Autopsy Geelong defeated by 15 points by WC

[MacStradbroke]

We are really feeling the loss of Taylor atm, perhaps Henderson too - except, would he have the fitness to make a huge difference?

While Dangerfield topped the Disposals again, some of his kicks + handballs were ineffective with five clangers + missed a goal. Also giveaway turnovers, so not a good enough effort considering his ability.

Menzel's marking was nullified, kicking 1.1. Menzel kicked eight goals in two games, despite Geelong's 84 I50s against Melbourne + Hawthorn. Menzel was the only AFL player to kick a goal every quarter. While Hawkins has kicked only one goal for those two games. Menzel was in the Top 5 general forwards for Contested Marks, Goals + in the Top 10 for Goal Assists + Score Involvements.

Hawkins + Dangerfield missed crucial goals in Q1 + Q2 respectively.

In Q1:
Geelong had three I50s from 17 Defensive half chains. Whilst WCE moved easily, creating four I50s from six Defensive half chains;
WCE outscored Geelong with 10 Scoring Shots to four;
WCE had 10 I50s from 15 intercepts, scoring 3.2.20;
WCE dominated Clearances 12-9 + Contested Possession 43-33 + outscored Geelong 10-4;
Geelong had 36% of time in the forward half, with seven of 12 I50s coming from our Defensive half.

Kudos to Sav for winning the first Centre Bounce tap against Natanui, despite no one winning the clearance. Amazing leap!
View attachment 480820
Could Sav take #2 Ruck + CHF or FF position?

Cataholic "Bews misses Hawkins by a country mile, Ablett handballs to the opposition, Guthrie kicks it out on the full"
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...m-optus-stadium.1190343/page-13#post-55035348

With our lack of defensive pressure, Midfielders did little to stop WCE forward entries. How many centre clearances did we win?

There was the passage of play 19:19 mark, when WCE kicked forward, Geelong tapped the ball, Bews grabbed it + ran, kicking it long towards Hawkins, who made little effort to get into position, strolling towards the ball, which went out. Just a poor effort. Boundary throw in + another good effort by Sav -
View attachment 480829

Next throw in, Sav again, with his big leap manages to beat Natanui + although WCE took possession, Geelong forced a turnover with Sav grabbing the ball from a Dangerfield tackle + handballing to Ablett, who chiseled a kick to Parfitt. Very good small passage of play under pressure, which was followed by crap kicks, fumbles, but a terrific smother by Stewart, more fumbles, a turnover + fortunately Venables missed a goal.

View attachment 480894

View attachment 480895

Gregson, under pressure, kicked to Bews, who kicked a goal. But again, some fumbles under pressure by players, but thankfully Gregson got the ball to Bews.

At the next centre bounce, Geelong's comedy of errors resulted in a free, then a 50m penalty + thankfully Sheed missed a set shot goal.

WCE missed another three possible goals. Geelong managed to gain possession, kicked forward + Ratugolea won a free kick, but made the mistake of handballing instead of kicking - probably due to no Geelong players being I50.

Dangerfield seemed so erratic to me, blasting kicks to no one, which were gathered by WCE. Hot Potato Handballs resulting in turnovers. Even bounced the ball poorly at one stage, hit the ground twice, struggled to capture it again + was tackled by Hurn.

Blitz was totally out of his depth playing #1 Ruck, should be played in Defence. It's totally unfair the way he's moved around.

By the 09:30 mark, WCE had missed six goals.
By the 06:30 mark, WCE had missed seven goals.
Finally, WCE kicked a goal at 04:15.

Now, Dangerfield is playing forward + being double scragged by WCE players. Ablett managed to kick the ball to the goal square, except Menzel was scragged by three WCE players.

Ball heads towards WCE I50 + is marked by Darling, with Kolo just watching! Another let off with Darling missing the goal. WCE up to eight missed goals.

In the dying seconds of Q1, Dangerfield kicked wildly, completely missing Menzel + ball went OOB on the full.

Sav, Stewart, Bews + Kolo the better players in Q1.

WCE by 16 points.

Q2:
Cuthrie ankle injury, out of the game. Cripps falling onto Guthrie's ankle in a tackle.

McGovern out manoeuvred Menzel, getting in front + marked.
WCE kicked forward, Bews gathered the ball, handballed to Kolo, who kicked long, OOBOF.

Then there was some backward + forward play by both teams. A handball from Parsons to Dangerfield, who missed a goal.

WCE kicked forward, Geelong took possession, Ablett to Parsons, who marked but the kick misses a target in our I50. Boundary throw in, Blitz earned a free, but shanks his kick. Scooter takes possession, to Ablett - unable to dispose effectively. Ball played into WCE I50, but goes out, WCE given a free for a shove. Lecras marks, but kicks right. Another let off for Geelong.

Tuohy kicked in towards Selwood, who wins a free kick. Selwood's kick is marked beautifully by Sav, with Cockatoo also competing. Sav's kick was intercepted by Lycett. Lycett's kick was intercepted by Sav on the wing, who then kicked backward to Kolo just outside Geelong's D50. Kolo also kicked backward, Henry ran to gather the ball + kicked across to Bews on the opposite Wing. Bews kicked to Stewart, who kicked to Tuohy, who chipped it about two metres to Stewart. Stewart found Kolo on the boundary. Kolo kicked to congestion, despite a loose Geelong player in the Centre. Wasted effort, Geelong unable to move the ball forward. More to + fro. Geelong managed to get the ball forward. Menegola attempts to chip the ball to Hawkins, but Sheppard intercepts the mark, but his kick is marked by Menegola + kicked to Sav + a behind.

Jetta kicked straight down to Hurn, who was on his own, Jetta sprinted up the corridor + was ready to receive Hurn's kick. Meanwhile there are four Geelong players in the area + only Ratugolea anywhere near Jetta, but Gaff took the mark + kicked to Sheed, who kicked Waterman, who was dumped by Henry, but dropped the ball in the tackle. Free against Henry - umpire pulled sides of his jumper Cripps missed the goal.

Behind Lecras
Behind Cockatoo
Behind Cockatoo
Goal Ryan
Goal Shuey
Goal Gaff
Behind Fogarty

WCE were effective + created an I50 from 40% of D50 + kicked four of eight goals from there.

In Q2 where both sides went by less than 30% by foot in the forward half, the Eagle's ability to convert proved the difference. WCE kicked four goals to Geelong's one from their D50 + five to one from one intercept.

Geelong failed to convert any of the 11 I50s into a goal in this quarter. While WCE have converted three of their last four I50s, of which, two were from intercepts.
Geelong missed five shots on goal in Q2.

Behinds:
Dangerfield
Ratugolea
Cockatoo x 2
Fogarty

Pressure from WCE on our Forwards! Hawkins tried to mark, when he's down, crowded by six WCE + only three Geelong players coming in!

View attachment 480924

To Hawkins credit, handball to Dangerfield to Menegola, ball was lost, Parfitt gathered by utterly dumped by a massive Natanui tackle! That tackle looks horrendous! How Parfitt wasn't injured by that crushing tackle?
Ball moved forward by WCE, but Stewart flicked Rioli across the boundary (with his little finger). + God love Parfitt! Up + off like the Dickens to push Venables over the boundary. Meanwhile Natanui was tackled by Stewart + Menegola lol Great by Parfitt. Then the incredible happened again! Bews kicked backward to Stewart, who kicked back further to D50 to Henry! Henry over-kicked + ball went out. More too-ing + fro-ing eventually some terrific play, Kolo (I think, picture is fuzzy) taps to Dangerfield, to Menegola with a rocket kick to Hawkins. Hawkins over-kicked, Parfitt gathered but long bombs + ball went out. Blah, blah, blah - half time.

Stewart + Menegola kept Geelong going.
Parfitt with some really hard tackles, good marks + kicks.
Kelly very good.
Where did Danger go? Found him, playing forward but couldn't get the ball forward, so thought he'd gone missing.
Not sure why there was so much criticism of Parsons. Took marks + kicked well, compared to others.
Too much sideways + backward kicking, not enough grunt, aggression or confidence to kick forward.

Kick Efficiency WCE 61% Geelong 62%
Q2 Time in Forward Half WCE 50% Geelong 50%

Also, what's with all the red boots this week? Cheap job lot? Boots not fitting? *Grasping for excuses*

To all posters who said one of the positives of the first half was Cockatoo not doing a hammy - YOU ALL JINXED HIM!

Q3:
We picked up - you know what happened - Geelong's kicking efficiency in the forward half improved to 62%.
Geelong intercepted + generated scores from their defensive half!
Geelong had 8 marks I50 for Q2 + Hawkins was the main target. He was targeted 7 times for 4 marks + 2.2.14.
Cats dominated on the outside, winning Uncontested Possession 68-37) + I50s 17-11.
Then some behinds.

Q4:
Geelong dominated from stoppages, winning 7 of 11 Centre Bounce Clearances in the second half + generated an I50 from each + two goals.
Then it all fell apart with goals from:
Darling x 2
Ryan
Sheed x 2
Lecras

Then a final goal by Hawkins.



Loved this from Kelly

Sav, Hawkins, Stewart, Parfitt, Menegola, Kelly, Bews, Henry + Fogarty all good.


Probably the most annoying + costly mistakes were from:

• The usual panicked hot potato handballs in congestion;
• Tapping the ball instead of marking it;
• Not staying on the man;
• Slow ball movement;
• Poor disposal;
• Inconsistency;

Yesterday, in particular:

• Obviously not having a #1 Ruck. We virtually conceded defeat before the game began;
• Holding the man at centre bounces.', ball ups + boundary throw ins, resulting in free kicks + WCE winning CC;
• Abysmal Midfield performance;
• Inaccurate goal kicking - 11 Goals with 12 Behinds (+ 2 Rushed)
• Stupid backward or sideways kicks;
• Poor workrate;
• Poor kicking, missing marking targets, resulting in turnovers;
• Lost structures;
• Individual, not team effort.

So the point of all this is to show where Geelong played badly, to prove the poor game + to identify where we need to improve.

Sure, starting without a Ruck was unforgivable! WTF is wrong with Smith? Is he injured or out of favour?

Was pulling Stanley supposed to be a clever tactic, to baffle WCE?

Was it imagined that our Midfield would win the game without a ruck?

But mostly it's the points above - 'Yesterday, in particular'

Imagine if WCE had kicked more accurately?

Lovely Tweet from Natanui about Sav

I believe the Parsons criticism may come from him having one disposal in the first half.....for the second week in a row!

 

[Play it Sam]

Awesome post!
I've changed my mind completely with Sav, I think we have a genuine star ruck in the making with this bloke, once he builds a tank he'll be set.
He was beating Nic Nat in the first quarter.

It's crazy what we miss on TV....it takes those images to see the extent of his leap. Gun.
Mind you, all this has eventuated since he had his hair cut. Reverse Samson

 

[Mad_Hatter]

I believe the Parsons criticism may come from him having one disposal in the first half.....for the second week in a row!

Parsons is the epitome of a downhill skier, when we are rolling he contributes and looks good, when we aren't he doesn't.
Not sure if thats specific to Parsons himself or more the role he plays (I'll call it the Motlop role).

 

[Play it Sam]

I believe the Parsons criticism may come from him having one disposal in the first half.....for the second week in a row!

Absolutely GONE.

 

[Partridge]

Awesome post!
I've changed my mind completely with Sav, I think we have a genuine star ruck in the making with this bloke, once he builds a tank he'll be set.
He was beating Nic Nat in the first quarter.

Not the only one. There's a ton of promise there.

I'd argue even now his endurance is far better than could have been expected as well.

 

[thegerman]

Stanley is a forward only, pinch hit in ruck. If he isn't up to standard he's in the twos.

Smith is a ruck. If he's not up to standard he's in the twos.

Blitz is not a ruck. Either he plays as a big mid or defensive post. If he's not up to standard he plays in the twos.

Sav Rat is a ruck that could totally change the landscape on our ruck predicament. His leap and size is promising. If he plays, he's a ruck that rests forward, or swaps with Stanley in forward roles for small periods.

What we have to do is consider what we want from the ruck position.

To me, it's Smith and Sav Rat. With the latter gaining ground as the starting ruck very quickly.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Not the only one. There's a ton of promise there.

I'd argue even now his endurance is far better than could have been expected as well.

Absolutely, credit to him that he's been able to build on it so quickly.

 

[Spearman]

Parsons plays on the wing, right?
substitute his name with Brynes, Varcoe, Motlop...
face it Geelong wingers don't rack up much in the way of stats, should be a good contest between him and Stanley for whipping boy

 

[catempire]

Good to see Steve Hocking confirm the Jack Henry deliberate was incorrect. What a garbage decision it was.

 

[Partridge]

Good to see Steve Hocking confirm the Jack Henry deliberate was incorrect. What a garbage decision it was.

Yeah they were both ridiculous. Particularly since they seemed to be lenient on holding the ball during the game too.

 

[Spazz Cat]

TLDR

Joking ..

Lol

 

[geelong_crazy26]

West Coast lifted their intensity big time in the last 5-10 minutes, they went to sleep for most of the second half. Our lack of numbers didn't help, but it'd be foolish to say those injuries lost us the four points. From a coaching point of view, it's the LAST thing you should think let alone say to a bunch of players who are unable to match the intent of their opposition, again, and again.

The Cats lost the game in the first half, as they did in rounds 1 & 2 (Melbourne lost, we didn't win). They lost due to their inability to apply themselves mentally to the contest, to their opponents defensively, to each other offensively. The team looks out of sync for the majority, especially when there's any real pressure from the opposition. We're directionless from defense, stagnant up the ground. Our midfield is a sieve, our opposition move the ball with little risk.

It's looking like a tough season ahead, injuries killing us, too much youth in the team. The same senior players like Guthrie not performing beyond that of a fringe listed player. Kelly's first 3 midfield games at AFL level are just as good as any of Guthrie's before he got removed for being rubbish.

Which only happened once we had a 1 man rotational bench compared to their 4 man rotations. This is catastrophic on fatigue.

I am surprised and a bit perplexed as to why people seem to be struggling to cope with such a simple truth from the game. We need to remove emotions from all of this a little.

Despite the poor first half, we still played good enough football to put ourselves in a match winning position with ten minutes to go, the only reason we got ran over was having a 1 man bench to rotate compared with their 4 man bench. That is just too much for any side to cope.

Why people keep saying we lost it in the first half makes no logical sense, because the first half happened and we where in a match winning position with 10 minutes left, so it wasn’t the first half, it was the injuries that cost us the points.

Sorry guys but this isn’t difficult.

I’m just taking emotions out of this and looking at it rationally.

Yes we have a lot of to work on defensively with our game thought, especially around the middle and stoppages.

 

[Spearman]

Hello Kitty - excellent post
it touches on what I think happened early: we made skill errors and were fumbly in first half. we seemed to be trying to counter-attack but it would break down. right idea, but bad execution.
I think CS has a vision, but the guys can't make it work, yet. still haven't spent enough time together. broken record time; I watched the 2011 opener v St. Kilda the other night, first I noticed that it was Cuthrie's debut; Menzel, THunt, Duncan still young; but look at the rest of the squad...how long had they been playing with each other, and Ling and Chapman were out. look at the group this year how many games let alone years do they have together? those with some time together (Murdoch, etc) are unlikely to be a part of next generation. even with the injuries, maybe CS and MC are confident enough with the younger guys to actually start the 'retool' I made the comment during the game, that this may be like 2003~2004, playing that rich crop of young players together as much as possible.
but with some of the amazing stars we have in the squad right now, still not a champion team, yet

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Yes, but you can't definitively say that without injuries we would have won - you can't even say that it's likely we would have won.

It's an unknown and frankly it's irrelevant.

That’s nonsense.

Of cause having 1 rotation is going to dismantle your sides fitness in the game. I wouldn’t expect anybody to win a football game from that position. The effect is massive.

We were not going to give that lead up with ten minutes to go otherwise. We where running all over them

 

[geelong_crazy26]

I have said multiple times that the injuries played a major role in us losing. Yes we most likely would have won without them but we could have played better early on and made them irrelevant (until next week)

So many things could be changed in that game that would result in us winning, so to continually state that the ONLY reason we lost was the injuries is incredibly narrow minded.
So yes we are not on the same page and I have no intention on being on that page

It isn’t narrow minded it’s just looking at facts of the matter, poor first half and all we still had a match winning lead with ten minutes left we wouldn’t have given up without the injuries.

What your saying is more along the narrative of we have to play an extra five goals or so better to compensate for the potential for an injury crisis.

I agree we have lots of areas to improve, but but poor first half and all we still would have won with a fit bench to rotate. To suggest otherwise is just dillusion and misinformed about the reality of the situation.

 

[Pollywaffle]

Parsons is the epitome of a downhill skier, when we are rolling he contributes and looks good, when we aren't he doesn't.
Not sure if thats specific to Parsons himself or more the role he plays (I'll call it the Motlop role).

Seems to have problem with repeat efforts...

 

[Play it Sam]

Which only happened once we had a 1 man rotational bench compared to their 4 man rotations. This is catastrophic on fatigue.

I am surprised and a bit perplexed as to why people seem to be struggling to cope with such a simple truth from the game. We need to remove emotions from all of this a little.

Despite the poor first half, we still played good enough football to put ourselves in a match winning position with ten minutes to go, the only reason we got ran over was having a 1 man bench to rotate compared with their 4 man bench. That is just too much for any side to cope.

Why people keep saying we lost it in the first half makes no logical sense, because the first half happened and we where in a match winning position with 10 minutes left, so it wasn’t the first half, it was the injuries that cost us the points.

Sorry guys but this isn’t difficult.

I’m just taking emotions out of this and looking at it rationally.

Yes we have a lot of to work on defensively with our game thought, especially around the middle and stoppages.

I'm going to unemotionally go with you on this one- to a point. They overcame a shocking start to draw level, so that's where we start the battle.
Rotations yes, to bring on better players to replace the fails (I'm looking at you Parsons, Gregson et al)
Of course Guthrie for defence grunt, Ablett for some all round magic, Cocky to run all day. At the very least name players to prevent clearances like that of Shuey's.
BUT, and it might be contentious, but I'm not a fan of the run out of gas, legs and/or guts and heat excuses.
At this level, after a strong pre season, and despite the new ground/ 6 day break/travel/ they want to plead fatigue?
CS has never used those reasons before, has always poo pooed the idea, and it's self serving preservation if he starts now.

 

[The_Todd07]

That’s nonsense.

Of cause having 1 rotation is going to dismantle your sides fitness in the game. I wouldn’t expect anybody to win a football game from that position. The effect is massive.

We were not going to give that lead up with ten minutes to go otherwise. We where running all over them

Its not nonsense
If any of the injuries dont happen the entire timeline of the game changes from that point.
Every outcome within the realms of possibility could occur but predicting exactly what would happen from then on is purely speculation

 

[hoopla]

A lot of positives from this game. Injuries and umpiring aside, the cats had a good second half. When they move the ball fast, they looked fantastic.

Umpiring was the worst I have ever seen in Perth...and that’s saying something given the eagles have pretty much been handed wins at home for a long time.

 

[STPer18]

WEST COAST v GEELONG
9 Dom Sheed (WC)
5 Brad Sheppard (WC)
5 Patrick Dangerfield (Geel)
4 Luke Shuey (WC)
3 Sam Menegola (Geel)
2 Gary Ablett (Geel)
1 Andrew Gaff (WC)
1 Tom Stewart (Geel)

 

[fpm84]

WEST COAST v GEELONG
9 Dom Sheed (WC)
5 Brad Sheppard (WC)
5 Patrick Dangerfield (Geel)
4 Luke Shuey (WC)
3 Sam Menegola (Geel)
2 Gary Ablett (Geel)
1 Andrew Gaff (WC)
1 Tom Stewart (Geel)

No votes for Naitanui, interesting.

 

[Farmer2Goggin]

They'll have to do something. The AFLPA won't let it stay like it is.
Probably keep the perforated metal and cover that with some sort of anti reflective clear Perspex.
Their actually lucky it was just a hand and not someone's face.

It's a brilliant stadium but they do need to do a risk assessment on the advertising panels and also the metal fence around the ground just above the advertising panels.
It's not inconceivable a player could make contact with the metal fence when contesting at speed near the boundary
Testing the memory but I still remember the Barry Davis face plant into the metal fence at Windy Hill - horrendous

 

[Hello Kitty]

Hello Kitty - excellent post
it touches on what I think happened early: we made skill errors and were fumbly in first half. we seemed to be trying to counter-attack but it would break down. right idea, but bad execution.
I think CS has a vision, but the guys can't make it work, yet. still haven't spent enough time together. broken record time; I watched the 2011 opener v St. Kilda the other night, first I noticed that it was Cuthrie's debut; Menzel, THunt, Duncan still young; but look at the rest of the squad...how long had they been playing with each other, and Ling and Chapman were out. look at the group this year how many games let alone years do they have together? those with some time together (Murdoch, etc) are unlikely to be a part of next generation. even with the injuries, maybe CS and MC are confident enough with the younger guys to actually start the 'retool' I made the comment during the game, that this may be like 2003~2004, playing that rich crop of young players together as much as possible.
but with some of the amazing stars we have in the squad right now, still not a champion team, yet

Thank you Spearman.

Exactly, my focus was on the first half, to look at the skill errors, fumbles, even just bad bounces affected us. While it was broken record time, it was worse than usual. Blame it on no Ruck, sure. Nevertheless, our über Midfield was expected to counter having no ruck, but failed. Lots of different reasons, which, I hope I covered.

You're right about the St Kilda game Rd1 in 2011, despite the new recruits, a good portion of the team had played years together.

This year so far, we've played four debutantes in Kelly, Ratugolea, Fogarty + Henry. We're missing Taylor + Henderson, who are crucial to our Defence. Despite the Club's ubiquitous Summer catchphrase that players have had 'the best preseason EVER' the expectations began unravelling. No matter how brilliant Selwood, Dangerfield + Ablett are, it takes time for them to become a cohesive unit. Duncan is a huge contributor to our Midfield, but underrated. Menegola is terrific, but still new + needs time to settle, still. I thought he was great yesterday. Then there's Scooter returning from injury too. Gregson - back from LTI. Cockatoo with his dicky hammies. Considering the 'outs' Stewart + his buddies did their best to hold our defence together. You know I'm agreeing with you. Scott + the MC do have confidence with the young guys + with all of the players selected. What let the team down was having no Ruck + expecting our 'Holy Trinity' to cope. Full + utter kudos to Sav, who in his third AFL game was more resilient (all due to Ratcat's training regime). But seriously, I thought he was brilliant, with just those few leaps higher than Natanui - not saying he beat Natanui, but thrilled with his effort in leaping + having the confidence to try to take on Natanui.

I think it's important + some posters accept, we may have losses, but the experience for the Kittens + for the new players, those returning from injury + for the veterans, it's worthwhile to persevere - but we need a Ruck!!! lol

I relish your enthusiasm + your hope, I feel the same way, although my previous post may not have expressed that feeling.

I have to admit that I was carried away with the dream of the Fab Five! While my head said give the team time, I wanted to see the dream manifest into reality. But am not writing this team off, just yet.

 

[Hello Kitty]

I believe the Parsons criticism may come from him having one disposal in the first half.....for the second week in a row!

OK. But then he took some good marks, kicked well to a target, + yes he made mistakes, but not nearly in the range of Dangerfield's shockers. But Dangerfield is untouchable, so angst is spewed at a kid like Parsons. Parsons had one more mark than Danger. His DE% 83.3. Four I50s. I know it's wrong to compare Parsons to Danger. Give the kid a break, yes he made some mistakes, but who didn't? He did stand up at times + I find it annoying that people always remember the one bad thing, but forget 10 good things.

 

[Hello Kitty]

Awesome post!
I've changed my mind completely with Sav, I think we have a genuine star ruck in the making with this bloke, once he builds a tank he'll be set.
He was beating Nic Nat in the first quarter.

Yes! Yay!!! Welcome to the Sav Lovers Club, you're member number three, to Ratcat + me

Sav's leap was amazing + that's why I wanted to post those pix, if I'd said he contested well against Natanui, the haters would have laughed! Even more, how wonderful was Natanui's Tweet? What a generous hearted man to give a Kitten acknowledgement?

I thought is endurance had improved a bit, right? A little?