Yup offence is a reason to stop your point of viewHow has 18c stopped freedom of speech?
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Yup offence is a reason to stop your point of viewHow has 18c stopped freedom of speech?
What?Yup offence is a reason to stop your point of view
So you think contempt of court should not be against the law. You’re cool with Derryn Hinch naming rape victims etc?In this case, absolutely not.
It should have led to military leaders getting what I hope they get eventually.
In no way am I disagreeing with you, aside from the actual violence aspect. You'll get a few arrests at these protests, but beyond that not a great deal happens; the protesters yell slogans, those going to the events go inside with their noses in the air.
I reiterate: why are you allowing them to restrict your freedom? Is freedom truly not that important to you?
Liberal DemocratsI would call myself a Conservative. An economic system built around reward for effort is far superior to anything thrown up by the left (this debate was settled 30 years ago).
Having said that, I'm fairly liberal in my views about social issues, sexuality, marriage, etc. I'm anti guns, pro choice (although not without limits), in favour of action on climate change.
I strongly urge people to think for themselves and listen to (and respect) the views of others.
I find those on the far right frightening. I find those on the far left to be hypocritical, self-righteous, and ignorant of history.
I cannot believe the Australian Government has considered denying access to Milo Yiannopoulos. It is not the role of Government to influence whom I listen to. I would hold this opinion also if it were a far left commentator (say someone of the ilk of Clementine Ford, who hates men at least as much as Milo hates Islam).
We desperately need another political party in Australia catering for Conservatives.
Ugly....I don't think they're a hate group. They're lobbyists, plain and simple, in pursuit of power and influence; they're not even true social reformers, because there is no backbone, no leadership, no real influence. They're unworthy successors of 'feminism', because it's less about ideals than it is power and shame.
Ad hominem (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies) is very specifically attacking the character from which an argument originates instead of their argument/ideas. It's a fallacy because the character of the person stating something isn't relevant to what they're saying, not from a logical standpoint; a person can be blind, and have no conception of what colour is beyond descriptions they read from a description of a Van Gough painting (from one of his more psychedelic works) yet be absolutely correct when they say that the sky is blue; responding with, "How would you know, you're blind!" is ad hominem.
I'm not necessarily talking about your quote, nor am I saying that the ad hominem is yours, or at least yours alone. I'm talking about both sides here, how 'feminists' like Clementine Ford love to insult those that disagree with them in a wide variety of ways, and how both you and EasternTiger between you agreed that third wave feminists became that way because they're ugly and/or stupid. If either side were to actually bother to attack each other's arguments/ideas, then there would be opportunity for progress; instead, what we're left in is an ideological impasse, with both sides being too antagonistic and too pridefull to actually commit their ideas to the task of defeating their opponent, and to allow for the possibility of loss.
I'm at a loss as to what you want. Do you want for the state to imprison those who step across the line? I'm all for that. Do you want the police to clamp down on non-peaceful protest? I'm for that too.200 protesters blocking my path and shouting in my face, and you want me to justify why I'm 'allowing them' to restrict my freedom? They are not all languid, mangina students. Some of them are violent arseholes.
As I said, if I had to run this gauntlet to get into a game of footy I would not attend either. But of course that would never happen. You'd get Gil, Andrews and Ashton on the front page telling us what a disgrace it was and it needed to be clamped down on immediately.
So their behaviour is ugly rather than their person?Ugly....
Came about as discussion around Milo making that statement. We elaborated on it.
I define ugly as a state of being , hatred, resentment, lack of emotional intelligence .
It manifests to the physical.
Yes they tend to be unattractive but I'd go further to say unattractive is not important. ugly for (lack of a better word and my limited vocabulary) enhances a person's physical traits to resemble ugliness.
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I agree that's where I'm headed. I am increasingly finding myself espousing libertarian views.Liberal Democrats
You wanted Manning executed. If the state pledged to begin executing biological racists, you would not find the policy as rosy.Or you want the law unevenly applied according to your politics?
Yes.So their behaviour is ugly rather than their person?
Well said. Give them enough rope ...It limits the potential for racists to be publicly racist.
For what it's worth, I think 18c should be repealed, if only so that those who want to be publicly racist can get publicly humiliated when people don't accept their nonsense. You cannot disprove an unspoken concept, and you cannot argue with silence.
I'm at a loss as to what you want. Do you want for the state to imprison those who step across the line? I'm all for that. Do you want the police to clamp down on non-peaceful protest? I'm for that too.
If what you're asking for is for the protests to be banned, I'm never going to be for that, ever. If what you're asking for is for protesters to be forced to pay for their protests, I'd be interested in theory right up until you couldn't protest without applying for a permit that came attached to a processing fee. If what you're asking for is the state paying for protection for obnoxious right wing speakers at their own cost, I'd be a little miffed, but from an ideological standpoint I'd be able to intellectualise it as being a component of protecting his/her right to freedom of speech and those who went along's freedom of association, expression etc.
Still waiting on evidence of an Australian version of Antifa.Last time Milo was out here there was wailing and gnashing of teeth.
I just hope antifa learns the meaning of peaceful protest.
... all of which could and would be used to silence political protest by politicians, given half the chance.What I'd like is to be able to attend speaking events of my choice, like I attend sporting events, without being intimidated from doing so. This isn't controversial. So if protesters attempt to block attendees from attending an event they should be issued with a banning notice that 'allows police to prohibit a person from a designated area for 24 hours where they suspect a person has committed an offence, or is acting in an offensive or drunken manner'. Acting Assistant Commissioner Andrew Crisp said banning notices ''allow police to remove troublemakers and drunks from an area, allowing people who are doing the right thing to enjoy themselves in a safe environment''.
Police also now have antisocial behaviour powers that allow for $234-on-the-spot fines for people who are drunk, drunk and disorderly, who fail to move on after being directed to by police and for disorderly conduct.
I don't want the state to pay for protection to listen to what you perceive as 'obnoxious right wing speakers'. I want the state to protect me to allow me to attend what I might find interesting.
It is interesting you are going down this path.Still waiting on evidence of an Australian version of Antifa.
What is interesting is the degree to which you are going to avoid answering my question.It is interesting you are going down this path.
I guess Anonymous doesn't exist either. You've painted yourself into a corner now, and you're coming across as very dishonest.What is interesting is the degree to which you are going to avoid answering my question.
???I guess Anonymous doesn't exist either. You've painted yourself into a corner now, and you're coming across as very dishonest.
Do you think antifa australia should be labelled a terrorist group?
Noted.???
I legitimately do not know what you mean, or what you are saying. You seem to be invoking things that you are 100% certain of, that simply do not exist. Anonymous is a collection of people who can and have hacked numerous government and private entities for the purpose of bringing to light their misdeeds and potentially bringing them to some form of social justice; they lack a nation per say, instead associating with each other. Just as there is not an American Anonymous, there is not an Australian Anonymous; to say more than that, you would have to be intimately acquainted with their goings on, from within the organisation.
Antifa, though, has had a presence a numerous American protests, and has public representation there. They have had members go to prison, and they have people who call themselves members of 'Antifa'. That cannot be said in an Australian context, and that's your issue. You are conflating American and Australian contexts without any evidence to say why or even to make the case that they should be similar. You are relying either on no-one picking you up on it, or vague references to conspiracy theories being accepted as passable reasoning.
There is no Australian Antifa. Feel free to prove me wrong, if you can, without vague references to some bogeyman to frighten children off to bed.
Lol you are struggling. The law Manning was charged under had a penalty of execution. Instead, Manning got seven years. This all powerful state you think must be stopped doesn’t seem that powerful.You wanted Manning executed. If the state pledged to begin executing biological racists, you would not find the policy as rosy.
I've never said there are nazis in Australia, nor do I frequent the threads that say they do.Noted.
I don't mind you playing make believe, as long as you're consistent and concede there is no official Nazi presence or neo-nazi party in Australia.
We are all sick of these imaginary Nazis that are going to destroy our Australian way of life.