Enough is enough

[Strapping Young Lad]

Gee you spend an inordinate amount of time on this site running from thread to thread getting triggered by anyone using the term woke in the pejorative. Get over it.

Having said that, the only reason I am still reading this dumbass thread is to find out more about these stampeding pink elephants. So I guess well done for raising the effort to take it seriously

Post needs more hyperbole.

 

[Mr Meow]

Hahaha.

Learn to use a dictionary son.

You're all over the place.

 

[Piggy Smalls]

In 2022 around 2,300 Aussie men committed suicide

I acknowledge I’m not keeping track but I know of 3 former afl players that have committed suicide ever.

Frawley plus 2 from the last few days

Shane Yarran. Shane Tuck. Cam McCarthy. Harley Balic.

 

[Bucking Bronco]

It’s woke to be worried about being sued now, apparently.

The stuff that the AFL is outlawing now isn't due to culpability.

Eddie Maguire went over this on the podcast he does with Bartel.

Concussion protocols, in-game head injury assessment and some direct contact stuff like the Pickett hits are things that they are legally obligated to put parameters in place for.

They are just executing their own woke discretion at this point.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

The stuff that the AFL is outlawing now isn't due to culpability.

Eddie Maguire went over this on the podcast he does with Bartel.

Concussion protocols, in-game head injury assessment and some direct contact stuff like the Pickett hits are things that they are legally obligated to put parameters in place for.

They are just executing their own woke discretion at this point.

Difficult to predict with that sort of level of certainty what a future court might find they should or shouldn’t have done in 2025 to meet their duty of care. The more they do, the more likely they’ll avoid liability.

If you think the old-school ex-football players currently in charge of the game are reducing the level of contact because they have some sort of “woke” agenda, whatever that might be, then I’m afraid you’re looking for woke where no woke exists.

They’re doing it for financial reasons - avoiding liability and minimising any drop in participation numbers from parents worried about their kids’ wellbeing. And maybe, somewhere deep down, they’d like to reduce the number of players who end up with brain damage at the end of their careers as a bit of a bonus.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

One thing the AFL, NRL and perhaps other codes need to be doing is really encouraging everyday footy supporters to get involved in their local footy club.

You can be a member at a AFL club but you’re not a member in a social sense, you’re just a season ticket buyer with hundreds of thousands of other strangers.

From the moment we leave school we can start leaving behind constant, friendly structures. A place where you belong, which is always there for you, where you form strong bonds through day-to-day life. Where you have people who know you around you constantly and you’re far less isolated.

Some people get it at work but many don’t, and even work has become more isolated for many since COVID.

A sporting club full of familiar faces that you get up and visit a couple of times a week can become a tremendous support. It’s not work or home and nothing is expected of you except to be there.

This is an established personal network that these sports already have but more needs to be done to pull people into them and let them know they’re welcome. God knows the clubs would love to have them.

They basically have what is thousands of men’s sheds across the country and they should employ them in the mental health space.

 

[demondavey]

It is woke.

The AFL have an unhealthy obsession with being liked.

It has crossed the point of them making changes due to what they're legally obligated to do, and now ventured into them making changes based on "image"/ "well-being".

Those are all great things, in most instances, but when you are operating within the confines of a contact sport, those things don't jive, unless you want to completely overhaul the fabric of the game, which they are now half-way to doing.

As you said, are we going to now look at removing speccies because they cause CTE?

Buddy, this is a contact sport.

Athletes pursuing a career in the AFL should be doing so, under the expectation that they will get concussed 15-20 times across the course of their junior/ adult career, it comes with the territory of being an athlete playing a contact sport.

Yes, the AFL should do everything they can to remove unnecessary instances that don't actually add anything to the game of benefit like the Pickett bumps, and the slinging tackles, but taking things away like hard-fought tackles/ bumps that don't make any contact with the head (like Dan Houston's), is literally a one-way ticket to turning the sport into basketball on grass.

No one is forcing anyone to play AFL.

If people don't want to run the risk of getting concussed, then they can go play non-contact sports that don't carry the risk of CTE like tennis, or work a mundane live in an office/ on a work site.

If you think the focus on the well being of players is woke then you have a big problem, and it often gets the label toxic masculinity.

Who gets concussed 15-20 times?

 

[Bucking Bronco]

Difficult to predict with that sort of level of certainty what a future court might find they should or shouldn’t have done in 2025 to meet their duty of care. The more they do, the more likely they’ll avoid liability.

If you think the old-school ex-football players currently in charge of the game are reducing the level of contact because they have some sort of “woke” agenda, whatever that might be, then I’m afraid you’re looking for woke where no woke exists.

They’re doing it for financial reasons - avoiding liability and minimising any drop in participation numbers from parents worried about their kids’ wellbeing. And maybe, somewhere deep down, they’d like to reduce the number of players who end up with brain damage at the end of their careers as a bit of a bonus.

That's not how it works.

You can't get sued for something like that that you had no idea about at the time.

The only reason the AFL and NFL has been sued recently is because it's alleged that they knew about the dangers of concussions, and didn't start mitigating for it a lot sooner - IE, they should have been doing concussion protocols, and head injury assessments many, many years earlier.

Eddie Maguire has stated that the changes the AFL are making - they are not legally obligated to be making, they are making them of their own volition.

Do you think you are in better position to make a informed call than him, sir?

 

[Bucking Bronco]

If you think the focus on the well being of players is woke then you have a big problem, and it often gets the label toxic masculinity.

Who gets concussed 15-20 times?

When it's changing the fabric of the game, such as potentially removing speccies, then yeah it is woke.

No one is forcing them to play AFL.

Everyone understands the risks of playing a contact sport like the AFL, you do so at your own risk.

Any player who plays until they're 30 would get concussed 15-20 across junior & senior football, when you include games/ training.

Now enough discussion.

You don't get it, you think it's some personal sociological ideation, when it's just common sense.

 

[boncer34]

Im sorry but this needs its own thread and needs one ASAP

Enough is enough

If AFL can find 600 million for ****ing Gold Coast they can find some for well the actual players

We as fans need to demand better. This is just not on. Its a black stain on the game right now. It cannot contimue for even 1 day more. The top brass need to have some class and announce some funding for supporting current and ex players NOW.

Dancing around the subject and losing 1 more life cant happen.

FIX IT NOW!!!!

Hunter didnt die of suicide.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/incredibly-sad-west-coast-eagles-great-dead-at-age-43/news-story/b9eb6db50a81364598f358e679ce3526

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

When it's changing the fabric of the game, such as potentially removing speccies, then yeah it is woke.

Has there been a suggestion, even in passing, of removing speccies?

 

[iameviljez]

That's not how it works.

You can't get sued for something like that that you had no idea about at the time.

I'm not sure that's actually true, to be fair.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Hunter didnt die of suicide.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/incredibly-sad-west-coast-eagles-great-dead-at-age-43/news-story/b9eb6db50a81364598f358e679ce3526

I never said he did? The thought was always a drug overdose. Its why im comparing the situation to Ben Cousins and the need for rehab

 

[ferball]

I don't want stomp all over the good intentions of high profile and seemingly caring people who encourage men to talk regarding their mental state to combat the societal shame of doing so.

However that messaging is a little simplistic to me. If talking was the answer, then why do still a large number of mental illness sufferers still die by suicide even when in treatment.

It seems to me the drivers of why someone kills themselves aren't necessarily relieved by talking about problems. But that is often presented as the solution to personal problems that may lead to suicide.

It's like when we hear of a suicide, the response "we need to talk more" is trotted out every time, seemingly assuming if this person did talk then the suicide wouldn't have happened.

I know people who claim listening to music saved their lives. Usually the music is along way from mainstream music too. Yet other people who listen to the same music sometimes choose to die anyway.

Sometimes it's a fluke phone call from a friend, loved one or old friend at just the right moment. Sometimes these things don't help either.

There are people for whom talking or therapy worked, as well as people who killed themselves cos it didn't.

I know people who reckon decades of heroin use stopped them from ending their lives and when they were ready for treatment they got it.

But I also agree that claiming that talking is a cure for suicide is really dangerous cos if it isn't working for someone at that particular moment it may make things worse. If that's your point.

There are no easy answers but the AFL should definitely be ponying up shitloads of cash to support men's mental health.

On CPH2069 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[boncer34]

I never said he did? The thought was always a drug overdose. Its why im comparing the situation to Ben Cousins and the need for rehab

Oh when you said it was mental health and concussions I assumed you were talking suicide.

 

[iameviljez]

Oh when you said it was mental health and concussions I assumed you were talking suicide.

To be fair, OP has talked a lot about Ben Cousins seeming to get clean, so it's plausible.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

That's not how it works.

You can't get sued for something like that that you had no idea about at the time.

The only reason the AFL and NFL has been sued recently is because it's alleged that they knew about the dangers of concussions, and didn't start mitigating for it a lot sooner - IE, they should have been doing concussion protocols, and head injury assessments many, many years earlier.

Eddie Maguire has stated that the changes the AFL are making - they are not legally obligated to be making, they are making them of their own volition.

Do you think you are in better position to make a informed call than him, sir?

I guarantee I’m in a better position to explain how the law works than you are.

I’m also pretty sceptical that Maguire actually said what you’re saying he said. I suspect it’s your interpretation of what you heard.

The AFL is being sued right now, and will be shit scared of being sued even harder in the future by players who will claim that they (the AFL) knew of the dangers of repeated concussions and didn’t do enough to protect players.

So they’re doing things now to protect players - instituting mandatory checks after head knocks, the 12 day protocols, the assessment panel for players that have had repeated knocks, cracking down on illegal head-high contact, cracking down on tackles that involve the player hitting their head on the ground, etc. I don’t know where or how (or if) Maguire draws a line and says “some of that we’re obligated to do, some of it we’re not.”

And even they’re not actually obligated to do something, it’s still something they can point to down the line and say “this is an additional measure we took to protect our players, this is something we did to meet our duty of care”.

That’s the actual reason they’re bringing in changes. Not because it suits their “woke agenda”, which … I don’t even understand that argument. Why are they supposedly doing it as part of a woke agenda? Just to piss off people like you? I don’t get it. Explain it to me.

 

[Cmarsh]

I know people who claim listening to music saved their lives. Usually the music is along way from mainstream music too. Yet other people who listen to the same music sometimes choose to die anyway.

Sometimes it's a fluke phone call from a friend, loved one or old friend at just the right moment. Sometimes these things don't help either.

There are people for whom talking or therapy worked, as well as people who killed themselves cos it didn't.

I know people who reckon decades of heroin use stopped them from ending their lives and when they were ready for treatment they got it.

But I also agree that claiming that talking is a cure for suicide is really dangerous cos if it isn't working for someone at that particular moment it may make things worse. If that's your point.

There are no easy answers but the AFL should definitely be ponying up shitloads of cash to support men's mental health.

On CPH2069 using BigFooty.com mobile app

Don't want to put too much responsibility of the AFL when much bigger entities who are directly responsible for this area are actively neglectful. Are you aware what's happening in the NSW health system at the moment? Govt doesn't want to pay Psychiatrists a competitive wage so they are resigning and mental health beds and units are closing. It's a disaster.

 

[The City Boyz]

Shane Yarran. Shane Tuck. Cam McCarthy. Harley Balic.

Balic wasn’t a suicide

 

[Toump Ass]

Goddamn how much partying was going on at West Coast Eagles.

Mainwaring dead. Ben Cousins we all know about. Kerr was on everything, got done for dealing Ketamine IIRC, basically a bum now from what I read on here. Chad Fletcher, heart attack in Las Vegas on the coke, I'm pretty sure? Daniel Chick battled drugs too, he's also a bum.

Hunter got done for doing Cocaine in 2014, and Police have now CONFIRMED his death was not suicide and also CONFIRMED drugs and drug paraphernalias were found on site.

 

[Toump Ass]

Balic wasn’t a suicide

Damn, I thought it was too. Think that was the suggestion at the time.
Turns out it was a heroin overdose. Don't see that very often these days.

 

[demondavey]

When it's changing the fabric of the game, such as potentially removing speccies, then yeah it is woke.

No one is forcing them to play AFL.

Everyone understands the risks of playing a contact sport like the AFL, you do so at your own risk.

Any player who plays until they're 30 would get concussed 15-20 across junior & senior football, when you include games/ training.

Now enough discussion.

You don't get it, you think it's some personal sociological ideation, when it's just common sense.

Absolutely ridiculous. Concussed once a year on average until you’re 30. No idea where you’ve pulled that. Thin air statistic.

I actually didn’t advocate for banning the speccie, just that it may be considered one day.

No mate, you’re not forced to play AFL, just like you’re not forced to work down a mine, however your employer has a duty of care to you.

 

[Bucking Bronco]

Absolutely ridiculous. Concussed once a year on average until you’re 30. No idea where you’ve pulled that. Thin air statistic.

I actually didn’t advocate for banning the speccie, just that it may be considered one day.

No mate, you’re not forced to play AFL, just like you’re not forced to work down a mine, however your employer has a duty of care to you.

You think it's unreasonable that a player who plays from the age of 7 to 31 (25 seasons), would get concussed just over once every 2 seasons?

15 concussions divided by 25 seasons equals 0.6 concussions per year btw, seeing as you seem like you will probably have trouble equating that.

Duty of care is not the bee-all, you have assumption of risk among many other things.

Comparing a job, with a form of entertainment, whose attractiveness hinges solely on how they are able to display the essence of their product to a paying-viewing audience, is the kind of stuff I am coming to expect from this discussion with you

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

I get the feeling someone might have been concussed more than the average.

7 year olds getting concussed in non contact Auskick in record numbers, apparently.

 

[Bucking Bronco]

I guarantee I’m in a better position to explain how the law works than you are.

I’m also pretty sceptical that Maguire actually said what you’re saying he said. I suspect it’s your interpretation of what you heard.

The AFL is being sued right now, and will be shit scared of being sued even harder in the future by players who will claim that they (the AFL) knew of the dangers of repeated concussions and didn’t do enough to protect players.

So they’re doing things now to protect players - instituting mandatory checks after head knocks, the 12 day protocols, the assessment panel for players that have had repeated knocks, cracking down on illegal head-high contact, cracking down on tackles that involve the player hitting their head on the ground, etc. I don’t know where or how (or if) Maguire draws a line and says “some of that we’re obligated to do, some of it we’re not.”

And even they’re not actually obligated to do something, it’s still something they can point to down the line and say “this is an additional measure we took to protect our players, this is something we did to meet our duty of care”.

That’s the actual reason they’re bringing in changes. Not because it suits their “woke agenda”, which … I don’t even understand that argument. Why are they supposedly doing it as part of a woke agenda? Just to piss off people like you? I don’t get it. Explain it to me.

I have already explained this stuff in previous replies.

The AFL is woke.

They are operating on the same plane as Disney.

Do I need to explain to you how Disney is woke?

You can't sue someone if you get sick from a material that you came into contact with on the job, if no one in the world knew it caused people to get sick. It's called foreseeability.

Unless you are a lawyer yourself, then no you probably can't guarantee anything.

You have no idea who I am lmao