Mega Thread Draft Talk Part 1

[Jimmy6019]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

....... the opportunity that GWS represent why I consider it.

Exactly. This is a one time only, unprecedented in AFL history, opportunity to get in early and pick up the BEST kids from what is touted as being one of the best drafts in recent history. I'm sorry but offering Hislop and Edwards is not going to cut it. If we let this slip it will be a massive failure by the club.

 

[Bird Man]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

I am not sure what you are saying but the GC/GWS system has been the system for the last 15 years for those oblivious to it!!


Why else would the gurus of AFL HQ endorse it??? Provided we don't tank, it has to be done if we want a premiership, that is the ABC of it, like it or not!!


Why do you think coaches on AFL insider are against priority picks if it was of no benefit to the lower clubs struggling?

Truth is this is the get out of jail card the power clubs do not want the battlers to have so they do no have a chance to provide hope to the supporters!!!!

what i am saying is that maybe 20 30 years you could build your side from low draft picks and what not but now .. not only do we need those draft picks which we have ( we have had Picks 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 12 ect ect.) so now we need to do what other clubs are doing now.. get good players like Judd and Carlton and cats with Pod ... we need to find very good players not for a short cut but to build the path for our success not 'play for picks'

 

[richmondkickass2]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Sandalands brother

 

[Bird Man]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Sandalands brother

how old is he ?

 

[folester41]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

if we seriously trade our first pick for anything other than a pick in the mini draft or a young up and coming gun i will be seriously pissed off.

 

[LOZWILDA]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

MUST use 1st rounder on a midfielder in the draft.
I beleive our backline is close to being OK. Thursfield, Moore, Mcguane are tradable. With Rance, Grimes and Astbury looking like ur future line-up with Gourdis as back-up. But the defensive side of our midfield is hurting bigtime. The likes of Jackson-dropping off from where he was last year and Edwards(can't tackle effectively ever) and does not hurt the opposition going forward enough. Grigg taking Tucks spot and not doing it justice. White not quite up to the job consistantly. All need to be replaced with some class, or some mature aged players from other leagues?
And of coarse the biggy -our Ruck problem- Someone competetive will do, unless we look at vickary and the unknown talents of Derickx next year? Bye bye Graham, and Brown gets last chance to prove something next year.
Only trade players or later picks for the mini-draft. NOT KEEPERS!

 

[Barnzy]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Should be best available, most likely a midfielder. Our midfield is overrated anyways. Has no depth at all after the first few and that's a big, big problem. You need at least 7-10 capable midfielders these days rotating through. Been smashed all year in the midfield and it's the reason we've lost games and a fair few by big margins. Midfield is the area where most games are won and lost. I see it as a bigger problem than our tall stocks.

We need to add to Martin, Cotchin, etc while trying to weed out the likes of Edwards, Jackson, etc. I mean, what midfielders are pushing up at Coburg? Hislop? meh. Contin? Untried. That literally basically covers it.

 

[_RT_]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

If the draft is as shallow as its being reported, I don't see a problem in us going down the path of trading some early picks to get established players that help fill holes in our list especially, if as rumoured, we're after talls.

With next years draft reportedly a super draft and us likely to have at least 2 picks inside the top 25 and possibly 3 in the top 30, we can always load up on talented mid sized players next year who should develop a bit quicker than young talls would.

Now before people start jumping in about this being a shortcut, I don't see how securing players who could be 10 year investments is taking shortcuts apart from the fact that another club has done the early development work on these kids. If anything this is the type of shortcut we should be looking at using as its not like we're loading up on guys in the late 20's we're simply adding more ready made talent to the age group we need to take us forward.

 

[tiggywigs]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

If the draft is as shallow as its being reported, I don't see a problem in us going down the path of trading some early picks to get established players that help fill holes in our list especially, if as rumoured, we're after talls.

With next years draft reportedly a super draft and us likely to have at least 2 picks inside the top 25 and possibly 3 in the top 30, we can always load up on talented mid sized players next year who should develop a bit quicker than young talls would.

Now before people start jumping in about this being a shortcut, I don't see how securing players who could be 10 year investments is taking shortcuts apart from the fact that another club has done the early development work on these kids. If anything this is the type of shortcut we should be looking at using as its not like we're loading up on guys in the late 20's we're simply adding more ready made talent to the age group we need to take us forward.

Logical.

And the priority "holes" in our list are?

 

[_RT_]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Logical.

And the priority "holes" in our list are?

Well it is widely acknowledged that we're going to go after a ruckman and possibly a couple of KPPs i.e. a forward and a defender.

 

[Jimmy6019]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

If the draft is as shallow as its being reported, I don't see a problem in us going down the path of trading some early picks to get established players that help fill holes in our list especially, if as rumoured, we're after talls.

With next years draft reportedly a super draft and us likely to have at least 2 picks inside the top 25 and possibly 3 in the top 30, we can always load up on talented mid sized players next year who should develop a bit quicker than young talls would.

Now before people start jumping in about this being a shortcut, I don't see how securing players who could be 10 year investments is taking shortcuts apart from the fact that another club has done the early development work on these kids. If anything this is the type of shortcut we should be looking at using as its not like we're loading up on guys in the late 20's we're simply adding more ready made talent to the age group we need to take us forward.

Yep, I can see it now.... another tyical Richmond 'rebuild' on the way. Trade our early draft picks for overrated players (picks that other clubs are more than happy to take off our hands) and plug the rest of the holes with 3-7 round draft picks and wonder why these players in a few years time arent developing into stars for us?? I'm sorry but its seriously starting to feel like Grioundhog Day, complete with another 10 years of kick it to Richo/Jack gameplan that will see up top out at about 6th-10th position. I pray that I'm wrong...Lord give me strength!!!!!

 

[Bird Man]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Logical.

And the priority "holes" in our list are?

Ruck

Defender

And I believe a rover / mid to kick it too jr8 and Ty... Cough * dangerfield

 

[TOOs_Finest]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Exactly. This is a one time only, unprecedented in AFL history, opportunity to get in early and pick up the BEST kids from what is touted as being one of the best drafts in recent history. I'm sorry but offering Hislop and Edwards is not going to cut it. If we let this slip it will be a massive failure by the club.

Orly? Fremantle/Matthew Lloyd ring any bells?

I do agree with your second statement. These kids won't come for any old rabble like Lloyd actually did. Unfortunately for us, I think this kind of situation is suited to the more established clubs, in particular those that are just leaving their premiership window, eg. Bulldogs/Saints/Geelong. They can offload matured and good players who will be worth something to GWS for a couple of years.

We cannot afford to offload anyone decent, since they are all still young. There is just no sense in trading good young players for potential good young players. IMO the mini-draft is just not for us, as tempting as it looks.

If the draft is as shallow as it's being reported, I don't see a problem in us going down the path of trading some early picks to get established players that help fill holes in our list especially, if as rumoured, we're after talls.

With next years draft reportedly a super draft and us likely to have at least 2 picks inside the top 25 and possibly 3 in the top 30, we can always load up on talented mid sized players next year who should develop a bit quicker than young talls would.

Now before people start jumping in about this being a shortcut, I don't see how securing players who could be 10 year investments is taking shortcuts apart from the fact that another club has done the early development work on these kids. If anything this is the type of shortcut we should be looking at using as its not like we're loading up on guys in the late 20's we're simply adding more ready made talent to the age group we need to take us forward.

This sounds great in theory RT. But unless you have guys practically knocking the door down to get to your club (eg. Houli last year), then you will lose out on these types of trades 90% of the time. Clubs will not give up these young guns unless they get paid overs for them. We are just not in a position to do that. Kane Johnson and Nathan Brown were at the right points in their careers to be picked up, but the fact is, we had to sell the farm to get them, and still we pay for it. This year will be no different.

 

[rammbo]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

You can the best kkp players in the world but you will b nothing if you dont hav a midfield and ours is half complete so it makes no sense to plug other holes first.

 

[Jimmy6019]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

This sounds great in theory RT. But unless you have guys practically knocking the door down to get to your club (eg. Houli last year), then you will lose out on these types of trades 90% of the time. Clubs will not give up these young guns unless they get paid overs for them. We are just not in a position to do that. Kane Johnson and Nathan Brown were at the right points in their careers to be picked up, but the fact is, we had to sell the farm to get them, and still we pay for it. This year will be no different.

Good call Dea Day, and fully agree. Unless we can basically get these players for free ie Houli or for very late draft picks we will lose out in those trades. Teams are not prepared to part with good/required players for our duds. What we will end up with is a bunch of Shaun Grigg equivalents on the list!!

 

[TigerTime88]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Firstly if there is a player of Dangerfields calibre available then I would happily give up our first rounder and more. Dangerfield was a pick 10 and has shown why and is still 21. Where we would go wrong is trading for a player like McIntosh.

If the player is under 23/24 and is a high quality player then I have no issue in swapping him for the draft pick in this draft.

However looking at this draft while it is shallow there is like always still going to be plenty of quality midfielders available around the top 10 to 12.

Like many have said our midfield while talked up alot still needs another 3 top end draft picks. We have 3 in the top 30 in the superdraft and also one this year. I think we should go 1 mid this year, 2 next year and a young ruckman.

Grigg, Kavanagh and Hoskin-Ellio sound good at this point if available.

 

[tiggywigs]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Orly? Fremantle/Matthew Lloyd ring any bells?

I do agree with your second statement. These kids won't come for any old rabble like Lloyd actually did. Unfortunately for us, I think this kind of situation is suited to the more established clubs, in particular those that are just leaving their premiership window, eg. Bulldogs/Saints/Geelong. They can offload matured and good players who will be worth something to GWS for a couple of years.

We cannot afford to offload anyone decent, since they are all still young. There is just no sense in trading good young players for potential good young players. IMO the mini-draft is just not for us, as tempting as it looks.



This sounds great in theory RT. But unless you have guys practically knocking the door down to get to your club (eg. Houli last year), then you will lose out on these types of trades 90% of the time. Clubs will not give up these young guns unless they get paid overs for them. We are just not in a position to do that. Kane Johnson and Nathan Brown were at the right points in their careers to be picked up, but the fact is, we had to sell the farm to get them, and still we pay for it. This year will be no different.

RT's theory is worth considering, despite your objections DD, on the basis of a "look before you leap" approach. In other words, the trading market will probably throw up our options before we have to decide to go one way or the other. If no one pops up that suits, then we can look at the best fresh talent available approach.

On the issue of list "holes", apart from ruck and (possibly) CHF/CHB, I really feel we badly lack a defender who can take care of small forwards. I hope that Dimma, Francis and crew have something in mind. I am sincerely sick of Betts and Milne and gang tearing us a new one.

 

[richoatthedisco]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Small forwards starve to death if a) you stop the supply going inside 50, and b) have a defender who can mark rather than just punch. If we get another key defender to accompany Rance, and Moore comes back, Grimes would be my choice for the little fellas. It's always better if your defensive player has a size advantage.

 

[tigs2010]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Small forwards starve to death if a) you stop the supply going inside 50, and b) have a defender who can mark rather than just punch. If we get another key defender to accompany Rance, and Moore comes back, Grimes would be my choice for the little fellas. It's always better if your defensive player has a size advantage.

Totally agree. Just look at the size of the "small" defenders in the best 2 teams in the league Collingwood and Geelong. Harry O'Brien often takes a small, Shaw is decent size, Maxwell has played on smalls. Josh Hunt, Milburn etc worry the small forwards out of the game. Harry O'Brien in the replay from memory stopped Milne from hardly touching the footy.

On topic...i think we should do nothing with our pick (hopefully pick 10) except use it on best available. which will likely be a mid. (Tyson, Kavanagh, Hoskin-Elliot, Grigg etc) one of these is likely to be available.

 

[nut]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

You can the best kkp players in the world but you will b nothing if you dont hav a midfield and ours is half complete so it makes no sense to plug other holes first.

Exactly...

You need the best midfield in the comp to win premierships.

If our football department cant develop a defence out of Batchelor, Grimes, Rance, Astbury, Post, Guordis, Helbir, Conca, Delidio, Newman, Mcguane, Thursfield, Houli, Grigg.... then god help us.

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

what i am saying is that maybe 20 30 years you could build your side from low draft picks and what not but now .. not only do we need those draft picks which we have ( we have had Picks 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 12 ect ect.) so now we need to do what other clubs are doing now.. get good players like Judd and Carlton and cats with Pod ... we need to find very good players not for a short cut but to build the path for our success not 'play for picks'

Rubbish, you can build on picks, that is what the mini draft is for. Seize the moment or die!!!!

I, as others are seeing, are feeling another grounghog day in the commentary. It appears to me there seems to be a protectionist overtone with more focus on sustaining the operators earnings through minimal impact proposals with the hope of a surge of natural development from a select few than making a definitive rebuild of the teams list to provide the sound base for development and quality accumulation of a number of new recruits through recruitment going forward before a more accredited list in quality and quantity that can develop in more normal realistic proportions as one can rise us towards a premiership which would be more palatably acceptable as well as believeable to fans and not to mention the players which would in turn boost their confidence and aspirations!!!

 

[nut]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

Rubbish, you can build on picks, that is what the mini draft is for. Seize the moment or die!!!!

I, as others are seeing, are feeling another grounghog day in the commentary. It appears to me there seems to be a protectionist overtone with more focus on sustaining the operators earnings through minimal impact proposals with the hope of a surge of natural development from a select few than making a definitive rebuild of the teams list to provide the sound base for development and quality accumulation of a number of new recruits through recruitment going forward before a more accredited list in quality and quantity that can develop in more normal realistic proportions as one can rise us towards a premiership which would be more palatably acceptable as well as believeable to fans and not to mention the players which would in turn boost their confidence and aspirations!!!

WOW what a sentence.... I do agree. We see to build up our players to god like status very quickly and then they become entranced in the club and almost untouchable....

If Jack Reiwoldt could deliver us pick 1 and 2 in the under 17 draft we would be crazy not to except..... and he would be crazy not to except 1 mil a season + all the promotional crap he seems to love.

 

[Jimmy6019]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

WOW what a sentence.... I do agree. We see to build up our players to god like status very quickly and then they become entranced in the club and almost untouchable....

If Jack Reiwoldt could deliver us pick 1 and 2 in the under 17 draft we would be crazy not to except..... and he would be crazy not to except 1 mil a season + all the promotional crap he seems to love.

Yep... we need to get our priorities right and build an A grade Elite midfield first before we even think about going anywhere. Imagine picking up two of the best 17yo midfielders in the country and fielding a midfield of Cotchin/Martin/Trengrove (equivalent)/Scully (equivalent). That my friends is a future premiership winning midfield.

I liken Richmond's predicament now to a homeless man who has won a Porsche (Jack) in a lottery. An amazing LUXURY to have... but when your sleeping on a park bench every night and eating out of bins, you need to sell it and get back on your feet!!

 

[Mr Magic]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

WOW what a sentence.... I do agree. We see to build up our players to god like status very quickly and then they become entranced in the club and almost untouchable....

If Jack Reiwoldt could deliver us pick 1 and 2 in the under 17 draft we would be crazy not to except..... and he would be crazy not to except 1 mil a season + all the promotional crap he seems to love.

JR is a bit like throwing the baby out with the bath water. I would be prepared to trade off some players like Lids and JR but only for their true worth. So if both went we would have to get Omeara L, Whitfield next year JR, a top 5 draft pick this year L, and best best minidraft pick in 2012 plus a little extra for JR.

So although the strategy is sound for the RFC and the fans IMO as we have 6 years to find forwards etc.. when we will be chasing high draft picks, we cannot be r*ped in any deal!!!!


If GWS or whoever wishes to rape us obviously it would not happen and no trade should be done.

If Lids and JR want to stay no trade would be done either. The argument, like it or not, is it might be better for them to go to GWS simply due to age/opportunity expectations over the next few years!

 

[nut]

Re: What will we do with our 1st round draft pick?

JR is a bit like throwing the baby out with the bath water. I would be prepared to trade off some players like Lids and JR but only for their true worth. So if both went we would have to get Omeara L, Whitfield next year JR, a top 5 draft pick this year L, and best best minidraft pick in 2012 plus a little extra for JR.

So although the strategy is sound for the RFC and the fans IMO as we have 6 years to find forwards etc.. when we will be chasing high draft picks we cannot be r*ped in any deal!!!!

This is why I am saying that the opportunity that GWS represents should not be over looked. WE WOULD GET MORE FOR JACK than he is worth.... it's as simple as that.

If we sit back and hope our draft picks become elite that we will spend the next 10 years watching GC and GWS winning multiple flags while we celebrate Jacks 70-80 goals a season.