G Half Full

[Hawkk]

isn't that the same as the kangas??

aren't the kangas positioning themselves on the gold coast to generate new long term revenue streams???

We are using Tasmania exclusively as a secondary market to compliment our primary market in Victoria with an eye to remaining competitive with the Collingwood’s and West Coast’s long term – hence the move to Waverley.

both clubs struggle to make ends meet in melbourne, so they look interstate so they can prosper

What are you smoking, Hawthorn have made 10 consecutive profits, have the 3rd highest revenue out of the Victorian clubs and consistently have 30,000+ members…hardly struggling to make ends meet in Melbourne.

With that being said, we along with most of the competition are significantly behind the WC and Collingwood’s of the world, hence the sponsorship agreement.

struggle to see how the kangas doing a deal with the gold coast to hopefully generate new supporters and revenue streams whilst holding on to their traditional melbourne base is different to hawthorn doing the same in tassie??

It’s completely different.

ont even know what the thread is about, im just replying to posts, mentioning why the pies and dons get bigger crowds than smaller clubs like hawthorn

Hawthorn isn’t a small club, that's where we differ...

 

[Hawkk]

BTW I hope the Pies win on Anzac Day

I don't

 

[Thats_Rubbish]

I don't

but hang on that's not right.....as Hawk supporters arent we meant to be overly worried and focussed on the Dons? you cant hope they win surely?

 

[Redline]

Every year around ANZAC day we get the familiar bitching and moaning about Essendon and Collingwood keeping the blockbuster games for themselves and not sharing them with other clubs. It isnt fair when anyone else could fill the MCG just as easily on such a day.

Yet here we are, Easter Monday an two of Victorias great white hopes getting ready to set themselves up for a finals tilt and their combined fans cant even half fill the MCG. Is a disgrace and time this game was given to someone else. Dogs Vs Saints would be a good one. At least the Bombers and the Pies fans have the courtesy and passion to turn up and watch their teams play.

From my point of view living outside Victoria I bassically want to see the best possible game between two Victorian Clubs on TV on the public holidays and couldn't really care how many turn up. Thankfully Essendon are playing some good football but the game this week doesn't really excite me that much. Nor did yesterday's.

 

[Hawkk]

but hang on that's not right.....as Hawk supporters arent we meant to be overly worried and focussed on the Dons? you cant hope they win surely?

No, but I can hope for a draw and a stack of Essendon 2-3 week injuries

 

[doppleganger]

We are using Tasmania exclusively as a secondary market to compliment our primary market in Victoria with an eye to remaining competitive with the Collingwood’s and West Coast’s long term – hence the move to Waverley.

aren't the kangas using the gold coast as a secondary market to complement their primary market in Victoria with an eye to remaining competitive with the Collingwood’s and West Coast’s long term – hence the redevlopment of Arden St.

What are you smoking, Hawthorn have made 10 consecutive profits, have the 3rd highest revenue out of the Victorian clubs and consistently have 30,000+ members…hardly struggling to make ends meet in Melbourne.

With that being said, we along with most of the competition are significantly behind the WC and Collingwood’s of the world, hence the sponsorship agreement

profits coz of ian dicker donations??

Hawthorn isn’t a small club, that's where we differ...

big clubs dont sell home games becuase the crowds they draw aren't enough to cover costs

 

[doppleganger]

Dopple I think we are not actually that far apart on our views. You're just wrong. No only kidding I did never say they bought players - just that players went to where the better teams were. I agree totally that popularity doesnt simply = success. Of course it doesnt. That has been my view throughout this thread. The fact is that some numbnuts started this thread by taking a potshot that wasnt warranted which lead to side issues which have distracted me.......from work.

BTW I hope the Pies win on Anzac Day

fair muff

 

[Hawkk]

aren't the kangas using the gold coast as a secondary market to complement their primary market in Victoria with an eye to remaining competitive with the Collingwood’s and West Coast’s long term – hence the redevlopment of Arden St.

I don't want to get involved in a slang match, but if you want to compare the off field performance of Hawthorn and the Kangaroos you are going to be very disappointed.

profits coz of ian dicker donations??

So you don't think other presidents haven't kicked in abit over time?

It doesn't take away the fact that despite being in the midst of our worst on field streak since 1945-1960, we still have the 3rd highest revenue base, have made consecutive profit (including a 1,200,000 dollar cash profit in 2006) and don't get any handouts from the AFL...

big clubs dont sell home games becuase the crowds they draw aren't enough to cover costs

If Hawthorn could play all 11 home games at Waverley or the MCG, I doubt we would even play games in Tasmania - where we traditionally have a strong membership anyway.

 

[discoduck]

is it any wonder hawk supporters can't stand essendon and collingwood peoples???

it is obvious essendon and collingwood have bigger supporter bases than hawthorn - so in reality, this whole argument is a "more people like us than you" type gloat. it's simple mathematics - if essendon and collingwood have 80000 members between them and 55000 show up, you're operating at 70% or so. if hawthorn and melbourne have 65000 members between them and 45000 show up, you're still around the 70% - so the crowds are pretty equal in terms of getting the people who support you to the game.

the other thing that irks me are people who only go and watch their team if it's their own home game. "it would have drawn more people if it was our home game". pfft. go and support your team no matter whose home game it is.

 

[doppleganger]

I don't want to get involved in a slang match, but if you want to compare the off field performance of Hawthorn and the Kangaroos you are going to be very disappointed.

just interested in why u dont think the kangas are doing the exact same thing as hawthorn, or what separates the two??

So you don't think other presidents haven't kicked in abit over time?

never said that, dicker did chuck in a fair amount tho didn't he?

If Hawthorn could play all 11 home games at Waverley or the MCG, I doubt we would even play games in Tasmania - where we traditionally have a strong membership anyway.

dont understand hawks fans not going to the dome, if they can come in from rowville to go to the g surely they can go to the dome???

 

[Daytripper]

Considering its been said quite a few times in this thread already - Hawthorn fans easily outnumbered Melbourne fans 2-1 out of 45,000 - yes I am comparing the crowd on Easter sunday. Firstly, there werent 32k dons fans - be fair and give at least 2k to the dockers and thats being more than conservative. Secondly, last i checked there are plenty of people in our society that are not influenced by Easter Sunday so that is NO more an excuse for crowd numbers than Easter Monday.

Do the maths (simple maths really) and you will see there is more than enough good reason to point out that this thread was started by a Essendon fan having a pot shot at crowd numbers without checking his own backyard first. There would be very little argument if the Bombers had got a better crowd themselves. Simple.

Firstly, you are just guessing at the 1:2 ratio of Melbourne to Hawthorn fans as you are also guessing re at least 2000 Docker fans.
Absoloutly unquantafiable.

Secondly, Easter Sunday is far more family orientated than Easter Monday. To say otherwise is ridiculous.

Thirdly, it was also the Orthodox Easter on Sunday (it fell on the same day as the Christian Easter this year). So basically that eliminates all people with Greek, Russian etc backgrounds from attending that day.

Will be interesting to see if Hawks v Roos cracks the 25K mark this weekend.

 

[Hawkk]

just interested in why u dont think the kangas are doing the exact same thing as hawthorn, or what separates the two??

Honestly, living up here its pretty obvious the AFL want another team up here, whether that's the Kangaroos, another team or a new license altogether the Gold Coast will have a team up here full time before 2015.

From an outsider looking in, I get the feeling that the Kangaroos aren't doing a great deal to increase their support and member base in Victoria. They are still based at Arden Street obviously but you never here of them out in the community trying to rally up support, TBH you couldn't really specify without the member books on you where the majority of North's support base comes from. That makes it very hard to target areas where support is strong and grow it.

In contrast, whilst Hawthorn has established a secondary market in Tasmania they are still actively looking to increase their support and member base in areas where Hawk support is strong in Victoria. The fact that Tasmania isn't in the AFL's sights for future expansion and that the club doesn't rely on AFL funding puts the club in a strong position and is the main difference.

But lets leave it at that, we don’t want the conversation veering in this direction.

never said that, dicker did chuck in a fair amount tho didn't he?

Well they had a 2.2 million dollar turnaround in cash position in the space of a year last year, either Dicker ran an inefficient ship and bankrolled the clubs over spending, he put in an excellent framework that now sees the club set to make big profits or Kennett is a sensational president...

 

[Hawkk]

Will be interesting to see if Hawks v Roos cracks the 25K mark this weekend.

It won't - the Sunday twilight games so far have fortunately fallen at times when school holidays/public holidays followed the Sunday.

The fact that this game is played on a Sunday that will basically nullify the family market from attending the game and that its at the Dome basically means a crowd over 20,000 is a minor miracle.

Next weeks attendance has no correlation with yesterdays turnout however...

 

[doppleganger]

In contrast, whilst Hawthorn has established a secondary market in Tasmania they are still actively looking to increase their support and member base in areas where Hawk support is strong in Victoria. The fact that Tasmania isn't in the AFL's sights for future expansion and that the club doesn't rely on AFL funding puts the club in a strong position and is the main difference.

It is obviously a good strategy, but taking away games from ur melbourne supporters can also turn away supporters and members in Melbourne

 

[brad]

Nothing like a bit of condescending language in an attempt to reassert yourself into a discussion thats not going to plan CHAMP.

As I said - the competition was a basket case and certain clubs that played in the VFL in the 1800's set themselves up (as you would expect) in a competition heavily weighted in their favour. There was no control of where players went (much like the pathetic excuse for a soccer league known as the EPL) so where did the good players go? the strong teams gee what a surprise. But thats OK, you continue to live off the old sentimental sob story of how tough things were for the Pies back then and while we're on the topic of losers and mediocrity when was the last time the pies won the spoon or the premiership? hmmmm

Just a reminder for those that have lost track of what this thread is about:
An opportunity was seen by a Essendon fan to take a potshot at Hawthorn (and maybe Melbourne???) for a poor crowd after his superior club won their second game in a row in front of a massive 32000. He took the shot despite the crowd being small due to the poor support of another club but who cares about that because he would know better. Then others of the same beliefs, and some from a far away struggling poor suburb (which is looked down on by others) who still think premierships from the middle of last century are relevant to 2007 came running forth to participate in the potting of the shot and help make themselves feel good. The main thing is all Essendon and Collingwood supporters feel warm and fuzzy about each other because they get big crowds to Anzac Day. Lets all have a group hug and thank our lucky stars for these two great clubs.

I think you should and DO thank your lucky stars. Don't hear Hawthorn asking the AFL to schedule their home games in Tassie against Essendon and Collingwood and choosing to play Freo or Port here at the G.

Why is it again they play HOME matches interstate?????

 

[BedlamHawk]

I wouldn't blame Hawthorn supporters for the poor crowd. From where I was sitting (ponsford stand), all you could see was a sea of gold flags everywhere when Hawthorn got a goal. The demon fans occupied a small portion of the MCC and ponsford stands. There should have been 50K + though. Interesting about next weeks game against North Melbourne. I would be pleasantly surprised if they got over 25,000 as North dont draw very big crowds and Hawthorn fans just hate going to the Dome. However they did get 28,000 there last year when North were around the bottom of the ladder.

 

[Paul Kersey]

Collingwood are such a powerhouse with a successful history that in the mid 80s the club was nearly placed into receivership.

Receivership is a procedure in common law countries whereby a creditor can enforce security against a company's assets in an effort to obtain repayment of the secured debt.

Hilarious.

 

[No. 35]

Collingwood are such a powerhouse with a successful history that in the mid 80s the club was nearly placed into receivership.



Hilarious.

and the rest is history. Not sure why you think it's hilarious ? (just read your post no others).

The fact that we were able to recover more than any other club without assistance? I think that's pretty laughable too, the AFL are a joke I agree, assistance should be stamped out. Goodbye to any club near receivership!!!

 

[Hawkk]

It is obviously a good strategy, but taking away games from ur melbourne supporters can also turn away supporters and members in Melbourne

That's the paradox, if its going to succeed we need the help of the AFL in regards to the fixture, FTA coverage etc. I know this topic has been done to death, but the fact that we play both Collingwood and Carlton at the Telstra Dome (granted its both Carlton and Collingwood's home games) given that both Collingwood and Carlton play home games at the MCG in games that traditionally draw large crowds, was it so much to ask to play the games at the MCG instead of the Dome?

To date, it’s been promising - our membership is up 20% on last year, but more needs to be done to make it a success. It’s a big challenge, but potentially it could make us as a football club.

In the eyes of the AFL the competition is made up of 3 Melbourne based clubs, 6 non Victorian sides and 7 hindrances; the trick is to become one of the significant clubs within AFL circles from our Victorian base. People can bag our club all they like, but at least - unlike a lot of other Victorian based clubs, we are trying to make things happen off our own bat.

I wouldn't blame Hawthorn supporters for the poor crowd. From where I was sitting (ponsford stand), all you could see was a sea of gold flags everywhere when Hawthorn got a goal. The demon fans occupied a small portion of the MCC and ponsford stands. There should have been 50K + though. Interesting about next weeks game against North Melbourne. I would be pleasantly surprised if they got over 25,000 as North dont draw very big crowds and Hawthorn fans just hate going to the Dome. However they did get 28,000 there last year when North were around the bottom of the ladder.

That's the irony, from what I've read the Hawthorn turnout was actually pretty good, yet it seems only Hawthorn fans are copping it in this thread...

Just on the Kangaroos game next week, I'd be surprised if more then 20,000 show up given the circumstances...

Sunday will be the first true indication as to the drawing power of the Sunday Night timeslot – IMO it will be a giant dud. From a grassroots supporter viewpoint, I can't see any positives in the timeslot for the fans...especially when spectators have to go to school/work the next day.

 

[No. 35]

That's the paradox, if its going to succeed we need the help of the AFL in regards to the fixture, FTA coverage etc. I know this topic has been done to death, but the fact that we play both Collingwood and Carlton at the Telstra Dome (granted its both Carlton and Collingwood's home games) given that both Collingwood and Carlton play home games at the MCG in games that traditionally draw large crowds, was it so much to ask to play the games at the MCG instead of the Dome?

True, before the year started I highlighted weekends I'd "get away" for the weekend.

One was the Hawthorn game. Why? biggest reason was the dome on a Sunday, second was the team we were playing.

I have an 18 game reserved seat, so therefore I've already paid for it, yet if I'm going to organize my life around the season I'll choose a TD game before any other and particularly on a Sunday. It's a Collingwood home game too so I feel happy to have not wasted my money. Different story when it's an away game, but still Hawthorn on Sunday....Snore! it's always embarrassingly bad for both.

 

[Paul.]

Collingwood are such a powerhouse with a successful history that in the mid 80s the club was nearly placed into receivership.



Hilarious.

Meh. We're not shacked up in 1/8th of whats left of a grandstand.

 

[Hawkk]

Meh. We're not shacked up in 1/8th of whats left of a grandstand.

I'll pay that

 

[Thats_Rubbish]

I'll pay that

Yeah I laughed too then I wondered whether Paul realises hawks have a $1 lease on the land and will own it outright?

 

[Peacock]

I'm sick of hearing Essendon and COllingwood supporters saying 'look at Hawthorn v Melbourne' you dont deserve ANZAC day. OK that is fair enough. If you are arguing that as your reason as to why Ess and Coll should keep ANZAC day, why not give other clubs that CAN fill the G a go? Carlton v Richmond would fill it easily and you all know that. So what is the problem?

 

[doppleganger]

That's the paradox, if its going to succeed we need the help of the AFL in regards to the fixture, FTA coverage etc. I know this topic has been done to death, but the fact that we play both Collingwood and Carlton at the Telstra Dome (granted its both Carlton and Collingwood's home games) given that both Collingwood and Carlton play home games at the MCG in games that traditionally draw large crowds, was it so much to ask to play the games at the MCG instead of the Dome?

but then people would complain that the pies play 16 games at the G

i dont understand why we dont play our 11 home games at the MCG our home ground, but that is another matter

hawks get 11 games at their preferred home venues this year, what happens with away games u shouldn't be able to complain about

To date, it’s been promising - our membership is up 20% on last year, but more needs to be done to make it a success. It’s a big challenge, but potentially it could make us as a football club.

numbers may be up, but wouldn't they have to be at reduced prices as not as many games to go to???

for instance the pies sell legends memberships, ie 18 game reserved seat packages for bout $700........by selling off 4 games the hawks cant even offer that type of ticket