Scandal Dustin Martin in drunken scuffle

DrMike

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If Hodge was lucid & could recall the incident then he should have known not to drive but he intentionally gambled on not being caught. No investigation as it was open & shut. My point is why should Dustin Martin serve a greater sentence than a convicted drink driver when no crime has been committed.
Because people feel like they can relate to Hodge, while Martin presents himself differently. Much easier to distance themselves from Martin as an "other". Community Psychologists would have a field day, and that's without going into Martin being of Maori descent.
 

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blackshadow

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i'm not sure I agree with your stance...

didn't the police statement refute that anything illegal occurred?

are you saying you want him suspended even without evidence of anything actually occurring?
We know that something did occur.

We know he was booted from the restaurant.

We know he was dragged away from the victim by his mates.

We know he apologised to the victim.

That's not nothing.
 

Jade

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i'm not sure I agree with your stance...

didn't the police statement refute that anything illegal occurred?

are you saying you want him suspended even without evidence of anything actually occurring?
What he's saying is it's not up to the police to determine whether a crime occurred. That can only be done by a court.

The police determine whether or not enough evidence exists to charge a person with a crime.
 

DrMike

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We know that something did occur.

We know he was booted from the restaurant.

We know he was dragged away from the victim by his mates.

We know he apologised to the victim.

That's not nothing.
If you have evidence that Martin performed a criminal act I suggest you contact the Police instead of ranting on a web forum.
 

blackshadow

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didn't the police statement refute that anything illegal occurred?

are you saying you want him suspended even without evidence of anything actually occurring?
Read my prior posts on what the police statement said and why it was incorrect to state as fact that no crime occurred.
 

mickctiger

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EVIDENCE old chap, without evidence and her statement it's over.
There's no need to be condescending, just because your argument cannot be sustained. There is no evidence. Hence the unequivocal statement that no criminal activity occurred. Why do some people have so much trouble comprehending that maybe, just maybe, such a statement is exactly what is means, that no crime occurred ?

Not all investigations lead to a person being charged. Sometimes the police are unable to gather enough evidence during their investigation to bring a case to court. This does not mean that the police do not believe her story, or that she was not not a victim of crime.
Or maybe, there was no crime. Sometimes it can be as simple as that. Just because she is a woman doesn't mean that she is beyond embellishing her side of the story


In her case she did not provide the police a statement, it would take a hot shot lawyer just minutes to pull apart any testimony from other diners who may or may not have been drinking themselves on the night. Hearsay doesn't count either. No evidence, no charge.
as you say, no evidence no charge. The police reviewed the footage, they spoke to witnesses and found that nothing criminal occurred, the allegations that she was all to ready to make via the media could not be sustained when properly investigated.
This is how the Police see it: An important aspect of any investigation is to record your statement. This will be usually conducted very early in the investigation. Statements will be taken in a private setting if at all possible. A statement is a written document that records what you can recall about the incident in detail and in chronological order. It is important that everything you can remember is included in your statement as even small details may help us to investigate the incident. We know it may not be easy for you to reveal certain facts, but it is important to disclose everything.
I think we all know how statements are recorded. Again, there is no need to be condescending just because you cannot sustain your argument.

She did not do this, making the investigation and evidence collecting impossible to pass any other judgement than no criminal act occurred.
Again, even though she chose not to make a statement, it dose not follow that the police will not pursue charges, if they believe an offense occurred. And believe me, under the current political environment regarding domestic violence, the police would have gone in hard if they believe a threat actually did occur. Statement or no statement. After all even PM Turnbull has made DV priority number 1. Unfortunately, for the alleged "victim", she chose to tell her story to sections of the Media and for whatever reason has chosen not to make a statement to the Police. That's not a good look at all. Excuses, such as her not wanting to be identified (she wouldn't be under normal court protocol) don't wash. It only makes her look as if she has something to hide
 

blackshadow

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If you have evidence that Martin performed a criminal act I suggest you contact the Police instead of ranting on a web forum.
Have I suggested he committed a criminal act?

I've just refuted that the police cannot state as fact that no criminal offence occurred, the best they can claim is that based on their investigation they believe that no criminal act occurred - there's a subtle but distinct difference.
 

Tiggytigers

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What the **** is wrong with people!?! If martin did what she said he did he would've been charged. Police investigated and said from CCTV footage and witnesses no criminal offence occurred. What's hard to understand ffs
 

Chief

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I'm assuming nothing.

This is getting more into SRP territory and less about Martin.
You didn't include that assumption in your post.

How I saw it was that you gave two assumptions only: the accusation was driven by money, the investigation only on purest motives of service of the state.

Weird how two people can see exactly the same set of words in two different ways, even while sober.
 

Jade

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What the **** is wrong with people!?! If martin did what she said he did he would've been charged. Police investigated and said from CCTV footage and witnesses no criminal offence occurred. What's hard to understand ffs
You're kidding right.

I think it would take me less than ten seconds to find a mountain of stories relating to physical and emotional abuse that never resulted in a charge because the victim refused to proceed.

It is in fact one of the core problems with violence against women, and one of the major reasons it is right now such a hot topic.

She didn't give a statement, so it didn't happen right? And now she's a liar.

God that sounds awfully familiar.....
 

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Defacto

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What he's saying is it's not up to the police to determine whether a crime occurred. That can only be done by a court.

The police determine whether or not enough evidence exists to charge a person with a crime.
If you have evidence that Martin performed a criminal act I suggest you contact the Police instead of ranting on a web forum.
this is where I am struggling to understand where he is coming from...

on one hand he had acknowledged that the police could not charge him due to lack of evidence to build a successful prosecution, but then is pushing for a ban from the AFL when they are in the same boat and would need evidence to support their ban.

so the police have not charged him due to lack of evidence, but people want the AFL to go ahead and ban him based on what exactly? is there more evidence the AFL has that the police do not?

the only way I could see a ban coming, would be from richmond due to him being a drunken idiot, rather than due to the abuse or threats which there seems to be a lack of evidence on...
 

SnakeMan86

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Wow. That's a lot of errors in one post.

A video of his antics is evidence.

Getting kicked out of the establishment is evidence.

His apology for his actions is evidence.

Is that alone enough to charge him? Police don't think so.

And that's also not what the police said.

Man you Tigers fans REALLY only see what you want to see hey?
While you guys are seeing only what want so desperately to see...
 
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What he's saying is it's not up to the police to determine whether a crime occurred. That can only be done by a court.

The police determine whether or not enough evidence exists to charge a person with a crime.
Why is everyone in this thread talking like it's one or the other? Both play a part in the determination of crime
 

Jade

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this is where I am struggling to understand where he is coming from...

on one hand he had acknowledged that the police could not charge him due to lack of evidence to build a successful prosecution, but then is pushing for a ban from the AFL when they are in the same boat and would need evidence to support their ban.

so the police have not charged him due to lack of evidence, but people want the AFL to go ahead and ban him based on what exactly? is there more evidence the AFL has that the police do not?

the only way I could see a ban coming, would be from richmond due to him being a drunken idiot, rather than due to the abuse or threats which there seems to be a lack of evidence on...
I can only speak for myself, but it's not that I WANT Martin banned, it's that I know exactly how the AFL responds to even the inference of poor behaviour. Proof is not required in the world of the AFL.

Having said that, there is little doubt that Martin is a complete flog, and also little doubt that he was acting like a dick on the night in question - even if it is not known exactly what that entails.

Previous form would suggest that, yes, he will be penalised (to what extent I don't know).
 

The Darkman

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Because people feel like they can relate to Hodge, while Martin presents himself differently. Much easier to distance themselves from Martin as an "other". Community Psychologists would have a field day, and that's without going into Martin being of Maori descent.
Yeah. Luke Hodge is a darling of the media. He gets to tell his side of the story to a television audience, even after he elbowed Swallow (I think) in the head. Dustin is an anti-hero & I didn't know he is a Maori. Criticised if he does anything 'wrong' but praised very sparingly. In an earlier comment, I asked why he received no AFL support after being abused by Collingwood fans whilst we couldn't do enough for Adam Goodes. Enough. You are right.
 

Defacto

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Why is everyone in this thread talking like it's one or the other? Both play a part in the determination of crime
great post...

and if the police force cannot find enough evidence to support their case, what hope does the AFL have in coming to a well considered penalty involving a lengthy ban?
 

Tiggytigers

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You're kidding right.

I think it would take me less than ten seconds to find a mountain of stories relating to physical and emotional abuse that never resulted in a charge because the victim refused to proceed.

It is in fact one of the core problems with violence against women, and one of the major reasons it is right now such a hot topic.

She didn't give a statement, so it didn't happen right? And now she's a liar.

God that sounds awfully familiar.....
Can you not read? The police said that from CCTV footage and talking to witnesses that no criminal offence occurred. Yes the lady didn't want to proceed but the police would just say that instead of saying that from the evidence given no criminal offence occurred. And hey no I didn't call her a liar, the police basically did. Is this to hard for you to comprehend or??
 

Jade

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Can you not read? The police said that from CCTV footage and talking to witnesses that no criminal offence occurred. Yes the lady didn't want to proceed but the police would just say that instead of saying that from the evidence given no criminal offence occurred. And hey no I didn't call her a liar, the police basically did. Is this to hard for you to comprehend or??
The police called her a liar did they?

My god the tangents.......

And the 'inferred' victim blaming in this thread is disgusting - and the reason this SHOULD be such a hot topic.
 

Brown Bottle

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I can only speak for myself, but it's not that I WANT Martin banned, it's that I know exactly how the AFL responds to even the inference of poor behaviour. Proof is not required in the world of the AFL.

Having said that, there is little doubt that Martin is a complete flog, and also little doubt that he was acting like a dick on the night in question - even if it is not known exactly what that entails.

Previous form would suggest that, yes, he will be penalised (to what extent I don't know).
You seem to be projecting mate
 

SnakeMan86

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Can you not read? The police said that from CCTV footage and talking to witnesses that no criminal offence occurred. Yes the lady didn't want to proceed but the police would just say that instead of saying that from the evidence given no criminal offence occurred. And hey no I didn't call her a liar, the police basically did. Is this to hard for you to comprehend or??
Its not that people cant read. This point and quote has been posted at least 100 times now, but unfortunately it doesn't support there agendas and thus chose to ignore it, or dispute the validity of it. It's quite sad.
 
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