Club Focus Essendon - Essendon's drafting since 1998 under Adrian Dodoro

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Bunk Moreland

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Ryder and Hibberd sure. Melksham was not unders, a pick in the 20's is perfectly acceptable and fair value.

Please don't take credit for Chapman. That was Wells and Co giving him away for peanuts as a gesture for his years of great service. Not Dodo being a genius recruiter. BTW that man was bang on about Chappy, refused to give him 2 years as he was near cooked, sure enough midway through his 2nd Bombers season he was indeed cooked.

P.S. DapperJong
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/search/145295678/?q=Dodoro&t=post&o=date&c[title_only]=1&c[node]=5+330+58+305+130+245+352+344+11
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/search/145295712/?q=dodoro&t=post&o=date&c[title_only]=1&c[node]=61+284+315+84

He's not so spoken about as to have multiple threads each year. Not many built up over many years.
My point remains - he gets deals done. Always. He doesn’t trail many in that dept.
 

Doctor Gero

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You making **** threads that have already been made ad nauseam has no bearing on my posting. Hope you are having fun in the SFA :)
Empirical evidence would suggest these threads have hardly been done.
I wasn't trying to troll or suggest he's useless, just wondering why he is so highly regarded. Results are lacking.
 

Lore

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Empirical evidence would suggest these threads have hardly been done.
I wasn't trying to troll or suggest he's useless, just wondering why he is so highly regarded. Results are lacking.
I'd be curious to see an in-depth analysis on all of the clubs' recruiting strategies and success since 2010. Perhaps in a new thread though.
 

DapperJong

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Empirical evidence would suggest these threads have hardly been done.
I wasn't trying to troll or suggest he's useless, just wondering why he is so highly regarded. Results are lacking.
What I meant by my Sherlock comment is that you didn't search hard enough. But anyway, I'm sure EFC realise that Dodoro probably isn't as culpible for lack of finals success as everyone on BF seems to think.
 

evo

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I'd be curious to see an in-depth analysis on all of the clubs' recruiting strategies and success since 2010. Perhaps in a new thread though.
I'll give you ours quickly: once we got rid of Greg Miller our list improved steadily until we eventuially won the flag. Interestingly, Miller was famous for trying to "win" trade week and would often butt heads with Adrian/ Sheeds. He also drafted a lot of outside mids/flankers/ seagulls

I think there's a lesson in that for all of us. ;)
 

TheSierBear

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It might be an essendon thing, but ASAGA is the term we give to the ASADA saga. It wasnt mistake.
Wait wat? ASAGA? You had a systemic doping regime and your club has for almost two decades has been treading between a **** and/or terrible club. ASADA nay WADA - ouch AFL, were just doing their jobs, and a lot better than the Essendon board during the whole sordid affair. James Hird, Bomber Thompson, and it's resulting player exodus, draft bans and being rewarded for pick 1, albeit a player with little upside in McGrath.


Like i said Reducto ad absurdum.
Indeed.
 

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Doctor Gero

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What I meant by my Sherlock comment is that you didn't search hard enough. But anyway, I'm sure EFC realise that Dodoro probably isn't as culpible for lack of finals success as everyone on BF seems to think.
I'd say there's 4 key parts to achieving finals success.

1. Recruitment/List Management.
2. Coaching/Player Development.
3. Players Game Day performance.
4. Luck.

You can do any two of 1-3 well but if the other is poor then you won't succeed.
All sides successful in finals have experienced an element of luck. A fortunate free kick, poster called a goal, ball bouncing the right way etc.

Is he as culpable? Depends on what the agreed perception is, is he culpable in some capacity. Absolutely.
I'm interested atm on point 1. If I watched your VFL side more often maybe then point 2 as well.
 

DapperJong

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I'd say there's 4 key parts to achieving finals success.

1. Recruitment/List Management.
2. Coaching/Player Development.
3. Players Game Day performance.
4. Luck.

You can do any two of 1-3 well but if the other is poor then you won't succeed.
All sides successful in finals have experienced an element of luck. A fortunate free kick, poster called a goal, ball bouncing the right way etc.

Is he as culpable? Depends on what the agreed perception is, is he culpable in some capacity. Absolutely.
I'm interested atm on point 1. If I watched your VFL side more often maybe then point 2 as well.
Agree with all of that.

As an Essendon supporter, Dodo is the least of my concerns. Even with not addressing the fact we could use an extra inside mid. But with 2018 basically done, your point 2 is where getting an inside mid is less of an issue for us now. The players we did bring in have settled into the game plan, and a few worrying youngsters have finally started to bloom. So much so that I would be happy to take all our picks to the draft this year. I think the list is in the best shape it's been in since 2001.

And as much as I hate mentioning it, we are still feeling the effects of the drug bans. So the turn around from that has been immensely good, which, you can credit Dodoro with to a large degree.

And he will probably grab Setterfield or Shiel anyway cos he gets **** done.
 

_Swoon

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I'd say there's 4 key parts to achieving finals success.

1. Recruitment/List Management.
2. Coaching/Player Development.
3. Players Game Day performance.
4. Luck.

You can do any two of 1-3 well but if the other is poor then you won't succeed.
All sides successful in finals have experienced an element of luck. A fortunate free kick, poster called a goal, ball bouncing the right way etc.

Is he as culpable? Depends on what the agreed perception is, is he culpable in some capacity. Absolutely.
I'm interested atm on point 1. If I watched your VFL side more often maybe then point 2 as well.
I don't know why you're not more interested in point 2. I mean, since the last time Essendon won a flag, we've had at the coaches box:

1. A successful yet old-school coach that was well known for not being overly receptive to new/external ideas and changes;
2. A junior, inexperienced coach who was appointed for the role from a very brief selection process;
3. A total gamble on an unproven, former star player who was appointed with barely any semblance of a selection process at all;
4. A formerly successful coach who was handed the reigns for one year only;
5. The third option for a second crack;
6. John Worsfold.

So forgive me for having this funny feeling that the real problem with the club over that period has been primarily to do with the coaches and the bizarre recruiting process to land them in the top job. The huge shift in performance after the reshuffling of the department in the wake of our round 8 loss to Carlton is more indication that Essendon is still anachronistically mired in the Sheedy-era of internal processes.

How anybody can look over all of this and think Dodoro is the real issue is a complete mystery. Essendon was run like **** for more than a decade. Everybody seems to know this when it comes to reciting drug scandal lore but not when it comes to critiquing any other facet of Essendon's lack of on-field success since 2001.

And yes, we haven't been successful since 2001. Sorry North fans, finals wins are a measure of success only for those who have nothing else.
 

TheGrizz

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Wait wat? ASAGA? You had a systemic doping regime and your club has for almost two decades has been treading between a **** and/or terrible club. ASADA nay WADA - ouch AFL, were just doing their jobs, and a lot better than the Essendon board during the whole sordid affair. James Hird, Bomber Thompson, and it's resulting player exodus, draft bans and being rewarded for pick 1, albeit a player with little upside in McGrath.




Indeed.
saga
ˈsɑːɡə/
noun
  1. 1.
    a long story of heroic achievement, especially a medieval prose narrative in Old Norse or Old Icelandic.
    "a figure straight out of a Viking saga"
    synonyms: epic, chronicle, legend, folk tale, romance, traditional story, history, narrative, adventure, fairy story, myth;
    roman-fleuve
    "the Celts' tribal sagas abound with mythical figures"
  2. 2.
    a long, involved story, account, or series of incidents
    .
    "launching into the saga of her engagement"
    synonyms: rigmarole, story, lengthy story/statement/explanation;Mor
Bit of an english lesson here, but we took the acronym ASADA and fused it with a word meaning a long involved story or incident - a reasonably apt description of a process that took 4 years - and presto we made up a catchy word.

It had nothing to do with who did their job and whether or not the club was culpable - just that the process was quite drawn out and rather dramatic at times - which i imagine most people would agree. Seems like a serious melt over nothing really.

But hey you have now shown your true colours, you were in reality one made up word away from a full anti-essendon melt.
And now we can clearly tell that your view on McGrath is clearly slanted due to your prejudice against us getting the pick in the first place.
 

TheSierBear

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saga
ˈsɑːɡə/
noun
  1. 1.
    a long story of heroic achievement, especially a medieval prose narrative in Old Norse or Old Icelandic.
    "a figure straight out of a Viking saga"
    synonyms: epic, chronicle, legend, folk tale, romance, traditional story, history, narrative, adventure, fairy story, myth;
    roman-fleuve
    "the Celts' tribal sagas abound with mythical figures"
  2. 2.
    a long, involved story, account, or series of incidents
    .
    "launching into the saga of her engagement"
    synonyms: rigmarole, story, lengthy story/statement/explanation;Mor
Bit of an english lesson here, but we took the acronym ASADA and fused it with a word meaning a long involved story or incident - a reasonably apt description of a process that took 4 years - and presto we made up a catchy word.

It had nothing to do with who did their job and whether or not the club was culpable - just that the process was quite drawn out and rather dramatic at times - which i imagine most people would agree. Seems like a serious melt over nothing really.

But hey you have now shown your true colours, you were in reality one made up word away from a full anti-essendon melt.
And now we can clearly tell that your view on McGrath is clearly slanted due to your prejudice against us getting the pick in the first place.
And why did the saga take so long, Mr Reducto ad Absurdum. :think:
And FYI no I didn't care too much about you guys getting pick 1, and I don't believe McGrath is the sort of player you'd hope to take at pick 1. I just don't see a lot of upside in him but that might be just me.
 
Last edited:

Run and carry

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Its all pretty straightforward to me. Essendon have a good list (not a great list). Disco and his team have compiled that list.

He's had significant challenges over his time but he has made great late selections. He has also traded well especially this year with SSS.
 

Jade

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Has been the list manager at Essendon since February 1998. As List Manager he presided over two drafts before their all-conquering side won the 2000 premiership taking the comp by storm. In 98-99 he recruited good players like McVeigh, Ramanauskas, Hille, Barnes (re-joining) and Podsiadly (0 Ess games). Of that Ramanauskas and Barnes played in the 2000 premiership. So his effect on the flag isn't exactly profound.

Only Gold Coast have not won a final more recently than the Bombers, and they haven't played in one. Yes, all other 16 clubs have won a final more recently, and some have been pretty poor run clubs for sustained periods. Yet not as bad as the Bombers, seemingly.

Last trade period he was lauded for his haul in the trade period yet after tonight's loss it'll be the 10th year without finals for Essendon, in the last 14 seasons, since their last finals success. ****! He even got a promotion this year to the Bombers Executive Team. Why?

Why is he seemingly regarded so highly internally, and by bomber fans given the sustained lack of verifiable football results to back up his list building work? I just don't get the hype. Why hasn't some serious pressure on his position been put on him? Nearly 15 years without a win in September. This wouldn't fly at other big clubs like the Pies, Hawks, Blues etc.
Solid post, and a good thread IMO - I think it's perfectly reasonable to ask whether or not Dodoro has been a success.

As one of the earlier posters mentioned, his tenure really does need some context - he effectively operated as a talent scout when list manager under Sheedy, and was often overruled, hence judging his performance pre-2008 is kind of a non-issue; the bloke was hamstrung.

Having said that, he's entering his eleventh 'Sheedy-free' off-season now.

His drafting in the immediate aftermath of Sheedy I think was a bit hit and miss. 2009 for example he drafted what has proven to be five AFL quality players; whereas 2011 the best player produced from our efforts has been Mark Baguley.

Towards the end of 2012 I'd suggest he'd have been given a 'par' at best - and may have been in danger of being ousted with another year or two of the same.

Funnily enough, I think he's really come in to his own as the club descended in to the ****. 2013 was nothing short of a raging success; banned from the first two rounds still managed to bring in Merrett, Fantasia (pick 55 FFS) and Ambrose.

I'd actually suggest that he and his team would be either the best drafting team in the business nowadays (or very close to it). Proof is in the results too; he drafted five of last years All-Australian team, and three of the 22under22 players.

With the Essendon Board of Directors FINALLY loosening the proverbial strings in relation to trade and free agency, he's already got nothing but ticks in that regard.

As of right now, I'd suggest he'd be in the top handful of list managers in the league; however if Essendon is unable to achieve sustained success over the next four to five years I'd suggest he'd go.
 

citizen-erased

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Cant really be blamed when a team that showed late in the season they can play good football played shocking football in the first 8 rounds

A team that beats the eagles comprehensively in WA (who had a free kick count higher than their score) and loses to carlton doesnt have a list problem in so much as it had a coaching one

Dodoro isn't the reason we finished out of the 8
 

TheGrizz

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And why did the saga take so long, Mr Reducto ad Absurdum. :think:
And FYI no I didn't care too much about you guys getting pick 1, and I don't believe McGrath is the sort of player you'd hope to take at pick 1. I just don't see a lot of upside in him but that might be just me.
Name calling- good to see you continje to devolve ....
Because litigious and administrative processes take forever, the investigation took ages by ASADA, Essendon appealed, twice and a myriad of other circumstances and incidents.

Im not even saying the outcome is not deserved FFS, you just went full melt when i mentioned that we had a nickname for a process that had something to do with ASADA and the fact it took a long time - which it undoubtedly did

Regardless, i obviously am not going to change your mind, you seem convinved that Dodoro has done very little right and i contend that while he has plenty of work to do, his supposed short comings are -at times- overblown due to reasons that i dont think are realistic. Whatever i suppose.
 

citizen-erased

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Empirical evidence would suggest these threads have hardly been done.
I wasn't trying to troll or suggest he's useless, just wondering why he is so highly regarded. Results are lacking.
Do list managers or coaches win finals though?
If its list managers, why do the hawks list crew get poached less than the coaches?

Surely it's about building a list that can win enough to get you there.
After that, it's over to the coaches to take them the next step
 

TheSierBear

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Name calling- good to see you continje to devolve ....
Because litigious and administrative processes take forever, the investigation took ages by ASADA, Essendon appealed, twice and a myriad of other circumstances and incidents.

Im not even saying the outcome is not deserved FFS, you just went full melt when i mentioned that we had a nickname for a process that had something to do with ASADA and the fact it took a long time - which it undoubtedly did

Regardless, i obviously am not going to change your mind, you seem convinved that Dodoro has done very little right and i contend that while he has plenty of work to do, his supposed short comings are -at times- overblown due to reasons that i dont think are realistic. Whatever i suppose.
Well I acknowledged Dodoro was good for a while there. Had his challenges. Think he has struggled of late, but that's my opinion. Think we are actually reaching common ground on Dodoro to be honest. You just aren't aware of it.
 

Mr Meeseeks

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Cant really be blamed when a team that showed late in the season they can play good football played shocking football in the first 8 rounds

A team that beats the eagles comprehensively in WA (who had a free kick count higher than their score) and loses to carlton doesnt have a list problem in so much as it had a coaching one

Dodoro isn't the reason we finished out of the 8
I agree. Essendon have gone backwards this year and to me its a bit of a suprise given their 2017 trade period..

Smith and Saad have probably been the recruits of the year and looking at those deals closer, Dodoro nailed them.

String I'm not so sure about. They need to be a stronger team for him to excel, he is the cream, is 25 and 30 a bit of a price too high? There were some decent kids available around then last year... I think that one might of been a mistake.

They're putting together a pretty good list given their penalties, the coaching and the players' consistency is what is letting them down.
 
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