Draft Watch part 2

[Barnzy]

Continue to build the midfield. Take a tall forward with a 2nd round pick. Our first few midfielders are very good but after that it falls off and lacks quality depth which is what you need. It's not as good as people make it out to be.

Collingwood, average tall forwards (Cloke is better than people give him credit for but no Riewoldt, Dawes basically just stood in the square and was on the end of good delivery).

Geelong had one of the best midfields of all time which carried them for 4 years and they won 2 flags. One of the best winning records. Make no mistake all built through the midfield. Mooney and Hawkins? Enough said.

Hawthorn is the only team in recent times that breaks the trend with Franklin and Roughead but they fell off the radar quickly.

I would be okay with perhaps taking a Lynch type at #6 IF we used the compo pick this year giving us 2 picks in the 20's and then use those on mids/HFF types. If not and we bank it, midfielder at #6.

My order of preference:

1. Heppell
2. Polec
3. Lynch
4. Gaff
5. Caddy

I think Gaff and Heppell will be gone regardless (West Coast/Brisbane) leaving us with Polec.

Gaff's interesting: he's a midfielder who gets a lot of it and has elite endurance. He's the kind of guy who'll get the ball over and over again in a chain of disposal up the field. The knock on Gaff (and depending upon who you talk to it varies as to how much they think this is an issue) is his disposal. It's not poor, by any stretch - in fact it's very safe - but it's by no means overly penetrating or dangerous. An outside midfielder needs X-Factor and I'm not sure if he's got enough of it. You'd certainly want him to develop his inside game, so he can play both inside and out at AFL level, for that raises his value certainly.

Outside mid without great pace, racks up the ball, left footer, good attitude and work ethic, kicking is very safe without having huge hurt factor. Does sound a lot like Luke Power clone.

 

[Mr Magic]

I don't totally agree with the midfield argument for Collingwood. They have done unusual things with the rotations and Brown and Jolly mobile big guys plus Cloke have made a bigger impact with the initial departure of Tarrant and Rocca.

Collingwood have Swann , Pendulbury, Didak and Thomas but the others aren't sensational, good, handy, fit, uncompromising, young, well coached particularly defensively, and strong bodied but not sensational and they were not high draft picks. We have no need to rush for midfielders just yet when Lids, Cotch , Martin and Foley can carry their own not to mention Grigg and others on the up!

I am sure we can get some great midfielders in at least the next 3 years if not 5 years and be up with the best of them

 

[Calcium Man]

Don't really have a preference to who we pick up. Every year I have my Favs and when they end up at another club I'm always disappointed. But more often then not end up more the happy with who FJ chooses.

I'm very much in the build a great midfield camp, but looking at an overall picture of the next 3 drafts not just this draft. I will completely understand if we pick Lynch. There doesn't seem to be much between him and Polec, our next pick should net us another goodish midfielder like Green.

Next year we will have another top 10 pick and that will likely net us a player of similar Ilk to a Polec. The year after is an uncomprimised draft so we should get another top 10 pick another mid of that Polec, Ziebell, Sidebottom ect. type. Plus use the compo pick and get another quality mid at 17 or so in what is meant to be a great draft.

Quick question to TFLUA tiger, Toadyvine and any other draft watchers what kind of Draft is 2012? 2006 was supposedly a super draft cos of the top end tall talent, 2007 was very deep for ruckmen from memory and this year seems to be a deep midfield draft.

 

[juss]

Strong midfield is the key to winning premierships. Best available mid for pick 6 and go for a tall on our next pick.

Exactly.
I don't know why people are pushing for a tall with our first pick when our midfield is still 2-3 A-graders short of being premiership material.

Jack Riewoldt is our best forward. He's better than any forward that the cats had, the pies had or west coast had. Between them there's something like 8 grand finals and 4 premierships since 2001. There are a few ways to go, you can win with dominant key forwards (Hawks 08) or you can win it with a good spread of goalkickers (Pies 2010), or on the back of elite midfields (West Coast 06, Cats 07).

Combine an elite midfield with a very good forward line and you're well on your way. We still have Griffiths, Post, Astbury, Vickery, Taylor as genuine forward options. I'd be grabbing an elite mid with pick 6. Cotchin, Martin and another A-grader is much more important for us at this stage. Besides, a good midfield will make your forwards a hell of a lot better anyway. Forwards can't kick goals if they don't have the ball delivered well to them. And any forward can kick a goal if their getting it lace out to them on the lead.

 

[Mr Magic]

Exactly.
I don't know why people are pushing for a tall with our first pick when our midfield is still 2-3 A-graders short of being premiership material.

Jack Riewoldt is our best forward. He's better than any forward that the cats had, the pies had or west coast had. Between them there's something like 8 grand finals and 4 premierships since 2001. There are a few ways to go, you can win with dominant key forwards (Hawks 08) or you can win it with a good spread of goalkickers (Pies 2010), or on the back of elite midfields (West Coast 06, Cats 07).

Combine an elite midfield with a very good forward line and you're well on your way. We still have Griffiths, Post, Astbury, Vickery, Taylor as genuine forward options. I'd be grabbing an elite mid with pick 6. Cotchin, Martin and another A-grader is much more important for us at this stage. Besides, a good midfield will make your forwards a hell of a lot better anyway. Forwards can't kick goals if they don't have the ball delivered well to them. And any forward can kick a goal if their getting it lace out to them on the lead.

Problems with your argument is I see Post and Astbury in our backline although they can swing forward, Griifiths can play FF IMO and be better suited there, JR is good but when you are the focal point you naturally will kick goals , Vickery for mine is more a Ruckman but can sit in a forward pocket, and Taylor is yoursmall/mid forward in a different role.

What is wrong with using 2011-2014 to pile on the mids particularly when they develop to a premiership quicker??(my target 2016).

I see Lynch killing off our need for a second ruckman. If we don't get him we could lose a mid chasing a second Ruckman. Mitchell type would not complement Griff and may not even make it.

Based on Calcium argument it reminds me of the Tambling Franklin argument although IMO Polec and Heppell are less risky due to there body size. If you have a outside mid and a tall forward to pick from, as Hawthorn put it, you go tall. We mighn't get another chance of someone at this calibre as a stronger midfield will lift us up the ladder away from these draft options.

I can understand WC, Gold Coast and Brisbane ignoring Lynch as he wouldn't be as good a fit for them, they have other options and need good midfielders which are available , but Richmond doesn't have that excuse!!

 

[LOZWILDA]

pick 6 Heppel/Polec/Gaff ............. pick 29 Cook/Mitchell/Lycett/Guthrie
or
pick 6 Lynch.............................. pick 29 Parker/Prestia/Newton/Cripps

Would be pretty happy with either option.

Phantoms would be totally different if West Coast went for Darling and Tigers went for Lynch???

 

[TigerTime88]

pick 6 Heppel/Polec/Gaff ............. pick 29 Cook/Mitchell/Lycett/Guthrie
or
pick 6 Lynch.............................. pick 29 Parker/Prestia/Newton/Cripps

Would be pretty happy with either option.

Phantoms would be totally different if West Coast went for Darling and Tigers went for Lynch???

Look if we can land Parker at 29 I will do cartwheels.

The thing for me is I don't really rate Lynch much and think he is being overrated fairly heavily. I understand a few people here like Toadavine love him but I just don't see him justifying pick 6.

My premiership formula excluding the backline would be a freakshow midfield supported by a decent forwardline like Geelong, Westcoast, Brisbane had in their time. Brisbane had a great forward line but the other two and more recently the Pies didn't. The fact of the matter is we already have a superstar FF in Jack Riewoldt. We really need to recruit someone to take the 2nd tall Chris Dawes role...but we already have Griffiths who on potential will be way better than someone like Dawes and an unbelievable second option. The thing we lack which I think is vital is the quality small goal kickers. We had one in Collins but got rid of him, other than that we are dry. A Nathan Brown type who can on any day kick 5 but is not KP. The resting midfielders can do the rest in the forwardline but that Jed Lamb/Nathan Brown player is super important to premiership sucess imo.

Those midfields above had at least 5 a-graders.

Cotchin, Martin, Deledio, Foley in my mind when up and running as 1 provide four A-graders. Morton could potentially be a 5th but at worst will be a very damaging player in a good side. Polec is class.....and Parker will be the Batsanic of this draft year if he lasts until 29 or whoever nabs him late.

So you could suggest after this draft year given a couple more years of development we will have 5 A-Graders:

Cotch, Martin, Deledio, Foley, Polec (assuming a guy picked at 6 will be a gun).

Supported by some handy B Graders

Edwards, Morton (could be A-grade imo), Grigg, Jackson, Parker

I just think adding to our talls with pick 29 will be equally as good as taking Lynch and we will also get the match winning x-factor of Jarrod Polec.

If we recieve two top ten picks for 2011 and 2012 we should see a side like this running out in 2013, which would be quite threatning:

NEwman Gourdis Moore
Connors Astbury Deledio (mid/HBF)
Polec* Cotchin Morton
1st pic*Griffiths Edwards
1st pic* Riewoldt 2nd pic*

Vickery, Foley, Martin

Post, Grigg, Parker*, draft pick

* indicates picks for 2011 and 2012.

If we were to go Polec and then Parker for example this year, I think we really then would concentrate of trick HFF/FP with our first picks in upcoming drafts and probably grab another tall for coverage. Obviously this side will dramatically change but those are the players I think have plenty of ability and should be around in 2012/2013 side when we are pushing. Plenty of midfield rotation there and Post and Vickery to play ruck and 3rd tall forward. Find some classy small forwards and we are on track.

The rest of the draft picks should go towards classy goal kickers going forward and also this year. Bit of a ramble but I feel I got my point across.

 

[Mr Magic]

Look if we can land Parker at 29 I will do cartwheels.

The thing for me is I don't really rate Lynch much and think he is being overrated fairly heavily. I understand a few people here like Toadavine love him but I just don't see him justifying pick 6.

My premiership formula excluding the backline would be a freakshow midfield supported by a decent forwardline like Geelong, Westcoast, Brisbane had in their time. Brisbane had a great forward line but the other two and more recently the Pies didn't. The fact of the matter is we already have a superstar FF in Jack Riewoldt. We really need to recruit someone to take the 2nd tall Chris Dawes role...but we already have Griffiths who on potential will be way better than someone like Dawes and an unbelievable second option. The thing we lack which I think is vital is the quality small goal kickers. We had one in Collins but got rid of him, other than that we are dry. A Nathan Brown type who can on any day kick 5 but is not KP. The resting midfielders can do the rest in the forwardline but that Jed Lamb/Nathan Brown player is super important to premiership sucess imo.

Those midfields above had at least 5 a-graders.

Cotchin, Martin, Deledio, Foley in my mind when up and running as 1 provide four A-graders. Morton could potentially be a 5th but at worst will be a very damaging player in a good side. Polec is class.....and Parker will be the Batsanic of this draft year if he lasts until 29 or whoever nabs him late.

So you could suggest after this draft year given a couple more years of development we will have 5 A-Graders:

Cotch, Martin, Deledio, Foley, Polec (assuming a guy picked at 6 will be a gun).

Supported by some handy B Graders

Edwards, Morton (could be A-grade imo), Grigg, Jackson, Parker

I just think adding to our talls with pick 29 will be equally as good as taking Lynch and we will also get the match winning x-factor of Jarrod Polec.

If we recieve two top ten picks for 2011 and 2012 we should see a side like this running out in 2013, which would be quite threatning:

NEwman Gourdis Moore
Connors Astbury Deledio (mid/HBF)
Polec* Cotchin Morton
1st pic*Griffiths Edwards
1st pic* Riewoldt 2nd pic*

Vickery, Foley, Martin

Post, Grigg, Parker*, draft pick

* indicates picks for 2011 and 2012.

If we were to go Polec and then Parker for example this year, I think we really then would concentrate of trick HFF/FP with our first picks in upcoming drafts and probably grab another tall for coverage. Obviously this side will dramatically change but those are the players I think have plenty of ability and should be around in 2012/2013 side when we are pushing. Plenty of midfield rotation there and Post and Vickery to play ruck and 3rd tall forward. Find some classy small forwards and we are on track.

The rest of the draft picks should go towards classy goal kickers going forward and also this year. Bit of a ramble but I feel I got my point across.

Ha Ha with respect I am going to comment that that team isn't good enough for me ( tongue in cheek of course)

This is my hypothetical team and I am looking at 2015 but more like 2016. This teams mantra is to slaughter the opposition 70's style like the Tigers of old. I had some fun with it putting Lynch on the HFF which he could do but for me he , Post Vickery and Griff would be rotating through the Ruck. Bearing in mind I am a neville nobody and the players have more say in their future than a hypothetical selector such as me, they know this and I hope they prove me wrong by rising up to be part of our champion team. I am assuming Taylor is not stupid enough to throw his opportunity away and I have done a Cuz pick on Peterson to help Taylor and for them to help each other in a mini team building growth leadership project to help them both as individuals which should make them better players for us

OK, This is my speculative team on hunches, projections etc....

This is not definite and there is some slack in it because , lets face it it aint going to happen but I am trying to be realistic and have added the support cast who clearly may be in our next great team.

** means top 10 pick in 2011-2013. * means top 30 pick in 2011-2013 *** means compo pick or trade and **** means top 12 pick 2014

Dea Grimes Post


** Astbury */value trade for older star like Aker but much better

Lids Cotch **


Steinberg ** Lynch

JR Griff Taylor

Rucks Vickery Martin **

Bench Foley Edwards Grigg *

Support Cast Connors, Morton, Oreilly, Peterson, Newman, Moore, Gourdis, King, ****, ***, *, *,Graham, Rance, Webberley, B Wilson,Houli, Tuck(if he outdoes his old man )plus other draft picks

I have probably forgot someone in the rush. I have assumed some of the draft picks won't succeed but I also know the compo pick is more likely than the top30 but I just mixed it up a bit to be reasonable. I also threw in a late trade(only a value trade eg. no high draft picks to be traded away) as we get nearer our premium team from players of the opposition. They may be more as we get closer to 2016 (hypothetically)

 

[db26]

For me if we go for a midfielder at 6 i would be happy only if we can get Cook or Mitchell and I dont think we can get either unless we use the compensation pick which I think we should use as this is a superdraft.Can we get either of Mitchell or Cook at 29???.

 

[TFLUA-Tiger]

Don't really have a preference to who we pick up. Every year I have my Favs and when they end up at another club I'm always disappointed. But more often then not end up more the happy with who FJ chooses.

I'm very much in the build a great midfield camp, but looking at an overall picture of the next 3 drafts not just this draft. I will completely understand if we pick Lynch. There doesn't seem to be much between him and Polec, our next pick should net us another goodish midfielder like Green.

Next year we will have another top 10 pick and that will likely net us a player of similar Ilk to a Polec. The year after is an uncomprimised draft so we should get another top 10 pick another mid of that Polec, Ziebell, Sidebottom ect. type. Plus use the compo pick and get another quality mid at 17 or so in what is meant to be a great draft.

Quick question to TFLUA tiger, Toadyvine and any other draft watchers what kind of Draft is 2012? 2006 was supposedly a super draft cos of the top end tall talent, 2007 was very deep for ruckmen from memory and this year seems to be a deep midfield draft.

Only seen a small sample size this early on, so it's pretty difficult to comment.

 

[Cathal Brugha]

I'm really struggling to split Lynch and Polec - I'd still take Polec, just.

But may well change before the ND - but I've been set on Polec for a long while.

I'm in the same boat. Over the past week I've been moving towards Lynch as the the benefit to the this side if let's say they both prove to be great players is much more if we have a top class CHF. Also we can pit Lynch, Post and other talls against each other and trade the excess for a good mid-fielder in 2 years time. But I would be happy with either.

Here's some video:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/102235/default.aspx

 

[richoatthedisco]

I still want Harper. Lynch if we really rate him.

 

[TigerTime88]

Ha Ha with respect I am going to comment that that team isn't good enough for me ( tongue in cheek of course)

This is my hypothetical team and I am looking at 2015 but more like 2016. This teams mantra is to slaughter the opposition 70's style like the Tigers of old. I had some fun with it putting Lynch on the HFF which he could do but for me he , Post Vickery and Griff would be rotating through the Ruck. Bearing in mind I am a neville nobody and the players have more say in their future than a hypothetical selector such as me, they know this and I hope they prove me wrong by rising up to be part of our champion team. I am assuming Taylor is not stupid enough to throw his opportunity away and I have done a Cuz pick on Peterson to help Taylor and for them to help each other in a mini team building growth leadership project to help them both as individuals which should make them better players for us

OK, This is my speculative team on hunches, projections etc....

This is not definite and there is some slack in it because , lets face it it aint going to happen but I am trying to be realistic and have added the support cast who clearly may be in our next great team.

** means top 10 pick in 2011-2013. * means top 30 pick in 2011-2013 *** means compo pick or trade and **** means top 12 pick 2014

Dea Grimes Post


** Astbury */value trade for older star like Aker but much better

Lids Cotch **


Steinberg ** Lynch

JR Griff Taylor

Rucks Vickery Martin **

Bench Foley Edwards Grigg *

Support Cast Connors, Morton, Oreilly, Peterson, Newman, Moore, Gourdis, King, ****, ***, *, *,Graham, Rance, Webberley, B Wilson,Houli, Tuck(if he outdoes his old man )plus other draft picks

I have probably forgot someone in the rush. I have assumed some of the draft picks won't succeed but I also know the compo pick is more likely than the top30 but I just mixed it up a bit to be reasonable. I also threw in a late trade(only a value trade eg. no high draft picks to be traded away) as we get nearer our premium team from players of the opposition. They may be more as we get closer to 2016 (hypothetically)

Lol how the hell does Dea, Grimes and an average under 18 player like Steinberg get a gig against talented current AFL players bolded?

 

[_RT_]

I've got a question for people wanting Lynch. Is it because he is best available or because he is the best fit?

The reason I ask is it would appear that the clubs thought process this time around is that they will be targetting best available with pick 6 and I'm not entirely sure that Lynch is exactly that.

 

[bigstyletiger]

I've got a question for people wanting Lynch. Is it because he is best available or because he is the best fit?

The reason I ask is it would appear that the clubs thought process this time around is that they will be targetting best available with pick 6 and I'm not entirely sure that Lynch is exactly that.

There's two ways I've been looking at this.

1. Lids will be 24 next year and realistically we have to have a red hot crack at the flag before he is 30 or we probably wont get one for at least another 15 years. This gives us time to develop a tall forward over the next 3/4 years that could be a genuine star of the comp. Going tall this year means we have time to target quality mids with our first pick in the next two drafts who will be able to have an impact sooner than a tall.

2. We just keep loading up on mids and go with the talls we have. While this is very doable and will probably open up our window a bit sooner JR is the only genuine tall forward we have. Post doesn't look to think like a forward. He looks more like Jeff White when he plays forward in that he just wants to take screamers. Griff has serious shoulder question marks and Vickery is a question mark. Astbury is the trump card for this argument though.

So basically I think both options are viable I just think that we still have time to draft and trade for mids especially as we have the draft compo pick up our sleeves.

If you asked me who I would prefer to watch in a Tigers jumper next year it would be one of Heppell, Polec or Atley. If you asked me who I would prefer to watch running around for the RFC in 4 years time it would be A massive Tom Lynch. I also don't think Cook will last through to our next pick and people have questioned Mitchell in terms of fit so maybe it's better to go tall first up and then mids thereafter.

 

[_RT_]

There's two ways I've been looking at this.

1. Lids will be 24 next year and realistically we have to have a red hot crack at the flag before he is 30 or we probably wont get one for at least another 15 years. This gives us time to develop a tall forward over the next 3/4 years that could be a genuine star of the comp. Going tall this year means we have time to target quality mids with our first pick in the next two drafts who will be able to have an impact sooner than a tall.

2. We just keep loading up on mids and go with the talls we have. While this is very doable and will probably open up our window a bit sooner JR is the only genuine tall forward we have. Post doesn't look to think like a forward. He looks more like Jeff White when he plays forward in that he just wants to take screamers. Griff has serious shoulder question marks and Vickery is a question mark. Astbury is the trump card for this argument though.

So basically I think both options are viable I just think that we still have time to draft and trade for mids especially as we have the draft compo pick up our sleeves.

If you asked me who I would prefer to watch in a Tigers jumper next year it would be one of Heppell, Polec or Atley. If you asked me who I would prefer to watch running around for the RFC in 4 years time it would be A massive Tom Lynch. I also don't think Cook will last through to our next pick and people have questioned Mitchell in terms of fit so maybe it's better to go tall first up and then mids thereafter.

Why does it necessarily have to be Lynch? Why can't we target a KPF with a later pick? We already have Jack Griffiths Post Astbury & possibly Vickery who could play as a tall forward. All 5 were taken inside the top 35 of the draft so the talent is obviously there.

As it is, we're heading into the draft with 4 picks inside 50, surely we'd be able to find another option if we overlooked Lynch at 6. Josh Walker & Anton Hamp are 2 kids who I believe could be available around the 46-50 mark and going by the write ups I've read on them both seem to play that lead CHF role that people here seem to have Lynch pencilled into.

With Jack and Griffiths already here, to me, there is no real need to go for someone like Lynch at 6. I reckon we'd be better served in building some real midfield depth by adding one of the highly rated midfielders at 6, maybe another 1 at 29 and then possibly looking at adding a tall later. Obviously if Mitchell or Cook was around at 29 you would jump at either 1 and look at the midsized option for the later picks

 

[bigstyletiger]

Fair enough RT. I just think that the if CHF is important, which is debateable, I think we could fill it with a potentially excellent one in Lynch. Your scenario in all seriousness has us nabbing a gun mid and a dud CHF as to be honest when you're drafing tall forwards that late you are most likely getting a VFL specialist or a role player.

 

[UpTheGuts]

I still want Harper. Lynch if we really rate him.

I am singing from your hymn book

 

[richoatthedisco]

RT, your argument could just as easily be turned the other way. Plenty of good mids will be available at our second pick. Mitchell looks limited to me.

 

[_RT_]

Fair enough RT. I just think that the if CHF is important, which is debateable, I think we could fill it with a potentially excellent one in Lynch. Your scenario in all seriousness has us nabbing a gun mid and a dud CHF as to be honest when you're drafing tall forwards that late you are most likely getting a VFL specialist or a role player.

But with Jack and Griffiths already on the list do we need to go out and grab another possible top line KPF, when a kid who is a role player i.e. lead up CHF type could be just as if not more effective than getting an A grade kid who doesn't get as much service as he should because there are other options just as good.

RT, your argument could just as easily be turned the other way. Plenty of good mids will be available at our second pick. Mitchell looks limited to me.

Well aware of that, but I'm of the belief that the midfield is where the game is won and lost. Win the midfield battle and even the most average of KPF can look good, see Lynch & Hansen at WCE when they won their flag on the back of a great midfield.

On the other hand you could have 2 great KPF lining up in your forward line, but if your midfield are chasing tail all game because they can't get their hands on it, they aren't of much use.

Thats why to me I like the idea of adding a midfielder like Smith Polec Pitt or Heppell at 6 and then another midfield type at 29 and then targetting a tall with 46 and/or 50. For mine adding another top liner to Cotchin Martin Foley & Lids and another quality support act to Morton Edwards Connors Grigg & Nason will mean there is plenty of talent on hand to deliver the ball into the likes of Jack Griffiths & 1 of Post or Vickery. Its the kind of mix that made the Pies so successful this season. Up forward they aren't exactly Dunstall/Lockett quality but Cloke Dawes & Brown certainly play their roles well. Its their midfield depth in Swan Ball Didak Sidebottom Thomas Beams Pendlebury Wellingham & Johnson that really puts sides to the sword. As mentioned above right now we bat about 3-4 deep in terms of realy quality in the middle, even then it only takes a solid tag to hurt us.

At the same time we could still look after our future somewhat by adding someone like Josh Walker a 17 year old 195cm 86kg KPF.

 

[folester41]

i dont rate mitchell, wouldnt want him with either of our first two picks.

if we can pick up one of prestia or parker with our second rounder ill be over the moon.

otherwise id like a hff type who can finish, we need goals.

 

[bigstyletiger]

But with Jack and Griffiths already on the list do we need to go out and grab another possible top line KPF, when a kid who is a role player i.e. lead up CHF type could be just as if not more effective than getting an A grade kid who doesn't get as much service as he should because there are other options just as good.


Well aware of that, but I'm of the belief that the midfield is where the game is won and lost. Win the midfield battle and even the most average of KPF can look good, see Lynch & Hansen at WCE when they won their flag on the back of a great midfield.

On the other hand you could have 2 great KPF lining up in your forward line, but if your midfield are chasing tail all game because they can't get their hands on it, they aren't of much use.

Thats why to me I like the idea of adding a midfielder like Smith Polec Pitt or Heppell at 6 and then another midfield type at 29 and then targetting a tall with 46 and/or 50. For mine adding another top liner to Cotchin Martin Foley & Lids and another quality support act to Morton Edwards Connors Grigg & Nason will mean there is plenty of talent on hand to deliver the ball into the likes of Jack Griffiths & 1 of Post or Vickery. Its the kind of mix that made the Pies so successful this season. Up forward they aren't exactly Dunstall/Lockett quality but Cloke Dawes & Brown certainly play their roles well. Its their midfield depth in Swan Ball Didak Sidebottom Thomas Beams Pendlebury Wellingham & Johnson that really puts sides to the sword. As mentioned above right now we bat about 3-4 deep in terms of realy quality in the middle, even then it only takes a solid tag to hurt us.

At the same time we could still look after our future somewhat by adding someone like Josh Walker a 17 year old 195cm 86kg KPF.

Good arguments RT. To be honest I completely agree with your reasoning. Just have a feeling that Lynch is too good to pass up and apart from Heppell I'm not sold. I love the look of Atley but am worried that his kicking could burn us. Polec showed in the first half of one of the SANFL finals that he is an out and out gun but in the second half went totally missing. Obviously he has a lot of development in him but worried that he could turn out be be one of those players that is great when it's going his way but disapears when it's not. Gaff I think is a very safe bet and a good replacement for Cousins but again, along with Heppell, not sure he'll be there and many are questioning his ability to hurt. In the end I'm going to be stoked with who we get. Just think that in terms of developing a midfield that will be out and out A grade we have a couple of years.

 

[Mr Magic]

Lol how the hell does Dea, Grimes and an average under 18 player like Steinberg get a gig against talented current AFL players bolded?

Well Newy is playing great but I am assuming he has to slow down at some point.

Basically , I am projecting Dea, Grimes and Steinberg to play better than Connors , Morton and Moore and playing at least to Newies current level which, with respect is currently higher than Connors, Morton although Moore isn't that far off.

A lot of my team is based on my vision of potential and I hope some can fulfill their potential if I am right. I am not right all the timebut Marto and JR haven't let me down!

 

[Mr Magic]

There's two ways I've been looking at this.

1. Lids will be 24 next year and realistically we have to have a red hot crack at the flag before he is 30 or we probably wont get one for at least another 15 years. This gives us time to develop a tall forward over the next 3/4 years that could be a genuine star of the comp. Going tall this year means we have time to target quality mids with our first pick in the next two drafts who will be able to have an impact sooner than a tall.

2. We just keep loading up on mids and go with the talls we have. While this is very doable and will probably open up our window a bit sooner JR is the only genuine tall forward we have. Post doesn't look to think like a forward. He looks more like Jeff White when he plays forward in that he just wants to take screamers. Griff has serious shoulder question marks and Vickery is a question mark. Astbury is the trump card for this argument though.

So basically I think both options are viable I just think that we still have time to draft and trade for mids especially as we have the draft compo pick up our sleeves.

If you asked me who I would prefer to watch in a Tigers jumper next year it would be one of Heppell, Polec or Atley. If you asked me who I would prefer to watch running around for the RFC in 4 years time it would be A massive Tom Lynch. I also don't think Cook will last through to our next pick and people have questioned Mitchell in terms of fit so maybe it's better to go tall first up and then mids thereafter.

That is so true!!!

People have to realise we have to have time to let the good forward we get time to develop while good mids take less time and therefore can be taken later particularly as there is a super draft in 2012

 

[Mr Magic]

Why does it necessarily have to be Lynch? Why can't we target a KPF with a later pick? We already have Jack Griffiths Post Astbury & possibly Vickery who could play as a tall forward. All 5 were taken inside the top 35 of the draft so the talent is obviously there.

As it is, we're heading into the draft with 4 picks inside 50, surely we'd be able to find another option if we overlooked Lynch at 6. Josh Walker & Anton Hamp are 2 kids who I believe could be available around the 46-50 mark and going by the write ups I've read on them both seem to play that lead CHF role that people here seem to have Lynch pencilled into.

With Jack and Griffiths already here, to me, there is no real need to go for someone like Lynch at 6. I reckon we'd be better served in building some real midfield depth by adding one of the highly rated midfielders at 6, maybe another 1 at 29 and then possibly looking at adding a tall later. Obviously if Mitchell or Cook was around at 29 you would jump at either 1 and look at the midsized option for the later picks

The answer for me is apart from Day, he is the only one good enough, best fit sand best available for the Tigers potentially.

Josh Walker and Anton are simply not threatening enough to be effective in a finals situation. They do not have enough weapons to worry the opposition under the pump, missing X factor. If we were going to get mids early, apart from Sternberg, I wouldn't get any other forwards late. As someone else said Mitchell is limited. A lot of footy is physicogical, It is like Malthouse with the Rucks, if you are going to get one they need to be good.

Now with your argument all 5 less than 35 , JR was about 12 and could have gone 8 if we didn't trade for Polak, Vickery was 8, Griff was injury queried otherwise he would be close to 10 and Post still has a jury but was a late bloomer like Lynch. Astbury was a very astute pick and to be commended but Griff still mighn't make it with the shoulders and I am not convinced FF is not a better position for him than CHF. I also think JR is most lethal as a third tall off the leash coming from the side or behind in the goal square after a leading Griff. You have to remember it is a team game and individual brilliance is not as good as the team collective. It is not just that Lynch is a very good forward , it is that Lynch is the very type of forward we want, leading, big tank, midfield qualities and Ruck prospects. The other thing is I am yet to be convinced Vickery is a true forward as opposed to a hybrid. Astbury is effective in defense and I also see Post having a role there to for sustained periods. The thing for me is Lynch breaks our forward line open by leading up the ground and creating space for a leading Griff and JR. Lynch could also be great in transition out of the backline . Lynch could have broken Collingwoods flood for example for St Kilda. Lynch could play a real Richo role and Lynch has midfield qualities at a level I have not seen in a forward for a long time let alone someone at 199cm.
Lynch for me could be a very good, but even if he isn't he is a real worry for the opposition and a key focal point. Lynch can bring qualities few players can bring IMO and he would be a nightmare matchup who wouldn't need an abundance of possessions to have an impact.

Cook and Mitchell do not have the required impact so if we got Gaff/Polec or
heppell I woudn't get Cook or Mitchell. You would be lucky to get someone like Lynch in the next 3 years as some rate him better than last years forwards and it would be highly unlikely to get a Lynch type whereas there is a good chance you could get players as good as the midfield three mentioned