Uncontracted Ed Langdon

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Unique Name

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 16, 2014
8,517
19,105
AFL Club
Fremantle
You reckon he's s**t?
He's a great team player, does a whole lot right. Gives 110% effort every game.


We've been discussing him a bit on our board. This was my last post that sums up my thoughts.

When fit our preferred distributors out the backline are Wilson, SHill and Ryan. It's their role to use the ball well and help us move the ball forward in an aggressive fashion. All three are injured so at the moment it's the lesser lights that are doing the distributing out of the back line. (Duman, Nyhuis, Logue, Hughes, etc.) Yes it would be great if they were better (we need our depth to be better if we want to move up the ladder). However they're the second string options and I'm not going to be as harsh on them as I am on the first string players.

- Ed Langdon is a first string player. He is our first choice midfielder to play on the opposite wing to BHill.
- When our team is fit we clearly try to get the ball to our designated distributors. SHill, Wilson, Ryan, BHill, Langdon, Walters, Mundy. (spot the odd one out)
- 71% of Ed Langdon's possessions were uncontested. Our mids were doing their part and feeding him the ball.
- Out of all our Best22 distributors, he is by far the worst. We may have depth players equally as bad, but that is why they are depth.
- Earlier in the year he was the 3rd worst kick i50 in the entire competition. 9 out of 10 times that he kicks inside 50 we do not retain the ball. Link
- A turnover from an outside midfielder is so much harder to defend, when an inside mid hack kicks it forward out of a pack the team know it's a 50/50 chance it's coming back. The defenders stay sharp and close to their opposite men. When an outside mid gets the ball in the clear the whole team streams forward assuming we are going to maintain position. Everyone is out of position when they turn it over. It hurts a lot more than it just being a missed scoring opportunity. How often have we seen it rebound straight back.
- His disposal efficiency looks good because he kicks the ball long and high (DPearce like). Very rarely is he able to spot up a target and kick to their advantage. He does not possess the skill to do so. Ed himself said this in an interview mid year. He is all about run and effort, not silky skills. (I'm trying to find this interview if anyone remembers it).


We keep talking about our lack of skills, our focus on effort over skill. I've never questioned Ed's effort, he always gives 110%. To me Ed Langdon is the personification of Ross Lyon 'Effort' ball. If we want to move forward we should be looking to offload him.


Also you mentioned him kicking at full tilt. How has he not learnt after 4-5 seasons to slow down a fraction before kicking.
 

Marc_Remillard

Angel of the Abyss
Jan 4, 2015
6,166
6,707
AFL Club
Melbourne
He's a great team player, does a whole lot right. Gives 110% effort every game.


We've been discussing him a bit on our board. This was my last post that sums up my thoughts.
Yes, going by your assessment of him he will definitely fit into the current Melbourne team

And all it costs us in a 2nd rounder

FMD
 

Sully90

Club Legend
Dec 24, 2011
1,419
2,145
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
Other Teams
Arsenal, Detroit Red Wings
Yes, going by your assessment of him he will definitely fit into the current Melbourne team

And all it costs us in a 2nd rounder

FMD
With Freo players it's hard to tell atm if their poor disposal is their own issue or if it was due to being coached by Ross Lyon for the past 4-8 years. If it's the latter and you manage to turn it around, then 20 for Langdon will look like an absolute steal for you over time. If not then at worse you've traded pick 20 for a hard running, long kicking wingman who gets alot of the ball. Not the worst situation in the world tbh.
 

Marc_Remillard

Angel of the Abyss
Jan 4, 2015
6,166
6,707
AFL Club
Melbourne
Even Freo fans have been saying he isn't good, more poor disposal is the last thing we need.

What's the point of getting a heap of the ball if 90% of his inside 50's goes to the opposition?

I would prefer to use our 2nd rounder to fill a need, not add to our existing problems
 

Marc_Remillard

Angel of the Abyss
Jan 4, 2015
6,166
6,707
AFL Club
Melbourne
With Freo players it's hard to tell atm if their poor disposal is their own issue or if it was due to being coached by Ross Lyon for the past 4-8 years. If it's the latter and you manage to turn it around, then 20 for Langdon will look like an absolute steal for you over time. If not then at worse you've traded pick 20 for a hard running, long kicking wingman who gets alot of the ball. Not the worst situation in the world tbh.
I've read your fans opinion of him, i can see how frustrating a player like him is. An early 2nd rounder for a bloke with terrible disposal is really poor imo. I would prefer we use that pick on a player that would make our team better, rather than more of the same

Freo would be extremely happy to offload him for an early 2nd rounder.
 

Damon_3388

Hall of Famer
Jun 23, 2008
31,940
25,008
Headed for Kirribilli House
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Norwood, Everton, Detroit Red Wings
He's a great team player, does a whole lot right. Gives 110% effort every game.


We've been discussing him a bit on our board. This was my last post that sums up my thoughts.
Yep, given his low contested possession rate (28.92%), Langdon's disposal efficiency (70.36%) and kicking efficiency (60.00%) is kind of poor. Those disposal and kicking efficiency numbers are similar to Fyfe, yet Fyfe has a far higher volume of contested possessions which will obviously affect his efficiency. They're also similar numbers to Andrew Gaff, who is also an outside winger, but has been criticised by many this year for just bombing blindly and not making the most of his touches.

Sure, Langdon kicks more than he handballs (1.39 kick-to-handball ratio), but given that he's not a super high inside 50 guy to counteract it (3.59 inside 50s per game, from 25 diposals per game), it kind of speaks to poor execution or decision making.
 

Purpellian Anchor

Purple Admiralty
Oct 14, 2011
2,297
1,526
Northam
AFL Club
Fremantle
Yep, given his low contested possession rate (28.92%), Langdon's disposal efficiency (70.36%) and kicking efficiency (60.00%) is kind of poor. Those disposal and kicking efficiency numbers are similar to Fyfe, yet Fyfe has a far higher volume of contested possessions which will obviously affect his efficiency. They're also similar numbers to Andrew Gaff, who is also an outside winger, but has been criticised by many this year for just bombing blindly and not making the most of his touches.

Sure, Langdon kicks more than he handballs (1.39 kick-to-handball ratio), but given that he's not a super high inside 50 guy to counteract it (3.59 inside 50s per game, from 25 diposals per game), it kind of speaks to poor execution or decision making.

Most can find fault with most of their players if we are looking with a critical eye and need for improvement. In short Langdon is in our best dozen irrespective of his kicking. That said, his value to us and to another club may be different. Really think he would be excellent at Collingwood for example to go with Stephenson in increasing their run and speed.
 

Damon_3388

Hall of Famer
Jun 23, 2008
31,940
25,008
Headed for Kirribilli House
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Norwood, Everton, Detroit Red Wings
Most can find fault with most of their players if we are looking with a critical eye and need for improvement. In short Langdon is in our best dozen irrespective of his kicking. That said, his value to us and to another club may be different. Really think he would be excellent at Collingwood for example to go with Stephenson in increasing their run and speed.
Oh, not saying he doesn't have value, and he's still only 23, so you'd think he's still got some improvement in him too, particularly if he can get some fit marking targets to kick to more regularly.

Not sure the cost will match the benefit for Collingwood getting him, as we've already got a number of winger types or guys who can grow into that role. I wouldn't say no outright to bringing him in, but I don't think the Pies would have or should use the currency that the Dockers would expect in return.
 

ilikepotatoes

Norm Smith Medallist
May 27, 2011
6,726
4,348
Australia
AFL Club
Fremantle
Other Teams
Liverpool, Pistons, Glory
Langdon's kicking went backwards by far this year. It was quite bizarre, never a great kick but there were multiple occasions this year where he missed his own boot or dribble it along the floor.

It's by far his most productive season, I wonder if he was more fatigued this year and given his age another preseason or two could help him improve that?
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

Sully90

Club Legend
Dec 24, 2011
1,419
2,145
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
Other Teams
Arsenal, Detroit Red Wings
I've read your fans opinion of him, i can see how frustrating a player like him is. An early 2nd rounder for a bloke with terrible disposal is really poor imo. I would prefer we use that pick on a player that would make our team better, rather than more of the same

Freo would be extremely happy to offload him for an early 2nd rounder.
So I'm going to go ahead and disagree with yourself and most of my fellow Freo fans on this one. There is no way Freo are "extremely happy" to "offload" him for an early second rounder. They've offered him a contract and would love to keep him. He's had 4 years of strong development and has turned into a hard running player who runs both ways.

But your main concern is over his kicking which I'm not going to defend to the hilt as as his stats so far speak for themselves. My only question is the cause of his average disposal (average, not terrible) which I think is more to do with being part of an environment which does not prioritise skills at all as well as consistently kicking into a forward line which has offered very little movement over the past 4 years. Despite his numbers, I've seen him slot enough goals beyond 40m and hit enough players on the lead that I think he will develop into a very effective inside 50 deliverer over time. He's only 24 next and has absolutely not hit his ceiling yet.

He has value beyond pick 20, and I think both Freo and Melbourne know that.
 

Quokka

Premiership Player
Apr 10, 2010
4,821
5,760
AFL Club
Fremantle
Even Freo fans have been saying he isn't good, more poor disposal is the last thing we need.

What's the point of getting a heap of the ball if 90% of his inside 50's goes to the opposition?

I would prefer to use our 2nd rounder to fill a need, not add to our existing problems
90% of his inside 50s end up with the opposition and yeah some of that has been his kicking and/or choice of targets... but Fremantle's forwards have also been a dodgy grab bag of odds and ends. And anyway he'd have been lucky if any two of them have been in front of him when he kicks.

That stat ain't all on Langdon.
 
Last edited:

Marc_Remillard

Angel of the Abyss
Jan 4, 2015
6,166
6,707
AFL Club
Melbourne
So I'm going to go ahead and disagree with yourself and most of my fellow Freo fans on this one. There is no way Freo are "extremely happy" to "offload" him for an early second rounder. They've offered him a contract and would love to keep him. He's had 4 years of strong development and has turned into a hard running player who runs both ways.

But your main concern is over his kicking which I'm not going to defend to the hilt as as his stats so far speak for themselves. My only question is the cause of his average disposal (average, not terrible) which I think is more to do with being part of an environment which does not prioritise skills at all as well as consistently kicking into a forward line which has offered very little movement over the past 4 years. Despite his numbers, I've seen him slot enough goals beyond 40m and hit enough players on the lead that I think he will develop into a very effective inside 50 deliverer over time. He's only 24 next and has absolutely not hit his ceiling yet.

He has value beyond pick 20, and I think both Freo and Melbourne know that.
Good reply however how is he going to improve his disposal under our environment?

I just think we should use that pick on another player who genuinely has the ability to improve our current issues.
 

Marc_Remillard

Angel of the Abyss
Jan 4, 2015
6,166
6,707
AFL Club
Melbourne
90% of his inside 50s end up with the opposition and yeah some of that has been his kicking and/or choice of targets... but Fremantle's forwards have also been a dodgy grab bag of odds and ends. And anyway he'd have been lucky if anyway two of them have been in front of him when he kicks.

That stat ain't all on Langdon.
And that's not going to improve at Melbourne.
 

Sully90

Club Legend
Dec 24, 2011
1,419
2,145
Perth
AFL Club
Fremantle
Other Teams
Arsenal, Detroit Red Wings
Good reply however how is he going to improve his disposal under our environment?

I just think we should use that pick on another player who genuinely has the ability to improve our current issues.
Good point, I understand Melbourne have had their own issues with forward I structure, I guess it depends on how much better you think Weideman and and McDonald are going to get at presenting targets. I don't know about their skills as a whole as I haven't watched enough Melbourne games to comment this year. I remember them being awesome at moving the ball in 2018 though.

With regards to your second point, I've never really valued picks outside of the top 10 in terms of success rate. That's more of a me thing though, and it's why I think you'd be better off spending your second round on a known quantity like Langdon who still has upside.
 

Marc_Remillard

Angel of the Abyss
Jan 4, 2015
6,166
6,707
AFL Club
Melbourne
Good point, I understand Melbourne have had their own issues with forward I structure, I guess it depends on how much better you think Weideman and and McDonald are going to get at presenting targets. I don't know about their skills as a whole as I haven't watched enough Melbourne games to comment this year. I remember them being awesome at moving the ball in 2018 though.

With regards to your second point, I've never really valued picks outside of the top 10 in terms of success rate. That's more of a me thing though, and it's why I think you'd be better off spending your second round on a known quantity like Langdon who still has upside.
It depends on who else is available
 

Purpellian Anchor

Purple Admiralty
Oct 14, 2011
2,297
1,526
Northam
AFL Club
Fremantle
Oh, not saying he doesn't have value, and he's still only 23, so you'd think he's still got some improvement in him too, particularly if he can get some fit marking targets to kick to more regularly.

Not sure the cost will match the benefit for Collingwood getting him, as we've already got a number of winger types or guys who can grow into that role. I wouldn't say no outright to bringing him in, but I don't think the Pies would have or should use the currency that the Dockers would expect in return.
Ed's kicking problem I suggest, without seeing him at training kicking casually, is because he is doing so when he is putting his body under maximum exertion re running toward goal or away from congestion etc. He just needs to learn from watch the likes of Stephen Hill (when he gets back on track) and gain composure by slowing down/or relaxing the body a little before he kicks. I think he will get better. If suddenly his kicking is say 10-15% up on the 70% efficiency now, how good a player is he then?
 

Damon_3388

Hall of Famer
Jun 23, 2008
31,940
25,008
Headed for Kirribilli House
AFL Club
Collingwood
Other Teams
Norwood, Everton, Detroit Red Wings
Ed's kicking problem I suggest, without seeing him at training kicking casually, is because he is doing so when he is putting his body under maximum exertion re running toward goal or away from congestion etc. He just needs to learn from watch the likes of Stephen Hill (when he gets back on track) and gain composure by slowing down/or relaxing the body a little before he kicks. I think he will get better. If suddenly his kicking is say 10-15% up on the 70% efficiency now, how good a player is he then?
If he can suddenly increase his disposal efficiency by 10-15%, he'd suddenly be the best ball user in the league.

That's probably too extreme a jump to expect, though. If he can get the overall efficiency to 75%, and the kicking efficiency to 65% (and turning this into more inside 50s and score involvements, too), while getting the same amount of ball and maintaining the same kick-to-handball ratio, then that'd be fine and he'd be pushing hard towards AA status.
 

mike91

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 13, 2011
8,441
10,640
Melbourne
AFL Club
Fremantle
Even Freo fans have been saying he isn't good, more poor disposal is the last thing we need.

What's the point of getting a heap of the ball if 90% of his inside 50's goes to the opposition?

I would prefer to use our 2nd rounder to fill a need, not add to our existing problems
Mate, Langdon is good. Freo fans are salty, if a player leaves they throw a tantrum. The smack talk about Weller and Neale, add Langdon for most of the year, dead set cringe.

The freo board overrates average players and are convinced proven spuds will turn into guns, meanwhile mock Langdon......logic.

Trust me, Langdon for #20(#21) is a good result for you.
 

Top Bottom