DONT TRADE CARLTONS PICK

[GROTTO]

Keep an eye on the contract extensions up there. They have recently locked a number of guys in but the 3 top 10 picks from last year are yet to be secured..the longer this drags out the better

Think about it for a minute. Why would an injured Rankine not signed an extension? He may not even get on the park this year and he still hasnt signed?

 

[GROTTO]

This option has been put up as the best two players this year, Rowell and Anderson are best mates. The idea is if Carlton and GC are bottom two (in any order) then GC could get both players as a package.

I thought everyone knew this?

 

[Crow till I die]

They've been there 5 minutes, even if GC is terrible they haven't even had time to hate the place.

For sure - although it is different times and if a player wants to play somewhere else it generally ends up happening. Kelly wanted out last year and Geelong held firm only because WCE didn't have the trade capital

 

[Peter Doherty]

I thought everyone knew this?

Not everyone tracks the draft too closely and if you didn't know these guys were best mates I guess that trade scenario would seem a little odd.

 

[Golumless]

I am saying you would want to be absolutely sure that none of these connections and friendships will have an impact on drafting him and expecting him to be here for the long haul..This is pick 1 and it holds great value and if there is even a skerrick of risk that Rowell or Anderson will want to leave after a few years, then what else can you do with the pick (go after Grundy or Luko or Rankine, split it into multiple high picks and maybe a player etc etc) - what we need to do is absolutely nail this pick however we use it

Friendships won't at all. That's just romanticism without of even a shred of reality involved. Connections may, especially if family is involved. Your father being permanently in your ear about playing for a club has much more weight then friends (they are usually rather temporary after all).

The risk of us losing them without a family connection is rather low, providing we manage our cap properly, and don't become a train wreck of a club.

Mate, the landscape has changed. I'd like to see us be smart with this pick and possibly even Carlton's second rounder.

It's not about us being a **** club not being able to keep them, they'll just have more reasons to go home rather than stay.

Sure, the landscape has changed. Not the method on how to keep players.

Money, outside connections, and a crystal clear plan to success that you can obtain buy in. Offer that, and you'll keep practically anyone.

 

[Golumless]

Lets not forget here, that these kids have already been offered a contract extension and have not signed yet and its June.

My understanding the offer was made in February.

Why would you? You only sign a contract extension a year out if you're desperate, or unlikely to be in a position to attract a fair bit of money.

Both Luko and Rankine know they're going to be wanted commodities. It makes much more sense to drag it out to get market value, as it's going to earn them more money.

 

[skittlebrew]

You've convinced me, not fanciful at all.

However odds are against us but I highly doubt AFC haven't asked the question.

 

[GROTTO]

Not everyone tracks the draft too closely and if you didn't know these guys were best mates I guess that trade scenario would seem a little odd.

That i fully respect and understand, but if your going to enter blindly into a conversation and discuss the issue, at least ask the question why?

Instead of saying it wont happen.

It may likely not happen. Thats not the issue, the issue is that we should be trying and at least see where the Suns stand on all of this.

 

[GROTTO]

Why would you? You only sign a contract extension a year out if you're desperate, or unlikely to be in a position to attract a fair bit of money.

Both Luko and Rankine know they're going to be wanted commodities. It makes much more sense to drag it out to get market value, as it's going to earn them more money.

Thats also assuming that money is a driving force in their decision.

Walsh has already signed an extension with Carlton. He went Pick 1 and is going to this years Rising Star.

 

[Mike Smyth]

We only end up paying for pick 10 in a weak draft for Gibbs (Carlton drafted LoB with this pick who isn't developing that well) because luckily Carlton finish last and there were only 2 FA compensation picks that affected this pick.

I still rate Gibbs as better than pick 10 in a weak draft and luckily it doesn't look his body is cooked, he has been durable all his career and I think Pyke is trying to teach him to defend, he has shown he can after his role on Oliver so I think you went to early on Gibbs, he still has at least 2 more years (it wouldn't surprise me if he plays for another 4 years but it up to him).

For god sake lets hope not.

As for the topic. No trade for me. Welcome to the AFC young Rowell.

 

[Golumless]

Thats also assuming that money is a driving force in their decision.

Walsh has already signed an extension with Carlton. He went Pick 1 and is going to this years Rising Star.

It is always a driving force in any decision. I'd be very surprised if Carlton aren't paying 4-500k for Walsh right now.

 

[GROTTO]

It is always a driving force in any decision. I'd be very surprised if Carlton aren't paying 4-500k for Walsh right now.

That also depends on the individual, some people view family as more important or their mental health.

There is examples of players choosing alternatives to accepting huge contracts.

 

[boffo]

Jack is Back''s theory on retention is: did Rowell and Anderson go to exclusive private schools, did they have a privileged upbringing in a rich family? These are the type of entitled brats that seem to want to go home at the first opportunity. (Reference Gunston and Tippett).

 

[GROTTO]

Jack is Back''s theory on retention is: did Rowell and Anderson go to exclusive private schools, did they have a privileged upbringing in a rich family? These are the type of entitled brats that seem to want to go home at the first opportunity. (Reference Gunston and Tippett).

Its interesting you say this as there is a lot of work that goes into recruiting a kid, they would be across all those issues that you mentioned, probably have data and studies to verify their decision making process.

 

[boffo]

Some NFL clubs like to trade down their picks, giving them more picks and therefore more chances to pick A-graders.

In last year's draft would you rather Connor Rozee (5) and Chance Jones (9) or Sam Walsh (1)?

 

[Sidthehat]

At present, GWS have Essendon pick - No9 and it looks like they'll need points to get Green who could well be bid on at 3. Wondering if we'd swap our two second rounders for this - 19 and 29. Would be slightly overs pointswise (1601 > 1469) and I know is an even draft after first three but with a number of youngsters already in SANFL side might be good to put all focus on one player we really want/need.

 

[GROTTO]

Some NFL clubs like to trade down their picks, giving them more picks and therefore more chances to pick A-graders.

In last year's draft would you rather Connor Rozee (5) and Chance Jones (9) or Sam Walsh (1)?

Draft is always a gamble.

Its been proven when the draft is redone several years later, it is never in the order in which the players were drafted.

 

[Crow till I die]

At present, GWS have Essendon pick - No9 and it looks like they'll need points to get Green who could well be bid on at 3. Wondering if we'd swap our two second rounders for this - 19 and 29. Would be slightly overs pointswise (1601 > 1469) and I know is an even draft after first three but with a number of youngsters already in SANFL side might be good to put all focus on one player we really want/need.

That provisional pick 9 could very well land us a cam taheny..imagine walking away from this draft with rowell and taheny as our first 2 picks...where do we sign

 

[CROWS84]

Knightmare on the draft board still projects Luko and Rankine above Rowell and Anderson it all hypothetically were available for this years draft

 

[Southerntakeover]

Some NFL clubs like to trade down their picks, giving them more picks and therefore more chances to pick A-graders.

In last year's draft would you rather Connor Rozee (5) and Chance Jones (9) or Sam Walsh (1)?

Very few successful NFL teams are build from endless trade downs though, particularly in positions of importance. If there's a stud LT, and you need a LT, you're not trading down.

The Eagles for instance turned their fortunes around by investing substantial resources to trade up to get their franchise quarterback.

I'm not sure the Crows are in a position to turn down elite midfield talent. We simply need it.

 

[Sidthehat]

Very few successful NFL teams are build from endless trade downs though, particularly in positions of importance. If there's a stud LT, and you need a LT, you're not trading down.

The Eagles for instance turned their fortunes around by investing substantial resources to trade up to get their franchise quarterback.

I'm not sure the Crows are in a position to turn down elite midfield talent. We simply need it.

Last year was a super draft too.

 

[boffo]

Very few successful NFL teams are build from endless trade downs though, particularly in positions of importance. If there's a stud LT, and you need a LT, you're not trading down.

The Eagles for instance turned their fortunes around by investing substantial resources to trade up to get their franchise quarterback.

I'm not sure the Crows are in a position to turn down elite midfield talent. We simply need it.

You're right, very few do draft down. The Patriots do though, according to this really interesting study.

Smart NFL teams trade down at the draft. Most NFL teams aren’t smart. (Sorry, but couldn't paste the link)

 

[Murray2503]

You're right, very few do draft down. The Patriots do though, according to this really interesting study.

Smart NFL teams trade down at the draft. Most NFL teams aren’t smart. (Sorry, but couldn't paste the link)

We have multiple holes in our team. Trading down is the answer to fill 2 of those holes instead of filling 1. Trading down is all about risk minimization. We have a prime opportunity to extract maximum value from pick 1. I would trade pick 1 to get 2 top 10 picks if possible. I will use pick 5 and 10 as an example. With the top pick i would trade in luko. If we have too i would trade out a player with pick 5 to get it done. Knight would be good example of such player. There may be a 3rd in return to the crows for giving up pick 5 and knight for luko. With the other pick (10) i would go after the best mid available with pace. This would leave us with pick 19(carlton 2nd round). I would trade pick 19 and Jenkins to get the best deal possible. I would be looking for pick 10 to 12. Melbourne would be a perfect location for Jerka. I would then use pick 10 to 12 on trading in a key back or taking the best key back in the draft. This strategy would solve 3 problems. Mid, forward, back. The crows would clear an ageing Jenkins and his wage off our list and in return gain Luko for the next 10 to 12 years. We would also gain a top mid and gain a key back which we need with Talia ageing. The crows forward line would contain Luko, Fogarty, Himmelberg for the next decade. End of 2020 i would target grundy when out of contract.

 

[mistylake]

The trading landscape has changed so much over just the last few years. Good luck trying to keep a pick 1 or 2 Vic Metro kid long term.

The better Rowell and Anderson are just makes the risk of them returning home even greater. Trading the pick is not about not rating them.

There's value in trading the pick, arguably more value if these two kids have no intention of staying long term.

Also if anyone's thinking, 'well even if they decide to go home we'll get good compensation', they won't be requesting a trade back to bottom teams with great picks.

You’d hope Hamish and his minions are delving deep into these best prospects backgrounds and if they are flakey or genuine people.
Sloane is a Vic metro and couldn’t be more dedicated (although last contract he still milked us).
We can’t be baulking at the best talents with our list.

 

[mistylake]

We have multiple holes in our team. Trading down is the answer to fill 2 of those holes instead of filling 1. Trading down is all about risk minimization. We have a prime opportunity to extract maximum value from pick 1. I would trade pick 1 to get 2 top 10 picks if possible. I will use pick 5 and 10 as an example. With the top pick i would trade in luko. If we have too i would trade out a player with pick 5 to get it done. Knight would be good example of such player. There may be a 3rd in return to the crows for giving up pick 5 and knight for luko. With the other pick (10) i would go after the best mid available with pace. This would leave us with pick 19(carlton 2nd round). I would trade pick 19 and Jenkins to get the best deal possible. I would be looking for pick 10 to 12. Melbourne would be a perfect location for Jerka. I would then use pick 10 to 12 on trading in a key back or taking the best key back in the draft. This strategy would solve 3 problems. Mid, forward, back. The crows would clear an ageing Jenkins and his wage off our list and in return gain Luko for the next 10 to 12 years. We would also gain a top mid and gain a key back which we need with Talia ageing. The crows forward line would contain Luko, Fogarty, Himmelberg for the next decade. End of 2020 i would target grundy when out of contract.

Sounds like a plan but you’re only going to get another Jones at 10 when we need a Dangerfield/Martin quality mid.