Rules Fremantle Board Rules - Start here

Discussion in 'Fremantle' started by Stronzo, Mar 2, 2015.

Put it out there
  1. salim malik

    salim malik Norm Smith Medallist

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    Same,what was Bushie suspended for. There seems to be an unfair stance taken in the Mcarthy threads against Freo posters. I had my privileges to post taken away in that thread for something that was never explained to me and a very moderate Freo poster was given a ban. The mentioned trolls all seem to have been given carte blanche to lay crap on our club while the protectors Bushie etc have copped the cards. The enjoyment was being sucked out of the Freo board. At the minute without the trolls and nay sayers the board is as it should be ,a discussion for Freo followers. Ban the trolls and leave the genuine Freo posters to enjoy their board please .
     
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  2. DudleyDocker

    DudleyDocker Club Legend

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    Well said salim malik - it seems the only people upset by Bushie's behaviour (other than the trolls) were the mods.

    Is there a way we can get this ban reversed Righteo?
     
  3. Crippa

    Crippa Club Legend

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    Something is rotten in the state of Denmark when even the old stalwarts and respected citizens of this board of the calibre of couldhavebeen salim malik Clems Knee etc are clamouring for Bushie's return and being ignored.

    The people have spoken along the breadth and length and depth and height of this forum so it's time to stop this farce and bring Bushie home for Christmas.

    Righteo would you kindly reverse the edict please.

    It is within your power to restore order and calm in the ranks.
     
  4. Stronzo

    Stronzo Premium Platinum

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    None of the current moderators are responsible for you grievance, so your banging on about something which is completely irrelevant to any of the freo board mods currently reading this. Pointless whinging.
     
  5. DudleyDocker

    DudleyDocker Club Legend

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    You asked a question I answered it - if that doesn't suit you then stiff shit. I couldn't really give a toss what you think is pointless whingeing mate.
     
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  6. Allikat

    Allikat Moderator

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    When I first agreed to be a mod I said that I loved how the Freo board operates. How we allow other teams posters on to contribute to the conversation - within reason - and how everyone gets along so well.

    I've been a mod for about a week now, and all I've done is delete a string of posts which consisted of a couple of posters yelling off topic - and put an explanation that I was deleting it because it was off-topic. I haven't done any deleting or anything since then. Well the reaction since has been really hurtful & disappointing, and has shown me a new light of what this forum can be like. I've been called some pretty nasty things, been personally attacked by posters who believe what one very vocal poster has said despite none of it being true. How about before attacking someone next time you hear both sides of the story?

    I have no requirement to discuss someone's grievances in an open forum - the correct way to discuss anything like that would be via PM - an avenue that wasn't even attempted with me before I started being attacked. I wasn't even online to speak for myself before everyone else joined in. And me answering in that thread would also be breaking a rule - the rule I was trying to enforce - that we keep threads on topic.

    We can't make rules that cover everything, doing so would basically make us North Korea. That's why the blanket rule is there - to cover those other circumstances if required - not so that we can be dictators. And everyone's being so contradictory to it's application. You want posters who are trolls outside the Freo board to be banned from the board before they've even broken a rule here - yet you want everyone to be banned consistently. You want trolls who come on this board to be dealt with harsher than everyone else - yet you're also derailing threads by replying to those trolls in a harsh manner thus also breaking the rules.

    The correct way to deal with this - if a troll comes on the forums report them. There's an extreme lack of reporting on this forum so without analysing every single post that happens as it happens how are mods supposed to help keep the place clean? And just because one person's breaking rules doesn't give everyone a blanket allowance to do so. If you want to have a go at someone expect to get similar treatment to them - and expect your posts to get cleaned up afterwards.

    And if you have a problem with how a mod does things, then PM them. If you still don't like it, speak to another board mod, or go higher up to a super mod. Those avenues are there to help all posters.

    You've just had a change of mods around the place, how about giving us a go before abusing us for things that happened during the past year. I can't change that, and I like to think that when those things were happening that I was a good poster - hence me getting this opportunity. Seriously, if you report stuff, or actually talk to us by PMing us, good things can happen in this forum. If you're going to abuse us openly, then expect to get carded.
     
  7. Freofalcon

    Freofalcon Brownlow Medallist

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    Upsetting you've been personally attacked in here Alli.

    Some people take the interwebz far too seriously and need to pull their heads in.
     
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  8. Messenger

    Messenger Admin

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    And this is it in a nutshell.

    There is no grand conspiracy to silence Bushie. Warning points accumulate. When you get to five you get a week off, ten two weeks,etc.

    All mods are volunteers and it's hard to recruit mods when they are used for target practice on the boards. So we afford them some protection from that. Having said that, all mods are accountable and if you have a problem you are able to approach that mod by PM or a super or an admin.
     
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  9. salim malik

    salim malik Norm Smith Medallist

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    Would it not be helpful if posters were told why they have received an infraction? I have received a few and still don't know what they were for.
    I was not having a shot at Allikat . I have met her and found her to be a true purple . My complaint is with the trolls having a free reign and Freo posters being carded for standing up for the club.
     
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  10. Crippa

    Crippa Club Legend

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    Everyone extended you a warm welcome and expressed how pleased they were to have you as a mod and nobody has abused you for things that happened in the past year or otherwise. The recent explosion of complaints was due entirely to the sudden arbitrary deletion of posts and the perception that Bushie was being penalized repeatedly by the arbitrary application of the Ballantyne rule by mods who personally didn't want him around.

    There has been no nasty name-calling. You did call Bushie a troll, which is a pretty nasty thing to call someone who is anything but, but Bushie never responded by calling you nasty names back. He did ask why you were calling him a troll - a public question posed in response to a public insult issued by a mod who it appeared was free to insult posters with impunity. There being no answer or apology forthcoming, he asked the question again, for which he was penalized and ultimately suspended. And all this at a time when every courtesy and welcome and indulgence was being extended to a notorious troll and Freo hater in Defacto.

    Great. couldhavebeen salim malik Reginald Perrin and others have actually talked to you on this Rules thread. I hope you can make good things happen by redressing the grievances of many who share their view.
     
  11. Reginald Perrin

    Reginald Perrin Brownlow Medallist

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    The concept that rules on any team board are to be applied to supporters of that board in exactly the same way they are to opposition posters seems ludicrous to me. Surely Freo supporters deserve more leeway on this board than those from opposition teams. Why have a team board otherwise?

    It's a personal viewpoint that posters who incessantly troll Freo elsewhere, particularly the main board where trolling is supposedly against the rules, have forfeit the right to visit this board in comfort.

    These points are, of course, for mods to decide. I'm merely expressing an opinion, something I'm reasonably sure we're still allowed to do.
     

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  12. Grape Bear

    Grape Bear Norm Smith Medallist

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    I support Reg (gasp!) on the above.

    I don't normally take to trolling and never go on any board but with respect, but I have noticed that on other boards, you can get banned for even just sneezing in a perceived negative way. Our board seems to be more welcoming to opposition posters, even those that are skirting the edge, but we also seem to give opposition trolls more leeway before kicking them out. Clearly, the atmosphere of being open to input from opposition supporters is a double edged sword in that while it encourages healthy discussion, it also invites dickheads who think they can get away with quite a bit with no consequence. To be fair to our mods, the trolls eventually get kicked out once they are reported, but it can take a while.

    With regards to the analogy about not tolerating people talking smack to you inside your own home, I would like to extend the analogy and put up an argument for just permabanning known Freo haters from polluting any of our threads, regardless of how they are posting. I know it seems unfair, but I don't see why we would want to be welcoming to posters that clearly hate Fremantle and constantly trash us everywhere else.

    I don't how it would be logical behaviour allowing a person who brought his dog into your home, allowed it to defecate all over your living room floor and left without cleaning his mess, and then goes around telling your neighbors what a shithead host you are, to ever come back into your home again, regardless of his intent the next time he comes around. I wouldn't even be letting him in.

    That's why I am not a mod. :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2015
  13. scon

    scon Norm Smith Medallist

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    As ever Reg your viewpoint is in glorious agreement with the Rules of Bigfooty:"Club boards are places for club supporters to gather. Respect the team and its supporters when you visit."
    Grand conspiracy or nay,given the vexatious nature of the discussion it's understandable that many consider the mechanism was 'This poster is easier to ban than respond to.'...or thereabouts.
    Points accumulate regardless of their fairness or any violation of dignity!
    Is there a rule the bloke contravened that someone from either the moderation or administration universe is happy to share or explain??
    A declaration on that front might allow some to return respectful.
     
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  14. Clems Knee

    Clems Knee Norm Smith Medallist

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    I reckon I'll take you up on this offer. In my opinion, a lot of the problems on this board stem from differing interpretations of the rules.

    Well, kinda depends on which troll you are really. How about a modification?
    "If you troll our posters/team on this or other boards, your presence on this board will not be tolerated."
    A simple check of a posters recent posting history should be able to determine whether they have been trolling. Some posters block access to their profile - I assume moderators can see past that? Quick justice to get them off our board.
    The harder issue is when posters with Fremantle as their designated club engage in trolling. We had to put up with a lot of that in 2015. Starting trolling threads on the main board, overly disrespectful comments about the team and its players, which are essentially button pushing exercises.
    Perhaps the rules should also state a reminder that "this is a public forum and family members of players are likely to read some of these posts."

    Of course the disclaimer at the end negates this statement. There has been a fair bit of playing the man on this board of late.

    All good.

    Horde.
    I agree that conversation evolves. Taylor's initiative in collecting the training reports from the thread is excellent. But I like the meandering discussion of vanilla slices etc. it doesn't hurt anyone. Please only delete posts when they break rules 1,2,3,5,6. Rule 4 infractions should result in dumping of posts to the Purple Horde, at most.

    And here is where Bushie has been a great defender on this board. There have been examples of very poor posting recently which was let stand. Bushie, correctly in my opinion, decried the acceptance of some grubby sexist comments.

    All the current mods were good posters before being elevated. I've had conversations with a moderator or two in the past, and believe that they are there for the right reasons. Maybe as a board we don't use the report buttons often enough, but I'm guessing that some people use them too often.
    There also appears to be a lack of transparency in how infraction points are handed out. Some get them for the mildest of misdemeanours, seemingly as a way to rack up enough points to suspend or ban. Closing threads that discuss this, or trying to limit discussion to PM do not help.

    This disclaimer ( the Ballantyne rule because it reflects his treatment by the umpires) is a pile of horseshit.
    The part stating the different histories of each poster should go. Some of us (not just moderators) need to get shorter memories. Bygones.
    People who start off trolling can become good contributors, similarly people who come out with racist or sexist comments but who don't repeat them. Moderating should be on the basis of current posts and recent posting history.

    How about this for a disclaimer?:
    "Whilst enforcing the rules we will take into account the context of discussions. We will endeavour to explain the reason for an infraction to the infringing poster, however; in some circumstances individual feedback is not practicable and we will give generalised feedback through the board or particular thread."

    tl;dr: it's not that hard to read a long post. Just read it.
     
  15. Freo Shark

    Freo Shark Invasion of the Purple Haze

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    That in a nutshell. Its nothing personal against Allikat or Righteo or any of them. I appreciate its a hard job to do.
     
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  16. Freo Shark

    Freo Shark Invasion of the Purple Haze

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    Sorry Seppo for quoting this manuscript but this should be taken on board to be discussed by all the mods. Makes a helluva lot of sense.

     
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  17. Stronzo

    Stronzo Premium Platinum

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    The disclaimer is brilliant.

    I vote it stays.
     
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  18. Grape Bear

    Grape Bear Norm Smith Medallist

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    If it stays then it definitely should apply to opposition trolls who come here and are deliberately provocative. Given the context of past history, they need to be given very little leeway on our board and if stirring trouble, mods should come down hard on them.

    Freo supporters on the Fremantle board shouldn't have the obligation to keep it civil more than posters who are playing "innocent" but clearly stirring the pot.

    I don't always agree with the Americans, but they definitely have it right that if an intruder comes into your home and you injure him or kill him, it's justifiable homicide or self defence. And if the intruder does vice versa, the penalty for the felony goes up exponentially. ;)
     
  19. Clems Knee

    Clems Knee Norm Smith Medallist

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    That's the extent of your argument?
    You're quite brilliant Stronzo.
     
  20. Stronzo

    Stronzo Premium Platinum

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    You can improve them no doubt, but the interpretations will always differ as mods will view things differently depending on the issue and who is involved and the mood of those involved. Like it or not, that is how modding works.

    I wrote the disclaimer to illustrate the point that's it's not consistent.

    Posters who have a history of causing trouble will attract the mods attention more than others. This won't change by altering some words here. The disclaimer actually lays bare some of the truths to applying the rules.
     
  21. Stronzo

    Stronzo Premium Platinum

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    That was tongue in cheek.
     
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  22. Clems Knee

    Clems Knee Norm Smith Medallist

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    So why have rules 1 - 6 at all?
    Mods are inconsistent, based on their moods, whether they like you, or whether they agree with what you say. Oh and if you have a bad reputation, deserved or not, you are toast.
    No wonder there is much unrest from real Fremantle posters on here.
    The disclaimer is not defensible as it is clearly unfair. That you wrote it to accurately reflect what is going on in moderating these boards is even more wrong. Both need to change.
     
  23. Stronzo

    Stronzo Premium Platinum

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    I wrote it to capture the variables that applying rules can cause.

    Tinker and tweak the rules, paint them a different colour - you'll still have inconsistencies based on the human nature of enforcing them.

    Anyway, that's why I wrote it. It's up to others now to decide what they want to do with them. There are site wide rules that give a broader explanation.
     
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  24. couldhavebeen

    couldhavebeen Premiership Player

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    The point that all posters are trying to make here is a lot of us were involved with Dockerland and very quickly left it because of the abusive manner in which they were treated and the amount of trolling that just made life hell if you tried to have a half serious discussion .

    What I and I think every Freo poster enjoys about Big Footy is that we can have great discussions , differing points of view and witty discussions with each other and visitors from the other teams without the vitriol .
    Yes some posters have gone a bit overboard but in 99% of cases then realize they have gone too far and have apologised .
    We are all mad passionate Freo fans or we wouldn't be here so please , all we want is a fare go and like all Fans we sometimes need an umpire to pull us into line and explain to us what we have done wrong .This way the miss understandings can be avoided , posters then understand and can either move on or if still unhappy go higher .
    The infraction needs to be explained before action is taken is the other common thread here .
    Allikat ,
    I'm sorry and upset that you have been abused here . I'm very upset that poster have seen fit to personally attack you .
    Please don't loose heart and quit .Without MODS the boards would be a different place .
    Just like a footy game we need umpires to keep the alive and in good health.
     
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  25. scon

    scon Norm Smith Medallist

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    Something rotten in the state of Denmark indeed!
    In the absence of any explanations I have noticed that apparentlydead is no longer suspended.