Review Dogs belt the filty Plastics 125 to 105

Remove this Banner Ad

Sep 22, 2008
25,502
34,595
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Had to roll my eyes at Bev in the post game presser, defending last week's forward structure by saying the issue wasn't the lack of talls but our ball use going inside 50. Obviously better ball use is going to improve you no matter who you have up forward and how tall they are, but it was blindingly obvious that last night was a win for structure. JUH and Schache aren't particularly good but they played their role and it let Naughts and Cody do some damage.

I know that's just Bev not wanting to concede he got something wrong publicly, clearly they recognised the issue by their selecting of Marra and Schache. But my god do I hope it's something we stick with. Naughts in genuine 1 on 1s is almost impossible to stop.
100%, there’s a reason ball use is better going inside 50 in a better structured forward line and it’s because there’s more options than just Naughty which spreads the defence and allows better ball use going in. Having the 3 talls even allows the guys like Cody & West to get the opportunities they had last night.

You can see even last night Jamarra and Naughty still flew for the same ball a bit but this will improve with game time. We need to allow them to find chemistry - it’d honestly be an absolute nightmare for the whole team to go from playing 1 tall to 3 back to 1 and trying to adjust.

I’m happy to say as poor as our team has been at times this year if we’d played with the 3 tall structure all year we’d be right in the hunt for top 4 right now - but instead we’re playing catch up. That’s on the coaches 100%
 
Sep 22, 2008
25,502
34,595
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Liked what I saw from Schache and JUH. Worth persisting with. Helped Naughton / Weightman out by having additional targets.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Schache had an interesting role, seemed to be very very high and even up to defence at times. I liked it - that’s his best role for sure.

Jamarra was so close too - could have been paid 2 marks inside 50 he nearly held on to, and was burnt a couple of times too. It’ll come for him no doubt - I think his effort last night was there all night which is all we can ask at this stage. His talent is so obvious, love the way he moves in traffic and he is really creative and skilful with his passes, I’d like to see us get him up around the ball when he’s quite to get him in the game

Jamarra & Schache both use the ball brilliantly going inside 50 to the leading target which is a huge help for Naughty
 
May 30, 2016
9,404
13,954
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boston Bruins, Boston Celtics
100%, there’s a reason ball use is better going inside 50 in a better structured forward line and it’s because there’s more options than just Naughty which spreads the defence and allows better ball use going in. Having the 3 talls even allows the guys like Cody & West to get the opportunities they had last night.

You can see even last night Jamarra and Naughty still flew for the same ball a bit but this will improve with game time. We need to allow them to find chemistry - it’d honestly be an absolute nightmare for the whole team to go from playing 1 tall to 3 back to 1 and trying to adjust.

I’m happy to say as poor as our team has been at times this year if we’d played with the 3 tall structure all year we’d be right in the hunt for top 4 right now - but instead we’re playing catch up. That’s on the coaches 100%
Yep was as simple as jamarra and schache understanding basic forward craft and not getting in their teammates' space.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

Libbaaaa

Premiership Player
Jun 1, 2021
3,644
7,912
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Bevo is such a stubborn bastard, has helped make him the successful coach he is but it would be a nightmare trying to question him.
 

Charlie Bucket

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 16, 2015
5,407
8,839
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
And Naughts had a night out because the oppo defenders couldn't sag off and triple team him all the time. Go figure 🤔

They couldn’t sag off because their defensive unit as a whole is a rabble.

Playing a defensive set up to allow certain defenders to peel off and assist in the air is one thing. Being able to execute it effectively is another. Geelong play that way very well and the game two weeks ago was no different.

We had some very effective fwds last night, but we can contribute a large part though to GWS’ defensive woes. They are horrific. It actually took some of the focus off ours, which was also horrific, just slightly less.

Our fwds capitalised on GWS’ poor performance. Which is what we should expect considering the talent Naughts and Weightman have.

GWS’s mids also lack defensive workrate, hence our smaller fwd half players were able to impact throughout the whole of the first half. They were pretty much the only reason we weren’t down by 5 goals at half time.
 

Charlie Bucket

Norm Smith Medallist
Nov 16, 2015
5,407
8,839
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
As a whole, i thought we were poor last night. Our mids took more than a half to get on top, even with GWS offering little resistance. Our defence was horrid.

We played a hell of a lot better two weeks prior albeit for a non existent first 35min.

We’re a mile off finals if we don’t improve our output across more than a few quarters. And considering it’s been an issue all season, we’ve got a lot of improvement to make up.
 
Oct 4, 2004
5,410
8,759
Essendon
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
MAN U/BROOKLYN NETS
Had to roll my eyes at Bev in the post game presser, defending last week's forward structure by saying the issue wasn't the lack of talls but our ball use going inside 50. Obviously better ball use is going to improve you no matter who you have up forward and how tall they are, but it was blindingly obvious that last night was a win for structure. JUH and Schache aren't particularly good but they played their role and it let Naughts and Cody do some damage.

I know that's just Bev not wanting to concede he got something wrong publicly, clearly they recognised the issue by their selecting of Marra and Schache. But my god do I hope it's something we stick with. Naughts in genuine 1 on 1s is almost impossible to stop.

I felt Bev made a detour to make sure he mentioned ball use as opposed to structure.

It just seemed on paper that our structure was more of an AFL side and that translated to on field.
 

hatescaptcha

Premiership Player
Aug 15, 2009
3,269
5,208
Truganina
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Defence horrid alright, we don’t have too many lockdown defenders these days like a Maynard at the pies. Just seems so easy to score against us these days.
Pretty average win but better than a loss.

Hoping Cleary becomes that lockdown defender that can also intercept.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 

Munnez

Premiership Player
Apr 2, 2018
3,389
3,834
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Yep was as simple as jamarra and schache understanding basic forward craft and not getting in their teammates' space.
Also that defenders couldn't just sag off as if they did but Shack & Marra can mark and finish so creates separation to allow 1 v 1 contests in which Naughts is very hard to stop
 

footscray1973

Premiership Player
May 17, 2004
4,998
9,431
Pepperland
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Footscray
Let's face it, we're winning in spite of our coaching. We clearly have the worst coach in the league, and by some margin. I bet he was outvoted at MC and didn't want to bring Schache or JUH in, but Spangher stuck to his guns. Give it 12 months, and clubs will be lining up to poach young Matt. Then Bevo has to start all over again.

I'd be throwing the kitchen sink at someone like Ash Hansen.
 
I know GWS had their injuries but Toby Greene basically played a career game and was dominant, and was probably responsible for at least eating into 20 points of the margin alone for him, abovr and beyond the all-australian level he plays on average.

There's not a heap better we could have done to defend that yet we still were the much better team. The main cause for concern I reckon we have was how good Preuss looked and how they were better from stoppages for the first half l. We made adjustments and English worked himself into the game against makeshift rucks from a clearance perspective but it wasn't a good start with accurate goalkicking providing a bit of cover. If Cody wasn't such an accurate kick, and we had scored 4.4 instead of 7.1 or whatever how people analysed the start of the game would have been a lot different here.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Dazb86

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 31, 2008
15,901
13,402
melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Hopefully Jamarra has a breakout game soon. He seems close at the moment. If he held onto a couple of those contested grabs a little longer he would have ended up with a few goals on the board. Was also burnt on a few occasions with players choosing the longer option and ignoring his lead. His kicking penetration could be a real weapon if he starts getting a little more easy ball at half forward. Good signs but obviously has a bit to work on before he's impacting games week in and week out.

McComb scared me last night as he was the last player in a few chains delivering the ball into the F50. He actually played pretty well outside of that horrendous set shot with a few well placed passes.

Schache played decently I thought. He is a good user when he gets his hands on it. I think he should stay in the side as that 2nd ruck/forward role for the rest of the year. At the very least he stretches the opposition away from Naughton.

West, Scott and McNeil were great IMO. Good to see some of the lesser lights impacting the game.

Naughton kicked straight 👌

Weightman kicked straight 👌

Our mids let us down a bit this game. Was really only that 3rd quarter when we got well on top. Macrae had a good game with some great tackling which stopped GWS in their tracks a few times. I'm a bit worried about Bonts year. Hasn't been anywhere.near his best. Treloar had a forgettable night and English had a mixed bag of a game. The stats say he was great but he was up and down most of the night.

Overall it was good to get a win. The defence still worries me going forward against decent sides. I don't think we have the manpower to stop sides when they get on top through the midfield.
 
Surely I’m not the only one who thinks our midfield performs better when they have a big bodied ruckmen in there? Timmy does a hell of a lot right, but geez he just doesn’t really have any influence in the guts does he. Surely we’d be better having someone whose sole focus revolves around stoppage work whilst letting Timmy be the unicorn that he is around the ground.

Schache was okay tonight, he was back he was forward he was through the midfield - he played fine. But Timmy would play that exact role 1000x better
Im starting to think you may be.

Given he is the only viable alternative. When we see Sweet dropping back into holes and taking contested marks, sharking his own tap work and driving the ball forward. Or doing much of anything at all other than making a negligible contribution to tap outs. Is the point when I'll get behind your campaign to bring in a big bodied ruckman.

Until then, I'd rather see our forward line function with 3 talls as efficiently as it did last night. The only tall we need to concern ourselves with is when it comes to slotting Bruce into the side over the coming weeks.

I just dont see any spinning of magnets where what Sweet brings outweighs anything we saw from English, Schache, JUH last night Let alone with imminent return of Bruce.

The interesting thing over the next couple of weeks is whether the mc have the testicular fortitude to add Bruce to the team that played last night. Or whether they drop one tall. One thing is almost certain, aside from an English injury, Sweet wont be at the forefront of their calculations.
 
Let's face it, we're winning in spite of our coaching. We clearly have the worst coach in the league, and by some margin. I bet he was outvoted at MC and didn't want to bring Schache or JUH in, but Spangher stuck to his guns. Give it 12 months, and clubs will be lining up to poach young Matt. Then Bevo has to start all over again.

I'd be throwing the kitchen sink at someone like Ash Hansen.
Spangher is just waiting on the Bigfooty kennel coup to take down Beveridge so he can take over the leash.
 
Sep 22, 2008
25,502
34,595
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Im starting to think you may be.

Given he is the only viable alternative. When we see Sweet dropping back into holes and taking contested marks, sharking his own tap work and driving the ball forward. Or doing much of anything at all other than making a negligible contribution to tap outs. Is the point when I'll get behind your campaign to bring in a big bodied ruckman.

Until then, I'd rather see our forward line function with 3 talls as efficiently as it did last night. The only tall we need to concern ourselves with is when it comes to slotting Bruce into the side over the coming weeks.

I just dont see any spinning of magnets where what Sweet brings outweighs anything we saw from English, Schache, JUH last night Let alone with imminent return of Bruce.

The interesting thing over the next couple of weeks is whether the mc have the testicular fortitude to add Bruce to the team that played last night. Or whether they drop one tall. One thing is almost certain, aside from an English injury, Sweet wont be at the forefront of their calculations.
I’m not going to get into it again so this is the last I’ll add and I know Sweet won’t play, as you said I hope we continue with the structure we got and it will be interesting to see how we go when Bruce comes back. Also my post wasn’t even necessarily in regards to Sweet but potential trade targets going forward - more than happy to upgrade Sweet with a better ruckman, but a number 1 stoppage/defensive type ruckmen - which our midfield would love considering how offensively we like to play in there.

But adding a ruckman doesn’t mean we lose all those things you’ve mentioned Timmy does, not even slightly. Timmy still does those things, possibly more often as he’s Matched up more regularly against the oppositions 2nd ruckmen. It also means you upgrade Schaches position by Timmy taking it and playing it much much better, and you improve our stoppage work for 100% of the game. Our midfield plays well to Sweet, it’s limited exposure but it’s enough to base an opinion on at this stage.

Timmy’s stats were really good last night, he obviously had some awesome moments, as he does every week, and his aggression and impact improved in the 2nd half. But I don’t think his overall impact last night was what I would expect from him especially after Preuss went off - and tbh could have been a bit of a worry if he didn’t. Don’t think that’s an unfair comment.

Anyway I’m done talking about rucks 😂 it is what it is, my opinion is known and I’m definitely not the only one who thinks it as you’ve mentioned, in fact I reckon more people here agree than disagree. But nothings going to change so is what it is.

Happy with this structure for the rest of the year
 

Freshwater

Premiership Player
Oct 30, 2014
4,123
8,070
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Let's face it, we're winning in spite of our coaching. We clearly have the worst coach in the league, and by some margin. I bet he was outvoted at MC and didn't want to bring Schache or JUH in, but Spangher stuck to his guns. Give it 12 months, and clubs will be lining up to poach young Matt. Then Bevo has to start all over again.

I'd be throwing the kitchen sink at someone like Ash Hansen.
If you’re really thinking this, we really do have a problem. This is where a footy manager and board level oversight must be clear in their reality of what is happening. Head coach must be a great manager of all the personal (players,coaches,staff) under his watch). His assistant coaches can have the game plan worked out, head coach doesn’t necessarily need to be the best at this but has to know when to park his ego and allow these coaches their rightful place. Fine line I know, is Bevo incapable of this now? What I saw last night is a team that will get destroyed by well drilled finals contenders in the next few months. Chris Grant and Luke Darcy are your eyes open?
 

Bald

Premium Gold
Apr 5, 2016
7,258
16,325
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boston Celtics
Let's face it, we're winning in spite of our coaching. We clearly have the worst coach in the league, and by some margin. I bet he was outvoted at MC and didn't want to bring Schache or JUH in, but Spangher stuck to his guns. Give it 12 months, and clubs will be lining up to poach young Matt. Then Bevo has to start all over again.

I'd be throwing the kitchen sink at someone like Ash Hansen.
Yeah look, I’m pretty sure if you lined all the coaches up, one that’s gotten a team to finals in all bar two seasons for two grand finals and one premiership isn’t going to be the worst coach by some distance.
 
Oct 19, 2012
13,806
17,876
Minas Morgul
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Jamarra is going to need a big game at the Hawks, I could see Bruce being selected against the Lions or the Swans so Jamarra has 1-2 games to make a statement. Schache offers the added versatility and can play big minutes/durable.

He had an almost game last night. Pretty unlucky 2-3 oppportunities didn't stick. I think he can make a big leap from year 2-3. Guns like jack riewoldt, kennedy, hawkins achieved very little in the first 2-3 years of there career.

Happy to play the 3 tall forwards and 1 ruck option against teams with medium to lower ruck divisions. Against teams like Freo/Melb/Stk I'm actually going with Sweet. I've seen English spanked too many time in the past 4 years to safely choose just the one ruck against these teams.
 
Sep 22, 2008
25,502
34,595
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Jamarra is going to need a big game at the Hawks, I could see Bruce being selected against the Lions or the Swans so Jamarra has 1-2 games to make a statement. Schache offers the added versatility and can play big minutes/durable.

He had an almost game last night. Pretty unlucky 2-3 oppportunities didn't stick. I think he can make a big leap from year 2-3. Guns like jack riewoldt, kennedy, hawkins achieved very little in the first 2-3 years of there career.

Happy to play the 3 tall forwards and 1 ruck option against teams with medium to lower ruck divisions. Against teams like Freo/Melb/Stk I'm actually going with Sweet. I've seen English spanked too many time in the past 4 years to safely choose just the one ruck against these teams.
Yeah this is probably the logical option - doesn’t change our structure week to week as English steps into Schaches role so we still play with the 3-1-3 set up every single week, just gives us extra ruck support against the teams we need it and gives us the extra flexibility with Schache against the teams where English will handle one out.

St Kilda, Melb, Freo, Carlton, Tigs probably the only teams we’d really be better off going two rucks against
 

Leon

Norm Smith Medallist
Jan 13, 2004
8,323
13,576
Bound for Germany 2006!
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Harry's Heroes
Also, as good as Greene is, anyone else notice that he’s very underrated at doing the Joel Selwood manoeuvre, the old shoulder drop to draw the high tackle?


There’s players in the league that cop it for doing that and rightly so - including some of ours - but old mate Toby is quite adept at it as well.
 

Foxman98

Norm Smith Medallist
May 25, 2018
5,152
7,185
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Yeah this is probably the logical option - doesn’t change our structure week to week as English steps into Schaches role so we still play with the 3-1-3 set up every single week, just gives us extra ruck support against the teams we need it and gives us the extra flexibility with Schache against the teams where English will handle one out.

St Kilda, Melb, Freo, Carlton, Tigs probably the only teams we’d really be better off going two rucks against
How do you still not get it. Sweet steps into Schache's role not English's role. Sweet is an awful forward which is where he'd be playing the majority of his time. English and Schache/Bruce is the best of what we currently have. If English is injured again Sweet will come back otherwise unless he finds something to add to his game other than average tap work he wont come in. We played them both against Melbounre last year and lost for a reason because Sweet is a liability around the ground
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Back