Strategy Functional Forward Structure (FFS!!!)

[Killer Power]

A lot of discussion in the SPP thread re how we will set up forward in 2020 and will it work and probably deserves its own dedicated thread.

Forward efficiency has been our Achilles heel throughout the Hinkley era arguably driven by poor tactics as much as the personnel available. In 2020 we will see a different line up with Howard / Sgray departed, the return of Dixon, SPP mooted to be moving forward plus multiple additions from the draft that could play a role.

How will we structure up and will it make one iota of difference if we don't stop kicking it deep into the pockets?

 

[Ant Bear]

It's [insert forward]'s fault for not running hard enough out of defence.

 

[Magus]

Expecting a lot of experimentation and to be pretty unsettled for most of the year.

 

[snozulu]

SPP is a goal scoring inside mid and in the middle is where he should play. Ebert plays that forward role ok for now and we have gray and marshall with dixon and the class of the newbies to add x factor

 

[Enviable Tradition]

Play a CHF (Dixon).

A FF leading out the square (Georgiadis)

A tall link man (Marshall)

And a resting ruck (Ladhams)

One genuine crumber (Butters)

One high half forward (Rozzee)

Then rotate mids through when one of these is on the bench (Gray, SPP, Ebert etc. )

People will say it is too tall but all of those are mobile options (bar the resting ruck) and for the majority of the game you would have one of those 4 talls on the bench (or in the ruck).

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[TeeKray]

Won't improve much until we trade for or draft and develop higher quality KPFs. Dixon is not good enough to be the go to man. Marshall will never be big enough to be the go to man. And I can't see anyone else on our list who is likely to develop into that player.

 

[JUSTWORK]

Won't improve much until we trade for or draft and develop higher quality KPFs. Dixon is not good enough to be the go to man. Marshall will never be big enough to be the go to man. And I can't see anyone else on our list who is likely to develop into that player.

Disagree Re Dixon, 2017 he was one of the best key forwards in the comp, with decent delivery and support he is absolutely good enough.

 

[Chewy316]

I have no faith under Hinkley that this will get fixed. Even when we were good in 13 and 14, our forward line wasn't exactly efficient by scheme. But rather, we had some excellent kicks for goal in Schulz and Wingard and our midfield would run over teams. More opportunities for goal eventually led to more goals. Our kicking though has gotten worse in general over the last five years and this has also translated to the forward line. So often we let ourselves down by doing all the attacking for 15 minutes for 3 or 4 points, and then the oppo get on the counter for a cheap goal out the back. It's classic Hinkley ball.

Moving SPP to the forward line isn't something new. They tried it in spurts last year going back as far as round 1 at the G when he spent some time resting in the forward 50.

Assuming Dixon and Marshall are the two talls, I hope that we have a hybrid 3rd guy like a Georgiades who can play the Gunston role. Our small forwards in Rozee, Robbie, Farrell, Butters etc are up to standard. Personnel to me isn't too big an issue. But whether Hinkley can actually coach the best out of this unit? The 8 ball at this stage says "Don't count on it."

 

[Janus]

Play Georgiades, and everything will be fixed.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Hinkley and Bassett combo driving strategy wont see any substantial improvement.

The stability mantra means more malaise in the forward line.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

Play Georgiades, and everything will be fixed.

Narrator: "It wasn't"

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[El_Scorcho]

Won't improve much until we trade for or draft and develop higher quality KPFs. Dixon is not good enough to be the go to man. Marshall will never be big enough to be the go to man. And I can't see anyone else on our list who is likely to develop into that player.

And we won't do this until the real crux of the problem is solved.

Ken Hinkley, and the football department in the era that he's coached, place absolutely no value on forward structure or a functional forward line. We don't play adequate KPFs, never have. As such we've not been bothered to even attempt to properly develop any young KPF that has found his way onto our list. We don't seem to have any plan to create space for leading forwards or to generate high percentage scoring opportunities. It's literally generate a turnover and then bank on individual brilliance, and that was the case even in 2013 and 2014. A well organised defence completely stifles us unless Robbie Gray can get off the chain a bit.

The chances of our forward line being functional in 2020 is zero unless Ken Hinkley and Nathan Bassett have done a complete and total backflip on their entire football philosophy.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

The chances of our forward line being functional in 2020 is zero unless Ken Hinkley and Nathan Bassett have done a complete and total backflip on their entire football philosophy.

A backflip is useless. It means you are still facing the same way and have just landed a few feet behind where you started.

We need a 180 degree turn around.

 

[Powerade 08]

Need to give Georgiades a good run of games. From the players on our list, he is the one you would guess the future forwardline is built around.

 

[VineValerian]

A backflip is useless. It means you are still facing the same way and have just landed a few feet behind where you started.

We need a 180 degree turn around.

A half backflip.
Means we will be standing on our hands!
Maybe not such a bad thing really.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

Play a CHF (Dixon).

A FF leading out the square (Georgiadis)

A tall link man (Marshall)

And a resting ruck (Ladhams)

One genuine crumber (Butters)

One high half forward (Rozzee)

Then rotate mids through when one of these is on the bench (Gray, SPP, Ebert etc. )

People will say it is too tall but all of those are mobile options (bar the resting ruck) and for the majority of the game you would have one of those 4 talls on the bench (or in the ruck).

On SM-G960F using
BigFooty.com mobile app

Lol what people? Ken Hinkley and his direct family?

 

[Byrons Firen]

Need to give Georgiades a good run of games. From the players on our list, he is the one you would guess the future forwardline is built around.

Got high hopes for Mitch and a hunch he'll turn out to be really special.

 

[*PAF]

Boak.
S. Gray
B. Ebert
Now SPP.

Meanwhile we play some forwards as midfielders.

Perhaps we could be better off if we let forwards be forwards and midfielders midfielders.

Extremely radical I know but who knows it might be worth a try.

 

[shewho]

We have a good midfield- we are in the top tier for centre clearances.

We have a good defence- we are in the top tier for least points conceded

We have a poor forward line- despite being in the top tier for Inside 50's we are below par for points scored.

We have the cattle- Gray, Dixon, Rozee is at least an excellent start. Fix our forward line and we are in contention. The pressure is on Bassett to produce.

I noticed something interesting (to me at least). Take the premiers from 2013 to 2019 (the Hinkley era). List their top 2 goal kickers. Our leading goal kicker never scored more than the premier's leading goal kicker. Only 3 times in this period has our leading goal kicker scored more than the premier's 2nd goal kicker- 2013, 2014 and 2017- the 3 times we have made finals under Hinkley.

From this I deduce some obvious points-

1. The premiers always have at least 2 reliable forwards who score plenty of goals
2. Port does best when it also has reliable avenues to goal.

The not so obvious point is although the days of the stay at home forward (Lockett, Dunstall etc) are gone, heavy rotations of forwards (the so called "sharing the goal scoring load") doesn't work. While it makes you less predictable to defenders, it also make you less predictable to your own midfield. Players who deliver the ball inside 50, thrive on predictability.

Imagine you're a Port midfielder, 75 meters out from goal, under pressure, who in an instant gets the ball. You have no time to think. You will have no idea what's ahead of you- maybe a tall like Dixon, maybe a small like Gray, maybe no-one.

Now imagine you're a Richmond midfielder in the same boat. You know roughly where Lynch and/or Riewoldt will be so under pressure you go into default mode.

In the last 5 or so years our coaches have talked about improving the quality of our Inside 50s. This reached a crescendo in 2017 when we recruited Rockliff, Watts and Motlop to improve our inside 50s. If we increase the predictability of our forward line, so that that poor **** 75 metres out knows what he will do with the ball before he gets it, our Inside 50s will look a whole lot better.

I'm not saying we need a permanent stay at home forward or that we should revert to a very predictable forward line. But we have the balance wrong and we have to push the pendulum back a bit further away from "unpredictable" and a bit closer to "predictable."

A predictable forward line may help the defending team, but it helps the attacking team more.

 

[PJ Power]

We have failed to replace/replicate the dynamic mix that was Schulz, Monfries, peak 2013-15 Wingard and R Gray.
We assumed that with Charlie we could simplify our game plan to kick long to him. Everything has suffered from there.
The recent recruiting of Rozee, Butters, Bergman, Georgiades and Williams gives us a lot more energy, forward acumen and x-factor. We now need a reliable big presence to work with them not be the go-to man 9 times out of 10.
We need players who lead repeatedly , find space, convert half chances, reliably kick the goals they should and mark when they get hands to the footy.

 

[Byrons Firen]

For a functional forward structure get rid of Bassett

Fix our forward line and we are in contention. The pressure is on Bassett to produce.

imo the Bassett model has failed miserably that is what he has produced. He did ok when defence coach but no way should he be even on the payroll.

Back to defence coach or out the door. That there has been so little accountability in our senior coaches or management is jaw dropping.

 

[MrChow]

I don’t agree our mid is good. They win contested possession and clearances but can’t kick.

when Houston, Burton, Amon get the ball and deliver inside 50 they hit targets.

our forward line have stopped leading often, because Boak, Wines, SPP, Ebert and so on can’t kick.

we are also too slow with our ball movement too, and leg speed through the midfield and high half forwards will help.

So in terms of structuring up, the forward line should be encouraged to lead, and learn to make space But ultimately it is more reliant on the midfield, and run ooff half back

with Rozee, Butters playing more mid - maybe..

Dixon, Marshall, Georgiades/Resting ruck
R Gray, Bergman, Farrell, SPP/Ebert (bench spot)

 

[PowerLil]

Heard an interesting stat on SEN today. We are last in the league for contested marks and by a fair margin.

 

[DazalenkoUBewty]

Won't improve much until we trade for or draft and develop higher quality KPFs. Dixon is not good enough to be the go to man. Marshall will never be big enough to be the go to man. And I can't see anyone else on our list who is likely to develop into that player.

Marshall is only 21. He will fill out. We'll see reasonable gains this season, but especially in the few seasons following. I think he'll turn into a serious weapon.

 

[JUSTWORK]

Marshall is only 21. He will fill out. We'll see reasonable gains this season, but especially in the few seasons following. I think he'll turn into a serious weapon.

I wouldn't expect Marshall to fill out much more then where he is now. Going into 4th season now, time to really step up and show why he was a first round pick.