Uncontracted Ed Langdon

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apuchar

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I imagine clubs will back themselves to improve his kicking to a reasonable level. Skills are irrelevant under Lyon.
 

Joao

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I imagine clubs will back themselves to improve his kicking to a reasonable level. Skills are irrelevant under Lyon.
Go read other clubs board and see how happy they are with their skill levels (especially after a loss).

His kicking is **** because his technique is ****. Unless his new club is going to remodel his action, he will always be ordinary at kicking.
 

Demon in Hell

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His kicking is **** because his technique is ****. Unless his new club is going to remodel his action, he will always be ordinary at kicking.
That, and being out of contact, are the reasons he is only worth a 3rd rounder.

No steak knives needed.
 

apuchar

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Go read other clubs board and see how happy they are with their skill levels (especially after a loss).

His kicking is **** because his technique is ****. Unless his new club is going to remodel his action, he will always be ordinary at kicking.
When he and Fyfe did extra kicking practice out of training times, his kicking improved to a reasonable level for a while. If his new club prioritises kicking in their normal training he may kick at a more acceptable level but he will never be a consistently great kick. WC were some of the worst kicks in the comp under Worsfold but that changed under Simpson. Even Pettucelle isn't as bad as he was as a junior. Not great but reasonable.
 

Marc_Remillard

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Who on Earth is reporting that? Freo could just trade him to one of the other interested Vic clubs if that were the case, considering Langdon doesn't have specific ties with Melbourne
Sorry mate, but it doesn't work like that, the club can't trade a player against his wishes. What happens is the player picks the club he wants to get a traded to and then a deal is worked out between the two clubs.

However, what is interesting in this case is that Freo's recent negotiating techniques have put a lot of other clubs off side, they are not a good club to trade with. So Melbourne trying to get him through the psd is a possibility.
 

Joao

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When he and Fyfe did extra kicking practice out of training times, his kicking improved to a reasonable level for a while. If his new club prioritises kicking in their normal training he may kick at a more acceptable level but he will never be a consistently great kick. WC were some of the worst kicks in the comp under Worsfold but that changed under Simpson. Even Pettucelle isn't as bad as he was as a junior. Not great but reasonable.
I can't be bothered arguing so how about we just make a bet. If ed moves clubs his new fans will regularly complain about his kicking until the end of his time there is my claim.

You in?
 

Peel67skin

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Sorry mate, but it doesn't work like that, the club can't trade a player against his wishes. What happens is the player picks the club he wants to get a traded to and then a deal is worked out between the two clubs.

However, what is interesting in this case is that Freo's recent negotiating techniques have put a lot of other clubs off side, they are not a good club to trade with. So Melbourne trying to get him through the psd is a possibility.
If he go PSd, isn't it a chance for GCS to get him, is it open to everyone. Weller definitely don't mind Langdon if you don't want to deal with Fremantle.
 

apuchar

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I can't be bothered arguing so how about we just make a bet. If ed moves clubs his new fans will regularly complain about his kicking until the end of his time there is my claim.

You in?
I complain about B Hills kicking at times. Not sure that means anything. It is clear when Langdon put more time into his kicking it improved and while it was never great it was at least reasonable. He hasn't been anywhere near reasonable this year, so it would be interesting to know if he has stopped doing extra training. As for the bet, I'm not competing with you, just making an observation.
 

Joao

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I complain about B Hills kicking at times. Not sure that means anything. It is clear when Langdon put more time into his kicking it improved and while it was never great it was at least reasonable. He hasn't been anywhere near reasonable this year, so it would be interesting to know if he has stopped doing extra training. As for the bet, I'm not competing with you, just making an observation.
I made an opposing observation and because I can't be bothered having an argument that I know will change neither of our minds it is simpler to just let it play out.

If you want me to rephrase my point, it is that Ed is, and will always be an ordinary kick and this is due to his technique. No amount of extra practice will get him to good (without remodelling his action) and certainly is not going to happen while he is an AFL player.
 

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apuchar

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I made an opposing observation and because I can't be bothered having an argument that I know will change neither of our minds it is simpler to just let it play out.

If you want me to rephrase my point, it is that Ed is, and will always be an ordinary kick and this is due to his technique. No amount of extra practice will get him to good (without remodelling his action) and certainly is not going to happen while he is an AFL player.
which doesn't tie in with his improvement when he did extra practice. Unless he changed his action while practising and because he is possibly no longer putting in extra practice his skill level has gone back to baseline.
 

Joao

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which doesn't tie in with his improvement when he did extra practice. Unless he changed his action while practising and because he is possibly no longer putting in extra practice his skill level has gone back to baseline.
Because his technique is gash he is going to fluctuate with his kicking (ie form), and that's exactly what I think happens. Practice might help a little to make it more consistent, but no matter what practice he does, he will still hack a good portion of his kicks.

Fyfe has definitely improved his kicking from slightly below average to slightly above, but his technique is better than Ed's so that is not surprising.

I am not saying practice doesn't help because clearly it does, but I am saying the reward for effort probably isn't there for kickers like Ed.
 

apuchar

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Because his technique is gash he is going to fluctuate with his kicking (ie form), and that's exactly what I think happens. Practice might help a little to make it more consistent, but no matter what practice he does, he will still hack a good portion of his kicks.

Fyfe has definitely improved his kicking from slightly below average to slightly above, but his technique is better than Ed's so that is not surprising.

I am not saying practice doesn't help because clearly it does, but I am saying the reward for effort probably isn't there for kickers like Ed.
I thought that too but skill acquisition and automatic performance research suggest differently. For a poor action to be changed the new action has to be practised and sufficiently enough to make it more automatic. As it is not automatic it is even more important to practice regularly to prevent you from returning to baseline. The lower the baseline the more practice is needed to be able to maintain a higher level. So if Ed put in extra practice, without going over the top, he could become a reasonable kick. Which is what happened. Without practice he has gone back to his old way.
 

Joao

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I thought that too but skill acquisition and automatic performance research suggest differently. For a poor action to be changed the new action has to be practised and sufficiently enough to make it more automatic. As it is not automatic it is even more important to practice regularly to prevent you from returning to baseline. The lower the baseline the more practice is needed to be able to maintain a higher level. So if Ed put in extra practice, without going over the top, he could become a reasonable kick. Which is what happened. Without practice he has gone back to his old way.
You are making huge assumptions there unless you have a log of precisely how much kicking training Ed does. Your point is mute until you can demonstrate that.
.
 

mike91

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Why would we give up a second rounder for a bloke who’s disposal is shocking.
Well, if you apply commonsense, you'll see that your team lacks speed, pressure and midfielders that actually run both ways.

If you think he can't kick and isn't worth a second, then literally your whole midfield isn't worth a second, because not one of them can kick straight
 

Theo X

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He has the odd shank, but overall it's comparable to a high possessions mid.
DE%
Clayton Oliver 69.9
Ed Langdon 69.4
Angus Brayshaw 64.4
While youre at it give us the % contested possessions for those players. Langdon shanks under no pressure.
 

Cobbler

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While youre at it give us the % contested possessions for those players. Langdon shanks under no pressure.
To the untrained eye he seems like he’s under no pressure.
I want you to visualise something for me... pretend your Langdon... on the wing free and easy... you have a bounce and look up the field. You have McCarthy scratching his arse, Darcy in the goal square and a mosquito fleet that includes the household names of Switkowski, Crowden, Schultz and our crumber Matera.

The defense rests your honour.
 

eastfreo75

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Sorry mate, but it doesn't work like that, the club can't trade a player against his wishes. What happens is the player picks the club he wants to get a traded to and then a deal is worked out between the two clubs.

However, what is interesting in this case is that Freo's recent negotiating techniques have put a lot of other clubs off side, they are not a good club to trade with. So Melbourne trying to get him through the psd is a possibility.
What tactics?

Everybody looks at the Weller trade. Mate, the Suns and Weller asked for a trade one day left in the trade period.

The kid got a massive offer from the Suns and they promised him the world.

Hogan was a fair deal and as was Neale’s.

Lobb deal worked well for both parties.

Wilson, B Hill and Hamling went for unders but wasn’t massive over the top.

Crozier deal was for a third rounder.

The McCarthy trade was fair.

Only the Weller trade was considered difficult to trade with. Suns leaving one day to get the trade done was pretty dumb.
 
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