Oppo Camp Discussion on other club's trade/draft decisions

Question Saints fans

I'm doing ratings and rankings of draftees from last year.

If you had your time again at could pick Cripps instead of Dunstan, Billings or Acres would you?

Trying to establish out of the following draftees last year out of
1. James Aish
2. Patrick Cripps
3. Lewis Taylor
4. Luke Dunstan

Who will be the better players in the long run in 3-5 years time
I wanted Cripps in that pick 18/19 range last year. Didn't know Acres was going to be available though, the better rated WA player.
 

gillo94

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What has Cripps done to be remotely close to Dunstan in terms of development. Dunstan has proven he can perform consistently at AFL level. With all due respect to Cripps, he's had one decent game at that level. Regardless of how good he's looked at VFL, for now-the two can't be compared.

Cripps did well with clearance works, been injured but last year but good wraps. Dunstan yes I admit will only get better loved watching him play and future captain no doubt, is ahead but have to wait and see game time development in their 2nd year of AFL football
 

gillo94

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What has Cripps done to be remotely close to Dunstan in terms of development. Dunstan has proven he can perform consistently at AFL level. With all due respect to Cripps, he's had one decent game at that level. Regardless of how good he's looked at VFL, for now-the two can't be compared.

Cripps did well with clearance works, been injured but last year but good wraps. Dunstan yes I admit will only get better loved watching him play and future captain no doubt, is ahead but have to wait and see game time development in their 2nd year of AFL football
 

God Save Max King

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Hard to say maybe Cripps in long term. Don't get me wrong think Billings is exceptional talent and will be good once matures more and gets more game time however feel Saints need key depth in the midfield moving forward

Petracca, Dunstan, Arces, Cripps looks like a mean strong combination in 4 years time you have to agree
You would rather have Cripps over the #1 pick in the draft? Say that again?
 

Jezzarayman

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3 games but first year, can't put too much pressure early

Cripps was a real bolter of the draft. He reminds me a little of Jobe Watson at junior Level. He will take 3-5 years but I reckon he will become a solid player. Light years from Dunstan and Billings at this stage. Still baffles the mind that Dunstan got to 18, not sure what Geelong were thinking.
 

gillo94

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You would rather have Cripps over the #1 pick in the draft? Say that again?

No what I mean is say Saints have these 4 players... Cripps, Petracca, Dunstan & Acres in the same midfield

Those 4 in the same team look strong, dominant and mean. Would make excellent combination in 4-5 year developing together
 
Cripps was a real bolter of the draft. He reminds me a little of Jobe Watson at junior Level. He will take 3-5 years but I reckon he will become a solid player. Light years from Dunstan and Billings at this stage. Still baffles the mind that Dunstan got to 18, not sure what Geelong were thinking.

or freo. that josh simpson selection set them a year back, which forced them to take a tall the year after
 
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The other thing that needs to be taken into account is that it was found mid way through the season that Dunstan had a wheat intolerance, that was causing him to put on unwanted weight and feel consistently sluggish/lethargic and that since he has cut the wheat out he has been feeling a lot better and has slimmed down considerably, so if he was performing as well as he was in the first half of the season in particular in spite of those issues, it makes you wonder how well he could do now that he's feeling better and isn't carrying as much unwanted weight.

If he wants to he can bulk back up again with pure muscle, but I'd suggest we won't want him to, as he will now be able to build up his tank more and become more explosive and likely get to a lot more contests, so that could all push him even further ahead of Cripps than he was this year.
 

gillo94

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Cripps was a real bolter of the draft. He reminds me a little of Jobe Watson at junior Level. He will take 3-5 years but I reckon he will become a solid player. Light years from Dunstan and Billings at this stage. Still baffles the mind that Dunstan got to 18, not sure what Geelong were thinking.

Where do you rank following players?

Cripps, Dunstan, Aish, Lewis Taylor
 
Would you like to have all four players in same midfield? I think would be good

i wouldnt take cripps. i really didnt get the hype surrounding him. was obviously a wiley call, i think looking back they'll accept they put too much trust in his call. was obviously biased given he coached him
 

gillo94

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The other thing that needs to be taken into account is that it was found mid way through the season that Dunstan had a wheat intolerance, that was causing him to put on unwanted weight and feel consistently sluggish/lethargic and that since he has cut the wheat out he has been feeling a lot better and has slimmed down considerably, so if he was performing as well as he was in the first half of the season in particular in spite of those issues, it makes you wonder how well he could do now that he's feeling better and isn't carrying as much unwanted weight.

If he wants to he can bulk back up again with pure muscle, but I'd suggest we won't want him to, as he will now be able to build up his tank more and become more explosive and likely get to a lot more contests, so that could all push him even further ahead of Cripps than he was this year.

Reason I see them even is because both got All Australians at their u18 championships. Blues midfield but deeper probs why didn't see great deal of game time but say Cripps was drafted to Saints may of played maybe 10 games
 

Jezzarayman

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or freo. that josh simpson selection set them a year back, which forced them to take a tall the year after

Freo bloody hell. What a joke. Should have taken Paparone, Shaw or grundy instead of Simpson in 12 and Acres or Dunstan over Apeness.
Must admit have been terribly unlucky with Morabito, super talent and would have been very handy in 2013 GF if was fully up and running.
 

gillo94

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i wouldnt take cripps. i really didnt get the hype surrounding him. was obviously a wiley call, i think looking back they'll accept they put too much trust in his call. was obviously biased given he coached him

I think both Cripps and Dunstan will get more responsibility and game time in 2015, both highly rated by their clubs and would make sense and both having another pre season and will be 1 year developed in senior football
 

Jezzarayman

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Where do you rank following players?

Cripps, Dunstan, Aish, Lewis Taylor

I think its better to wait a few years before ranking draftees. If I was drafting for St Kilda based on juniors and 1st year Afl form. I'd take
Aish > Dunstan > Taylor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raph Clarke > > Cripps
 

Jezzarayman

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The other thing that needs to be taken into account is that it was found mid way through the season that Dunstan had a wheat intolerance, that was causing him to put on unwanted weight and feel consistently sluggish/lethargic and that since he has cut the wheat out he has been feeling a lot better and has slimmed down considerably, so if he was performing as well as he was in the first half of the season in particular in spite of those issues, it makes you wonder how well he could do now that he's feeling better and isn't carrying as much unwanted weight.

If he wants to he can bulk back up again with pure muscle, but I'd suggest we won't want him to, as he will now be able to build up his tank more and become more explosive and likely get to a lot more contests, so that could all push him even further ahead of Cripps than he was this year.

aussierulesrules are we drafting Kate Upton? surely best available?
 

gillo94

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I think its better to wait a few years before ranking draftees. If I was drafting for St Kilda based on juniors and 1st year Afl form. I'd take
Aish > Dunstan > Taylor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raph Clarke > > Cripps

Why did Blues recruit Cripps ahead of Dunstan? Think more long term development decision?
 
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Honestly I really rate Dunstan, cannot believe a player of his calibre slipped so low, his kind of player you build a team around, future captain

I think ATM Cripps not far off Dunstan terms of development but Dunstan ahead
I don't want to be rude, I understand being a Carlton supporter you've got high hopes for cripps but you're out of your mind if you think he's not far off Dunstan at the moment.
At the moment he's miles off.
First year stats mate:

Dunstan Cripps

2014 Season 2014
16 Games 3
8.9 Kicks 3.3
9.8 Handballs 5.7
18.8 Disposals 9.0
3.7 Marks 1.7
0.6 Goals 0
0.4 Behinds 0.3
3.8 Tackles 3.0
0.1 Hitouts 0
2.2 Inside 50s 1.0
0.3 Goal Assists 0
0.9 Frees For 0.7
0.9 Frees Ag. 1.0
7.6 Cont. Poss. 4.3
11.4 Unc. Poss. 5.0
12.9 Eff. Disposals 5.0
68.6% Eff. Disp. % 55.6%
2.5 Clangers 1.3
0.1 Cont. Marks 0
0.4 Marks I50 0
3.0 Clearances 0.3
1.2 Rebound 50s 0.7
0.8 1%s 2.0
0.7 Bounces 1.3
68.7 TOG % 51.7
 

Jezzarayman

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Why did Blues recruit Cripps ahead of Dunstan? Think more long term development decision?

Probably the same reason that you traded pick 7 for KJ and 19 because your recruitment team is well a bit questionable. I wouldn't give up on Cripps, his clearance work and hands will develop very nicely and as he improves as an athlete could become a very handy player, I see his style as very Michael Barlow / Jobe Watson esque. Menzel is a potential star if his knees hold up. Kane lucas a deadset waste of a pick. Carlton need to Acknowledge that a long rebuild is required, I think the powers that be have too much ego and "Power Club" mentality to accept that. Dark Blue times ahead.
 

gillo94

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I don't want to be rude, I understand being a Carlton supporter you've got high hopes for cripps but you're out of your mind if you think he's not far off Dunstan at the moment.
At the moment he's miles off.
First year stats mate:

Dunstan Cripps

2014 Season 2014
16 Games 3
8.9 Kicks 3.3
9.8 Handballs 5.7
18.8 Disposals 9.0
3.7 Marks 1.7
0.6 Goals 0
0.4 Behinds 0.3
3.8 Tackles 3.0
0.1 Hitouts 0
2.2 Inside 50s 1.0
0.3 Goal Assists 0
0.9 Frees For 0.7
0.9 Frees Ag. 1.0
7.6 Cont. Poss. 4.3
11.4 Unc. Poss. 5.0
12.9 Eff. Disposals 5.0
68.6% Eff. Disp. % 55.6%
2.5 Clangers 1.3
0.1 Cont. Marks 0
0.4 Marks I50 0
3.0 Clearances 0.3
1.2 Rebound 50s 0.7
0.8 1%s 2.0
0.7 Bounces 1.3
68.7 TOG % 51.7

What areas do you think Dunstan and Cripps need to improve to get to the next level
 

gillo94

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Probably the same reason that you traded pick 7 for KJ and 19 because your recruitment team is well a bit questionable. I wouldn't give up on Cripps, his clearance work and hands will develop very nicely and as he improves as an athlete could become a very handy player, I see his style as very Michael Barlow / Jobe Watson esque. Menzel is a potential star if his knees hold up. Kane lucas a deadset waste of a pick. Carlton need to Acknowledge that a long rebuild is required, I think the powers that be have too much ego and "Power Club" mentality to accept that. Dark Blue times ahead.

Where do you see Blues finishing in 2015 keep in mind the draw is favourable
 
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