Essendon 29k?

[Chaz Pendlebury]

You were 2-1 coming into a round 4 match coming off a flag.

You also got 11,682 versu Port when you missed the finals in 2004.

Essendon and Collingwood both have a minimum of 30,000-ish that they never drop below when the Pies and Dons are struggling.

Last 4 have been sub 30,000, including 27,000 odd last year against freo (finals year).

We averaged 35,000 at our two games against freo and port at the dome in 04/05...

 

[Art Corvelay]

Essendon and Collingwood both have a minimum of 30,000-ish that they never drop below when the Pies and Dons are struggling.

The Essendon v Port game only drew 29k to a 50k seat stadium on a sunny Saturday afternoon.

I lol'd again Dan - unless 29k is now more then 30k Semantics are fun

 

[noffle]

I think that this thread went over (almost) everyone's head.

 

[memberforever]

Saturday afternoon games are awful times for games, effectively rules out

Are you joking, Saturday afternoon in Melbourne is traditional football day. Should get some big crowds on Saturdays.

 

[Frothies Mcveigh]

Pointless thread.

Saturday afternoon, people are playing sport, low Port Adelaide fan base in Melbourne. Also its Mothers Day weekend so people are generally doing family things.

 

[Dont be a lemon]

Does anyone have a source for the exact crowd figure? I can't seem to find it.

 

[Scotland]

Seriously are you another one of those mentally challenged West Coast fans who doesn't consider common sense before deciding to press the 'Submit Reply' button on here?

As of today Essendon have 40,041 members in a 10 team town & West Coast 53,958 in a 2 team town ... despite having over 13,000 more members you are bragging about having a little over 6,000 more to your game? Yeah, great theory...

I guess you're going to tell me next that the Eagles are a better side than the Dockers despite winning 4 less games and losing by 7 goals last week?

LOL.

I couldn't give a rats arse how many 'members' you have or how many supporters you think you have.

Essendon and Collingwood fans religiously talk up how wonderful their clubs and how great their crowds are. We are shit, played a shit team in a shit timeslot and still had 36,000 West Coast fans show up. Where were all your fans?

 

[BACCS]

Incredibly ignorant thread.

Essendon and Collingwood are the only Victorian clubs who can get between 40-50,000 versus West Coast, Adelaide, Fremantle and Port on a regular basis.

When both Essendon and Collingwood are struggling (Essendon was 2-4 going into the game), games against those low-drawing opponents tend to drop to a minimum of 30,000-ish.

In 2007, when the Bombers were in form, 47,000 saw them play West Coast at the Dome.

And the two biggest crowds Fremantle has played in front of in Melbourne were 42,256 at the Dome (vs Essendon in '03) and 45,383 at the MCG vs Collingwood in '08.

Essendon and Collingwood should draw large crowds against Adelaide in Melbourne, because unlike Port, we have a strong supporter base over there and wouldn't be suprised if we outnumbered NM supporters at Etihad next weekend.... And Adelaide drew 31k to a Sunday twilight game on Mother's Day, so I can see the merit in this thread, it was a piss poor turnout.

 

[kaysee]

Does anyone have a source for the exact crowd figure? I can't seem to find it.

Sure AA:
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_match_list

29248

 

[BACCS]

Pointless thread.

Saturday afternoon, people are playing sport, low Port Adelaide fan base in Melbourne. Also its Mothers Day weekend so people are generally doing family things.

Yet Adelaide drew 31k to a Sunday twilight game ON Mother's Day, against Richmond? Go figure.

 

[BomberGal]

Massive lol's

One assumes you don't know the meaning of 'give or take'.

Are you joking, Saturday afternoon in Melbourne is traditional football day. Should get some big crowds on Saturdays.

Night matches and Sunday games always get better crowds. Essendon rarely play on a Saturday afternoon anyway.

 

[kaysee]

Essendon and Collingwood should draw large crowds against Adelaide in Melbourne, because unlike Port, we have a strong supporter base over there and wouldn't be suprised if we outnumbered NM supporters at Etihad next weekend.... And Adelaide drew 31k to a Sunday twilight game on Mother's Day, so I can see the merit in this thread, it was a piss poor turnout.

The thread isn't to bag Essendon's turnout... but to highlight how Victorian's shouldn't be quick to bag Port's crowd turnouts. When in recent years we've been playing our worst ever football and loosing, we're not a "BIG" supported club, we often play interstate teams, always play outdoors, and occassionally get crap timeslots... yet we average around 25k.... but we get bagged.

Thread is more about education.

 

[Art Corvelay]

One assumes you don't know the meaning of 'give or take'.

Absolute minimum sounds pretty absolute, although fair point

 

[toddy104]

Before the Game listed the crowd at 36,000. Sooo im gunna go with that okay. haha. But Seriously essendon fans really have not turned out this year thus far, Fair enough to I would have thought

 

[Dan26]

Last 4 have been sub 30,000, including 27,000 odd last year against freo (finals year).

We averaged 35,000 at our two games against freo and port at the dome in 04/05...

Here are Essendon's and Collingwood's figures for all games versus Freo/Port/Adel/WCE In Melbourne when the Pies and dons have MISSED the finals.

ESSENDON
2010 Ess vs Port at Dome 29,248
2010 Ess vs Fre at Dome 29,651
2008 Ess vs Port at Dome 28,409
2008 Ess vs WCE at Dome 33,386
2008 Ess vs Adel at Dome 32,184
2007 Ess vs Frem at Dome 32,623
2007 Ess vs WCE at Dome 48,913
2007 Ess vs Adel at Dome 35,010
2006 Ess vs WCE at Dome 31,434
2006 Ess vs Port at Dome 29,232
2005 Ess vd Freo at Dome 30,383

Average 32,770. Average against Port and Freo 29,924


COLLINGWOOD
2005 Coll vs Fremantle at MCG 26,586
2005 Coll vs Port at Dome 35,844
2005 Coll vs West Coast at MCG 31,105
2005 Coll vs Adelaide at Dome 31,464
2004 Coll vs Fremantle at Dome 34,416
2004 Coll vs Adelaide at Dome 37,881
2004 Coll vs Port at MCG 27,226
2004 Coll vs West Coast at Dome 44,401

Average 33,615. Average against Port and Fremantle 31,018



I decided not to go back to 2001, as I had to draw the line somewhere, but in that year (where Collingwood narrowly missed the finals) they drew 26,067 vs Fremantle and 36,589 vs WCE. You complain that we drew 27,000-odd versus Freo in our finals year last year (we went 10-11-1) You went 11-11 in 2001 and drew 26,067 against them!

As you can see, there is virtually no difference in any apples vs apples comparison with Essendon and Collingwood.

Even in bad years, when Essendon went 3-18-1 in 2006, they played in front of 935,522 people! Collingwood's 4-18 year in 1999 drew 886,750

It's easier to compare the bad years from both clubs because Essendon's home ground (the Dome) doesn't limit the amount of people who want to go when the team is playing poorly.

When the team is playing well, the Dome limits Essendon's drawing power. Essendon obviously would have set the all time crowd record in both the 2000 and 2001 season if they were playing all their home games at the MCG.

The numbers show that ANY APPLES VS APPLES COMPARISON puts the two clubs at equal drawing power. It's amazing how exactly it works out, when you do apples vs apples for the two clubs.

Also, in Collingwood's finals year in 2006, you played Freo at the MCG in front of 30,373 and you played Port in front of 32,276 at the Dome.

 

[toddy104]

Dan ur a machine, now can u do my homework?

 

[Dan26]

Dan ur a machine, now can u do my homework?

I find if I do my research, it's easy to prove people right or wrong. Lot's of people don't do any research because they can't be bothered (or probably because they have a life, haha)

Lot's of people have wild theories that they back up with absoluely NOTHING. Or they back them up with selective stats rather than looking at the big picture as I like to do.

 

[FootyJunkie]

Saturday afternoon games are awful times for games, effectively rules out families that play sport, people who are working and I'm sure others as well.

It's a sad statement to make, but you're right.

Saturday Afternoon is the traditional time slot for footy. It's a shame that its been heavily neglected slowly in the past 15 or so years in place of Saturday Night footy and other timeslots. I guess the AFL have to go with the times. A night September GF is just around the corner, as soon as Demetriou leaves office.

 

[Chaz Pendlebury]

Right, Research, Big Picture

Essendon have never drawn more than Collingwood in any year, other than when they finished in the eight and Collingwood didn't

They closest, in terms of games won, that Collingwood have been behind Essendon and drew less was in 2004 (the last time Essendon outdrew the Pies) The Pies won 4 less games and had an average of 700 less.

In 2001, Collingwood had 6 less wins and averaged 1,900 less

In 2002, Collingwood had 0.5 more wins and average 4,900 more

In 2003, Collingwood had 2 more wins and average 4,900 more

In 2005, Collingwood had 3 less wins and averaged 1,600 more

In 2006, Collingwood had 11 more wins and averaged 10,400 more

In 2007, Collingwood had 3 more wins and averaged 6,300 more

In 2008, Collingwood had 4 more wins and averaged 9,200 more

In 2009, Collingwood had 4.5 more wins and averaged 4,900 more

In 2010, Collingwood has 4 more wins and is averaging 9,000 more

Carlton have averaged more than Essendon the last two years and are sure to do it again this year (by some margin)

So that is pretty damning evidence, comprehensive and not at all selective

And the Dome thing. Essendon would have, at best, had marginally more sell out matches than Collingwood over the decade that would have got more at the G.

It also is evident that games there below capacity in the middle of winter (particularly in when its raining) draw higher than the MCG. This is evidenced by the three lowest games in 04/05 that you posted just happened to be the 3 at the G. The dome games against the same teams all drew 7,500 plus more. And every other MCG tenant would vouch that the bad form plus wet wintery weather devastates crowd numbers

 

[Dan26]

Right, Research, Big Picture

Essendon have never drawn more than Collingwood in any year, other than when they finished in the eight and Collingwood didn't

They closest, in terms of games won, that Collingwood have been behind Essendon and drew less was in 2004 (the last time Essendon outdrew the Pies) The Pies won 4 less games and had an average of 700 less.

In 2001, Collingwood had 6 less wins and averaged 1,900 less

In 2002, Collingwood had 0.5 more wins and average 4,900 more

In 2003, Collingwood had 2 more wins and average 4,900 more

In 2005, Collingwood had 3 less wins and averaged 1,600 more

In 2006, Collingwood had 11 more wins and averaged 10,400 more

In 2007, Collingwood had 3 more wins and averaged 6,300 more

In 2008, Collingwood had 4 more wins and averaged 9,200 more

In 2009, Collingwood had 4.5 more wins and averaged 4,900 more

In 2010, Collingwood has 4 more wins and is averaging 9,000 more

Carlton have averaged more than Essendon the last two years and are sure to do it again this year (by some margin)

So that is pretty damning evidence, comprehensive and not at all selective

And the Dome thing. Essendon would have, at best, had marginally more sell out matches than Collingwood over the decade that would have got more at the G.

It also is evident that games there below capacity in the middle of winter (particularly in when its raining) draw higher than the MCG. This is evidenced by the three lowest games in 04/05 that you posted just happened to be the 3 at the G. The dome games against the same teams all drew 7,500 plus more. And every other MCG tenant would vouch that the bad form plus wet wintery weather devastates crowd numbers

Don't give me the stupid wetaher excuse. For every perosn that doesn't go to the MCG because of the weather, there are others that DO go to the MCG, because of the extra MCC and AFL members that can attend MCG games.

Any apples vs apples comparison put both clubs at the same crowd drawing level. Every year you have mentioned is post 2000, which is when Essendon moved to the Dome.

Essendon and Collingwood's crowd drawing capacity against interstate teams is proved to be the same. The crowd drawing capacity in high-performance years is the same (TAKING INTO ACCOUNT ESSENDON PLAY AT THE DOME) and the Bombers 1998 and 1999 figures reflect this, when they were an MCG tenant.

So, it's hard to compare Essendon's finals years (2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 and 2004) because Essendon was a Dome tenant in this time.

Okay, so lets do an apples vs apples comparison, of both clubs bad years, which are almost identical at around a 35% win-loss record each.


ESSENDON'S 5 YEARS OF 2005, 06, 07, 08, 09
2005: 979,102
2006: 935,522
2007: 1,088,652
2008: 1,044,123
2009: 1,089,224

Average crowd over those 110 games of 46,696. Lost more games than they won every year. Total win-loss record over those 5 years 36.0%



COLLINGWOOD'S 6 YEARS OF 1995, 96, 97, 98, 99, 00
1995: 1,033,444
1996: 924,919
1997: 1,102,961
1998: 1,041,431
1999: 886,750
2000: 951,346

Average crowd over those 132 games of 45,006. Lost more games than they won every year. Total win-loss record over those 6 years 34.8%


See, what I mean? If you compare apples with apples they are both about the same.

Even looking at the last couple of years where Collingwood hit the all-time record (1,189,932 in 2009, 1,247,391 in 2008 and 1,226,604 in 2007) in the years where you were "around" that Preliminary Final mark. What do you think Essendon would have done in 2000 and 2001 had they been primarily an MCG tenant!!!!

In those years the Bombers had 1,107,345 in 2000 and 1,124,805 in 2001!! Playing at the Dome!

There were 4-5 Dome games every year in those two years that got high 40,000's that would have drawn 60 and 70,000 at the MCG. A couple stand out, particularly the Hawthorn game in 2001 that would have got 75,000 if it was at the MCG and the Geelong game in 2000 that would have got 75,000.

But even games against Sydeny and teams like that would get 60,000. Back in 1996 and 1998, we played two games against Sydney at the MCG which got 69,000 and 62,000. I remember when we stole a game late in 2001 at the Dome with a late Alessio goal in front of a typical mid to high 40,000's crowd thinking "this is one of those games that would have got around 60,000 at the MCG, with more MCC members, more AFL members and more theatre goers."

There were HEAPS of those types of games in 2000 and 2001 against mid-range teams like the Bulldogs, Hawks, Swans etc that got 45,000+ that would have easily drawn 60,000 or more at the MCG. In 1998, we drew 68,000 versus the Dogs in round 21.

In 2000, that same round 21 match versus the Bulldogs with them playing for a finals berth and Essendon for an unbeaten season drew a virtual sell-out at the Dome. No doubt it would have been 65,000-70,000 at the MCG, with MCC and AFL members able to just rock up. As well as other theatre goers.

Essendon would have drawn 1.2 million easily in 2000 and 2001 if we were an MCG tenant. Just about every Dome game versus a Victorian opponent or the Swans in those two years would have been 60,000-plus at the MCG.

 

[gaelictiogar]

Incredibly ignorant thread.

Essendon and Collingwood are the only Victorian clubs who can get between 40-50,000 versus West Coast, Adelaide, Fremantle and Port on a regular basis.

When both Essendon and Collingwood are struggling (Essendon was 2-4 going into the game), games against those low-drawing opponents tend to drop to a minimum of 30,000-ish.

In 2007, when the Bombers were in form, 47,000 saw them play West Coast at the Dome.

And the two biggest crowds Fremantle has played in front of in Melbourne were 42,256 at the Dome (vs Essendon in '03) and 45,383 at the MCG vs Collingwood in '08.

It is years since Essendon drew 40,000 V Port, Freo or Adelaide Dan. Not since the Sheedy glory days. Indeed its a while since they drew 30,000 VS Port.

It is inaccurate to say that something that hasn't happened at all in 7 or 8 years happens regularly. Essendon are a huge club with a superb drawing capacity but you don't regularly draw 40K plus V interstate opposition and haven't done so in years.

 

[gaelictiogar]

Dan is essentially correct it has to be said. All other things being equal Essendon draw almost - not quite but almost - as well as the Pies. The fact is Collingwood have finalled 4 times in a row and PFed twice in the last 3 years. They have in the past two seasons and this season been at optimum or near optimum drawing capacity. Essendon have been ordinary in comparison.

However Carlton are now in their third successive season outdrawing Essendon as they have done dozens of times in the past and are not exactly top 4 certs are they? So much depends on EXPECTATION. The Blues have overtaken Essendon because their fans EXPECT in the post Judd era. The Pies will break all records this year because their fans EXPECT. Hawthorn will attendances fall through the floor because expectation is punctured. Expected results as much as a ctual results inform attendances.

 

[Slattery_20]

We don't pull big crowds at the dome. Full stop.

 

[smasha]

Dan is essentially correct it has to be said. All other things being equal Essendon draw almost - not quite but almost - as well as the Pies. The fact is Collingwood have finalled 4 times in a row and PFed twice in the last 3 years. They have in the past two seasons and this season been at optimum or near optimum drawing capacity. Essendon have been ordinary in comparison.

However Carlton are now in their third successive season outdrawing Essendon as they have done dozens of times in the past and are not exactly top 4 certs are they? So much depends on EXPECTATION. The Blues have overtaken Essendon because their fans EXPECT in the post Judd era. The Pies will break all records this year because their fans EXPECT. Hawthorn will attendances fall through the floor because expectation is punctured. Expected results as much as a ctual results inform attendances.

Compare Richmonds last 28 years to Essendons.

We would have the same crowds if not more if we were WINNING games and premierships.

**** ,if we won a flag ,the membership would go off the board!

Makes me laugh when the Bombers carry on about their big supporter base.

That base was achieved through winning games.

We have over 40k members with a team that is rock bottom.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

29k and get bagged for it?
Id love to draw 29k to an interstate game!!

29k?!

Isn't that Norths yearly attendance total