Mega Thread Draft Talk Part 1

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

Interesting I must say and I am sure other clubs follow similar strategies.

One thing I will say is there appears to be an over emphasis on skills.

For example football ability(including skills/brains) would be top of my list then, then physical( not just athletic but height, agility, speed etc...) then a skill filter.

For example Farmer and White/Nason would not pass my filter as wouldn't get through the football ability and physical barriers although white was got on the cheap whereas a Polo would be given more time as his skill develops relatively speaking.

Who was the guy we missed on who play 3 rounds for GC?

What? U say too much emphasis on skills but then say your first filter would be football ability (skills)

FJ stated in that they need to pass 3 things Skills/Physical/Mental.

Sometimes late in draft this may not be available. THey may only tick a couple of those boxes and therefore fail. ie Taylor Skills and Physical are tick but Mental not so he failed but worth a try. Farmer was a trade so not FJ, White was before FJ and Nason was pick 71.

Last year's draft:
Conca: Skills Tick, Physical (looks like he will fill out and is 185cm so tick) Mental (best ever on the test they do so tick)
Batch: Skills Tick, Physical Tick, Mental Tick
Helbig Ticks at least the first two and seems very determined.
Then u get to the late picks like MacDonald who failed physical but they may have seen that as potentially improving so took the risk.

2009 Draft:
Martin ticks all
Griffiths ticks all
Astbury ticks all
Dea ticks all
Grimes ticks mental skills aren't too bad and ability wise reads play well good defensively. Physically they would have thought he could put size on.
The rest were risks.

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: drafting

What? U say too much emphasis on skills but then say your first filter would be football ability (skills)

FJ stated in that they need to pass 3 things Skills/Physical/Mental.

Sometimes late in draft this may not be available. THey may only tick a couple of those boxes and therefore fail. ie Taylor Skills and Physical are tick but Mental not so he failed but worth a try. Farmer was a trade so not FJ, White was before FJ and Nason was pick 71.

Last year's draft:
Conca: Skills Tick, Physical (looks like he will fill out and is 185cm so tick) Mental (best ever on the test they do so tick)
Batch: Skills Tick, Physical Tick, Mental Tick
Helbig Ticks at least the first two and seems very determined.
Then u get to the late picks like MacDonald who failed physical but they may have seen that as potentially improving so took the risk.

2009 Draft:
Martin ticks all
Griffiths ticks all
Astbury ticks all
Dea ticks all
Grimes ticks mental skills aren't too bad and ability wise reads play well good defensively. Physically they would have thought he could put size on.
The rest were risks.

When I say over emphasis on skills, the emphasis appears to be on disposal skills as opposed to other skills, i am talking in the context of a Sam Reid for example who might be slightly more questionable by foot but vastly superior in the physical and marking contestability(football ability) side of things.

Farmer for me is too slow and not good enough for his position, Nason too short and not enough upside(potential AFL qualities call it what you will for his size) likewise with White but White cost us virtually nothing and has speed so is a better pick.

Put it this way, Polo should have been kept because his deficiences in the disposal skill department could be improved which is probably why he was grabbed by the Saints. Farmer on the other hand will never get taller and definitely will not get quicker or more explosive and evasive!

BTW when I am talking Brain I am not talking just about composure under pressure, but smarts with and without ball in hand, vision, reading the play, extras etc...

Why did MacDonald not pass the physical??? It is funny because I rate Grimes ahead of Astbury so how are you rating them???, not that Astbury is deficient. With Griff shoulders are a relative physical impediment like it or not in certain situations.

Taylor is also not a forgone conclusion on the physical either.

This is where we may have a problem where we are picking a lot of average players in areas where they don't have outstanding features in one area but not so in other areas but these areas can be improved. In other words, I thing we could be placing to much emphasis on areas that can be developed and not enough on areas that cannot and are taken for granted!

For example some of those guys you ticked might have passed but we are talking 6 out of ten as opposed to a 9 and there in lies the difference particularly if you get a kid with a 9, 8 and a 4 against a kid who is 6, 6, 6 where the area of 4 really can be improved to a 7 who would you pick???

 

[TigerTime88]

Re: drafting

Agree Farmer needs to go and Polo deserved to be given a decent run in the middle. Imo Polo was a better option than Jackson as a defensive tagger.

In saying that I have a feeling his work ethic probably wasn't where it should be and this kind of thing could have been a factor. Was on the list for 6 years after all...

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: drafting

Agree Farmer needs to go and Polo deserved to be given a decent run in the middle. Imo Polo was a better option than Jackson as a defensive tagger.

In saying that I have a feeling his work ethic probably wasn't where it should be and this kind of thing could have been a factor. Was on the list for 6 years after all...

It is interesting because Jackson apparently is smart from what I have heard/read according to some but he wouldn't pass my mental test because is periheral vision is not adequate like Hyde and his decision making is too far slow amongst other things.

McGuane on the other hand , is weak on disposal but wouldn't pass the physical anyway as legs far too light with insufficient balance etc... and no desire over the years to improve this.

One thing I have noticed is a lot of our players are relatively dour , so there appears to be a bias against fast twitches, a bias against height/spring and size/strength as well as agility relatively speaking for whatever reason

 

[TigerTime88]

Re: drafting

I want some big midfielders this year with the first two picks.

Big, strong, quick.

Deledio/Judd like size who can play...

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: drafting

I want some big midfielders this year with the first two picks.

Big, strong, quick.

Deledio/Judd like size who can play...

I agree with your principles but we shouldn't be categorical with our picks. With Judds profile and others , as demonstrated over the rest of recent draft years,everyone is chasing the same thing predominately being mids of a certain type.

So with everyone looking for midfielders so it is wise to look at roads less travelled.

In this sense, we should get best available for first pick which might not be a mid but I agree with what you are saying regarding plucking out midfield gems when they arise

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

When I say over emphasis on skills, the emphasis appears to be on disposal skills as opposed to other skills, i am talking in the context of a Sam Reid for example who might be slightly more questionable by foot but vastly superior in the physical and marking contestability(football ability) side of things.

Farmer for me is too slow and not good enough for his position, Nason too short and not enough upside(potential AFL qualities call it what you will for his size) likewise with White but White cost us virtually nothing and has speed so is a better pick.

Put it this way, Polo should have been kept because his deficiences in the disposal skill department could be improved which is probably why he was grabbed by the Saints. Farmer on the other hand will never get taller and definitely will not get quicker or more explosive and evasive!

BTW when I am talking Brain I am not talking just about composure under pressure, but smarts with and without ball in hand, vision, reading the play, extras etc...

Why did MacDonald not pass the physical??? It is funny because I rate Grimes ahead of Astbury so how are you rating them???, not that Astbury is deficient. With Griff shoulders are a relative physical impediment like it or not in certain situations.

Taylor is also not a forgone conclusion on the physical either.

This is where we may have a problem where we are picking a lot of average players in areas where they don't have outstanding features in one area but not so in other areas but these areas can be improved. In other words, I thing we could be placing to much emphasis on areas that can be developed and not enough on areas that cannot and are taken for granted!

For example some of those guys you ticked might have passed but we are talking 6 out of ten as opposed to a 9 and there in lies the difference particularly if you get a kid with a 9, 8 and a 4 against a kid who is 6, 6, 6 where the area of 4 really can be improved to a 7 who would you pick???

I said i rate Grimes in certain areas. His kicking isn't fantastic though and nor was he big but we would have picked him based on his defensive 'skills' and the hope he bulked up.

MacDonald wouldn't have passed physically because he is so bloody unfit. BUT we would pick him because its an a
rea that can be improved.

Farmer and White aren't FJ's fault so can't be added into the debate about FJ's drafting. Nason/Webberley we agree on. They aren't physically going to get any better. Should be delisted and replaced at years end.

I want some big midfielders this year with the first two picks.

Big, strong, quick.

Deledio/Judd like size who can play...

Agree. Adelaide should overtake us again and we have pick 10. Kavanagh/Grigg plus Kerridge would be ideal.

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: drafting

It is interesting you say we hoped Grimes would bulk up.

In my recollection virtually all our draftees we hope bulk up, Grimes has height and speed apart from the defensive skills plus other physical attributes.

McDonald unfitness is not physical, that is his environment, so if anything it could be mental. The fact he may not run a 4 minute mile or whatever is physical. When I talk physical it is more about what their bodies are capable of doing including stamina feats.

I never mentioned Webberly who has more ability than some, and why wouldn't White be FJ's fault, but I am not bothered about the White selection after the draft anyway as there wasn't much to pick from as I recall

Anyway out of those three you mention one I am not overly excited about ( I can see an argument for him though and why he would be rated high) based on phantom commentary in the physical area while there is another I saw in the U18 vision we are more likely to be available at our turn, and that I hope we can snag at our pick one because I think he is underrated even though rated in the top 30 everywhere

 

[LuKe2428]

Re: drafting

Hoping for one of Kavanagh, Sumner or Tyson with our first pick.
Second pick one of Bossley or Crozier (rekon he will slide)

 

[Damo80]

Re: drafting

#15 GWS - Myles Bolger (WA - Ruck)
Height: 199cm, Weight: 80kg, DOB: 25/03/1993
Recruited from: South Fremantle Football Club
Style: Darren Jolly

Anyone seen this kid play? Any chance he'd slide through to our early 2nd round picks? He's missed a lot of footy and has had a foot injury, but sounds promising.

Could try to do a trade with a player and pick 32'ish to GWS in return for their pick 15? Would have to be a decent player for GWS to consider it. Or perhaps we'd be better off trying to get into the mini draft for Grundy?

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

Hoping for one of Kavanagh, Sumner or Tyson with our first pick.
Second pick one of Bossley or Crozier (rekon he will slide)

I really hope Kavanagh lasts to our pick. Tyson certainly won't. Kavanagh wouldn't have if not for injury but is now a chance. We wouldn't want to win too many more games though.

Personally I like our KPD and we just need to let them develop. If Crozier slips i would be wrapped. We really lack an x-factor player. Emmanuel Irra and Shannon Taylor could be options with our compo pick next year too. HOw exciting would it be having Crozier standing on peoples heads? lol

#15 GWS - Myles Bolger (WA - Ruck)
Height: 199cm, Weight: 80kg, DOB: 25/03/1993
Recruited from: South Fremantle Football Club
Style: Darren Jolly

Anyone seen this kid play? Any chance he'd slide through to our early 2nd round picks? He's missed a lot of footy and has had a foot injury, but sounds promising.

Could try to do a trade with a player and pick 32'ish to GWS in return for their pick 15? Would have to be a decent player for GWS to consider it. Or perhaps we'd be better off trying to get into the mini draft for Grundy?

Saw him play a bit vs SA. Looked good from bits i saw. Good around ground. May need to grow a little bit. People are saying he doesn't jump (did have a broken foot i believe). Personally didn't notice it but if he doesn't jump then he will fit in beautifully

 

[juss]

Re: drafting

I'm not expert in state league football, but between the VFL, WAFL, QAFL and SANFL there are ruckman between the ages of 21 and 24.

Why not draft the best one with a 3rd/4th round pick, similar to what we tried with Derickx?

 

[Damo80]

Re: drafting

Second pick one of Bossley or Crozier (rekon he will slide)

I assume you're talking Andrew Boseley? Just did some posting on him. Would be a wise move to get a good long term KPD prospect in if still available at pick 33 odd. Not sure there's anyone on our list currently who has shown they're capable to be the 2nd big defender (along with Rance). Draft the big ranga (Boseley), and the other big ranga (Leppa) can teach him all he knows!

I'm not expert in state league football, but between the VFL, WAFL, QAFL and SANFL there are ruckman between the ages of 21 and 24.

Why not draft the best one with a 3rd/4th round pick, similar to what we tried with Derickx?

Not saying there isn't someone out there capable of stepping up to legitimate AFL level, but when we're already playing two who are borderline AFL level, and drafted another one last year from the WAFL, not sure it's our best option. We could end up with 4 rucks who are borderline AFL capable.

We're better to seek a ready made upgrade from another AFL list (Maric, Hampson etc etc) and/or draft the best available 18 year old, or make a play for Grundy in the mini draft.

 

[Rustof]

Re: drafting

What's wrong with Kerridge that will put him into the second round ? Poor kicking? not very outside?

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

Lots! Shhhhh

Didn't play champs doesn't help. Playing for a team that's won 1 game also doesn't help. I doubt he will slip that far. More hope than anything.

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

BF Phantom Draft still has Dom Tyson and Elliot Kavanagh left on the board at pick 10!!! Unfortunately we currently have pick 12 lol

 

[Damo80]

Re: drafting

Don't worry, the HS has it sorted!

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/the-run-home-to-the-finals/story-e6frf9jf-1226101945950

In all honesty, the way the Demons are playing, how can you have them down for 3 wins to finish the year (ok, they finish with the Suns and Port)? We should beat them on form, but I'm not holding my breath. As discussed, in terms of draft position, we're probably better served not winning anyway.

 

[Jimmy6019]

Re: drafting

^^^ Agree. Loved the win against Sydney but it's hard to get too excited about the remaining rounds. Let's face it the last three games are dead rubbers. This is the time when we should be playing our kids and resting injured players for the year, not the otherway around. We might as well salvage something out of the season and grab a top 10 pick in a thin draft... Could be the difference???

 

[TigerTime88]

Re: drafting

I agree.

Really don't want to see us beat Adelaide.

Dogs, Demons do have an easy run home...if Adelaide win then I am happy to keep winning...otherwise pick 10 takes priority imo.

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

Pick 10 will be a good player. Like i said Tyson and Kavanagh are available still in the Phantom Draft board. Also guys like Greene and McKenzie. Or even Bolger the ruckman if we are desperate.

In regards to GWS mini-draft massive LOL they want Deledio AND our compo for O'Meara. Seriously see the mini-draft not happening at all. No club is going to give up their best players plus a sweetener. The other option is give 2 best 22 players. Have also heard that GWS are asking ridiculous prices for these picks to the point Adelaide and a few other clubs refused to put in requests for players to nominate. I actually hope no one bids and these players end up in 2012 draft.

 

[Dustin Credible]

Re: drafting

I've been reading on the drafts and trading board that the Eagles will be delisting Bradd Dalzeill at the end of the season.

I thought he was promising when at Brisbane, not sure what's gone wrong at West Coast.

Is 24 years old. Worth a rookie pick I would of thought.

 

[Magic17]

Re: drafting

Pick 10 will be a good player. Like i said Tyson and Kavanagh are available still in the Phantom Draft board. Also guys like Greene and McKenzie. Or even Bolger the ruckman if we are desperate.

In regards to GWS mini-draft massive LOL they want Deledio AND our compo for O'Meara. Seriously see the mini-draft not happening at all. No club is going to give up their best players plus a sweetener. The other option is give 2 best 22 players. Have also heard that GWS are asking ridiculous prices for these picks to the point Adelaide and a few other clubs refused to put in requests for players to nominate. I actually hope no one bids and these players end up in 2012 draft.

What the feck!!!... where did you read that?

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

What the feck!!!... where did you read that?

Their supporters seem to think they are the deals being asked for. Massive LOL at them. By all means O'Meara may end up the better player but no club throws away their best player plus a 1st rounder for a kid. Also have read that they rejected Adelaide's offer of Taylor Walker and Bernie Vince for a later pick. Are they kidding themselves?

 

[richolovesgoal]

Re: drafting

I've been reading on the drafts and trading board that the Eagles will be delisting Bradd Dalzeill at the end of the season.

I thought he was promising when at Brisbane, not sure what's gone wrong at West Coast.

Is 24 years old. Worth a rookie pick I would of thought.

I wouldn't mind picking him up in the rookie draft, looked really good at Brisbane, seems to have lost the plot since then. If he can work on his disposal, he could be a good aquisition, sit him on a wing, always been an accumulator.

 

[tigs2010]

Re: drafting

I wouldn't mind picking him up in the rookie draft, looked really good at Brisbane, seems to have lost the plot since then. If he can work on his disposal, he could be a good aquisition, sit him on a wing, always been an accumulator.

shit kick so shouldn't be touched based on recruiting policy.