Recruiting Draft Watch 2021

[eDPS]

eDPS's 2021 Draft Rankings

Lore's 2021 Provisional Draft Order
Any issues with it please tag Lore in this thread: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/2021-provisional-draft-order.1251001/

 

[Hazardinho]

I'm seeing other accounts on multiple forums claim we're super keen on Josh Sinn, which imo i can definitely see the appeal. If it weren't for injuries, he'd probably be in the top 5 conversation and he was someone i was super keen on since last year, but thought he'd be going top 3 in this years draft. Maybe the reasoning in selecting him, might be Sinn taking Redman's position and pushing Redman on a wing, and maybe Langford moving forward and then Perkins into midfield long term anyway, which makes a lot of sense. Plus having a left-footer in defence makes it more balanced and dynamic, plus the surging runs out of the defensive 50 Sinn would provide make us deadly from transitions, especially if you have Hind, Rids, already there.

 

[Keystone agony]

Saints only have pick #9 and then #62, so we won't be getting any 20-40's picks from them.

Bulldogs are a chance to trade out, but I think we'll be outbid. I don't think our F2, which could be around #32 if we improve (which Bulldogs will be worried about), is going to get pick #25 in this year's draft. I think you'll have to be a team who is expected to finish near the bottom of the ladder with an F2 or an F1. And I expect a team will have to pay a likely early F2 and an R3 to get that pick. It appears to be a sellers market.

Some examples: North has 42, 47, and an earlier (likely) F2. They could easily outbid us.
Melbourne has 37, 49 and 57. They can't trade their F2, but for anyone wanting points out position us.
Geelong have 30, 32, 34 and 50. If they want to move up the order, we've got problems. They could also package an F2 into the deal.


I think if he goes outside the top 40 Fremantle can take him via their NGA. That said, some draft experts were putting him in the 20's a little while ago. Although he does seem to have slipped a bit.

My understanding is 3 way trades can still occur

Saints have an F2

It really depends if a side like Geelong, North would be willing to give up a F2 and such a better pick this year. Our F2 would be seen of much greater value than Geelongs F2 right now aswell. Both teams also have a pick at a similar spot.

If i was North i wouldnt give up my F2 + pick 47 for what will be pick 25 this year

If i was the dogs id prefer Essendons F2 over Geelongs F2

 

[Bjchan13]

Mathew Johnson looks great on his video highlights. Stands up well in a tackle, good foot skills.
Would be happy if we landed him. https://www.afl.com.au/news/685788/...orm-guide-top-draft-prospects-october-ranking

He's my preferred pick now. Will still be happy with Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera or Josh Goater

 

[Keystone agony]

Not many being linked to Gibcus or Erazmus

Feel like the top 5 are set
Horne Francis
Daicos
Darcy
Mac/Callaghan
Callaghan/Mac

6. Adelaide (Seems most likely linked to Rachelle but who knows)

7. Hawks - Ward (Seems pretty set)
8. Freo - Amiss (Still think they take him with one of their picks)

9. Saints - Very unsure aswell. They need everything

Erazmus was 192cm in the Herald Sun. 190cm in the Cal Twomey phantom. Is he still growing?

 

[ant555]

If the big bodied mid is best available, I'm more than happy to take him. I've said best available non-tall should be the go. The only proviso being, I would rate kicking skills as a key attribute if I were rating best available. My tongue-in-cheek preference (since I don't really know the players) is Sonsie since he brings top kicking and is good at the contest and stoppages. So best of both worlds, with the downer he has lacked some consistency.

The discussion started from a post where Keystone agony said his number one priority would be an inside mid. When I questioned this, he/she asked if I was joking and said we need a "big inside midfielder". Which I have challenged. My preference if we were talking types would be a larger focus on disposal than clearance ability. If the inside mid is clearly the better option, go for it. But for me, if that inside player doesn't have other strings to his bow, it would be harder for me rank them best available.

Yet as already mentioned all the players that have been discussed by most as preferred big bodied midfielders all have an inside game , an outside running game and a decent marking game. You seem to be hung up on "big bodied inside mid " term alone . No one is suggesting we draft a Ben Cunnington clone. All most want is something a little different to what we have. Rather than having a fleet of 180cm midfielders as our prime guys. Even if Perkins makes it in the midfield we will have 5 x 180cm and 1 x 188cm . I am not including Cox as his role on the wing is different. Not including Langford as his best form has been wing / half forward.
Personally I am also on record as saying we do not actually have to get a clearance player. We have to improve two areas. Overall contested possession and marking power around the ground. We do have some players that will help this going forward but we still need to keep upgrading that area.

I do not think we are as far away as most and I have been on record as saying we did pretty well with only two of our best midfielders on the park. However I am not going away from my list management thoughts from the last 10 years where it is my opinion we have not ever looked at the overall balance of the list. This opinion comes from my time working in the area and observing a few other clubs as much as us.

I can see why you are an Adrian fan. Sonsie is a very good prospect and his kicking is very good. He would be a plus for us but he has to replace one of the 180cm guys and he does not change the profile of the list. As I said above IMO we the two biggest issues are overall contested footy and as part of that players able to take contested marks over all positions. I am not hanging my hat on one draft and the few we have. We have 180cm midfielder depth. We do not have 188cm midfielder depth. Kicking is an area we can improve on for sure which is why I do not mind Sinn as a speedy running half back is of use as well given we are a bit thin in that area.

The fact I have challenged a few answers has nothing to do with the KA post. I have challenged the dismissal of needing to improve our contested footy depth and the fact that 3 or so players that may improve is not really depth in that area. At no stage have I said we need to do anything with clearance or stoppage. Where the conversation started is irrelevant. You can discuss with KA as far as that initial post goes. We are mid range to bottom in the contested stats. We are in the 6th to 10th range in total contested possessions. The top sides and the GF sides have generally been in the 1 to 5 range as far as total contested possessions go. We improve that a little by internal and drafting a bit of depth in the bigger bodies and we are pushing top 5.

 

[ant555]

I'm seeing other accounts on multiple forums claim we're super keen on Josh Sinn, which imo i can definitely see the appeal. If it weren't for injuries, he'd probably be in the top 5 conversation and he was someone i was super keen on since last year, but thought he'd be going top 3 in this years draft. Maybe the reasoning in selecting him, might be Sinn taking Redman's position and pushing Redman on a wing, and maybe Langford moving forward and then Perkins into midfield long term anyway, which makes a lot of sense. Plus having a left-footer in defence makes it more balanced and dynamic, plus the surging runs out of the defensive 50 Sinn would provide make us deadly from transitions, especially if you have Hind, Rids, already there.

I like Sinn. He can add something and lets face it our small defender pool is not overflowing and he is a dangerous player out of half back.

 

[BrunoV]

I like Sinn. He can add something and lets face it our small defender pool is not overflowing and he is a dangerous player out of half back.

Sinn and Andrew strike me as the most 'Dodoro' players who could be available at 11.

If I was a betting man I'd be putting my money on Sinn. No doubt we could do with another running defender and speed has been a focus for a long time now.

 

[TheFrenchCut]

Sinn and Andrew strike me as the most 'Dodoro' players who could be available at 11.

If I was a betting man I'd be putting my money on Sinn. No doubt we could do with another running defender and speed has been a focus for a long time now.

Pace?
Plays half-back?
Could possibly play midfield without having spent much actual time there at junior level?

He is an obscenely Dodoro pick and honestly I would respect it. Can practically already hear the classic "we actually rated him as top three" and "we think he'll be able to play midfield down the track" lines pinging around my head.

 

[TheGrizz]

If we are interested in Sinn I would prefer to see if we could slide back and pick up another pick and still draft him.
11 for 15 and 27 from Richmond for example.

If Erasmus/Goater/Wanganeen-Milera are available though I would prefer to just take them

 

[Ants]

My understanding is 3 way trades can still occur

Saints have an F2

It really depends if a side like Geelong, North would be willing to give up a F2 and such a better pick this year. Our F2 would be seen of much greater value than Geelongs F2 right now aswell. Both teams also have a pick at a similar spot.

If i was North i wouldnt give up my F2 + pick 47 for what will be pick 25 this year

If i was the dogs id prefer Essendons F2 over Geelongs F2

Except that’s really two trades. One with Saints to get their F2 for points picks.

Then us trying to get back into the second round. Which comes back to my opinion that I think it will be too expensive.

I think it will take an F1 or an F2 from a team expected to finish low to get a pick in the twenties. A single F2 like ours will get you a pick 35+.

It’s like 2019 where clubs had to give up a F2 to move up 2-3 spots. In 2019 we did it, Brisbane did it, GCS gave up a future #11 for #25. Except in 2021 we need to move up 20 spots. Which will cost waaayy more than a single F2.

 

[BrunoV]

Pace?
Plays half-back?
Could possibly play midfield without having spent much actual time there at junior level?

He is an obscenely Dodoro pick and honestly I would respect it. Can practically already hear the classic "we actually rated him as top three" and "we think he'll be able to play midfield down the track" lines pinging around my head.

If we are interested in Sinn I would prefer to see if we could slide back and pick up another pick and still draft him.
11 for 15 and 27 from Richmond for example.

If Erasmus/Goater/Wanganeen-Milera are available though I would prefer to just take them

I should have included Wanganeen-Milera, he is probably the most Dodoro player.

I should say, I'm not against a half back. Hind faded pretty badly. While I don't see his position as being under any immediate threat I could see him surpassed.

 

[Yoda_]

I should have included Wanganeen-Milera, he is probably the most Dodoro player.

I should say, I'm not against a half back. Hind faded pretty badly. While I don't see his position as being under any immediate threat I could see him surpassed.

The addition of Kelly to the list off sets the need to bring in a small defender imho.

Perhaps one who can start at HB but eventually roll up to a wing would be nice


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[Bjchan13]

I should have included Wanganeen-Milera, he is probably the most Dodoro player.

I should say, I'm not against a half back. Hind faded pretty badly. While I don't see his position as being under any immediate threat I could see him surpassed.

Dodoro hasn't really ever picked someone like Nasiah in the first round. Or Sinn. Talented tall like Mac Andrew yes, he chose Ryder at 6, Cox last year.

 

[Keystone agony]

Except that’s really two trades. One with Saints to get their F2 for points picks.

Then us trying to get back into the second round. Which comes back to my opinion that I think it will be too expensive.

I think it will take an F1 or an F2 from a team expected to finish low to get a pick in the twenties. A single F2 like ours will get you a pick 35+.

It’s like 2019 where clubs had to give up a F2 to move up 2-3 spots. In 2019 we did it, Brisbane did it, GCS gave up a future #11 for #25. Except in 2021 we need to move up 20 spots. Which will cost waaayy more than a single F2.

Yeh seperate trade ideas

The saints would need to involve another club

Im talking F2 and 42, 47 should be able to net us something pretty decent in a 3/4 way trade including the saints

Still think the dogs makes sense aswell, can they do better we shall see. I hope were putting it forward to them though

Just finding ways as to how we can move into the early 20s like weve been publicising without giving up our F1

Our F1 for Cats F1 and 22 (24) ? Not sure cats do that

As you mentioned it can be dangerous trading up for a certain player if you cant take emotion out of it because the club your trading with knows they can get alot as theyre not the one initiating the deal.

 

[Keystone agony]

1. Horne Francis
2. Daicos
3. Darcy
4. MAC/Callaghan
5. Callaghan/Mac
6. Rachelle (Crows)
7. Ward (Hawks)
8. Amiss (Freo)
9. Hobbs or Gibcus (Rich)
10. Erazmus (Freo)
11. ? (Stkilda) Wanganeen?
12. M.Johnson (Eagles)
13. (Ess or Rich)

Based on this atleast one of Hobbs, Gibcus or Wanganeen should be available at the tigers pick, if they really want the one left over as theyve been linked to Hobbs to replace Cotchin and Gibcus to replace Astbury/Garthwaite than theyd have to have a good look as theyre unlikely to be available at their next pick 17

 

[Yoda_]

Reading Chris25 ‘s opinion of Josh Goater and it’s one that has swayed me from wanting him.

Don’t particularly want Wanganeen - Milera either.

My preferences would be Matt Johnson or Mitch Knevitt


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[Ants]

The addition of Kelly to the list off sets the need to bring in a small defender imho.

Perhaps one who can start at HB but eventually roll up to a wing would be nice

Not really. We had ONE small back unavailable for the EF and had to play Gleeson. Kelly replaces Gleeson, but we still have no depth behind him. Two injuries and we’re back to playing non-defenders as stop gaps.
It certainly doesn’t have to be with #13, but it is a priority we draft 1-2 small backs this year.

 

[Ants]

Yeh seperate trade ideas

The saints would need to involve another club

Im talking F2 and 42, 47 should be able to net us something pretty decent in a 3/4 way trade including the saints

Still think the dogs makes sense aswell, can they do better we shall see. I hope were putting it forward to them though

Just finding ways as to how we can move into the early 20s like weve been publicising without giving up our F1

Our F1 for Cats F1 and 22 (24) ? Not sure cats do that

As you mentioned it can be dangerous trading up for a certain player if you cant take emotion out of it because the club your trading with knows they can get alot as theyre not the one initiating the deal.

But the saints don’t need to involve anyone. They just trade their F2 to a team with late picks, of which there are a number. Or they carry a deficit. No need to involve us at all. And if they do, they they won’t care what we then do with the F2.

But yes, if you’re willing to give up an F2 and two midrange F3s to get a single F2, meaning we have to take an extra player at 70 odd, yes we may be able to do that. Effectively paying way overs like I said.

 

[Duckworth]

Not really. We had ONE small back unavailable for the EF and had to play Gleeson. Kelly replaces Gleeson, but we still have no depth behind him. Two injuries and we’re back to playing non-defenders as stop gaps.
It certainly doesn’t have to be with #13, but it is a priority we draft 1-2 small backs this year.

Redman, Hind, Kelly with backup from McGrath and Guelfi. No need to prioritise 2 small defenders - more pressing needs IMHO.
edit: Hird also spent a lot of time as a small defender. They are prioritising defenders who can play on multiple types and are versatile. Think players who can play on a variety of types eg Laverde, Ridley, Redman and Kelly. I don't think recruiting a small defender is on the agenda.

 

[ant555]

The addition of Kelly to the list off sets the need to bring in a small defender imho.

Perhaps one who can start at HB but eventually roll up to a wing would be nice


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The thing with Kelly is he is not just the guy to play on small defenders. Against us he played on Jones and I think Hooker . I think he was still in for that game.
Sinn is the bloke who can play the running half back role.

 

[Old Campaigner]

What's Wanganeen - Milera like overhead?

 

[ant555]

Reading Chris25 ‘s opinion of Josh Goater and it’s one that has swayed me from wanting him.

Don’t particularly want Wanganeen - Milera either.

My preferences would be Matt Johnson or Mitch Knevitt


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Did he not have Goater at pick 14 in his Phantom ?
Not sure where the midfield questions are coming from. He did play midfield for Calder and Metro this year. He played half forward for us in the VFL. Lets face it he averaged 24 disposals and 8 clearances in the trial games for Metro and 21 disposals and 5 clearances for Calder. I also do not agree with him having major issues with his kicking. If he did have to play half back he would be fine as most of the average stuff has been the real under pressure stuff.
I would take any of the three really. They all have strong midfield games with an outside running ability.

 

[eDPS]

What's Wanganeen - Milera like overhead?

He doesn’t always stick them but he can get on shoulders no problem

 

[ant555]

What's Wanganeen - Milera like overhead?

He is pretty light so anything contested is not really even his 3 wood right now let alone it being one wood. As he develops I suspect he will have the strength to hold his own but his go will be outside running winger with sublime skills and an ability to find space. He is also pretty smart in the forward half. I suspect he will take 2 to 3 pre seasons to fill out a bit. He is probably good enough to play some games in his first year but it would be all outside stuff.

 

[TheGrizz]

If a player we like is still there at 15 such as Chesser, Sinn or Knevitt (17 after bids), I wonder if we offer to trade our F1 for it.

Richmond have done a similar deal in the past with Geelong (to get pick 15 in fact), and there is probably not much chance that we make the GF next year, and so Richmond upgrade the pick for free in a year with more exposure of the junior talent (2022) and still have 3 picks in the 20's this year.

With the Davey's maybe being 15-30 at the moment for us next year, we will still be able to pick up quality in that part of the draft if we lose our F1