Toast Esava

[Turbocat]

His first goal from Saturday night needs to be Exhibit A whenever the discussion of his supposed 'upside' is raised again.

The number of players 195 and above who could even pick up that footy cleanly at pace is surely able to be counted on one hand. Let alone spin around and snap it straight through the goals without breaking stride.

And all this from a 19-year latecomer to footy. With less than 20 AFL games to his name.

Just play him. And then play him some more. And, if he begins to really struggle, think about giving him a rest.

Before playing him yet again, anyway.

He really could be that good.

He is 2 months short of 21 (july24 1998)..

I was impressed with his straight line pace against alir alir... looked like he had hima few different times... he should be encouraged to lead more

 

[Turbocat]

'Put me on Lenny and I will destroy him' - bartel told bomber at quarter time

Did he?

 

[Sttew]

Loved Sav's game on Saturday. He was 100% worth persevering with

 

[goyoucatters]

He is 2 months short of 21 (july24 1998)..

I was impressed with his straight line pace against alir alir... looked like he had hima few different times... he should be encouraged to lead more

Sorry, Turbocat. Thanks for the correction.

And you're right about his pace. Coupled with his overall bulk, it makes him a frightening proposition when leading up at the football with some space in front of him. As Aliir found out just in time for Esava's second goal on Saturday night.

 

[Turbocat]

Loved Sav's game on Saturday. He was 100% worth persevering with

As a lot have been saying. He will have plenty of poor games yet...but once he is up to 50-80 games id expect that type of performance or better on a regular basis

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

As good as Sav's first goal was (and for a big bloke it was brilliant) I was equally impressed with his second, but for different reasons. We already know how athletically gifted he is and the first goal was further proof of that; but the second goal is what I want to see more of - some bread and butter forward work. Sav took front position against Aliir then pushed back hard on him and treaded (trod?) water for a few steps to protect the drop zone, before attempting to break away at the ball. By that point Aliir had no option but to concede the mark or hold Sav and give away a free kick.

It's standard forward craft, but I think that's an area that Sav needs to improve rather than always relying on his athleticism to get to the ball. It was also pleasing to see him nail the set shot - more of that please!

 

[David the Cat]

As good as Sav's first goal was (and for a big bloke it was brilliant) I was equally impressed with his second, but for different reasons. We already know how athletically gifted he is and the first goal was further proof of that; but the second goal is what I want to see more of - some bread and butter forward work. Sav took front position against Aliir then pushed back hard on him and treaded (trod?) water for a few steps to protect the drop zone, before attempting to break away at the ball. By that point Aliir had no option but to concede the mark or hold Sav and give away a free kick.

It's standard forward craft, but I think that's an area that Sav needs to improve rather than always relying on his athleticism to get to the ball. It was also pleasing to see him nail the set shot - more of that please!

Its "trod"......

Sav is a goer all right....and a Scott favourite...

Mark him down as a 100+ game player...notwithstanding a run of injuries.

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

Its "trod"......

Sav is a goer all right....and a Scott favourite...

Mark him down as a 100+ game player...notwithstanding a run of injuries.

Haha, cheers. They both sounded wrong in my head.

No doubt he's a favourite, the fact he was even playing on the weekend is testament to that.

I meant to mention in that last post that the body work Sav showed for his second goal reminded me a lot of how Hawkins uses his body in that situation. Probably not a coincidence and no one better currently running around to learn it from.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Did all you can ask for him to keep his spot... kicked his two goals.

I wasn’t overly impressed with his game as a whole. Alir quite often felt he could peel off esava and double team Hawkins or float as a ranger in defense. Didn’t feel he had to be standing next to esava at all times. Which worries me moving forward if this is the level of respect he gets and things begin to get tougher for hawk.

Only took one mark for the game which was a concern.

His footy smarts and positioning are atrocious right now for someone in his third AFL season.

Has a lot of work to do to make it. But has the potential which is all you can call it right now.

 

[Play it Sam]

Did all you can ask for him to keep his spot... kicked his two goals.

I wasn’t overly impressed with his game as a whole. Alir quite often felt he could peel off esava and double team Hawkins or float as a ranger in defense. Didn’t feel he had to be standing next to esava at all times. Which worries me moving forward if this is the level of respect he gets and things begin to get tougher for hawk.

Only took one mark for the game which was a concern.

His footy smarts and positioning are atrocious right now for someone in his third AFL season.

Has a lot of work to do to make it. But has the potential which is all you can call it right now.

I agree with this. He has a loping style and when you're that big it takes effort to bounce straight back up after hitting the ground/failed intercept. He doesn't show enough orientation and urgency in that respect. The spectacularly athletic goal whilst confidence instilling, only accounted for six needed points, and his set shots are nerve wracking. Handballs fair, ruck work just a huge body in there to bustle without finesse,. marking inconsistent. He's getting a fair crack, and learning but earmarked for bigger things, and he knows it. Need patience for the big man before covering him in accolades.

 

[Mr Meow]

I agree with this. He has a loping style and when you're that big it takes effort to bounce straight back up after hitting the ground/failed intercept. He doesn't show enough orientation and urgency in that respect. The spectacularly athletic goal whilst confidence instilling, only accounted for six needed points, and his set shots are nerve wracking. Handballs fair, ruck work just a huge body in there to bustle without finesse,. marking inconsistent. He's getting a fair crack, and learning but earmarked for bigger things, and he knows it. Need patience for the big man before covering him in accolades.

What about the several contests he dived into - winning a mark, spoiling what was a certain opposition intercept, or digging a handball out to start an attacking chain? Sav was very good on the weekend. If you want to narrow in on limitations, at least use another match.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

What about the several contests he dived into - winning a mark, spoiling what was a certain opposition intercept, or digging a handball out to start an attacking chain? Sav was very good on the weekend. If you want to narrow in on limitations, at least use another match.

He did do a couple of things but it wasn’t a great game.

Alir had 20 touches and took 9 marks... sey only took one mark. Alir also set up a lot and played as an interceptor. So when you say sav was intercepting he did it only once, he actually got pretty badly beaten most of the game by alir in the air.

I would give the points easily to alir for the game if it was a boxing match for each other’s blows. He did a bit of damage to us back there on sav.

 

[Play it Sam]

What about the several contests he dived into - winning a mark, spoiling what was a certain opposition intercept, or digging a handball out to start an attacking chain? Sav was very good on the weekend. If you want to narrow in on limitations, at least use another match.

I'm speaking sum of parts-overall games. Sav did do very well, compared to his last few intermittent games, and given his previous injury, age and experience base. The most avid admirer has to admit that he's raw. Raw equals inconsistent. That doesn't mean I'm belittling what he has achieved, just hopeful for an even better return and more focus as he assimilates. I'm enjoying watching him blossom, as a supporter and an acquaintance.

 

[Mr Meow]

He did do a couple of things but it wasn’t a great game.

Alir had 20 touches and took 9 marks... sey only took one mark. Alir also set up a lot and played as an interceptor. So when you say sav was intercepting he did it only once, he actually got pretty badly beaten most of the game by alir in the air.

I would give the points easily to alir for the game if it was a boxing match for each other’s blows. He did a bit of damage to us back there on sav.

I thought Aliir played well also. It was a good match up. Allir was good in the air, while most of Sav's 10 handballs came from ground balls. He got to plenty of contests and the outcome afterwards was quite often positive.

Fort the week before was shocking by comparison. He only entered my TV screen about 10 times, with a few handballs tantamount to his entire contribution. Sav's influence in the Sydney game exceeded that of Fort's from even the week before that, the 3 goal game where he did nothing else.

The MC know what they are doing in this case. I'll only get worried once you get on the MC and start playing Fort/Abbot/Buzza ahead of a fully fit Sav on a consistent basis. Scott's faith in Sav shows he knows what he's doing more than his favourite devotee, so best pay respect to your hero on this one.

 

[Mr Meow]

I'm speaking sum of parts-overall games. Sav did do very well, compared to his last few intermittent games, and given his previous injury, age and experience base. The most avid admirer has to admit that he's raw. Raw equals inconsistent. That doesn't mean I'm belittling what he has achieved, just hopeful for an even better return and more focus as he assimilates. I'm enjoying watching him blossom, as a supporter and an acquaintance.

Oh right, sorry I thought this was exclusively contained to the Sydney game. I definitely see what you're saying. At times he has looked flat and down on confidence. Especially on the set shot kicking. I truly believe that if nothing was changed except a steadier conversion rate, his confidence would be up and his general impact would rise a significant amount. He is that sort of player. Which makes it a frustrating journey sometimes to persist with, but I really think we are doing the right thing backing him in unless he is SO devoid of confidence nothing except extended absence from Seniors could recuperate him for a second charge. I don't think he's at that stage yet. We will reap the rewards with this approach, I reckon.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

I thought Aliir played well also. It was a good match up. Allir was good in the air, while most of Sav's 10 handballs came from ground balls. He got to plenty of contests and the outcome afterwards was quite often positive.

Fort the week before was shocking by comparison. He only entered my TV screen about 10 times, with a few handballs tantamount to his entire contribution. Sav's influence in the Sydney game exceeded that of Fort's from even the week before that, the 3 goal game where he did nothing else.

The MC know what they are doing in this case. I'll only get worried once you get on the MC and start playing Fort/Abbot/Buzza ahead of a fully fit Sav on a consistent basis. Scott's faith in Sav shows he knows what he's doing more than his favourite devotee, so best pay respect to your hero on this one.

I never said I wanted fort abbot buzza in I actually said he keeps his spot in a post above. Also check who started this toast thread and argued lots in the first few pages. I am pretty balanced on the topic and call it how it is.

I don’t think I have ever once complained or attacked MC about anything selection like yourself and others do. I just always respect their opinions.

His season has been pretty poor by any stretch as a key forward this year, but his upside is very good and you can see why they persist with him as there is potential.

But to call it anymore then potential with his low output this year is just wrong.

 

[Mr Meow]

I never said I wanted fort abbot buzza in I actually said he keeps his spot in a post above. Also check who started this toast thread and argued lots in the first few pages. I am pretty balanced on the topic and call it how it is.

I don’t think I have ever once complained or attacked MC about anything selection like yourself and others do. I just always respect their opinions.

His season has been pretty poor by any stretch as a key forward this year, but his upside is very good and you can see why they persist with him as there is potential.

But to call it anymore then potential with his low output this year is just wrong.

I'm just stirring you up a bit, Crazy. I know - I'm cruel.

You've made me contemplate if I have had serious MC attackings. I was never even on the "Kill Parsons" or "Blicavs is useless" committees. Probably on the "too tall"ers when Kolo was played on the wing and we had one too many slow/tall veterans in the backline. However now, the balance is pretty much perfect.

So how dare you call me an MC attacker. I bid you good day, sir!

 

[Play it Sam]

I thought Aliir played well also. It was a good match up. Allir was good in the air, while most of Sav's 10 handballs came from ground balls. He got to plenty of contests and the outcome afterwards was quite often positive.

Fort the week before was shocking by comparison. He only entered my TV screen about 10 times, with a few handballs tantamount to his entire contribution. Sav's influence in the Sydney game exceeded that of Fort's from even the week before that, the 3 goal game where he did nothing else.

The MC know what they are doing in this case. I'll only get worried once you get on the MC and start playing Fort/Abbot/Buzza ahead of a fully fit Sav on a consistent basis. Scott's faith in Sav shows he knows what he's doing more than his favourite devotee, so best pay respect to your hero on this one.

Who mentioned Fort? You did, deflecting, by comparing Sav to the lowest common denominator. I read that he'd done enough with 2 goals and general play to keep his place. How does that add up to a Fort/Buzza/Abbot preference? Sav is not immune to criticism on your say so.
BTW: Sarcasm might be witty but doesn't win points, your MC crack was irrelevant.

EDIT: Oh okay, I see you two have thrashed it out before my slow fingers pressed enter. Off to Bedfordshire (no hard feelings). Haha.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

I'm just stirring you up a bit, Crazy. I know - I'm cruel.

You've made me contemplate if I have had serious MC attackings. I was never even on the "Kill Parsons" or "Blicavs is useless" committees. Probably on the "too tall"ers when Kolo was played on the wing and we had one too many slow/tall veterans in the backline. However now, the balance is pretty much perfect.

So how dare you call me an MC attacker. I bid you good day, sir!

All good mate. Not sure if you personally ever have either but I know MC selection seems to be a favourite criticism on this board in general so I stereotyped.

I think we are due for a big sav screamer soon don’t you think?? Get a bit of timing and confidence back in his marking that was so good initially last year

 

[Warhorse]

Sav got well beaten in the air and I thought it was one his worse games in that regard

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

I wonder how many of Aliir's marks came in the first half compared to the second - anyone know? I thought Sav allowed Aliir to intercept too easily in the first half, but tightened up on it in the second so I'd be interested to know if the stats bear that out.

To be fair to Sav, Aliir is one of the best intercept marks in the league (second most behind McGovern this year) so it was to be expected that he'd grab a few. I just wanted to see Sav get more involved - he's been invisible in quite a few of his matches this year - which he did; his highest disposal (and goal) count for the year shows that, and his pressure was noticeable - I can recall at least a few occasions where a Sydney player shanked a kick coming out of our forward 50 due to Sav's chasing.

There's still plenty to work on - I want to see him clunk a few marks, in particular - but it was a big step in the right direction. It was easily the best game we've seen from either he or Fort in that CHF/2nd ruck role this year, so he's got people like me off his back regarding his selection at least!

 

[Ratcat]

Sav did what l hoped he might after being rightfully dropped from the team, he worked harder especially when cruising forward.
16 possessions when his season average is 7 was a big stepup
Big forwards kicking a good share is what wins flags 9 times out of 10, so In my view he's more importantly a CHF than Stanley's assistant.

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

Sav did what l hoped he might after being rightfully dropped from the team, he worked harder especially when cruising forward.
16 possessions when his season average is 7 was a big stepup
Big forwards kicking a good share is what wins flags 9 times out of 10.
In my view he's more importantly a CHF than Stanley's assistant.

Don't think you can say he was dropped since he never played VFL and came straight back into the side. Also, it's hard to say whether he 'worked harder' on Saturday or just benefited from the rest, but I'm more inclined to go with the latter. He definitely looked to be moving better to my eyes. I think it's easy to forget how significant an injury a leg break like his is - plenty of examples of players taking a while to come back from them.

 

[Drunkcat]

At this stage of his career that's all he has to do need at least 1 goal a game anything more is a bonus

 

[The rabbi]

What did the big fella kick in the final tonight? Was it 3 goals in a final?
Seriously, we have to decide to develop our young players instead of looking to 30+ year old players to be the saviours of the club.