though and we all know the AFL love to manipulate an outcome so it really shouldn’t be that unbelievable to think that they might have singed off a beneficial third party deal.

Btw, In each of those cases listed above, that’s exactly what was reported at the time. In some cases it still is.

People still rattle on about the Essendon players not knowing, the st kilda school girl saga got square away with a tell all on 60 minutes where she said it was all made up, she then bought herself a new house in Queensland....an unemployed 20yr old. The AFL said the Dees never tanked, but fined then anyway.

The AFL keep serving up bulls**t and the masses keep swallowing it. How could anyone possibly trust them?

You pretty much just described the plot for the Matrix. Unfortunately there are some that are still happy to be plugged into it

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Does Shhhhh spread fake news?

Based on what Shhhhh is saying it may be that Gerard Whateley does.

Hawks first pick trade restriction likely to be waived: Whateley

Hawthorn will look to trade their first round pick despite AFL restrictions according to Gerard Whateley.

www.sen.com.au

Or does the AFL rule mean that you can't trade it to improve your draft position either?

 

[Holy Rioli]

Based on what Shhhhh is saying it may be that Gerard Whateley does.

Hawks first pick trade restriction likely to be waived: Whateley

Hawthorn will look to trade their first round pick despite AFL restrictions according to Gerard Whateley.

www.sen.com.au

Or does the AFL rule mean that you can't trade it to improve your draft position either?

You gotta read through the bullshit - Geelong are the only team that are restricted from trading their 1st rounder this year (the team Whately supports). It's a lot more palatable to complain about Hawthorn being able to trade it so that no one blinks and eye when Geelong get approval to trade theirs.

 

[Billyc]

We don’t know the details of Coniglio’s contract for sure, that’s why it is alleged.

There is lots of chatter about the AFL being involved in this if you talk to people in or connected to the industry though and we all know the AFL love to manipulate an outcome so it really shouldn’t surprise you that people are skeptical about his contract and the AFL’s involvement.

Btw, In each of those cases listed above, that’s exactly what was reported at the time. In some cases it still is.

People still rattle on about the Essendon players not knowing, the st kilda school girl saga got square away with a tell all on 60 minutes where she said it was all made up, she then bought herself a new house in Queensland....an unemployed 20yr old. The AFL said the Dees never tanked, but fined then anyway.

The AFL keep serving up bulls**t and the masses keep swallowing it. How could anyone possibly trust them?

So, in short, you don't know and you have assumed and guessed or you have reported the assumptions or guesses of other people. That is what I thought, just wanted you to confirm.

Do I think AFL kicked in some money? Probably. But I don't know the details and neither do you. We also don't know whether it made a lick of difference.

I don't know what Coniglio was intending to do all along and neither do you. People connected to each of GWS, Carlton and Hawthorn were genuinely convinced he wanted to play out his career at those clubs and had given assurances that he would. Whatever way you spin it, either people were making that stuff up (you tend to dismiss anyone on the internet who supports a different footy club or anyone in the media but religiously endorse anyone within your Hawthorn echo chamber), or he and his manager were playing games with 2 clubs (like many before them). There was no shortage of reporting throughout (both in the media and online) that he wanted to and would likely stay at GWS.

 

[Brishawk]

So, in short, you don't know and you have assumed and guessed or you have reported the assumptions or guesses of other people. That is what I thought, just wanted you to confirm.

Do I think AFL kicked in some money? Probably. But I don't know the details and neither do you. We also don't know whether it made a lick of difference.

I don't know what Coniglio was intending to do all along and neither do you. People connected to each of GWS, Carlton and Hawthorn were genuinely convinced he wanted to play out his career at those clubs and had given assurances that he would. Whatever way you spin it, either people were making that stuff up (you tend to dismiss anyone on the internet who supports a different footy club or anyone in the media but religiously endorse anyone within your Hawthorn echo chamber), or he and his manager were playing games with 2 clubs (like many before them). There was no shortage of reporting throughout (both in the media and online) that he wanted to and would likely stay at GWS.

There is what people know and what people are willing to share on a public forum. Read between the lines.

 

[Gralin]

So, in short, you don't know and you have assumed and guessed or you have reported the assumptions or guesses of other people. That is what I thought, just wanted you to confirm.

Do I think AFL kicked in some money? Probably. But I don't know the details and neither do you. We also don't know whether it made a lick of difference.

I don't know what Coniglio was intending to do all along and neither do you. People connected to each of GWS, Carlton and Hawthorn were genuinely convinced he wanted to play out his career at those clubs and had given assurances that he would. Whatever way you spin it, either people were making that stuff up (you tend to dismiss anyone on the internet who supports a different footy club or anyone in the media but religiously endorse anyone within your Hawthorn echo chamber), or he and his manager were playing games with 2 clubs (like many before them). There was no shortage of reporting throughout (both in the media and online) that he wanted to and would likely stay at GWS.

No doubt we have one, but the entire AFL media bar the odd rogue reporter (Caro with Hird for example) is an echo chamber.

You just have to look at how someone calls into 3AW with a question or a radio/tv presenter poses a hypothetical and a week later the news cycle is talking about that event like its a fact as they all get in on it the same as posters on the forum do.

There isn't anything special about the AFL media, most of them wouldn't be able to hold down a job reporting on anything else because they aren't actual journalists, how many ex players are there in that group or people that just made a career out of this soap opera that it's turned into.

The media narrative is just that, it's a story being told based on how the AFL/owners of the media companies want things being portrayed. To keep interest high, to keep clicks and tweets rolling, to stay relevant.

There is a fair bit of promotion and spin going on at all times. It's not unque to the Cogs situation and in general it's not about screwing a club, it's about pushing the brand to the front in the way the AFL thinks will get the widest audience and most money.

 

[phreeze77]

We are all pretty much anonymous hawthorn supporters. Most of us wouldn’t know each other if we bumped into each other on the street. So trusting information or believing everything you read on these forums are a recipe for disappointment.

I had information from a junior hawks player that Coniglio was “pretty much done” to Hawthorn. I chose not to share it because of my now skepticism of anything until it’s done with polo and presser.

Also these things aren’t normally told to junior members of the club as they are yet to understand the confidentiality of such deals and how loose lips can derail it.

So it may have been locker room talk. Junior peer talk.

Last year my nephew claimed to see Shiel and Clarko at our Bnf at Crown. I shared it ... pretty much next couple of days he announced Essendon.

 

[asanque]

You gotta read through the bulls**t - Geelong are the only team that are restricted from trading their 1st rounder this year (the team Whately supports). It's a lot more palatable to complain about Hawthorn being able to trade it so that no one blinks and eye when Geelong get approval to trade theirs.

Great post.

First-round pick rule: How is your club placed?

Geelong is unable to trade its first draft pick unless it acquires another first-round selection

www.afl.com.au

 

[Sixpence]

So it may have been locker room talk. Junior peer talk.

Last year my nephew claimed to see Shiel and Clarko at our Bnf at Crown. I shared it ... pretty much next couple of days he announced Essendon.

The thing with these two points, is that the final outcome doesn't mean they weren't true at the time. Shiel signing with Essendon isn't proof that he wasn't at our BnF with Clarko, just that the assumption you made from it was wrong. Cogs signing with GWS doesn't prove that he hadn't actually agreed to sign with Hawthorn. All it proves is that something changed and for whatever reason they decided not to sign with us.

I've heard the "Cogs done deal to Hawthorn" from far too many different sources for me to doubt it was true at some point in time. Given nearly all of these reports were said with such certainty, rather than simply over confidence, I'm very suspect that something has happened behind the scenes with Gil.

Shiel comments were confident, but they were never said with the absolute certainty that the Cogs ones have been.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

So, in short, you don't know and you have assumed and guessed or you have reported the assumptions or guesses of other people. That is what I thought, just wanted you to confirm.

No. I’ve been told a number which is what I posted, but who knows if it’s right. Which again is why the word “allegedly” was written.

Do you believe he re-signed “for less money” after being offered 1.3-1.5m by Carlton?

 

[phreeze77]

The thing with these two points, is that the final outcome doesn't mean they weren't true at the time. Shiel signing with Essendon isn't proof that he wasn't at our BnF with Clarko, just that the assumption you made from it was wrong. Cogs signing with GWS doesn't prove that he hadn't actually agreed to sign with Hawthorn. All it proves is that something changed and for whatever reason they decided not to sign with us.

I've heard the "Cogs done deal to Hawthorn" from far too many different sources for me to doubt it was true at some point in time. Given nearly all of these reports were said with such certainty, rather than simply over confidence, I'm very suspect that something has happened behind the scenes with Gil.

Shiel comments were confident, but they were never said with the absolute certainty that the Cogs ones have been.

They may have all been correct at the time. Ultimately it makes people look like geese when it doesn’t come to fruition , whilst they have good intentions and they are Hawthorn through and through and want to share the news , it’s a vocation fraught with mockery when it doesn’t pan out that way.

I’m sure Topiary , nash88 , tylerdurden agree that the reactions after the fact are too much to handle and could possibly drive them away from the board.

I’ve been one that was disappointed with an outcome after riding the excitement of the information given here and wished I could take back what I said.

Whilst I’m appreciative of the information shared. I refuse to believe it until a presser with polo.

In saying all that I would like to say, Thanks for the information guys , at least you don’t back every horse and say see I was right like the “journos”

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

Shhhhh hears that the club views the 2019 draft as significantly stronger than the 2020 draft.
Although final list decisions are still being formalized, the list management team would like to see the club take additional picks to the 2019 draft.

Great news. Thanks for sharing Shhhh.

 

[QuietB]

Why is nobody reporting it? Why is Eddie Macguire not up in arms? Why haven’t other clubs called it out?

When Sydney had COLA and used it to lure Tippett and Franklin, Macguire and the Victorian media saw to it that COLA was scrapped and the swans were then banned from trading

In this instance it seems to be people on the internet with all the finer details of Coniglio’s contract yet the Melbourne media and Macguire types (who never miss an opportunity to whinge about favouritism of northerners) remain silent.

It is obviously very possible the AFL kicked some money in at some point but the sort of numbers above are just guesswork. People on the internet are just making assumptions and guessing.

Pies got Treloar - Eddie has his piece of GWS

I do not know how much - but it is 100% fact the AFL tipped in enough money to keep Coniglio at GWS.

 

[Off The Couch]

And Billyc if you don’t want to believe that, that’s okay

 

[Rushed_Behind]

Pies got Treloar - Eddie has his piece of GWS

I do not know how much - but it is 100% fact the AFL tipped in enough money to keep Coniglio at GWS.

I heard Geraldo morning show on SEN it was only $30k

 

[QuietB]

I heard Geraldo morning show on SEN it was only $30k

A month

Like I said I don't know exactly how much but it was more than that.

 

[Rushed_Behind]

A month

Like I said I don't know exactly how much but it was more than that.

Well they’re peddling the $30k line.