Review Dogs Run Out Of Legs And Lose To Collingwood - Rd 4 2019

WallyStringhaus

All Australian
Joined
Aug 27, 2015
Posts
675
Likes
2,527
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Absolutely. I think what frustrates people is that he can look like he's just about to rip a game up one week and then disappear the next couple of weeks. You just want him to crash a pack. Throw his body around.

If a player (any player) is struggling, hopefully they put their hand up and step away because if they don't, they just leave themselves open to criticism. That's not fair, but it just opens that door.
We took a chance on a young man with mental health issues so we need to be realistic enough to know that he will ALWAYS have ups and downs.

Anyone who has known or dealt with people who have serious mental health issues will tell you that their moods can fluctuate wildly not just on a day to day basis but on a moment to moment basis.

A person can feel like they have the sunshine on their shoulders, feeling fresh and relaxed and have it all come apart if the smallest thing doesn't go to plan. That's why it is not that easy for people to "put their hands up and step away" because things can and do go to **** pretty easy.

Look at Tom Boyd's first two years in our system. Really underwhelming in 2015, banished from the team halfway through 2016, a premiership hero just months later. I think Josh is ahead of where Tom was and he too may need some tough love to get there but he needs a lot of support and understanding as well.

I think he is in a great environment within a great club and surrounded by great people and I'm super optimistic that in time he will become a really good footballer who plays a key role in delivering us another flag.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

grassman75

Premium Platinum
Joined
Jun 16, 2008
Posts
4,053
Likes
5,084
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Sweet with less AFL experience is likely to also be towelled up in his first few games so it'll just be more of the same, with less impact around the ground. By the time Sweet makes the adjustment to the elite level it'll be beyond round 7 and, if the ruck problem is stopping us from winning, we may pick up a few more losses before then.
I was trying to be subtlety sarcastic...Sweet is a mile off
 

VogonProsthetnic

Premiership Player
Joined
Apr 26, 2010
Posts
3,615
Likes
3,905
Location
Beaufort
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
We desperately need classy finishers in our forward line- have a look at how Stephenson, Elliott and Thomas all finished off half chances. Smith fits the bill here and from the sound of it young Riley knows where the goals are. Fergus and Lynch are the other two who are quick and can finish.

Guys who keep butchering chances like Gowers and Dunkley should not be allowed in the forward line.
 

Bemoreboyddog

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Nov 4, 2014
Posts
7,443
Likes
8,224
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
I dunno? Maybe provide a better contest in the air? As opposed to guys like Wood and Crozier who have to jump with all their power every single time Collingwood kick it to him? Cordy is 192cm, Cox 211cm, that isn't a good matchup.
Lewis is 197cm and watch his contests from last week against Gold Coast. Wasn’t good. The only player that we could maybe try on Cox is Trengove.
 

Fossie 32

Premium Platinum
Joined
Oct 6, 2002
Posts
19,827
Likes
10,000
Location
1300GODOGS
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Melbourne..VICTORY, Leeds
If Collingwood play like that they don’t make finals

Honestly what the pies achieved last year has zero bearing and there is no way they should be even close to flag fav.

It was a very ordinary game between two mid table teams
Yay! We're mid table with a bullet :p So is that between 7th and 12th? :rainbow:
 
Joined
Apr 2, 2019
Posts
51
Likes
105
AFL Club
Collingwood
Sorry to intrude everyone, your Bulldogs scared us to pieces with that game, I was very impressed with your boys’ ability to dictate the game away from the pies for long stretches and completely shut down our ball movement out from full-back.

Also although your ruckmen were beaten your mids were much better at taking the advantage from the hit-outs, much to our consternation. Grundy had 59 hit-outs but only 17 to advantage, so your players were definitely helping the ruckmen out.

I hope the rematch in June will be just as intense and I would not like to come across the Dogs in September if they find a way to last the full four quarters.
 

dogwatch

Premium Platinum
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Posts
16,328
Likes
22,309
Location
Canberra
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Arsenal
The negativity on Hunter is astounding. He's playing fine. The stuff about his kicking is way over egged. And now they're onto his handballs.

Look guys. If you want to have a go. Pick out the proper targets. Schache has no form. Dickson is cooked. Gowers has no form. English is not still not up to it. Richards is out of form. Wood is struggling for some reason.

Hunter? He's going fine. In the best players every week. Except on the perverse favourites fan club site, Bulldogs Big Footy.
They all copped their whack - much more than Lachie did. I have no problem with people saying Hunter is lacking in some areas.

I still don't want him being the one who so often has to deliver the crucial kick inside 50. Do you?

Ask WallyStringhaus how Lachie goes for GAs and goals. Among the lowest in the league for players of his ilk.
 

Dogs Rule

Norm Smith Medallist
Joined
Sep 27, 2005
Posts
8,725
Likes
10,214
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Footscray
We took a chance on a young man with mental health issues so we need to be realistic enough to know that he will ALWAYS have ups and downs.

Anyone who has known or dealt with people who have serious mental health issues will tell you that their moods can fluctuate wildly not just on a day to day basis but on a moment to moment basis.

A person can feel like they have the sunshine on their shoulders, feeling fresh and relaxed and have it all come apart if the smallest thing doesn't go to plan. That's why it is not that easy for people to "put their hands up and step away" because things can and do go to **** pretty easy.

Look at Tom Boyd's first two years in our system. Really underwhelming in 2015, banished from the team halfway through 2016, a premiership hero just months later. I think Josh is ahead of where Tom was and he too may need some tough love to get there but he needs a lot of support and understanding as well.

I think he is in a great environment within a great club and surrounded by great people and I'm super optimistic that in time he will become a really good footballer who plays a key role in delivering us another flag.
Mate, I know what it's like to deal with a mental health issue (personal experience) and I know it's sometimes hard to put your hand up.

You just have to hope all our players feel comfortable enough to put their hands up and are getting the support they need, which I'm sure they are.

Schache can be a very good player, he just needs a push and might constantly need pushing for the rest of his career.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Dec 30, 2003
Posts
1,110
Likes
856
Location
Melbourne western region
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Bulldogs / Willy / Palace
We cant expect much when the opposition ruckman wins 88% of the hit outs. Richards has had a poor start to the season and needs VFL time. Need Trengove to assist English. 5 of their first 6 goals came from our poor skills. Add to all that our 5 day break and we did so well to get into a winning position. Love Wallis but he has cost us a goal a game so far this season.

Gowers is another needing VFL time. Another 4 points trashed but more disappointed the week before.
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

perro_loco

Club Legend
Joined
Apr 10, 2016
Posts
1,402
Likes
1,647
Location
Western Suburbs
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boca Juniors
So have i and without being callous that’s life unfortunately

We all go through it and using that as an excuse is weak in my opinion. Others use it as a reason to perform nit Shrink and regardless that’s no excuse for being soft

If u can’t have a crack for whatever reason don’t go out there but if u do then at least bloody try
people cope in different situations differently. i have seen big tough boys s##t their pants in situations where you would not expect them to. i don't think it is an excuse but simply the guy being honest and putting himself out there. it is the way humans operate. now that i am in the Philippines for work i see kids in the street earning a living that 99.5% of male adult Australians could not cope with in the same situation. would i criticise them, no. each situation needs to be addresses on its merits and circumstances.
 

perro_loco

Club Legend
Joined
Apr 10, 2016
Posts
1,402
Likes
1,647
Location
Western Suburbs
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boca Juniors
I've worked in my current job for 13 years and been a model employee for almost the entirety of my career. The time when I wasn't at my best? Last year when my father became extremely ill. The back and forth between Melbourne and the 16 hours it took to drive back home were a killer and affected my perfomance greatly.

Lucky for me I had an understanding boss who supported me through my darkest moments. Anyone who thinks that what happens in your personal life shouldnt impact your professional life is absolutely kidding themselves.

There are a myriad of reasons why people dont perform to the best of their abilities...I'm all for constructive criticism of the way players perform, however, calling them soft and pea hearted from the comfort of behind a keyboard is out of bounds for me.
"calling them pea hearted and soft" is being pea hearted and soft from behind a keyboard. well put WS.
 

Mattdougie

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Jun 29, 2013
Posts
13,569
Likes
11,223
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
"calling them pea hearted and soft" is being pea hearted and soft from behind a keyboard. well put WS.
You think ? So he isn’t soft?

You think his attack on the ball and contest is acceptable?

Perhaps I should use PC terms such as timid or careful? In the end no matter how you say it Schaches effort is soft and to blame something that happened 15 years ago is beyond pathetic
 

perro_loco

Club Legend
Joined
Apr 10, 2016
Posts
1,402
Likes
1,647
Location
Western Suburbs
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boca Juniors
You think ? So he isn’t soft?

You think his attack on the ball and contest is acceptable?

Perhaps I should use PC terms such as timid or careful? In the end no matter how you say it Schaches effort is soft and to blame something that happened 15 years ago is beyond pathetic
No need to use 'PC'. Just use correct and accurate language. otherwise you let yourself down in communicating your ideas. By using the language that you choose to use, you devalue your ideas and come across as someone who is aggressive, angry and arrogant. don't get me wrong MD you know alot about footy and I really enjoy reading your footy assessment when you do it thoughtfully. stick to using accurate language. I agree his efforts are not as strong as they should. On that matter I reckon Schache is used in the wrong position. You have said this yourself, pal. Go Dogs!!!
 

Mattdougie

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Jun 29, 2013
Posts
13,569
Likes
11,223
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
No need to use 'PC'. Just use correct and accurate language. otherwise you let yourself down in communicating your ideas. By using the language that you choose to use, you devalue your ideas and come across as someone who is aggressive, angry and arrogant. don't get me wrong MD you know alot about footy and I really enjoy reading your footy assessment when you do it thoughtfully. stick to using accurate language. I agree his efforts are not as strong as they should. On that matter I reckon Schache is used in the wrong position. You have said this yourself, pal. Go Dogs!!!
I did mate

He is soft to say anything else is incorrect. I won’t edit my words because someone thinks it unfair to label someone with a deserved moniker.

If he thinks he can’t get the ball he is making no moves and efforts to change that. I call a spade a spade and unfortunately his effort is nowhere near good enough and he shirks contests regularly. In my world that is soft
 

perro_loco

Club Legend
Joined
Apr 10, 2016
Posts
1,402
Likes
1,647
Location
Western Suburbs
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boca Juniors
The first half was some of the worst AFL level footy I’ve ever seen
It was a terrible first half of afl. it was like watching high school rugby union. by the way, just heard this massive thunder and hope it is not mount pinatuvo erupting again. it was the loudest thing i have ever heard. it is raining now, so it must have been a tropical thunder that was very close. just changed my undies. :straining::straining::straining::drunk::drunk::drunk:
 

Mattdougie

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Jun 29, 2013
Posts
13,569
Likes
11,223
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
It was a terrible first half of afl. it was like watching high school rugby union. by the way, just heard this massive thunder and hope it is not mount pinatuvo erupting again. it was the loudest thing i have ever heard. it is raining now, so it must have been a tropical thunder that was very close. just changed my undies. :straining::straining::straining::drunk::drunk::drunk:
Don’t be soft lol
 
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
Posts
68
Likes
235
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
So have i and without being callous that’s life unfortunately

We all go through it and using that as an excuse is weak in my opinion. Others use it as a reason to perform nit Shrink and regardless that’s no excuse for being soft

If u can’t have a crack for whatever reason don’t go out there but if u do then at least bloody try
1555165044837.png
 

perro_loco

Club Legend
Joined
Apr 10, 2016
Posts
1,402
Likes
1,647
Location
Western Suburbs
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Other Teams
Boca Juniors
Sorry to intrude everyone, your Bulldogs scared us to pieces with that game, I was very impressed with your boys’ ability to dictate the game away from the pies for long stretches and completely shut down our ball movement out from full-back.

Also although your ruckmen were beaten your mids were much better at taking the advantage from the hit-outs, much to our consternation. Grundy had 59 hit-outs but only 17 to advantage, so your players were definitely helping the ruckmen out.

I hope the rematch in June will be just as intense and I would not like to come across the Dogs in September if they find a way to last the full four quarters.
Good to read your thoughts on the game. In hindisgh, I think we played much better than we (this board, including myself) give how we played.
We dominated half of the the second and totally the third quarter. What did not work for us was our poor conversion and the easy goals we gave away.
Our forward line is not working very well and our kicking for goal is really poor. It is early in the season, but if we manage to improve our scoring and reduce our turovers (which have cost us in all 4 games) we can be a threat.
The team is still improving and we have a couple of players in the twos knocking the door loudly. So watch out. Also this season is really even given today's results. so don't be surprised that we make the finals and we give it a good shake. GO DOGS!!!
 

threenewpadlocks

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 10, 2012
Posts
10,628
Likes
13,278
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
Don't want to pick apart specific players - enough of that has been done in this thread - but our game style was a lot different from previous weeks.

Good: defensive work against opposition ball movement was much improved from the way we got burnt on turnovers in the back end of the Sydney game, and against Hawks and Gold Coast. Collingwood are a better, more slick ball moving team than those three, yet we defending their quick ball movement better than those three teams. There was a period of about a quarter and a half of footy in the second and third quarters where Collingwood just didn't look like they had an avenue to goal and it wasn't because of the manic pressure that we applied in particular in the first two weeks, but rather just our positioning and structures held up behind the ball.

Good: We're developing a very crafty operating half-back line. Daniel has good vision. Duryea, Crozier and Suckling are all left-footers who make good decisions. Our forward line is trash and we're missing the quality hit-up targets from the half-forward line (sorry Sam Lloyd, you're not the answer), and whislt this half-back unit lacks a bit of dash and pace, they're good kicks and they make good decisions, something that will help us

Bad: The fact that when Libba didn't have as dominant a game as he did in the first three weeks, you felt that the other players didn't pick up the slack in helping us be that dominant contested ball team we have to be to push for finals this year, especially when the game was in the balance.

In Beveridge's time as coach, bar 2015, he's been a player who on the "contest/outnumber v spread and ball movement" spectrum of how to win the game has been heavily in favour of the former, and we've won games even with inferior quality ball movement through sheer outpositioning, outtrunning and outwinning the ball v the opposition. So it was kind of strange to see us be competitive in a game through, even perhaps, slightly better ball movement, but worse around the contest. For example when we got a couple of goals up late in the 3rd but the Pies went away with the game, it's not as if they "broke apart" the game by tearing the game apart with ball movement, but they just wore us down and got to more contests and thrashed us in the contested ball in the last quarter. That's something that we've won games over the last few years doing to other teams so it was strange to be on the receiving end of. But we can't rely on Libba having a rest of the season like he did the first three games, and we can't accept that we got beaten like that by the Pies midfielders.

Perspective:
In giving games - and not just games, but important roles - to the likes of English, Schache, Smith, Richards, even Gowers (not young, but young-ish and still inexperienced), Naughton, means that we see the importance of development, even this early into the season. It may be ugly, it may lose us games, and it may not "appear" a rebuild as we're still being competitive and pushing on the edges of finals - but our team selection is still rebuilt, so we have to keep that in perspective.
 

threenewpadlocks

Brownlow Medallist
Joined
Sep 10, 2012
Posts
10,628
Likes
13,278
Location
Melbourne
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
We were setting up to shark Grundy's hitouts at the contest 100%. Tim English might be thin as a rake but he actually has an inch on Grundy. It's physically impossible for him not to have won more than 10% of hitouts unless we were deliberatly not trying to, it's just common sense.

Even Sandilands at his absolute peak in 2015 "only" won about 70% of hitout contests, if crappy ruckmen could win a quarter of the hitouts against peak Sandi when they were trying it's common sense to think that English - if he really was trying to - could have won a quarter of the hitouts against Grundy.

Whether it was right or wrong of course requires further discussion, but lets get the common sense out of the way.
 

Munnez

Team Captain
Joined
Apr 2, 2018
Posts
446
Likes
335
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
They all copped their whack - much more than Lachie did. I have no problem with people saying Hunter is lacking in some areas.

I still don't want him being the one who so often has to deliver the crucial kick inside 50. Do you?

Ask WallyStringhaus how Lachie goes for GAs and goals. Among the lowest in the league for players of his ilk.
So often comes flying back for an easy I50 after Hunter kicks it down the line or just screws it around the corner.
Absolute admiration for his work rate, but as a club we need to get around him and give him a good option to hand off to someone like Bond or Lynch to execute the pass I50.
Cross is a good example huge work rate but kicking not a strength and that's ok brings a lot to the table. Just feel that we are able to capitalize better on his strengths. And mightn't get burnt as often on the quick opposition return
 
Top Bottom