- May 3, 2007
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would you support a club that hasnt won a trophy or premiership in their 30-40 year history?
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Opinion Fan misery index by team supported
- Thread starter WillHayward
- Start date
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would you support a club that hasnt won a trophy or premiership in their 30-40 year history?
Which club is that currently?
- Sep 15, 2005
- 13,075
- 20,637
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- Geelong
Ouch.
I always say that the only opposition fans that can understand the psychology of being a Cats supporter are Collingwood fans.
Those GF losses take a big toll; yes both clubs have been fortunate enough to have won multiple flags in the AFL era, but there have been some bitter bitter pills to swallow in between drinks.
- Apr 24, 2013
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- Collingwood
The saga definitely broke many Essendon fans' brains. It turned half miserable and half into raving conspiracy loons. And the 20-year period of failure - which in a historical sense isn't actually that big - is taking its toll as well.
But the Essendon supporter safety blanket is the equal 'most flags' thing. I personally think that holding on to success achieved in an amateur, divided state league 100 years before you were born is beyond idiotic, but Carlton fans are equally guilty of that.
If Collingwood had choked 2 less Grand Finals and could claim the 'most flags' thing, then some of the other chokes would be far more tolerable, because we could at least delude ourselves that we are still overall the most historically successful. But we can't even clutch on to that safety blanket.
Multiple? Two, should've been more.
- May 3, 2007
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well freo has been on the comp for 27 years and no flags.
Had Collingwood won 0 flags from 1892-2021, would you still follow them?
Yes coz I'm a Collingwood supporter, we stick phat no matter how bad we are, like now.
Until just over 4 years, I would have said Tiger supporters had gone through the most pain. A 37 year premier drought is one thing but it was the utter lack of success in making finals and then our catastrophic performance in those extraordinary rare appearances, that caused the more misery.
Additionally it was the media and opposition supporter ridicule, that stung. As a big club, we draw a lot of attention so any story about us sells and rates. It became a hilarious perpetual cycle for people to watch us fail year after year. It also was an easy set up for the media - build up the pressure on the club as the failures mounted, then watch us implode sacking coaches/ turning over boards etc and then sell copious articles about the fall out. Rince and repeat.
I see the media doing the same thing to Carlton atm.
So why I feel for clubs like Collingwood, Saints and Freo for their lack of flag success, Its clubs like Carlton and even Essendon, that have struggled to even win finals of late, that really causes the most misery imho.
Additionally it was the media and opposition supporter ridicule, that stung. As a big club, we draw a lot of attention so any story about us sells and rates. It became a hilarious perpetual cycle for people to watch us fail year after year. It also was an easy set up for the media - build up the pressure on the club as the failures mounted, then watch us implode sacking coaches/ turning over boards etc and then sell copious articles about the fall out. Rince and repeat.
I see the media doing the same thing to Carlton atm.
So why I feel for clubs like Collingwood, Saints and Freo for their lack of flag success, Its clubs like Carlton and even Essendon, that have struggled to even win finals of late, that really causes the most misery imho.
There is a huge fan-media contingent cheering Essendon on. They get hyped up every year not because of some build-up/tear-down cycle (like Richmond 90s/00s) but because their nuffy supporters occupy a disproportionate number of high-ranking positions both on air and behind the scenes.
Carlton haven't had the same fan-media infrastructure since 10 lost the rights and Lane, Walls and Maher lost their little clique.
Crankyhawk
Brownlow Medallist
So with the modifications I proposed earlier (-5 misery for a flag if that reduces misery more than going to zero, halve misery for first GF defeat after a previous flag but then add 1 point for each GF loss after without winning a flag in addition to usual misery, bottom 4 = 2 misery points, wooden spoon = 3 misery, finals = 0 misery for that year, but then to get this finals non misery bonus you need to exceed prior finals achievement next time - this counter rests if 5 years out of finals)
Adelaide = 13 (have lost GF since last flag)
Brisbane (starting count from 2001 = 0) = 13 (have lost GF since last flag)
Carlton = 18 (they peak at negative 20 (!) in 1987, and are negative 19 from 1995) (have lost GF since last flag)
Collingwood = (start count from 2010 = 0) = 12 ((have lost GF since last flag)
Essendon = (starting at 1984 = 0) = 24 (have lost GF since last flag)
Fremantle = 20
Geelong = (start at 2007 = 0) = zero misery (have lost GF since last flag). This is due to getting to negative 9 misery at 2011 and losing 2020 did not add a misery point as this was first GF loss since flag in 2011)
Gold Coast = 21 (almost averaging 2 misery/ year of existence)
GWS = 7.5 (have lost GF)
Hawthorn =
Melbourne = zero
North Melbourne (1996 = 0) = 23
Port adelaide =
Richmond (start at 2017 = 0) = negative 8
St Kilda =
Sydney (start at 2005 = 0, works out the same as 2012 = 0) = 11 (hurt by losing more GF and a couple of bottom 4)
WCE = (start at 2018 =0, have done working out from 1987 and they were just above 5 misery at 2018) = 3
Western bulldogs (start at 2016 = 0) = 2 (have lost GF)
Will do the others when I get time
which means
most miserable
Essendon 24
North melbourne 23
Gold coast 21
Fremantle 20
Carlton 18
brisbane, adelaide 13
collingwood 12
sydney 11
GWS 7.5
WCE 3
Bulldogs 2
Melbourne, Geelong 0
Richmond negative 8
(with st kilda - likely highest, port and hawks to do)
Adelaide = 13 (have lost GF since last flag)
Brisbane (starting count from 2001 = 0) = 13 (have lost GF since last flag)
Carlton = 18 (they peak at negative 20 (!) in 1987, and are negative 19 from 1995) (have lost GF since last flag)
Collingwood = (start count from 2010 = 0) = 12 ((have lost GF since last flag)
Essendon = (starting at 1984 = 0) = 24 (have lost GF since last flag)
Fremantle = 20
Geelong = (start at 2007 = 0) = zero misery (have lost GF since last flag). This is due to getting to negative 9 misery at 2011 and losing 2020 did not add a misery point as this was first GF loss since flag in 2011)
Gold Coast = 21 (almost averaging 2 misery/ year of existence)
GWS = 7.5 (have lost GF)
Hawthorn =
Melbourne = zero
North Melbourne (1996 = 0) = 23
Port adelaide =
Richmond (start at 2017 = 0) = negative 8
St Kilda =
Sydney (start at 2005 = 0, works out the same as 2012 = 0) = 11 (hurt by losing more GF and a couple of bottom 4)
WCE = (start at 2018 =0, have done working out from 1987 and they were just above 5 misery at 2018) = 3
Western bulldogs (start at 2016 = 0) = 2 (have lost GF)
Will do the others when I get time
which means
most miserable
Essendon 24
North melbourne 23
Gold coast 21
Fremantle 20
Carlton 18
brisbane, adelaide 13
collingwood 12
sydney 11
GWS 7.5
WCE 3
Bulldogs 2
Melbourne, Geelong 0
Richmond negative 8
(with st kilda - likely highest, port and hawks to do)
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- Jul 5, 2012
- 24,745
- 40,163
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- Sydney
- Other Teams
- Kidding, right?
Must say, I'm really enjoying this thread! Although there is a tendency for people to try and out-misery everyone else, it's kind of a safe space for everyone to express their deepest disappointments with their clubs to oppo supporters, instead of the usual chest thumping and tyre pumping.
I'm amused at types trying to lay claim to out misery Demons long suffering fans before this drought finally broken.
None of others come close to misery they experienced. Were winning it by length of straight at Flemington until this grand final with Saints distant second.
Now Saints take the lead of misery stakes.
- Jul 5, 2012
- 24,745
- 40,163
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- Sydney
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- Kidding, right?
All hail the new rulers!
- May 3, 2007
- 36,265
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- Man City, Valencia, Lazio, Panthers
and freo too
maxiboy238
Senior List
- Apr 30, 2018
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big Victorian clubs like carlton or essendon have been average for 20 years
lol younger generation of supporters don’t understand the power these club can generate when they get up and running
lol younger generation of supporters don’t understand the power these club can generate when they get up and running
- Thread starter
- #391
Ive updated this and Melbourne have dropped from 1st to to 2nd last on the index. Sainters fans now clearly the unhappiest.
Saints 39
Blues 28
North 24
Freo 24
Bombers 23
Lions 20
Crows 20
Port 19
Pies 13
GWS 12
Hawks 8
Bulldogs 6
Eagles 5
Swans 3
Richmond 3
Melbourne 2
Geelong 1
[Gold Coast No Score]
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- Mar 3, 2022
- 4,817
- 6,343
- AFL Club
- Adelaide
Oh havent you heard? North are making finals this year. Their pre-season hysteria gives them a negative -50 effect on their current score. Yours will be more accurate a month into the season
Ahem.
We didnt hire an eventual 3 time premiership coach, who'd be 4 time if not for cox forgetting he's cox....3 time richmond premiership coach i should say too...cos his laptop had issues
Hired a former club legend whose experience was coaching under 9s. Who undertook a doping program that derailed the club for over a decade now.
Tried to fight forces larger than us without a shred of evidence and got everyone banned during their peak years...not without 4 years of news stories about dark alleyways, shady characters and loose dealings.
Offered the same job to two former legends, then sacked the one we went with months later.
Hired a guy who was trying to help a club out of a tragedy not of their own making, only to hire his replacement to work under him in that tried and true "handover" arrangement.
Had 4 guns walk out on us during covid lockdowns.
On the week one of our greatest indigenous players retired....a couple of days after our most expensive player was openly mocked by the opposition during our captains 200th game party (fittingly capped by being smashed)....our ceo is in the news for pissing off an indigenous olympic legend to the point she quit the long walk board....this was our lead up to the last dreamtime match.
Made a sacked coach coach his last game without being told he's sacked, as we pursued a coach who ultimately turned us down for North.
Made the last successful coach we had an immortal, put him on the board and watched him criticise the coach we eventually hired after finally undertaking the process we paid millions to be told to do.....hours after we hired him cos we didn't pick his golden boy...who as mentioned earlier set us back over a decade.
Hired a ceo we had to sack 24hrs later as the nation devated religious freedom and bigotry against our backdrop.
And there's a twitter clock counting up a league record drought for a finals win that is inevitably going to add another 500 days to it.....minimum.
Oh, and after vacating our traditional home due to losing out to a bowls club, it would appear our state of the art facilities are in the way of a melbourne airport expansion and we may need to get out the way
Please put us 2nd behind the saints.
- May 3, 2007
- 36,265
- 21,005
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- Fremantle
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- Man City, Valencia, Lazio, Panthers
Nah.... Your team has won 16 flags despite not winning a final in 18 years. It's easily gonna reach to 20 years.
Still .... Essendon has won 16 premierships.
How many premierships have Fremantle Dockers win?
- May 3, 2007
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Also.... How come blues and kangaroos out rank the dockers on the misery index?
Freo should be out right 2nd based on their lack of success in 30 seasons.
You could even argue the dockers should top the misery index.
What are the numbers based on?
- Thread starter
- #396
I count making a GF as "joyous".
Of course this is debatable and subjective.
But winning a prelim and the whole GFa week build up is a pretty fun time.
The Score is years since Flag OR years since GF (*3).
Whichever is lowest.
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- Thread starter
- #397
The index is for CURRENT fans.
That is the relative misery for present day fans as at 2023. So the relative misery/joy right now.
So Essendon's 16 flags aren't relevant.
I don't count the joy of the dead.
Much of that joy has either died or long dissipated.
I think the afterglow of three very recent flags continues to dull any real misery in a Tiger supporter, especially while so many of those premiership heroes are still at the helm. There's definitely a residual joy at such success which lingers well beyond just a couple of seasons, especially for us older Tigers. I would have Richmond and Geelong pretty much on par with one another at this stage, with Melbourne a close third last.
That said, if Cotchin, Dusty, JackR and Grimes (and Dimma) all depart with no further flags claimed in the next 3-4 years, the misery index will start to boot up again.
ftfy
Don’t forget hiring convicted drug smuggler/ice addict as a coach too
