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tribey

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#79
Either a nine year old boy has hacked your account or you've missed your last dose of Midol.

On a serious note, can you ever have a difference of opinion without being belligerent?
 

conVINCEd

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#81
I didn't see the first quarter and a half, and I know everyone has already had their say about the game but I'll add my two cents...

For three years I have been saying that we need a new FB - and the AFC haven't listened to me! Basset gets murdured everytime we play a team with a strong FF - we would have beaten Brisbane 3-4 times in the last two years if we could've held Lynch. Basset is not only skinny, but for some reason moves like a big man. He tries hard but isn't up to AFL standard IMO.

The kids were pretty good. Hentschell was excellent - he did well on Riewoldt like I thought he would - and should have stayed on him the whole game. Johncock was as he usually is, Jericho was very promising (reminded me a bit of Modra), Schuback didn't get much of it but showed some good signs IMO.

Gallagher and Begley were pretty good as well. Definitely some positive signs, surely we will beat Richmond? :confused:
 

Bockchoy67

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Thread starter #82
Originally posted by McLeod23
Definitely some positive signs, surely we will beat Richmond? :confused:
It's not the ability of our players that's the core of our problem, it's how we use the ball that hurts us the most. Look at Sydney, for instance.

SYDNEY
They run with the ball, bring into down the center, and kick to a leading forward or a reliable contested marker.

ADELAIDE
They kick to short options, kick wide and kick to another short option. Wait for about 10secs before booting the ball high up in the air. No one takes mark and the opposition get hold of it, run down the center and kick a goal.

Our forwards do not lead, and when they do, it's almost always wide. This is mainly because the ball is wide as well, as our players have ran the ball from the flanks onto the wing.

So, with a lack of leading forwards, our players hoist it up in the air and hope for the best. None of our players take a mark, resulting in yet another wasted oppotunity.

It's this that plagues us not the most, and despite losing, we continue to use this game of football. It's not working and as long as we continue to use it, we won't score goals to the level that is required.

And as a result, we do not win games. :rolleyes:
 

conVINCEd

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#83
I realise this Bockchoy67, however I understand that Garry Ayres is incapable of acknowleding that our gameplan is pathetic and that he has made mistakes. Therefore I don't expect our gameplan to change; I simply hope that our players put in a decent effort and our younger players are given gametime and improve.

I saw the Swans play today and they were bloody good. Top three for sure. I wouldn't mind a few of their players on our list. J.Bolton and Kennelly in particular, Hall would be pretty handy too :) .

Oops, and Goodes.
 

Stiffy_18

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#85
As dezzmo said i don't think its a game plan as such but rather not having a KPP confident enough in their own ability to lead down the centre and tak a contested mark. I reckon someone like a fit and in form Mark Stevens would straighten us up to no end.

I think it more to do with the cattle than the game plan.

Every side tends to play wide when they don't have a big strong forward that DEMANDS the bal and takes contested marks. Even Brisbane tend to **** fart around the flanks when they don't have Brown and/or Lynch in the line up.
 

dicko

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#86
KPP

The problem with the forward line is that Wayne cant run, jump and struggles to get his arms above his head. He was drafted as a back up CHF, but with the loss of stevens has become our focal point, but he is to old. There are no others to step up and Perrie is to inconsitant for the role. This has been our shortfall for the last 3 to 4 years and its not getting better. We just dont have a big strong CHF and not many teams do, but the ones that dont have more players kicking goals. Look at Westcoast, no key CHF but they have a number of players that can score. We have the likes of Welsh who in close is to slow and gets caught, Tyson tries hard as does Johncock and Burton but these players are the ones that should be chipping in along with the Key CHF that we dont have

Combine that with the loss of some midfielders ie Johnson, Bickley, then we have problems. Goodwins injury exposed that area, in that with all of them on deck we are not to bad, but a single injury leaves us short

The back line is getting old, and smart is gone next year and benny hart is not getting any younger. Bassett is to light and not tall enough. We missed Hart this weekend as St Kilda exposed our lack of height, and the loss of Biglands (Dumb Arse) didnt help.

Some serious rebuilding is needed over this year and probably next year, with a new coach next year.

If you cant win a flag in 5 years then out the door you go. We may do better, but I dont think we will do worse.

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:
 

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Stiffy_18

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#87
To be honest I think our backline is somewhat our strenght. Kenny is a VERY good CHB and Hentschel is coming along really nicely. Massie is playing some excellent footy and Begley has sloted well in BP to mind the nippy small forward that have historically kicked our backside.

I think we really need a big strong, robust, athletic FB who can handle big forwards. Apart from that i think our backline is not too bad. Especially if we take into account medium to long term future.

I think we have some very good option in the forward line once they develop. We can build the forward line around Watts. If Krueger can overcome his back injury he could develop into an athletic FF who takes contested marks and is a thumping kick. Jericho is another marking option who can play both tall and small. I think we need to add some serious goalsneaks in coming drafts/trades.

Midfield is a major concern at this point in time. We really need a bit of everything but in the coming draft/trading period I think we need to get a ruckman and some midfielders.
 
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#88
Originally posted by Bockchoy67
It's not the ability of our players that's the core of our problem, it's how we use the ball that hurts us the most. Look at Sydney, for instance.

SYDNEY
They run with the ball, bring into down the center, and kick to a leading forward or a reliable contested marker.

ADELAIDE
They kick to short options, kick wide and kick to another short option. Wait for about 10secs before booting the ball high up in the air. No one takes mark and the opposition get hold of it, run down the center and kick a goal.

Our forwards do not lead, and when they do, it's almost always wide. This is mainly because the ball is wide as well, as our players have ran the ball from the flanks onto the wing.

So, with a lack of leading forwards, our players hoist it up in the air and hope for the best. None of our players take a mark, resulting in yet another wasted oppotunity.

It's this that plagues us not the most, and despite losing, we continue to use this game of football. It's not working and as long as we continue to use it, we won't score goals to the level that is required.

And as a result, we do not win games. :rolleyes:
Age old conundrum this.
Do you play a gamestyle to suit the players you have.
Or
Do you get the players to play the gamestyle the coach believes in.

Sydney are yet to win a premiership with their running style.
History shows the Brisbane structure and gamestyle wins more premierships.
Comparing our spine to Brisbanes or any top side, and you would have to agree we do not have the personnel.
Unfotunately M. Stevens changed the entire mix of our KP options - thats life.
 
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#89
Originally posted by McLeod23
I realise this Bockchoy67, however I understand that Garry Ayres is incapable of acknowleding that our gameplan is pathetic and that he has made mistakes. Therefore I don't expect our gameplan to change; I simply hope that our players put in a decent effort and our younger players are given gametime and improve.

I saw the Swans play today and they were bloody good. Top three for sure. I wouldn't mind a few of their players on our list. J.Bolton and Kennelly in particular, Hall would be pretty handy too :) .

Oops, and Goodes.
On TV we did appear to come thru the centre regularly. Yes in the 2nd qtr we then went to the pocket to leads, but not so much after half time.
Yes Ayres is stubborn,hated his first year with us, but he one me over in the last 3 years. We've been ultra competitive, we just dont have the cattle.
Having said that all teams are only 2-3 class players from being a really competitive unit.
 
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#90
Originally posted by Stiffy_18
As dezzmo said i don't think its a game plan as such but rather not having a KPP confident enough in their own ability to lead down the centre and tak a contested mark. I reckon someone like a fit and in form Mark Stevens would straighten us up to no end.

I think it more to do with the cattle than the game plan.

Every side tends to play wide when they don't have a big strong forward that DEMANDS the bal and takes contested marks. Even Brisbane tend to **** fart around the flanks when they don't have Brown and/or Lynch in the line up.
As he said:)
 

Stiffy_18

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#91
Originally posted by Wayne's-World
Age old conundrum this.
Do you play a gamestyle to suit the players you have.
Or
Do you get the players to play the gamestyle the coach believes in.

Sydney are yet to win a premiership with their running style.
History shows the Brisbane structure and gamestyle wins more premierships.
Comparing our spine to Brisbanes or any top side, and you would have to agree we do not have the personnel.
Unfotunately M. Stevens changed the entire mix of our KP options - thats life.
Thats whyy first and foremost you build a strong spine, followed by a strong ruckman and midfield, then you add on things like goalsneaks and small defenders.
 
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#92
Originally posted by Stiffy_18
Thats whyy first and foremost you build a strong spine, followed by a strong ruckman and midfield, then you add on things like goalsneaks and small defenders.
Yes and without it you tend to try and bypass opposition KPP and ruckman, thus playing short and wide.
Unfortunately no opposition bypasses our ruckman, they actually play thru them:p
 

PAfolwr

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#93
Originally posted by Stiffy_18
I think that is a big thing and a big positive considering those 2 boys are long term players. Kenny has already established himself as our #1 ruckman and Hentschel is fast becoming our shining light this year. Hart still has a couple of years left of footy left in him but Smart is finished.

What did you think of Hentschel's game and Jericho's debut??????
Hentschell had an excellent game IMO, at the very least 7/10, even up as high as 9/10. Did just about everything one could ask for.
He didn't seem to play that tall, in as far as preferring to spoil rather than back himself, but that will come with experience and a bit more bulk. Has good brain.
Must play every game this year going on that, and leave him at back until he gets his feet wet. He does very well back there.

Jericho certainly is interesting. Plays both tall and short (had to check his height to see if he was tall or not), plus is a goer and seems to have brains. I thought I had read on here that his body wasn't quite ready yet, but that didn't look to be the case at all. :confused:
He must be played every game as well. Just do not expect too much consistency yet. (same goes for Hentschel) Talent aplenty there.

The other things out of yesterdays game, no matter how well Johncock does in the forward line, you need him at back. Small forwards have always killed you lot. (shove bode up there, he will score a few goals and keep the ball in the area as well)

Carey should be retired early. Yes he did create a few goals, and he took a sort of overhead mark, but he seems to create more havoc with your "team play" than the opposition. It's as if a lot of your players are in awe of him. They constantly look for him even when they shouldn't.

Burton needs to play up forward. He does create a lot of contests etc from around the wing area, but he will score 30-50 goals a year, is unpredictable in the air (you need that up there), plus brain fades up there will not cost you goals. There were at least two "goals" yesterday.
 

macca23

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#94
Originally posted by PAfolwr

Carey should be retired early. Yes he did create a few goals, and he took a sort of overhead mark, but he seems to create more havoc with your "team play" than the opposition. It's as if a lot of your players are in awe of him. They constantly look for him even when they shouldn't.

Burton needs to play up forward. He does create a lot of contests etc from around the wing area, but he will score 30-50 goals a year, is unpredictable in the air (you need that up there), plus brain fades up there will not cost you goals. There were at least two "goals" yesterday.
You can't be a true Port supporter - you always make too much sense!!! ;)

Why, I bet you don't even have a stolen hubcap collection!! :D

Your comments about Carey are very accurate. He demands the ball at all times even when he is in a very poor position. He seems to have forgotten that he can't do what he used to do.

No Carey would force Ayres to play Burts up forward. He kicked 50+ goals there 2 years ago when there was no Carey and there's no reason why he couldn't again. It would be the best way to get value from him.
 

PAfolwr

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#95
Originally posted by macca23
...Why, I bet you don't even have a stolen hubcap collection!! :D
...
Too me nearly the whole second half of the Port game to break into my own house yesterday, :( .......... but I can open doors in a lot of old cars in very quick time. :D
 

spindoctor

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#96
Originally posted by Stiffy_18
If Krueger can overcome his back injury he could develop into an athletic FF who takes contested marks and is a thumping kick.
WHERE is this coming from?

You used to have nothing but invective for him!

You still haven't explained the change in view.
 

Stiffy_18

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#97
Originally posted by spindoctor
WHERE is this coming from?

You used to have nothing but invective for him!

You still haven't explained the change in view.
You asked a question a week or so ago. I gave you the answer. I am sure you are smart enough to use the search function to find out exactly what was my beef when AFC drafted Krueger. Absolutely nothing to do with his ability as a key forward. More to do with his ability (or lack of) as a ruckman.
 

Alex99

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#99
If Krueger can overcome his back injury he could develop into an athletic FF who takes contested marks and is a thumping kick.



He has never show any sort of form with the bays as a FF. Why now will he be able to develop in to a KPP at AFL level ???

Our problem is that we haven got any ready made forwards playing now as a KPP in the SANFL to come into the side.

who ATM playes as a key postion forward, Regularly in the SANFL. All of our talls are defenders ( Bock, Parker, Smith, Even Perrie was started at FB for NORTH untill 5 mins into the 3rd quarter he was moved to CHF or HFF, Is ben Rutten plaing centre half back for west or up forward this year?)

Everyone has questionsed our game plan, the senior players , the coach now l am saying the club need to look at Jhon reid.The club needs to ask him to place more pressure on the SANFL coaches to Constantly play ( Rutten bock and Watts when he gets a senior game for the eagles as key forwards)

Not to be negitive but if M stevens get back he should go to CHB for the remander of the season and play Kenny Mcgregor at CHF but it is very unlikely that M stevens will play in crows colours again.
 
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