Draft discusson thread

[Underdog]

Agreed

We've never lost a player because of cash. Judd's total package would've been comparable, if not better in Perth with the property deals etc that the club tips them in to.

It should also be noted that additional to Naitanui's salary he will be receiving marketing fees as West Coast's marquee player. The cap on marketing fees is a touch under 550K per club from memory.

If he were to go to GWS, he wouldn't receive this money as Isreal Folau will be the poster boy.

 

[maxrm]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

No GAFF Please!

Like every year all the first few picks have potential. I'm not sure where the stat info comes from but on the AFL website there is a fairly comprehensive draft machine which rates all the draft potentials in 8 major categories. Kicking, Marking, Handball Awareness, Pace, Possession Winning, Endurance, Agility, Power and Spring.

Of the midfielders Polec is first in 5 of the above 8 and top 10 in all of them. All those going on about Gaffs endurance might be interested to note Polac rates higher in first place with Gaff second, Swallow third and the surprise packet I believe the Eagles should take in 4th place, Josh Caddy.

Gaff has absolutely zero right side ability(watch his videos), Josh Caddy can use both. Gaff doesn't even make the top ten midfielder list for pace. Polec is listed as first with my surprise packet Caddy coming in third behind Polec and Bennell.

Polec is the only midfielder who finishes in the top ten in all 8 categories and wins 5 of them. There is only one player who stands alone in second place by finishing in the top ten of 7 of the 8 categories, Josh Caddy. The only one he missed out in was Agility, but so did Gaff and Swallow I might add.
Of all these midfielders guess who averaged the most contested posessions (11!) and clearences (7) during the under18 championships, Josh Caddy. He also averaged a goal every game and did I mention he has real pace (3rd fastest midfielder behind Polec and Bennell) to go with his ball winning ability.

Now watch some of his video. Of all the above he has more aggression, lays more tackles and pushes off opponents. All good signs the likes of Martin, last year and Judd in the past showed at youth level. My only concern is he is already pretty solid and will have to watch over bulking on the weights.

I know we want some outside pace and delivery skill but Josh Caddy can do that as well as a pussy footed one sided Gaff (actually as mentioned Gaff has no pace anyway).

It has to be a choice between Polec or Caddy.

Mate, I definitely wouldn't be using the AFL draft machine as a bible for the draft as you are. It's a sh** appliance, it's alright if your interested in understanding and learning a bit about the players etc, but seriously, most of it is bull****, there is no way Polec is #1 for all those things, and Gaff is definitely #1 for endurance. They even previously had the 200cm Daniel Gorringe listed at 178cm? So if I were you, stop glorifying the draft machine so much, it is by no means something you should base your draft knowledge around.

 

[richy4]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

^^ true

but Josh Caddy hasn't been mentioned enough on this board, fairly underrated..

 

[Snooperclyde]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Brodie Smith is much more like Judd.
I'd go for him if I were the recruiters

although Polec would be good as well

Another that can see huge potential in this lad.

 

[larrikin]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

No way Smith will be in play at 4 from what's going around

 

[WCE_phil]

Gimme swannies draft picks in the real deal and i'll be stoked.

4. Heppell
26. Mitchell
29. Parker

Considering i was considering parker for pick 4 much earlier in the year and i consider mitchell to be the best ff in this draft group it was a very,very nice mock from our boy.

 

[Obeanie1]

I'm really getting interested about what will be available with picks 26 and now 29. The HUN's mock draft top 25 has some pretty decent sorts but how's about those who are outside that 25;

Also with Cam Bruce now nominating maybe Saint Kilda or Hawthorn may use their first round pick????

Josh Green (18, midfielder/small forward, Clarance Tas)
Jamie Cripps (18, medium defender, East Fremantle WA)
Blayne Wilson (18, medium defender, Peel Thunder WA)
Matthew Watson (18, tall defender, Calder Cannons)
Anton Hamp (18, tall forward, Claremont WA)
Luke Mitchell (18, tall defender/forward, Calder Cannons)
Isaac Smith (21, outside midfielder, North Ballarat)

 

[dajesmac]

I'm really getting interested about what will be available with picks 26 and now 29. The HUN's mock draft top 25 has some pretty decent sorts but how's about those who are outside that 25;

Also with Cam Bruce now nominating maybe Saint Kilda or Hawthorn may use their first round pick????

Josh Green (18, midfielder/small forward, Clarance Tas)
Jamie Cripps (18, medium defender, East Fremantle WA)
Blayne Wilson (18, medium defender, Peel Thunder WA)
Matthew Watson (18, tall defender, Calder Cannons)
Anton Hamp (18, tall forward, Claremont WA)
Luke Mitchell (18, tall defender/forward, Calder Cannons)
Isaac Smith (21, outside midfielder, North Ballarat)

Would only be keen on Green, Watson, Smith or Mitchell + Andreoli.

Wilson I wish we'd kept 45 for.

 

[Eastern Rangers]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

^^ true

but Josh Caddy hasn't been mentioned enough on this board, fairly underrated..

Very under rated. Would be rated alongside Smith.

 

[Goosecat]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Mate, I definitely wouldn't be using the AFL draft machine as a bible for the draft as you are. It's a sh** appliance, it's alright if your interested in understanding and learning a bit about the players etc, but seriously, most of it is bull****, there is no way Polec is #1 for all those things, and Gaff is definitely #1 for endurance. They even previously had the 200cm Daniel Gorringe listed at 178cm? So if I were you, stop glorifying the draft machine so much, it is by no means something you should base your draft knowledge around.

Fair enough.
Just to get things in order here, whilst I have used the "Draft Machine" in this instance it is not as you would say "My Bible",
If you would like some actual combine results instead, then fine. Josh Caddy finished 8th in beep test and 3km time trial whilst Gaff finished 1st and second respectively, However guess who then went on to win the clean hands test, Josh Caddy, followed by Heppell who also finished 6th in the beep test and 3rd in running verticle jump, with no Gaff in sight.
My point was and is, to raise awareness of other possibilities. My apologies if that wasn't apparent.
To put things in further context I played a decent level in my time and back my ability to view a player in game situations. Gaff has ability, no doubt and is a natural receiver, link player who could particularly be usefull on the open spaces of Subiaco. However his use by foot is no better then say a Heath Black, Mark Nicoski, he has no right side and will rarely if ever win his own ball. I'm just not sure if that is really the type we want to take at pick 4.
I rate Heppell, Polec and Caddy all above him and hope we take one of them.

 

[richy4]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Very under rated. Would be rated alongside Smith.

so not in contention for pick 4 then? wish we had another pick around the 6-12 area.

 

[Pat_Footy]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Fair enough.
Just to get things in order here, whilst I have used the "Draft Machine" in this instance it is not as you would say "My Bible",
If you would like some actual combine results instead, then fine. Josh Caddy finished 8th in beep test and 3km time trial whilst Gaff finished 1st and second respectively, However guess who then went on to win the clean hands test, Josh Caddy, followed by Heppell who also finished 6th in the beep test and 3rd in running verticle jump, with no Gaff in sight.
My point was and is, to raise awareness of other possibilities. My apologies if that wasn't apparent.
To put things in further context I played a decent level in my time and back my ability to view a player in game situations. Gaff has ability, no doubt and is a natural receiver, link player who could particularly be usefull on the open spaces of Subiaco. However his use by foot is no better then say a Heath Black, Mark Nicoski, he has no right side and will rarely if ever win his own ball. I'm just not sure if that is really the type we want to take at pick 4.
I rate Heppell, Polec and Caddy all above him and hope we take one of them.

I thought there was an article saying Heppel had the cleanest hands and won the test. Either way, first or second no difference.

I'm surprised so many phantom drafts have Gaff at 4, accumulators always attract attention. I think he lacks in areas which are becoming increasingly important.

 

[Snooperclyde]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

No way Smith will be in play at 4 from what's going around

His combine results have let him down but his actual footy against men in the SANFL has been equal to Polec IMO and his ability to hit targets is most impressive.

Your right though, he wont be in the mix at 4 and he will definately be gone by 26 but I rate his ability as one of the better payers in the draft and whoever gets him will have a gun in a couple of years.

 

[Postman_Pav]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

I thought there was an article saying Heppel had the cleanest hands and won the test. Either way, first or second no difference.

I'm surprised so many phantom drafts have Gaff at 4, accumulators always attract attention. I think he lacks in areas which are becoming increasingly important.

The truth is all the players at 4 have flaws. Gaff is easily the least risky, a sure fire 200 gamer. The same cannot be said for Heppell and Polec. Both have question marks about their AFL position in particular IMO - or more particularly if they will be anything more than flankers. To end up using pick 4 on a flanker who is not silky or really quick (which neither are) is not recommended. At least you know Gaff is super strong chance to be a 200 game midfielder. West Coast need a very good player at 4 preferably with pace and skill but the truth is that that option just isnt there.

 

[tesseract]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

WC do not need Smith or Caddy. WC have more than a few that play similar roles.

The more that other clubs take such players that WC won't pick because of need, the better the likelihood of needed players sliding to where WC can nab them at pick 26 and 29.
I hope other clubs take Smith, Caddy and the like, as that's good for WC. Neither are worth pick 4 anyway, and similar types should be unwanted by WC.

WC have holes in the team that need filling. Selecting HBF's and IM's do nothing to fill in these holes. Discussing Caddy and Smith is a waste of time, as they'll be selected between our 1st and 2nd pick, in all likelihood.

Lycett sliding to pick 26 would be great for WC, as would selecting Chalwell at 29, IMO.

A quality young developing Ruckman is required this year. Lycett, as well as most young Ruckman, will need at least 3 years of development time. With Cox having roughly 3 years left, the time frame of Lycett's development could coincide with Cox's retirement quite nicely.

With Glass' retirement due soon, and Schofield, while showing some good signs this year, not a certainty, someone like Chalwell adds KPD depth and may well overtake 1 or more of the 3 youngsters who're filling the KPD and 3rd tall roles at present. A good local option from a stable that produces amongst the best talent in the land is preferable, IMO, to that of what I'm starting to believe is a couple of overhyped on BF KPF's in Cook and Mitchell.

 

[tesseract]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

The truth is all the players at 4 have flaws. Gaff is easily the least risky, a sure fire 200 gamer. The same cannot be said for Heppell and Polec. Both have question marks about their AFL position in particular IMO - or more particularly if they will be anything more than flankers. To end up using pick 4 on a flanker who is not silky or really quick (which neither are) is not recommended. At least you know Gaff is super strong chance to be a 200 game midfielder. West Coast need a very good player at 4 preferably with pace and skill but the truth is that that option just isnt there.

The only thing stopping any of Gaff, Polec and Heppell having a long career is injury. The days of top 10 picks being flops are coming to an end, with the professionalism involved in recruiting increasing. Even if they prove to be unworthy of such a high pick, they won't prove to be so bad that they'll be de-listed and have their career cut short.

Heppell may start his career on a flank, but he'll soon be moved into the midfield and likely be rotated onto a flank with other midfielders.
Polec I doubt will ever play on a flank. The start of his career may be his only time as he's eased into AFL. Polec's an out an out Wingman.

 

[Postman_Pav]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

The only thing stopping any of Gaff, Polec and Heppell having a long career is injury. The days of top 10 picks being flops are coming to an end, with the professionalism involved in recruiting increasing. Even if they prove to be unworthy of such a high pick, they won't prove to be so bad that they'll be de-listed and have their career cut short.

Heppell may start his career on a flank, but he'll soon be moved into the midfield and likely be rotated onto a flank with other midfielders.
Polec I doubt will ever play on a flank. The start of his career may be his only time as he's eased into AFL. Polec's an out an out Wingman.

Wingman are flankers nowadays. The line is very blurred in modern footy, you dont just sit out on the wing like in the old days or junior footy. I personally think there are two types of 'midfielder/flanker' type player; guys that you can put in the centre square and help win stoppages and those that are flankers who go with the flow over the ground but dont enter the stoppages. I personally dont think Polec will ever be in the stoppages and I dont think he has the elite kicking or pace to excel in a purely outside role. His kicking and pace are good but not great. Likewise, I have major doubts over Heppell making it is a midfielder, I dont think he is a natural in the packs myself. For the record, I dont mind either of those guys, in fact I really like them. But at pick 4, Gaff is a standout in that you really know what you are getting.

 

[adagio]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Wingman are flankers nowadays. The line is very blurred in modern footy, you dont just sit out on the wing like in the old days or junior footy. I personally think there are two types of 'midfielder/flanker' type player; guys that you can put in the centre square and help win stoppages and those that are flankers who go with the flow over the ground but dont enter the stoppages. I personally dont think Polec will ever be in the stoppages and I dont think he has the elite kicking or pace to excel in a purely outside role. His kicking and pace are good but not great. Likewise, I have major doubts over Heppell making it is a midfielder, I dont think he is a natural in the packs myself. For the record, I dont mind either of those guys, in fact I really like them. But at pick 4, Gaff is a standout in that you really know what you are getting.

I haven't seen footage of Heppell in midfield but, on hearsay, he is outstanding.

Also his combine results indicate elite handball efficiency and awareness, which to me is an extremely strong indication of midfield capability. All the good midfielders have blink-and-you'll-miss-it hands in congestion.

 

[tesseract]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Wingman are flankers nowadays. The line is very blurred in modern footy, you dont just sit out on the wing like in the old days or junior footy. I personally think there are two types of 'midfielder/flanker' type player; guys that you can put in the centre square and help win stoppages and those that are flankers who go with the flow over the ground but dont enter the stoppages. I personally dont think Polec will ever be in the stoppages and I dont think he has the elite kicking or pace to excel in a purely outside role. His kicking and pace are good but not great. Likewise, I have major doubts over Heppell making it is a midfielder, I dont think he is a natural in the packs myself. For the record, I dont mind either of those guys, in fact I really like them. But at pick 4, Gaff is a standout in that you really know what you are getting.

Players do tend to run everywhere nowadays, but that doesn't make the role of flankers and Wingmen the same.
I think most are aware of what Polec and Heppell will be dishing up when they play. The word is out on all these guys.
Gaff is solid, but he's not exceptional to the point where he stands out. If Gaff was a standout, he'd be a lock for pick 4. That's not the case. There's a few good options who're worthy of being taken here.

What you call centre square types and flanker types is no different from Inside Midfielder and Outside Midfielder tags.

Polec is 18yo. Whilst he's predominantly an OM at present, that doesn't mean that other parts of his game won't develop. It's too early to be giving out such definitive statements as "I don't think Polec ever will ...".

I don't think elite pace or elite kicking are prerequisites for a purely outside role. If that were the case, there wouldn't be many purely outside players in the game. Neither Polec, Heppell or Gaff measure up to that standard.

 

[dajesmac]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

We need to snap up Isaac Smith if he lasts to 26, and then take Chalwell/Mitchell/Cook at 29.

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRAnvngB1ag&feature=player_embedded[/YOUTUBE]

 

[tesseract]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

If Eyesack Smith is a consideration at our PP, Andreoli would be a consideration too. WC would likely go with the home grown guy.

If IS is to be taken, it'd have to be with the PP, as I believe Norf have opted to take their compensation pick with no other view than to snaring IS with their pick 27.

 

[dext]

I reckon west coast would jump on smith at 26, but I don't think he'll make it past Geelong, saints or hawks picks. Good late form in the year along with the fact he'll slot into there 22 in round one adding instant pace will be a good fit for a team in there premiership window. Esp saints. Fingers crossed tho

 

[EagleMan87]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Name: Dyson Heppell
Height: 187cm
Weight: 79kg
DOB: 14th May 1992
Position: Midfielder/ Defender
Club: Gipplsand Power
TAC Cup Statistics: http://www.sportingpulse.com/team_in...102897-8056772
Video Footage:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBuu0mGQ7aM

Achievements:
2010 Vic Country Team
2010 Vic Country Most Valuable Player
2010 All Australian Selection
2010 Morrish Medalist
2010 TAC Cup Team of the Year
2010 Gippsland Power Captain
2010 Draft Combine Invite

Draft Camp Results:
2nd in Clean Hands Test – 28/30 93% efficiency
3rd in Running Vertical Leap – 86cm
6th in Beep test – 14.13
8th in Standing Vertical Leap – 64cm
20m Sprint – 2.98

Heppell played three matches for Vic Country in the NAB AFL Under-16 Championships, producing 18 disposals, 2 goals and five score assists in his first match against South Australia. He made his debut for Gippsland after that as a 16 year old in the TAC Cup in Round 11 and played in the Preliminary final loss to Dandenong. In 2009 he played 19 games for the Power predominately as a defender, but moved into the midfield at the end of the season to average 24 disposals, four inside 50’s and five rebound 50’s in his last four matches. AFL Prospectus

Left-footed half-back who lopes along before delivering long to the chest of a teammate. Sort of like Grant Birchall with a bouncy gait. Showed in the first game of the championships, against Vic Metro, that he has the wherewithal to recover from setbacks. The question is whether he can break out of a lope and achieve a gallop. Paul Daffey

Skilful left-footed medium defender with penetrating kick, strength overhead and clean hands. Was outstanding for Vic Country in the under-18 championships, winning MVP and All-Australian honours. Averaged 20 disposals at 75 per cent efficiency and four tackles. Kevin Sheehan

He is probably the best rebounding defender in the competition and his importance to Gippsland is unmatched by any other. His kicking is pin point and his effective kicking sets Gippsland up for numerous forward movements. He is strong in the air and clean on the ground, and teams will be keen to curb Heppell’s influence before he tears the game to pieces. He has the licence, as a designated kicker, to find the right options and more often than not his decision making is spot on. TAC Cup Website

In his own words

What type of player are you?
I'm a skilful, attacking defender.

Which AFL player do you feel you resemble and why?
Josh Drummond because he is a very skilful, creative defender with a long, accurate left foot kick.

What are your strengths as a footballer?
Kicking ability, overhead marking, and clean hands at ground level.

What parts of your game would you like to improve?
Explosiveness, ability to break away from stoppages, body strength.

Which AFL team do you support and how did you come to barrack for them?
Essendon, because they were a very successful club when I was in primary school.

Who has been the biggest influence on your career so far, and why?
Dad - he has been a real mentor for me and has supported me with my football.

 

[Pat_Footy]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Heppel just looks like a footballer. In a couple of years everyone will know his name.

Isaac Smith looks like a beauty.

 

[NiceCunnington]

Re: Josh Caddy for me!!

Anyone who thinks Polec is slow and poorly skilled is in for a hell of a shock next year.

Can't really go wrong with Polec, Heppel or Gaff.

EH, I've noticed you don't really rate Cripps. Can you tell me a bit about some of your concerns?