Do Collingwood need to enter a rebuild phase?

[Fadge]

I will enjoy the weekly pile on while we win ugly every week, but we win and thats all that matters. When we finish up there again it will be very sweet

I can't recall the last team to win as many games as Collingwood win through sheer luck.

Whether it's umpiring, bad kicking from the opposition, or injuries to the opposition - Collingwood win so many games they really don't deserve to win...

 

[doppleganger]

Plenty of time for the young man to build on his strength and Tank. Think we've found our future ruck!

Yep, just like back in 2020-21 with D.Cameron.

Got him for nothing, wait until he is 24 and physically able to play ruck and then let him go.

Steene picked up for nothing, let him develop when 20-21, and when physically ready to play expose him.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Going by last nights game, still no indication of the cliff coming, purely on the back of the well drilled system game.

Dunno what happened from the Ade game to last night, but suddenly our not so good forwards look like forwards. Certainly a change from possession slow temp game in the previous match to run and carry to efficient i50 entries, and tempo'd the game when the Giants gained momentum.

Certainly looks like a development / management year vs all chips in last year. Though I doubt Fly will admit as much

Hard to tell how this team stacks up for this year, played a severely depleted Giants with key backs out and still only managed 13 goals, admittedly only conceding 54 pts. Probs helped with Giants poor kicking at goal.

Before the season started I didn't know where to put em, contend for a flag this year? Not likely, planets would have to align, play system at optimum. etc.

Bottom 4? Possibly, would have to be a mare season for that.

Given the final 10 now, I think they'll make that but little to zero impact in finals.

So how will the player development go, with a view to next year and beyond? Wait and see, the youth doesn't look much yet but hard to tell, I watched large parts of the vlf game yesterday and there's promising signs and not so promising signs.

West looked good early, and Steene looked comfortable at the level last night.

 

[Mynamesinuse]

Going by last nights game, still no indication of the cliff coming, purely on the back of the well drilled system game.

Dunno what happened from the Ade game to last night, but suddenly our not so good forwards look like forwards. Certainly a change from possession slow temp game in the previous match to run and carry to efficient i50 entries, and tempo'd the game when the Giants gained momentum.

Certainly looks like a development / management year vs all chips in last year. Though I doubt Fly will admit as much

Hard to tell how this team stacks up for this year, played a severely depleted Giants with key backs out and still only managed 13 goals, admittedly only conceding 54 pts. Probs helped with Giants poor kicking at goal.

Before the season started I didn't know where to put em, contend for a flag this year? Not likely, planets would have to align, play system at optimum. etc.

Bottom 4? Possibly, would have to be a mare season for that.

Given the final 10 now, I think they'll make that but little to zero impact in finals.

So how will the player development go, with a view to next year and beyond? Wait and see, the youth doesn't look much yet but hard to tell, I watched large parts of the vlf game yesterday and there's promising signs and not so promising signs.

West looked good early, and Steene looked comfortable at the level last night.

So based on the game of Collingwood at full strength and GWS missing 8 you have made that conclusion

 

[Carringbush2010]

So based on the game of Collingwood at full strength and GWS missing 8 you have made that conclusion

Yes

 

[Mynamesinuse]

Yes

Odd.

 

[txbyhull]

pretty shocking second half from my RIC v FREO players. Need a lift from a few here.

I8/1346 +140 VC at HT

 

[txbyhull]

pretty shocking second half from my RIC v FREO players. Need a lift from a few here.

I8/1346 +140 VC at HT

How the **** do I keep doing this

 

[Mr Meow]

Going by last nights game, still no indication of the cliff coming, purely on the back of the well drilled system game.

Dunno what happened from the Ade game to last night, but suddenly our not so good forwards look like forwards. Certainly a change from possession slow temp game in the previous match to run and carry to efficient i50 entries, and tempo'd the game when the Giants gained momentum.

Certainly looks like a development / management year vs all chips in last year. Though I doubt Fly will admit as much

Hard to tell how this team stacks up for this year, played a severely depleted Giants with key backs out and still only managed 13 goals, admittedly only conceding 54 pts. Probs helped with Giants poor kicking at goal.

Before the season started I didn't know where to put em, contend for a flag this year? Not likely, planets would have to align, play system at optimum. etc.

Bottom 4? Possibly, would have to be a mare season for that.

Given the final 10 now, I think they'll make that but little to zero impact in finals.

So how will the player development go, with a view to next year and beyond? Wait and see, the youth doesn't look much yet but hard to tell, I watched large parts of the vlf game yesterday and there's promising signs and not so promising signs.

West looked good early, and Steene looked comfortable at the level last night.

Collingwood still have a superb set of defenders, arguably the strongest assortment of veterans any side has had in the AFL era (so much smarts and polished skills) and the Daicos brothers. There is no way they are going to plummet with all of those elements in place.

Also, look at how many sides are genuinely terrible. There's at least half a dozen. It is almost impossible for a well run, well coached side full of veteran pros to sink too low. A bad season with everything going wrong probably means finishing 11th or 12th.

The medium to long term question is how they manage things when the really high class veterans retire, especially if it happens in a cluster. You'd think it will, but maybe not if everyone plays until 40 years old like Pendlebury.

 

[Carringbush2010]

Collingwood still have a superb set of defenders, arguably the strongest assortment of veterans any side has had in the AFL era (so much smarts and polished skills) and the Daicos brothers. There is no way they are going to plummet with all of those elements in place.

Also, look at how many sides are genuinely terrible. There's at least half a dozen. It is almost impossible for a well run, well coached side full of veteran pros to sink too low. A bad season with everything going wrong probably means finishing 11th or 12th.

The medium to long term question is how they manage things when the really high class veterans retire, especially if it happens in a cluster. You'd think it will, but maybe not if everyone plays until 40 years old like Pendlebury.

Like I said, to go bottom 4 would have to be a mare season.

As for the bolded, well, increasingly good older A and B graders are still having impact on the competition. Guys like Sides last night for example, maybe add Crisp, such is his endurance.

It's likely though that guys like Billy and Moore don't make it to late 30s like Pendles has, wait and see. Certainly a major gamble.

To be honest I don't have this team as a top 8 team, let alone top 4 and contending. System has carried us this far, as good as it's been I don't think there's another flag in it.

A finals win? Borderline.

 

[Mr Meow]

Like I said, to go bottom 4 would have to be a mare season.

As for the bolded, well, increasingly good older A and B graders are still having impact on the competition. Guys like Sides last night for example, maybe add Crisp, such is his endurance.

It's likely though that guys like Billy and Moore don't make it to late 30s like Pendles has, wait and see. Certainly a major gamble.

To be honest I don't have this team as a top 8 team, let alone top 4 and contending. System has carried us this far, as good as it's been I don't think there's another flag in it.

A finals win? Borderline.

I had Collingwood around 6th-8th before the season started and system + pro veterans in place mean you'd be a bit naive to predict a plummet this year. Pretty much all of the lower teams have poor defences, poor coaches or a less than stellar veteran cohort - sometimes all 3. Collingwood have none of those issues.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I had Collingwood around 6th-8th before the season started and system + pro veterans in place mean you'd be a bit naive to predict a plummet this year. Pretty much all of the lower teams have poor defences, poor coaches or a less than stellar veteran cohort - sometimes all 3. Collingwood have none of those issues.

Ok, gonna have to rebutt here.

Coaching panel - tick
Pro veterans - tick, but for how long?
System - tick, but with a caveat.

That being that the same system that brought them a flag, the rest of the comp has figured out and applied their own versions of (in part a reason we're seeing ball speed football this year ala Pies 22, 23 and for large parts of last year) AND being able to nullify what was once a nigh on impossible to defeat system, even as early as last year.

Given how close the comp is (above the bottom4), I'll give you a mulligan on the 6-8, but I'll agree to disagree and think we're more likely a 8-10 team.

 

[Pleasedontfail11]

So based on the game of Collingwood at full strength and GWS missing 8 you have made that conclusion

Collingwood were down 1.5 players on the field for over a half of footy and by the end easily accounted for GWS, who didnt lose any players. Thoughout the year many teams will be down 6-10 players due to injury, GWS were unlucky with the injuries they had, but its not unusual. GWS has a deep list, and with a bit more luck with injuries, they will challenge any team.
Collingwood so far don't look like world beaters, but they should be a finals team again this year. I'm sorry if this doesn't fit your narrative.
How about Oscar Steene? Was rated as the 4th best debutante for Collingwood ever.

 

[Former Decathlete]

 

[txbyhull]

Surprised its only 30 near the end of the third. Pies been shocking for the most part without Nick.

 

[Mr Meow]

Surprised its only 30 near the end of the third. Pies been shocking for the most part without Nick.

Brisbane have been very wasteful. Should be 10+ goals ahead.

Pies have decent skills, but look pretty slow.

 

[Daka]

 

[txbyhull]

Look like they've genuinely just given up at the end here

 

[Former Decathlete]

Look like they've genuinely just given up at the end here

Full blown drubbing.

Lions off a 5 day break away game.

 

[Daka]

Surely, this is Pendlebury & Sidebottom's last season... I know Pendles wasn't out there but is starting to get more injuries.

I thought Steele was gone a couple of years ago, he has a good game every now and than but think he is done now.

 

[Mynamesinuse]

How’d there three young blokes go?

 

[Mynamesinuse]

Talked their young kids up pres season now not so much.

 

[JZTIME!]

Quiet in here? Expect a big response from them if ND and Pendles play. Take those 2 superstars out and the rest are mere mortals

 

[timokane]

2026 and wins the flag in 2028 basic

 

[Cyclops]

Im sticking with the "just wait to the pointy end (not saying which year)" excuse for now, this time last year we were unbackable and wise heads were nodding over Brisbane's fall.

One specific issue I see is the Mihocek role. His part in Elliots fantastic year in 25 got him some recognition finally, but he flew under the radar with his off the ball stuff for years and years. "Handy" theyd say, like he was a sneaky half forward.

We only let him go because the body really is on the brink, but haven't found the roving battering ram/blocker to replace him.

The problem with our shallow entries this year is in part his absence. McStay has done the double role of chf and perpetual motion forward and has picked up scoring slack, but he cant do it all and its harder for Elliot and skunk and Shulz to get the isolations they feed off so well without the smirkng plough clearing channels.

Hoping Mcstay and Buller present as the main act and say West or one of the other youngsters can slot in to run furrows through enemy defences.

A repurposed defender might be handy, they read defences from inside well, so if we could spare Howe thats an option too, although the body isn't up to repeat ramming.