Do we have the Cattle?

Turbocat

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And today the bandwagons have started to roll, Geelong are one dimensional, Geelong have no game breakers , Geelong lack A grade players , Geelong are slow , Geelong over achieved last year , Geelong lack a quality forward , Geelong should trade Bartel for Whitnall , Geelong are not proffesional ,Gelong will never go anywhere without FF that cant mark overhead, Geelong have a captain that cant jump , a back line that’s disintegrating a non existent forwardline, a slow uninspiring midfield, Geelong have got big problems.

Now a fair percentage of this is just the usually public/media over reaction to the current realm of results. The media are fantastic on reporting the bleeding obvious, some “supporters” have no tolerance for this current climate of having a bees Richard between a top 4 side and a bottom 4 side but I ask one question, are they right? Watching us get beaten by the Dogs , by the Saints , watching the players that they got for basically being crap sides , namely priority picks, go on and flog us, I have to wonder do we have the cattle? Fully fit, every one firing in ours and every other club Id say we are short of 2 match winners to be a top 4 side. A Cooney/Ball type, quick quality mid and Kosinski / Riewoldt / Brown type , that being a match winning forward.

I have been tailing the Cats for far to long, through far to many years to be satisfied with another group of player that ultimately were just short of the best. Already the new Dogs are starting to show at least as much much promise as us,WC have dominated, Saints just have too much quality, even Freo have what I consider the best player I’ve seen this year and what do they have in common? Sants, Dogs, Wcoast , Fremantle, they are all recipients of early picks and we haven’t had a pick inside 7 for 15 years.
Am I being too Jack like , too negative, I really hope so cause the alternative is repulsive. More mediocrity, more middle ground ,ohh gawd I think I feel sick
 

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della

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#3
Nothing wrong with the coach, thats like saying is Lee matthews are worse coach this year cause his team might miss the finals, just look at out forward structure in particular and how r u ever going to win a flag with that setup
 

ablett factor

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#4
we probably lack a star, IMO that will be ablett but hes not quite there yet. the other worry is a gamebreaking forward, although i havent given up on playfair yet and if everything goes to plan nathan ablett will fill that role and also a really quick midfielder. wojcinsky was a big loss for us as he played this role and even though he is copping a fair amount of criticism at the moment i think in the next few years tenace can be this sort of player.
 

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#5
With a full team in we can beat any team in the competition! Look at what happened to alot of the other teams this year with injuries, Brisbane, St Kilda, Port etc. They all looked shaky when their lists were depleted. Its just that our injury list has probably been the worst in the league and its happening at the wrong time of year. Also I think our list is the second youngest in the competition (can anyone confirm this?) so when you consider where we are developmentally I think we are still going along alright. Also, if the team can see a sports psychologist to get them over the collective goal kicking 'yips' that has plagued us for this season and last, we'd be winning nearly every week!

The lack of a gamebreaker causes me a concern sometimes, but at the end of the day I think we have got quite a few players that can blow a game apart.

I'm still keeping the faith!
 
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#6
Turbocat said:
Am I being too Jack like , too negative, I really hope so cause the alternative is repulsive. More mediocrity, more middle ground ,ohh gawd I think I feel sick
It's good to see I can still get a mention. You say I am negative all the time, lets just sum up what I am about. I do not rate Henry Playfair or Jared Rooke at all. Is this a crime. There are a lot of supporters out there that bag a lot more players than I do. I believe that the posters on this board overate our players on a regular basis. There have been posts on this board that Chris Tarrant or Brendan Fevola are not required at Geelong and are no better than any of our forwards. The cats best forward is Kent Kingsley. He is the worst best forward in the competition, if you know what I mean. When we win we all think we have a great list, but under close scrutiny it might only be average. I think we are similar to the pies of a couple of years ago in that we finished higher than we probably should have last year and its not a clear indication of where we stand overall. The comments made by Bomber last year after the Moloney-Ottens trade worry me. He said the club would never trade their 1st draft pick again or a recognised player as it was to hard on everybody. Well welcome to the industry. I understand under the draft and salary cap rules its very hard to have stars in every position on the ground, but we are difficient in a lot of areas. We require some key defenders to help Scarlett. Harley in a perfect world would be a half back flanker and Egan or Spencer are no certenties to make the grade. Our on ballers lack pace and kicking skills. When was the last time one of our midfielders gets the ball in the centre has a couple of bouncers and kicks a goal from outside 50??? We have the worst set of key forwards in the competition and whether you like it or not, we CAN NOT win anything with Playfair Haynes Gardiner or probably Lonergan as key forwards. In the ruck I believe is where Ottens should play with King assisting so I think we are covered in that area. Overall I think there are 10 players on the list that the jury is still out on and about 6 that just won't make it. With another year of no top 10 draft pick its hard to see that elusive a grade player entering our system this year. The only way for the cats to head is to trade into the top 10 or even better the top 5 of the draft and start a mini re build.
 

Partridge

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#7
ablett factor said:
we probably lack a star, IMO that will be ablett but hes not quite there yet. the other worry is a gamebreaking forward, although i havent given up on playfair yet and if everything goes to plan nathan ablett will fill that role and also a really quick midfielder. wojcinsky was a big loss for us as he played this role and even though he is copping a fair amount of criticism at the moment i think in the next few years tenace can be this sort of player.
As far as quick gamebusting midfielders there are 2 guys in our current side that were drafted for that purpose - Kelly and Tenace. Both have all the skills, simple fact is neither have proved themselves yet. Might sound harsh but Kelly is in his 4th season and should be performing at the top level now. Tenace a little bit more leeway as it's only his 2nd season but both should be doing a lot more.
 

Turbocat

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Partridge said:
As far as quick gamebusting midfielders there are 2 guys in our current side that were drafted for that purpose - Kelly and Tenace. Both have all the skills, simple fact is neither have proved themselves yet. Might sound harsh but Kelly is in his 4th season and should be performing at the top level now. Tenace a little bit more leeway as it's only his 2nd season but both should be doing a lot more.
I dont think Kelly has ever been blistering but I think has lost speed , post the leg.
 

Turbocat

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Jack-Packenham said:
It's good to see I can still get a mention. You say I am negative all the time, lets just sum up what I am about. I do not rate Henry Playfair or Jared Rooke at all. Is this a crime. There are a lot of supporters out there that bag a lot more players than I do. I believe that the posters on this board overate our players on a regular basis. There have been posts on this board that Chris Tarrant or Brendan Fevola are not required at Geelong and are no better than any of our forwards. The cats best forward is Kent Kingsley. He is the worst best forward in the competition, if you know what I mean. When we win we all think we have a great list, but under close scrutiny it might only be average. I think we are similar to the pies of a couple of years ago in that we finished higher than we probably should have last year and its not a clear indication of where we stand overall. The comments made by Bomber last year after the Moloney-Ottens trade worry me. He said the club would never trade their 1st draft pick again or a recognised player as it was to hard on everybody. Well welcome to the industry. I understand under the draft and salary cap rules its very hard to have stars in every position on the ground, but we are difficient in a lot of areas. We require some key defenders to help Scarlett. Harley in a perfect world would be a half back flanker and Egan or Spencer are no certenties to make the grade. Our on ballers lack pace and kicking skills. When was the last time one of our midfielders gets the ball in the centre has a couple of bouncers and kicks a goal from outside 50??? We have the worst set of key forwards in the competition and whether you like it or not, we CAN NOT win anything with Playfair Haynes Gardiner or probably Lonergan as key forwards. In the ruck I believe is where Ottens should play with King assisting so I think we are covered in that area. Overall I think there are 10 players on the list that the jury is still out on and about 6 that just won't make it. With another year of no top 10 draft pick its hard to see that elusive a grade player entering our system this year. The only way for the cats to head is to trade into the top 10 or even better the top 5 of the draft and start a mini re build.
You , negative Jack?.
Did we over achieve last year? In a way thats my question , the comp is so even its usually fittest teams that finish the highest.So any year one of 10-12 side can finish top 4 but Id say if you matched our list against those other lists we gennerally are a better list than you give us credit for but we lack that star game breaking player, that usually comes from the first 5 players in the draft.Can we trade to get one, almost impossible id say.The value that all clubs place on these pick is so high it would have to be considered a poor draft to pull it off. Carlton after missing on Goddard and Wells wont trade, Hawthorn rebuilding wont trade, which means only Ess and Coll and both would also like to replace ageing champs with new ones.
 

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#13
I would swap our list for St Kilda, Fremantle, West Coast, Brisbane and Port Adelaide. Bulldogs are line ball with us. In the same boat.
 

Turbocat

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Jack-Packenham said:
I would swap our list for St Kilda, Fremantle, West Coast, Brisbane and Port Adelaide. Bulldogs are line ball with us. In the same boat.
When do you ascess and compare, its not just year to year, but month to month. Swaping lists, Id struggle with the concept but give two players from any other side in this group and my mouth starts to water. Pavlich and Cooney would do me just fine but a Riewoldt and Griffen/ JBrown and Ball/ Kosinski and Judd would be fine choices. Put any of these pairs in our colours and all the other players would be better for it.

The other point is if we did got to the well again, make a hell of a deal for a top 5 pick,(Id hate to think who it would cost us) , there is still no iron clad , money back guarantee that we get the player we are after. You might get a player who becomes a solid performer, who while is not a dud is not a champion. Goddard and Walker types.
 

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#15
Jack-Packenham said:
I would swap our list for St Kilda, Fremantle, West Coast, Brisbane and Port Adelaide. Bulldogs are line ball with us. In the same boat.

Can we do a trade...Jack for any football fan willing to learn the game. 3rd round pick is about all we can hope for
 

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#16
Cattle: YES
Heart: NO

Whether we can find that passion & hard at the football team instinct we had last year is beyond me. One can only hope!
 
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worthogs said:
Can we do a trade...Jack for any football fan willing to learn the game. 3rd round pick is about all we can hope for

If you disagree, argue the point, don't be a juvenile and start sniping when you can't put together a detailed arguement that consists of 3 sentences or more. What is wrong with my comments, I would love to hear your view for a change instead of these childish comebacks that just prove how intelligent you are.
 
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#18
bartel 4 tarrant???
it would pain me to see this happen but our forward lines has been the problem since 1997, 8 years ago now. we need a power forward desperatly. brad ottens is a ruckman and a very lazy forward who falls over far to much. tarrant gives us marking we desperatly need
 

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#19
I think you have a great list, but a lot of that is based on potential. Last year I don't think Geelong overachieved, because the defense was in rock solid and the midfield was even with an OK forwardline.
This year has been a bit different. Geelong do have the players, but lets remember this team is still 2-3 years off peaking.
 

Turbocat

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davey_magik said:
I think you have a great list, but a lot of that is based on potential. Last year I don't think Geelong overachieved, because the defense was in rock solid and the midfield was even with an OK forwardline.
This year has been a bit different. Geelong do have the players, but lets remember this team is still 2-3 years off peaking.
Thanks for the thoughts DM, (hope your not just trying to soften us up for this week).
 

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#21
Jack-Packenham said:
If you disagree, argue the point, don't be a juvenile and start sniping when you can't put together a detailed arguement that consists of 3 sentences or more. What is wrong with my comments, I would love to hear your view for a change instead of these childish comebacks that just prove how intelligent you are.
You want comment, well try this.

Defenders, at full strength it is the best in the comp by a mile. Harley has played about 10mins all year, Mooney can fill a sweeper 3rd tall option and Monica is a bigger loss than most care to imagine.

I agree that Rahily is a dud and should not get a game and if we had more than 12 fit players would not get a game. Egan, Spencer etc are all green, and could possibly be Ok if they had the full back line in teaching them how to play in a quality unit.

The on ballers are far better than you give them credit for. They were not disgraced against the Saints or even Essendon. Corey is Quality, Bartel and Kelly are creative, Ling can waste disposals at times but runs all day, Pace is Burns and Tenace although both need to improve their overall game, but both are good running players, Wojcinski, will add a lot of run from next year.

Kingsley “the worst Best forward” is still 8th on the goal-kicking ladder, which must mean there are a few worse full forwards going around. He should not be our main target but has done a good job considering he has not had a lot of help form the players around him or poor delivery into the forward 50.

I think Playfair CAN PLAY, so we will always differ on that one. He can lead up the ground and on more than on occasion this year has presented a target. Our small forwards are amongst the best in the comp, but our mid sized ones are causing us problems.

Most people, you included quickly bag the Cats and since the break this year we have fallen over, some form but a lot injury. Those players that are getting back take time to run into form and the biggest problem is that we don’t have experienced depth to cover.

If you dont think we are good enough for You go join the Doggies bandwagon, they need the membership and we wont miss you!
 
F

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#22
I honestly don't know if we have what it takes to win a premiership with the current group, however i will say that there isn't a club in the league who could survive the wretched run with injuries we've had and emerge with a premiership.

It goes deeper than just the injury lists you see every week, it goes right back to the pre-season setbacks numerous key players had.

Even if we had a good run with injuries it was still going to be difficult to win a premiership in 2005 given how many players went into the season grossly underdone.

To win a premiership you need everything to go right.

BTW To clarify, i never once thought we'd win a premiership in 2005. I did think we'd finish top 4 with a good injury run, but thought a premiership was unrealistic given the issues we had from day one.
 

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#23
There is no substitue for quality and unfortunately we havent had access to the quality picks we probably need. Our two highest picks of recent times in Mackie and Tenace are still young, so fingers tocuhed they can blossom and go some way to rectifying the problem.
 
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#24
i think we do have the cattle and it is only a matter time before we become consistently good. Commentators say we need to address pace i dont think so with monica, byrnes, tenace and gazza we got heaps of it. I think guys like Egan and Blake are gonna be players for the future as is Tim Callan who if given the opportunity will hopefully replace sando. We really need a natural forward to structure around hopefully nathan ablett canfill that role in the future along with someone who we could develop or trade for. A fit and healthy Geelong side is as good as any the comp.
 

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#25
Again.. I think that no other team can or could withstand the injuries that we have had this year (just to reiterate Phat's comments). Our forward line is a little shaky, but I figured we'd do okay just through sheer weight of forward entries (and for a great deal of the season this was the case!). Admittedly we have dropped a couple of games that we should have won, but I still see this a a sign of a young team. I think we have what it takes to win the premiership if we have a better run with injuries. Its all about having the players on the park at the right time of year!

I'm gonna hang tough! We are still a young side and I think we can do it!

Cheers!
Sean.
 
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